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Work in Progress / Sun Crusher: The Great War - A blend genre of RTS and Action.

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Bulleyes
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Posted: 7th Oct 2004 13:13 Edited at: 7th Oct 2004 18:45
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After months of development, finally we had finished the core stuffs of the game. Now we are posting some screenies for preview over here. Feel free to comment.

Just for those who had forgotten what is the game about, Sun Crusher is actually a multiplayer game done in DBpro blending both real-time strategy and third person shooter gameplay. In this game, you either take role as a fleet commander, or battle armor. As a fleet commander, you spend most of your time planning tactical strategy of your fleets, which each of them is actual human player. You are able to jump into the cockpit of the capital ships on your side as well and have some action. If you play it as a battle armor, you will be joining other players on your side to fight against the enemy fleet. You will enjoy the total action gameplay, and you are expected to follow the fleet commander's order to achieve victory for your team. The victory is achieved by destroying the opponent's mothership.

We will be posting a semi-playable demo by the end of this month for Beta testing and to gather more feedbacks. Stay tune!

We would also like to hear comments in the following area from you guys. Although you can't say much without playing the actual demo, but you can give us your best shot based on your past experience.

- What do you think about the graphics quality from the in-game screen shot?

- How do you evaluate the degree of creativity in this game?

- Have you played any blended RTS/Action game? What do you think about this genre?

- and anything that you feel that it might be useful for us to make this game even more fun. Thanks!

For some in-game screenshots,
http://www.badnose.com/development/suncrusher_screenshots.html

To know more about Sun Crusher: The Great War
http://www.badnose.com/development/development.html

The know more about Bad Nose Entertainment
http://www.badnose.com/

Thomas Cheah (Technical Director)
Bad Nose Entertainment - Where games are forged from the flames of talent and passion.
http://www.badnose.com/
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Wiggett
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Posted: 7th Oct 2004 13:18 Edited at: 7th Oct 2004 13:22
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and jaw dropping
dropping
dropping
gone.
Dude that looks totally awesome, great work and really nice models. downloading the teaser now, really looks like it'd be a nice multiplayer game witha mix of homeworld and freelancer.


just watched the video, nice intro, so many sounds stolen from starcraft also the stargate transport thingy at the end witht eh rings. but also it looks like it's got a tribesesque feel, witht eh armoured suits etc. cant wait for the beta.


http://www.angelfire.com/wizard2/unpotkf
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Eric T
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Posted: 7th Oct 2004 13:19 Edited at: 7th Oct 2004 13:24
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Holy teh f*ck. That is one awesome looking game.

/me Gives bulleyes a pat on the back.

Edit: Just watched the trailer, and all i can say is.... woah woah woah woah woah.

AMD 64bit 3200+, Gigabyte GA-K8NS Pro motherboard, 512meg HYPER RAM, ATI Radeon 9600XT 128mb, 120GB Maxtor 7200RPM, nFinity Version 2
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Bulleyes
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Posted: 7th Oct 2004 13:27 Edited at: 7th Oct 2004 18:46
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Hehe... thanks. But I am not the modeller. Thanks to my talented lead artist.

Thomas Cheah (Technical Director)
Bad Nose Entertainment - Where games are forged from the flames of talent and passion.
http://www.badnose.com/
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Wiggett
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Posted: 7th Oct 2004 13:49 Edited at: 7th Oct 2004 13:52
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obviously he is talking about me, i am the talented lead artist

hehe nah, in response to your queries,
I've played a few of the rts/action games and i gotta say they can be pretty fun when played properly. From your screenshots the space ships you have are very well modelled and look fantasticaly textured, however the space background does look a bit bland in some areas, like the texture is stretched out too much, but thats not really a problem, in all the other shots teh game looks very well made, one that would rank high in teh charts and possibly sell for a pretty penny.


http://www.angelfire.com/wizard2/unpotkf
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Bulleyes
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Posted: 7th Oct 2004 14:04 Edited at: 7th Oct 2004 18:47
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@Uberwiggett

Thanks! Your comments are useful. You mentioned that the space background is a bit bored. In your mind, what will you do to make it better? Of course, if you don't mind sharing. (We will include you in our special thanks list.)

