Sorry your browser is not supported!

You are using an outdated browser that does not support modern web technologies, in order to use this site please update to a new browser.

Browsers supported include Chrome, FireFox, Safari, Opera, Internet Explorer 10+ or Microsoft Edge.

Geek Culture / All the "students" posting for code

Author
Message
wattywatts
14
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 25th May 2009
Location: Michigan
Posted: 9th Nov 2013 06:36
Link
It seems like there must be a lot of intro to programming classes using DBPro, but should we be helping them? I'm lost on this. Isn't it cheating? I'm an art education major and I know that if I neglected to tell my students exactly how to do something it would be because I wanted them to figure it out on their own; someone telling them how to do it would defeat the purpose.
Just putting it out there.

http://www.indiedb.com/games/max-vs-mars
Back to top
Profile PM Email
Zotoaster
19
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 20th Dec 2004
Location: Scotland
Posted: 9th Nov 2013 11:42
Link
Thing is, they already know the answer, telling it to them is useless. Some people just need help navigating their brains to find the answer, and I think that's okay, because you're not giving them answers, you're teaching them how to find them.

"everyone forgets a semi-colon sometimes." - Phaelax
Back to top
Profile PM Email
MrValentine
AGK Backer
13
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 5th Dec 2010
Playing: FFVII
Posted: 9th Nov 2013 12:54
Link
I was thinking about this too...

I think if we give them PSEUDO Code, they can work out the code themselves... but that is just from my experience, they need to learn Best Practices [Such as using PSEUDO Code] in order to solve complex issues they face... [You know like the Hello World project ]

I think they should Pre-Fix their posts with STU

Back to top
Profile PM
Libervurto
17
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 30th Jun 2006
Location: On Toast
Posted: 9th Nov 2013 17:44 Edited at: 9th Nov 2013 17:47
Link
I am guilty of going nuts on a problem a noobie posts and solving it for them, which can help people learn if they are the sort to read through code. I have said before about doing things like including intentional errors so the noobie will have understand the code and fix it for it to work but I often forget to do that. Really I don't think it matters how much we "help", if the person you are helping isn't going to read through your code and learn something from it and instead just wants to copy/paste then they aren't going to learn anything anyway!
I wouldn't even worry about helping them towards a grade they don't deserve, for one I don't really care about that, and if they don't know what the code is doing chances are their project will be a broken mess anyway.

I actually hate the way programming is taught as a solitary endeavour, as if you have to make everything from scratch yourself, that's horse plop! The vast majority of programming is maintaining and modifying other people's code! Even if you are working on a hobby project you will be using and modifying other people's code to incorporate it into your project. Programming is a communal activity, like any other science/technology, we borrow ideas, formulae and code from each other all the time.


Formerly OBese87.
Back to top
Profile PM Email
JLMoondog
Moderator
15
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 18th Jan 2009
Location: Paradox
Posted: 9th Nov 2013 18:33 Edited at: 9th Nov 2013 18:33
Link
I do this in art allot. When I was in grade school, learning how to draw human figures, I\'d flip to my favorite section of a comic book and copy a character on larger paper. This taught me form, poses, anatomy structure, shading, etc.

I tackle coding the same way. If I\'m unsure how to do something in code, I\'ll look for a snippet that does something the same or similar, copy it and in turn I learn how it works. I guess this method is only effective if you know the language and you know the basic concepts of coding.

Inmortalis Nox
Back to top
Profile PM Email Website
bitJericho
21
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 9th Oct 2002
Location: United States
Posted: 10th Nov 2013 01:25
Link
Quote: "I tackle coding the same way. If I\'m unsure how to do something in code, I\'ll look for a snippet that does something the same or similar, copy it and in turn I learn how it works. I guess this method is only effective if you know the language and you know the basic concepts of coding.
"


I do this all the time. You don't have to even know the language it's coming from, just some basic syntax of the language or general programming syntax. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to know what math.sin() is A great way of finding relavent code is to search for something and include some other similar language. I do a lot of searches of things like "formula for this or that for javascript" Just because I know the code I'll get will be in a form I might understand better or I know a technique I'm looking for will exist in that language specifically. A lot of people wrote great 3d (and pseudo 3d) code in qbasic for example. A lot of great raycasting and raytracing techniques can be learned from qbasic code.

