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Geek Culture / [LOCKED] Stop the coup

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JoshK
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Posted: 28th Oct 2004 17:46
If you can vote next week, you have got to, and make sure everyone else does, too. Post this image anywhere you can.


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David T
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Posted: 28th Oct 2004 17:55
Is there a coup on? Who's protesting - Republicans

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Eric T
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Posted: 28th Oct 2004 18:31
<--Can vote
<--Thought about voting
<--Noticed both candidates are worthless
<--Decided to stay home on november second doing something more worthwhile to me, playing with myself.



Teh Go0rfmeister
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Posted: 28th Oct 2004 18:55
*still doesnt see whyt people dare to vote bush from what we hear in the UK... ok forgetting the war in iraq, but surely the tax cuts for the rich are enough to piss anyone off

indi
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Posted: 28th Oct 2004 19:03
we are supposed to be in a democratic society in australia but we dont have a choice, we have to vote, Not that I do anyway

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Peter H
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Posted: 28th Oct 2004 22:10
nice digatily edited photo...but one mistake...his finger is way too long

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Dave J
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Posted: 28th Oct 2004 22:17
Quote: "we are supposed to be in a democratic society in australia but we dont have a choice, we have to vote, Not that I do anyway "


*Gasp*


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Ian T
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Posted: 28th Oct 2004 22:46
Quote: "*still doesnt see whyt people dare to vote bush from what we hear in the UK... ok forgetting the war in iraq, but surely the tax cuts for the rich are enough to piss anyone off"


Most of your papers are, I'm sorry to say, hilariously biased. They're the kind of stuff you should read along with a very conservative paper to get a fairly balanced perspective. Same with TV. The only way to get balanced news is to watch both sides of the story, and believe me, you'e only getting one.

Five people in my immediate family registered voters, all voting for Bush . As I predicted on another forum, he's probably going to win by 2-4% with the difference within the margin of error in some key states, which the liberals will undoubtedly make a big deal about. Doesn't matter in the end anyways.

It'll be nice to have sane taxes for four more years at least .


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Kentaree
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Posted: 28th Oct 2004 23:27
Mouse, how do you know television on your side of the ocean isn't horribly biased? It's as easy to say for you as it is for us. Don't forget we get both US and European tv, so we CAN see both sides of the story. How many non-US news sources do you see?

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Ian T
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Posted: 28th Oct 2004 23:32
Quote: " Mouse, how do you know television on your side of the ocean isn't horribly biased?"


I didn't say it wasn't. Obviously it is. You're jumping to conclusions . It is not, however, nearly as far to the right as your UK TV to the left-- evidence, every major US TV station has portrayed Kerry in a favorable light at one time or another and follows his campaign fairly evenly, but I haven't heard of your TV stations having any reporting on Bush that even pretend to be unbiased.

The best way to get the full story is Google News. Read the article from conservative, moderate and liberal sources.


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David T
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Posted: 28th Oct 2004 23:49 Edited at: 28th Oct 2004 23:51
I watch Al Jazeera *

I read their coverage of the Iraq Invasion was praised for the quality.

Rather than us in the West seeing a few troops firing a shell into the distance, with shouts of "yeah!" when it hits the ground Al Jazeera had people actually at the sites where the missiles hit. It certainly wasn't nice and clean like our coverage suggested.

On a different note - who came up with Sky News' colour scheme?!? Bright blue (0,0,255) with bright red (255,0,0)? It's awful!

*in fact I only watch that a few times. I watch BBC News 24 along with Sky News when I want my eyes burned and Fox when I need a laugh

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Kentaree
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Posted: 28th Oct 2004 23:57
Yup, you're right, you didnt say the tv over there wasnt biased, my apologies.

Quote: "but I haven't heard of your TV stations having any reporting on Bush that even pretend to be unbiased"


I can honestly say I haven't heard any tv stations over here try and portray either Bush or Kerry in an particularly unfavourable light. I watch a selection of news channels, and one of my jobs is in a newsagent, so I can read plenty of different newspapers
The tabloids mostly take potshots, but at both candidates, and the broadsheets give fairly unbiased info on both.

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Ian T
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Posted: 29th Oct 2004 00:00 Edited at: 29th Oct 2004 00:02
Quote: "
Rather than us in the West seeing a few troops firing a shell into the distance, with shouts of "yeah!" when it hits the ground Al Jazeera had people actually at the sites where the missiles hit. It certainly wasn't nice and clean like our coverage suggested."