Thomas Cheah (Technical Director)
Bad Nose Entertainment - Where games are forged from the flames of talent and passion.
http://www.badnose.com/
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Wiggett
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Posted: 7th Oct 2004 14:20 Edited at: 7th Oct 2004 14:26
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no need to give me credit, I'm just doing my job as forum pirate
but yeah not sure how to fix up the background, it doesnt look that bad it just looks a little flat in areas, maybe by makign two backgrounds, one with stars etc and have it transparent on the black, then keep the original backgroudn too, that way you get a little bit of depth to the bg.I'm not big on coding like that so i dunno what it will do to the framerate having two backgrounds. That example is assuming you have a skybox (or sphere) which it sorta looks like from the screens, you get what i mean with dual backgrounds yeah? like having two spheres with the inner one transparent. anyway see if that will help, just somehow add more depth to it, it will make your damn good looking models seem more better. hope it helps.


[edit] the bg in teh last picture, the triton one looks pretty neat. i will dig up a freelancer pic to see how they're bg's are done

edit2: ok here is the href to a screen of freelancer, its hard to see the bg cause of the asteroids and the large ball of light, which some call a star close up. but you can see they made their textures get mroe depth to make it look like its very large, whereas your textures are flat and make it look like you're in a bubble.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v468/uberwiggett/free_screen002.jpg
i have only linked it cause it is a 1024*768 image might make some 56kers cry. anyway hope it helps you man that game looks awesome


http://www.angelfire.com/wizard2/unpotkf
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Dakilla
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Posted: 7th Oct 2004 15:34
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Hi Uber. I'm the art guy for the project and have been considering what you have suggested. seems feasible enough and yeah we have seen other game's skyboxes such as freelancer,freespace,homeworld and will try to work on improve on the in game graphics . You will be seeing more models and various backgrounds in time to come. Cheers m8
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Cpt Caveman
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Posted: 7th Oct 2004 15:55
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In the trailer, Im interested in how the shadows were made, when you see the character walking down the corridor???


Is that ingame or rendered??
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Dakilla
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Posted: 7th Oct 2004 15:58
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Well Elemenop the trailer you have seen are actually prerendered and not an in game sequence.
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Dakilla
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Posted: 7th Oct 2004 16:03
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The characters which you have seen in the earlier shots were created with pixel shader effects which was meant to be in the original game. However after much consideration we've decided to go ahead without pixel shader in game.
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Wiggett
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Posted: 7th Oct 2004 16:05
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hi dakilla, good to see you didnt take my comment on the background as an offense It's just with the brilliant work on textures and effects that i can see in the screens and the teaser, it's sort of a jolt to have the flat bg texture, i can just see a deep bg feature amplifying your games visuals very much, but i gotta say damn fine work on the models and textures it really does look top notch, which sorry to say isnt found in db much. i can only hope that my hq game gets as much detail in its art work as sun crusher.


http://www.angelfire.com/wizard2/unpotkf
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Zokomoko
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Posted: 7th Oct 2004 16:57
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Amazing !

the video is stunning.

the closest i've been to play an action/rts was dungeon keeper 2, were you could get into one of your minions and fight.
i think that's a really good combo.

how did you do the space background ?
it's so colorfull and pretty

groovy baby, yeah
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Dakilla
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Posted: 7th Oct 2004 17:06
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Thanks Zokomoko. As compared to dungeon keep 2 the minions that you have referred to are other actual human players under your command
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Dakilla
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Posted: 7th Oct 2004 18:28
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But please bear with our development as we're new comers and are constantly striving to improve on this game. Any constructive crits are highly welcomed.
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Zokomoko
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Posted: 7th Oct 2004 18:33
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it doesn't look like you're new-comers, it's a highly proffesional looking game.

i'm still interested in what software you used to make the background ? i'm dying to create one as high quality as yours in my game.
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Dakilla
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Posted: 7th Oct 2004 19:51
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Well just for your info the backgrounds and textures are all created using photoshop and models done in 3ds max
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Peter H
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Posted: 7th Oct 2004 23:55 Edited at: 7th Oct 2004 23:56
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oooo...awesome

i'm currently working on a 3D Space RTS along the lines of homeworld...

i have a friend who has made all the models in DoGa CGA...which means they will have pretty poor textures but oh well...

maybe if you finish soon "dakilla" can re-do my ships?

anyway looking forward to seeing this finished
(yay! i can show my friends the trailer and then they'll know that it IS possible to get something cool out of DBPro)

"We make the worst games in the universe."