Back to top
Profile PM Email Website
Sasuke
18
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 2nd Dec 2005
Location: Milton Keynes UK
Posted: 10th Nov 2013 02:51
Link
One thing about them which annoys me is not using the search bar! There should be like a message that pops up saying if this is your first time posting a thread, try searching first!

"Get in the Van!" - Van B
Back to top
Profile PM Email
MrValentine
AGK Backer
13
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 5th Dec 2010
Playing: FFVII
Posted: 10th Nov 2013 03:14
Link
Quote: "if this is your first time posting a thread, try searching first!"


I do believe I recall it mentioning that...

Back to top
Profile PM
JLMoondog
Moderator
15
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 18th Jan 2009
Location: Paradox
Posted: 10th Nov 2013 05:26
Link
It could be merely ignorance. The search tool is at the very bottom of the page, just above the copyright..where as any other forum I've ever been to has them at the very top.

Inmortalis Nox
Back to top
Profile PM Email Website
Ortu
DBPro Master
16
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 21st Nov 2007
Location: Austin, TX
Posted: 10th Nov 2013 06:45
Link
I think the real problem with these requests is that while they may just want the code, what they need and will get more benefit from, is us helping to give them an understanding of the logic behind the code.

It's one thing to ask for help with a specific command or syntax, but these requests are more broad and show a lack of necessary core logic which would direct them towards the specific commands needed.

On one hand, it's good to see a bunch of new people getting in to programming, on the other hand, when they not only ask for the solution to be handed to them, but also just flat ask where to put it rather than questioning how it works and why and thereby working to figure out how to implement it themselves, I have to wonder how much they are really interested in learning to code vs how much they are simply interested in passing a course.

I'm all for helping people learn and understand, I'm not terribly interested in earning someone a grade.

Back to top
Profile PM Email Website
Quik
15
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 3rd Jul 2008
Location: Equestria!
Posted: 10th Nov 2013 10:48
Link
It much depends on the mindset. I've been scavenging a lot trying to find the specific code snippet i'm looking for - once I find it though, I broke it down and figured out how exactly it worked.
If you just want the snippet, and are not going to bother with UNDERSTANDING IT, then yes - you're not going to learn.



Whose eyes are those eyes?
Back to top
Profile PM
Libervurto
17
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 30th Jun 2006
Location: On Toast
Posted: 10th Nov 2013 19:54 Edited at: 10th Nov 2013 19:54
Link
Quote: "I have to wonder how much they are really interested in learning to code vs how much they are simply interested in passing a course."

Then it's really down to us to be more savvy and decide how much time these newbies are worth, i.e. how likely they are to learn anything and give something back to the community.


Formerly OBese87.
Back to top
Profile PM Email
Phaelax
DBPro Master
21
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 16th Apr 2003
Location: Metropia
Posted: 12th Nov 2013 05:26
Link
I've dealt with this a lot over the past 10 years on various java programming sites. Yes, it's ok to help them. But don't just give them the answer, actually help them by pointing them in the right direction without giving the answer directly. Make them think, make them work it out their self.

Posts like "i must make pacman project, can you gimmez teh code?", I will either ignore completely or answer and a completely rude manner. People with no real interest in programming or not will to make any effort at all and are perfectly happy cheating their way through I do not want to help. I want them to fail and never have a job in the IT world where I might be unfortunate enough to have to work with them.

http://zimnox.com
Back to top
Profile PM Email Website
Back to top

Login to post a reply

Server time is: 2024-05-18 14:16:27
Your offset time is: 2024-05-18 14:16:27