Who the heck ever suggested war was clean? People are killed. Violently. Bloodily. It often is not very quick at all. Civilians are caught in the crossfire. Smart bombs miss. Allied troops mistake each other for enemies. Innocents and warriors alike die. It's a war. I and the people fighting this have understood it from the outset. We have also understood the alternatives. I find it amusing liberal pacifict celebrities like Madonna can present pictures of the 'terror' we've brought to Iraq with a straight face knowing the atrocities commited regularly under Saddam Hussain which frankly I can't even list in a forum which very young people visit. I'd like to see them stand up to evil and do the right thing once in their sad, foppish, spoiled rotten lives. Meh, letting a rant get in here. Sorry.


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Kentaree
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Posted: 29th Oct 2004 00:03
The funny thing is, under Saddam's regime, people knew that stuff like that was going to happen, but now, there's total and utter chaos, along with killings and torturings, and suicide bombings which didn't happen when Saddam was in charge, so while things have changed, they haven't changed all that much.

That said, its the Iraqis themselves to blame at this stage. I agree totally with mouse that its a war, what do you expect, pillow fights?

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Ian T
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Posted: 29th Oct 2004 00:08 Edited at: 29th Oct 2004 00:08
I have two opinions on this.

Optimistic- We undoubtedly did the right thing trying to pull Iraq out of the control of Saddam and the insane power struggles of the Middle East. It'll never be fun there until the wars stop all over (probably never), but it can get a whole lot better.

Pessimistic- The democracy is temporary. There is no hope for Iraq as long as there are countries like Afganistan and Iran around pulling them down into the endless spiral of religious warfare. We did the 'right' thing, but it was stupid, because there's no hope for the country; it was a waste of our troops' lives.

(Edit: Before someone jumps on me, 'our' meant the coallition, okay?)

Sigh. I have a feeling realistic is the second option.


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Damokles
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Posted: 29th Oct 2004 00:22
Quote: "Pessimistic- The democracy is temporary."


I highly doubt there is democracy there.
Honestly I doubt there is real democracy anywhere.

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Kentaree
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Posted: 29th Oct 2004 00:22
Yes, I do believe it was the right thing to get rid of Saddam. The excuse they gave was invalid, and I don't like the way they went about it, but hey. Problem is, the moment the other countries pull out, the next Saddam is going to come into power.

My opinion is: give them their country back, like they want. What they do with it afterwards is their problem.

We have gone extremely off-topic though. Who I'd vote for if I was American? Kerry. Why? Cos Bush has had his chance, Kerry can't be much worse anyway (I hope).

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Shadow Robert
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Posted: 29th Oct 2004 00:22
Quote: "Most of your papers are, I'm sorry to say, hilariously biased. They're the kind of stuff you should read along with a very conservative paper to get a fairly balanced perspective. Same with TV. The only way to get balanced news is to watch both sides of the story, and believe me, you'e only getting one."


Quote: "It is not, however, nearly as far to the right as your UK TV to the left-- evidence, every major US TV station has portrayed Kerry in a favorable light at one time or another and follows his campaign fairly evenly, but I haven't heard of your TV stations having any reporting on Bush that even pretend to be unbiased."


Quote: "The best way to get the full story is Google News. Read the article from conservative, moderate and liberal sources."


You have never watched any UK TV nor have you ever read all of the UK newspapers.

Sorry but your statements are clearly from someone who is going on pure hear'say about how the British portray the US Presidential Race.

I think the main problem here is you seem to have a stereotypical view on what our culture is like and is portraying. Unlike the US, here your able to get a huge range of news channels and papers from the United States and Europe.

While there are a small selection of bag-rags (tabloids) which simply take pot shots and try to show another naked celebraty or some backwater fool who married his dog to get a tax cut; there are only a very very small selection of the available papers which fit into this catagory.

I'm not going to say that any of our papers aren't Conservative, Liberal or Democratic based; and this comes across in the writing of them. It is however stupid to say that they are one side or the other. Many of our papers and news channels do thier best to provide an unbias oppinion although this doesn't always work out as such, the fact that we have an entire spectrum of papers and new channels which provide a choice any person with remote intelligence will know that the news is something being interpreted and not written in stone.

now i could be as close minded and stupid as you to say the US only has a single bias opinion in thier newspapers and news channels; but the fact is that isn't true. while to a degree alot of them will not cause trouble like the BBC recently did covering the Iraqi Situation in an unfavourable light (causing the resignation of a number of high ranking BBC producers), the fact remains that provided you bridge out from the channel/paper which panders to your particular views you usually can get a pretty good view of everything.

Niether nation is a silenced dictatorship, with the news only being what the government wants it to be. So stop your pathetic ragging on other nations for the views of a few people.

From what i've seen neither candidate is really cared about by our media either way. I've taken the time to watch a good few of the debates they've done on BBC News24 and CNN; personally all i see alot is Bush taking focus away from his own policies to attack the stance, history and nature of Kerry s'.
While Kerry goes into what he plans to do (in detail often), Bush keeps trying to side track issues by pulling on the strings of Kerrys ideas and notions.