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Ian T
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Posted: 8th Oct 2004 02:44 Edited at: 8th Oct 2004 02:45
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That looks pretty amazing. Is it really DarkBASIC?

Edit-- I might also mention that the title "The Great War" was already used recently in a space combat game, "Freespace". You may already be aware of this though.


"Did you just call my girlfriend a cow?"
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Hamish McHaggis
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Posted: 8th Oct 2004 03:25
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Nice! I remember this from ages ago, and I was trying to find it a couple of weeks ago again. I presume the last few screens aren't in DBPro since they look of higher quality? I think if you took mipmapping off of the ships they would look nicer, and more sharp. DBPro mipmapping makes them look all blurry and nasty .

Isn't it? Wasn't it? Marvellous!
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Bulleyes
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Posted: 8th Oct 2004 03:41
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@Hamish:

Thanks for the lovely tips. But will removing mip maps means that my game will consume more video memory?

FYI, the last few screenshots are one of the in-game cinematics.

Thomas Cheah (Technical Director)
Bad Nose Entertainment - Where games are forged from the flames of talent and passion.
http://www.badnose.com/
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Hamish McHaggis
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Posted: 8th Oct 2004 05:18
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Hmm, maybe, maybe removing mipmapping isn't such a good idea.

Isn't it? Wasn't it? Marvellous!
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soapyfish
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Posted: 8th Oct 2004 05:27
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Quote: "we had finished the core stuffs of the game"


This is just the core stuff It's going to be even more amazing when you've added the polish.

Formely code2kill
To tell you the truth, I'm just glad I DON'T enjoy playng The Sims.
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Oneka
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Posted: 8th Oct 2004 05:28
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Yeah some good games are coming beat that Blitz xD good job on sun crusher I will play it when its out


Making better games everday!
Oh yeah and just so you know its Oh-nek-a not One-ka!
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Dakilla
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Posted: 8th Oct 2004 11:39
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Thanks for all the crits guys. Sun Crusher was basically conceived outta both of our fav games namely counter strike and warcraft(THEY ROCKSS) and we've attempted to combine both gameplay at the very basic level in our first prototype. Once it is released however, we will be able to give you guys a feel of both action and strategy. Buying ships and weapons upgrades will not be available at the moment and will be included in time to come as well as several level and mission scenarios.

p/s: in this game if you're ships weapons are depleted you can ram into otherships as a last kamikaze resort to destroy them and put em engines to good use.
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Crazy Programmer
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Posted: 8th Oct 2004 11:47
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cooooooooolllll

that is so f*ing awsome

10 out of 10

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Rknight
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Posted: 8th Oct 2004 14:00
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Very impressive!

Perhaps a tad fewer stars would improve the background. A little too crowded to give an impression of depth.
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The admiral
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Posted: 8th Oct 2004 14:21
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It looks awsome i remember hearing about this game. Do you have the ability to board and capture ships like fight in the corridors etc till you get onto the bridge?? That would be awsome the history of this game gives it a very haloish feel in a good way of course.

[href]www.vapourhost.com/~flyer[/href]
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Wiggett
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Posted: 8th Oct 2004 14:51
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actually on board ship fightign does sound like a neat feature to add, but i don['t think it really fits in with their game style, i mean you'd have to stop the rts game and switch to an fps shooter, then when the outcome is decided you'd have to switch back to the rts scene and start the rts again. sorta would be hard for a commander to switch like that, although you could have it where teh commander still plays in rts mode while other plays are in an fps mode onboard a ship (make a few different levels based on your ships design and load them up when the players board a ship) and for the commander have that boarded ship sit in space not doing anything or have it still under his control an dmoving until the players reach the controls and take over the ship, then have it added to the other commander's fleet. but that will take a whole lot more coding and is probably not what the game is looking for. anyway keep up teh god work guys.