It was said above 'Bush seems to be lowering tax for the Rich', while it can be said he is pandering to the Rich ($200K+ Bracket) the fact of the matter is that he wasn't. He gave the same tax cut to every level of the nation; Problem is he also seems to be spending more because of his actions which do not consern the country.

Bush hasn't been a particularly bad president in what he promised he has actually somewhat gone on to do, not exactly what was promised but atleast he did it. Facts remain though that he has pushed the country into a decline of thier wealth, spreading natural resources thin and generally making the job of the next guy to balance the budget very hard.

You can't simply sit down and believe you have once side of the story from a single source, and you can't believe everything your told. People in each instance have already made thier decisions conserning these characters; although it may not be ment alot try and sway you to thier particular choice.

This said I don't know why I'm even bothering to argue for either of the outspoken people (Froogle/Mouse) considering neither of your are old enough to vote, so who cares what you think.


PowerSoft
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Posted: 29th Oct 2004 00:25
where you been?


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Ian T
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Posted: 29th Oct 2004 00:29 Edited at: 29th Oct 2004 00:31
Ahem.

For once I agree with something Raven says:

Quote: "It was said above 'Bush seems to be lowering tax for the Rich', while it can be said he is pandering to the Rich ($200K+ Bracket) the fact of the matter is that he wasn't. He gave the same tax cut to every level of the nation; Problem is he also seems to be spending more because of his actions which do not consern the country."


My family can be considered by no sane level of judgement 'wealthy', but we got a big tax break under Bush and Kerry can't wait to make it harder for us to pay for food, water, electricity etc all over again.


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PowerSoft
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Posted: 29th Oct 2004 00:31
me? I was asking where he had been.


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David T
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Posted: 29th Oct 2004 00:31
Quote: "Who the heck ever suggested war was clean? People are killed. Violently. Bloodily. It often is not very quick at all. Civilians are caught in the crossfire. Smart bombs miss. Allied troops mistake each other for enemies. Innocents and warriors alike die. .......... Saddam Hussain which frankly I can't even list in a forum which very young people visit. I'd like to see them stand up to evil and do the right thing once in their sad, foppish, spoiled rotten lives. Meh, letting a rant get in here. Sorry."


Okay I seem to have hit a nerve I'm not personally shocked by the war. I was just saying that in general our news portrays the war in a better light than it might be.

For example

- Bomb hits coalition journalists camp, 20 journalists killed from the US and UK.

- Bomb hits residential area, 20 civilians killed.

Which one would you honestly give precedence?

Quote: "Sigh. I have a feeling realistic is the second option."


So do I. The area has never known democracy, we can't induce it within a few years. Perhaps in the next 10,20, or even 50 years we'll see things change.

Quote: "Honestly I doubt there is real democracy anywhere."


Funny you said that - I was reading a magazine yesterday in Paris CDG that ranked Canada as more corrupt than Oman and Norway. Random

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Ian T
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Posted: 29th Oct 2004 00:32
I just edited the post. Originally it was a comment on Raven's absense, which was just taking the post off topic .


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Ian T
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Posted: 29th Oct 2004 00:33
Quote: "Honestly I doubt there is real democracy anywhere."


If by 'real democracy' you mean pure democracy, AKA mob rule, then yeah, thank god. The US is a republic baby.


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PowerSoft
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Posted: 29th Oct 2004 00:34
oh. where has he been?


btw i think the war was right for the wrong reasons


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Kentaree
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Posted: 29th Oct 2004 00:36 Edited at: 29th Oct 2004 00:37
Gah, I wont even comment on corruption. Oh wait, I will

From what I've seen from the last US election, there was plenty of corruption and bribery going on there, while the US are always supervising other elections to make sure they're fair, which I find ironic.

Ireland. In my opinion one of the most twisted and corrupt countries in Europe, if not the northern hemisphere. The government promises everything, does nothing, spends millions on stuff like private planes and holidays, when there's a hospital 20 miles from here that's lying half empty cos they're not getting the funding to pay for staff.
I wont even go into what you can get done by slipping someone a wad of cash into their hand.

p.s If I disappear after this post, I ask of the US people in this forums to get the government to label Ireland as a dictatorship and avenge me

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The Big Babou
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Posted: 29th Oct 2004 00:37 Edited at: 29th Oct 2004 00:38
to relax this discussion a bit, something funny:

http://www.wc3sear.ch/misc/Voting_Machine.wmv

edit: link edited

... they call it a royale with cheese ...
Ian T
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Posted: 29th Oct 2004 00:39
Quote: "
From what I've seen from the last US election, there was plenty of corruption and bribery going on there, while the US are always supervising other elections to make sure they're fair, which I find ironic."