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Bulleyes
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Posted: 8th Oct 2004 14:54
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We had this board and capture idea in our game design document. But alas, it didn't make it to the implementation eventually, well at least for this upcoming playable demo. We prefer to focus on the core stuff, and get players feedback on the core idea of RTS/Action mix. Then, we might decide to add those features that we left out previously.

But most probably it won't be as detail as you mentioned, i.e. fight in the corridors till you get onto the bridge. That will make the game very huge. It will be a mix of outdoor and indoor gameplay. But will see how the response goes, and also to see how "capable" is DarkBasic Pro.

Thomas Cheah (Technical Director)
Bad Nose Entertainment - Where games are forged from the flames of talent and passion.
http://www.badnose.com/
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Dakilla
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Posted: 8th Oct 2004 15:00
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On the gameplay issue side should the interiors of the ships be opened there will prolly be lotsa campers fighting in the ship's insides. As the interiors will prolly be reinforced with automatic weapons plus with campers on board will just spoil the fun.
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AlecM
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Posted: 8th Oct 2004 16:40
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what can I say aside from that this looks freaking awesome? By far the best looking game in DBP with some great potential for good gameplay. Praise like that doesnt come from me easily either.


Buy it
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Cellbloc Studios
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Posted: 8th Oct 2004 16:41
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Impressed. Nice to see what people are creating with DarkBasic Professional and that it is not a ¨silly¨ language. Professional work was done on this. MANY hours of time, months of development.. you should do a ¨post mordem¨ when you are done.

-This is my boomstick!
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Bulleyes
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@Froggermon and Cellbloc

Thanks for your great praise and support. We really appreciate that. We hoped that we can find a publisher that is interested in our game and eventually we are able to push into the market. Of course, we would also like to show the DBpro community that DBpro is capable of delivering professional and commercial quality games.

When we look back in time, we purchased DBpro in 2002, and there is so many obstacles along the way. There is even some point in time where we almost decide to thrash DBpro and go for some other tools. But what I believed that time was, even though DBpro is still buggy, but it doesn't mean that the new engine that we are gonna license will be bugs-free. I would say the most important is, at least I understand how DBpro works, and most importantly, I am aware of most of the bugs in DBpro. This had kept my determination in using DBpro until now. What I usually advocate people around me is, the final output of your work is usually 35% depends on your tools, and the rest 65% is based on your skills and expertise.

As for now, we realized DBpro had come from a long way. A lot of more stable then it used to be. It's time to give yourself some confident in DBpro and make something professional out of it. Despite of its name "BASIC", it can really be used to create advance game out of it.

If you were wondering what might be our major pain with DBpro now. Well, it's not those bugs. I always believed that bugs can be workaround, even though they are time consuming at times. But at least they are not the major stopping stone. The pain we had now is the compilation time. At the present moment, our code reached around 30000 lines, which took around 4 minutes to compile on our developmemt machine. This will decrease our productivity significantly. The only way that we can do now is, modularize the code as much as we could, and unit test them module by module. And of course, a wishful thought will be to hope that Lee Bamber himself thought of a way to optimize the compiler and speed things up.

Cheers mate! Again, thanks for all the comments and support! If there is more, please go on with the list.

Thomas Cheah (Technical Director)
Bad Nose Entertainment - Where games are forged from the flames of talent and passion.
http://www.badnose.com/
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The admiral
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I thought you already have 3rd person controls so boarding a ship and fighting in 3rd person shouldnt be too much harder and would make the game a lot more enjoyable for what it is.

[href]www.vapourhost.com/~flyer[/href]
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Bulleyes
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@The admiral

Thanks for your comments. Your idea is a good one. We give a good thought of it initially. Well, just for your info, from implementation complexity perspective, including that features meaning that we have to design the level for the ship interior. That's not the major issue. Something that worth thinking is the transition between the free flight, and the indoor environment. From technical perspective, this means that you must switch the collision detection algorithm used based on the players environment. Another issue that we thought of this is, all the fleets inside the ship needs to be rotated and translated, as the ship is moving. This might be an expensive process.

Anyway, we MIGHT still looking for the possiblity of this feature, IF it is really feasible.

Thomas Cheah (Technical Director)
Bad Nose Entertainment - Where games are forged from the flames of talent and passion.
http://www.badnose.com/
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Zero Blitzt
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That is severely excellent.

Please don't let this project die for some reason like countless others

By the way, that is the kind of game I'd buy if I could. Will you be selling it or is it a free download?


Come to #coding. We promise we wont kick you!
DISCLAIMER: Promises may not actually be upheld.
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ALPHA ZERO PRODUCTIONS
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Posted: 8th Oct 2004 21:30
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i am sure he will be selling it

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Dakilla
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Hi zero, thanks for the support! lol. Anyways we are planning to sell the game. But date to release is still along way to go. Hopefully if all goes well the game will be available for purchase in 1.5 years max!. Also with dbpro's dev team we hope to prove that dbpro is a good development product when it comes to making commercial games. all ya need is a lil love and patience.Cheers.
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The admiral
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Lol some of us already know that dbpro is capable of proffesional and commercial type products. But its good to see you guys so commited and hard working we all know how easy it can be to give up when things get tough.

[href]www.vapourhost.com/~flyer[/href]
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Cellbloc Studios
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Let me know if you need a publisher. I have contacts in both the USA and Europe.

-This...is my boomstick!
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Cellbloc Studios
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Posted: 10th Oct 2004 06:17 Edited at: 10th Oct 2004 06:19
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Double Post. Sorry about that.

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The dude guy
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AWESOME GRAPHICS! Where'd you learn to model like that!?!?!?!?

Here's my forums www.andrewtamalunas.proboards28.com . Please join!
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ALPHA ZERO PRODUCTIONS
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better than my models that 4 sure

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Red Ocktober
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Posted: 10th Oct 2004 10:05 Edited at: 10th Oct 2004 10:10
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No... No... No... This can't be a Dark Basic game... it just can't!!!

i thought they said DB was another one of those can't make professional looking games...

oh man, i just saw the video... i'm still in shock!!!

great work BE... just plain great...

questions... are those shadered effects... bumpmapping on the interiors and a different metallic shader on the ships???

[added]
ok... ok... i've calmed down a bit... had a chance to really read through the thread...

can't wait to see how it all translates into ingame scenes...

ok, later... i'm going back to play the video again... and again...

--Mike
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Dakilla
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cellbloc studios: Hi we're always on the lookout for potential publishing deals/contacts if you do know of any contacts out there you could drop us a mail at pr@badnose.com if you dont want to post your email on this board. Cheers.

Red Ocktober:Yes DBPRO CAN MAKE PROFESSIONAL GAMES. LOL. Just to clarify that the trailer you saw does have shader effects. However after much consideration and testing we've decided to scrap the shader effects as most vid cards still run them pretty slow and if you keep looking at that video I'm pretty sure you'll be spotting lotsa animation problems.It aint perfect but we're still learning.Cheers.
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Red Ocktober
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... it may not be perfect, but it's da#m close to it

thanks for the additional info...

again... really impressive job.

--Mike
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Cellbloc Studios
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Posted: 11th Oct 2004 03:22 Edited at: 11th Oct 2004 03:26
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@Dakilla:

Not a problem. Who should I address the email to? I also use MSN/AOL Messenger services if you need to talk to me directly.

[EDIT]
I see that your hiring programmers. I have only worked on 3 published commercial projects, is that enough?

-This...is my boomstick!
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Peter H
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Quote: "I'm pretty sure you'll be spotting lotsa animation problems"

yeah the guy walked a little "stiffly"...maybe add a little opposite movement? (I.E. left foot goes forward, right shoulder goes back)

"We make the worst games in the universe."

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Dakilla
20
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Joined: 20th Dec 2003
Location: Malaysia
Posted: 11th Oct 2004 13:56
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Hi cellbloc just address it to Yap or Thomas. We can talk further from there. Cheers!
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