I would not put it past either political party to bribe, cheat, lie, steal and kill to secure the election.

However, I think the fault of this lies with the left. My logic here is very clean and simple: The right stands for a small government and rights of the people; the left stands for a large, 'parent' government that takes care of everything. The more the left gets their way, the more power the government has, the more the corruption spreads. More and more evil leaks in as more power falls into the hands of the government. This is one of the reasons it is crucial that the right retain the presidency.


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Kentaree
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Posted: 29th Oct 2004 00:43
Something else funny:

The Irish government spent 50 million euros this year on buying and setting up a new electronic voting system, running on a modified version of windows98 and using an access database for storage. The system was deemed insecure by experts after purchase, and the system has been ditched. What a waste of 50million...

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Ian T
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Posted: 29th Oct 2004 00:44
That is pretty funny. By the way, I totally agree with you about Ireland. It's sad how much abuse that country has seen over the years .


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Damokles
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Posted: 29th Oct 2004 00:46
Well, to get some stress away, tell me what that proggy said about your next vote :
http://www.albinoblacksheep.com/flash/voter.php

- Mind the gap -
Ian T
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Posted: 29th Oct 2004 00:47
I just made another exception to the general policy and removed your post Manticore, as it--

Took the post off topic

Contained inappropriate content


And this is a serious discussion.

Why don't you try acting your age?


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Ian T
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Posted: 29th Oct 2004 00:49
*lol* Damokles. I got 'middle of the road independant'. But that thing really didn't make any sense-- asking you which hateful steriotype you hate more and judging your political stance by it is pretty stupid, especially because many people will hate their own steriotypes which give them bad names more than those of their enemies!


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Kentaree
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Posted: 29th Oct 2004 01:02 Edited at: 29th Oct 2004 01:04
Uhm, a tiny bit offtopic, but WTF?

http://forum.thegamecreators.com/xt/xt_apollo_download.php?i=423810

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David T
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Posted: 29th Oct 2004 01:20
It's That Dude Guy, he's out to get you with his army of smilies

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JoshK
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Posted: 29th Oct 2004 01:52 Edited at: 29th Oct 2004 02:08
Quote: "The right stands for a small government and rights of the people; the left stands for a large, 'parent' government that takes care of everything."

Mouse, you are a fool. How does the Patriot Act stand for the rights of the people? How does Bush increasing the size of the government since Clinton left office stand for small government? How does running up the biggest debt in history stand for fiscal responsibility?

Bush is not a Republican. I'm a Green, but would happily prefer a real Republican to the fascist Bush.

How does experimental nation-building stand for anything but a large parent government taking care of everything? How does the Department of Homeland Security stand for anything but an Orwellian nightmare?

Your normal paradigm of right/left good/evil does not apply this year. We are under attack by a revolutionary force.

How can you possibly justify torture in concentration camps, suspension of the Bill of Rights, secret arrests, and unprovoked invasions of nonthreatening nations in the name of lower taxes(?) Your lower taxes, (even if they reall are under Bush) aren't going to mean much when they come to place you in the camps.

Doesn't it BOTHER you that the Bush regime is subverting our democratic process? Okay, maybe you trust Bush with dictatoral power, but what about his successor?

These are fundamental tenants of America. If a democrat were destroying the Constitution like Bush is, you would be calling for civil war. What is wrong with you? Why can't you see that it is possible that a Republican president who claims to be Christian might have bad intent?

Oh, and that picture is NOT edited.

The secret police:
http://www.livejournal.com/users/anniesj/331112.html

Voter fraud in Florida:
http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story2&u=/latimests/20041027/ts_latimes/signsofvoterfraudappear
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/programmes/newsnight/3956129.stm
http://deseretnews.com/dn/view/0,1249,595101100,00.html
http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=564&ncid=703&e=7&u=/nm/20041027/ts_nm/campaign_florida_dc

Violence and unrest:
http://www.dmregister.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20041016/NEWS09/410160329/1001
http://www.sun-sentinel.com/news/local/southflorida/sfl-1027politicalattack,0,5218066.story?coll=sfla-home-headlines
http://www.cnn.com/2004/ALLPOLITICS/10/27/fl.13.harris.attack/

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David T
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Posted: 29th Oct 2004 01:55 Edited at: 29th Oct 2004 01:59
On a different note, access to georgewbush.com has been blocked to all but US citizens.

Good old BBC listed all the alternate ways to get in

https://georgewbush.com/

http://65.172.163.222/

http://origin.georgewbush.com/

So much money gets invested for ads, campaigns, 'bribes', celebrity endorsements etc that really the deciding factor today in an election is not who's got the better policies but who has the biggest bank balance to hire all the PR people. Sad I know.

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Dazzag
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Posted: 29th Oct 2004 02:17
I only ever voted once. It When I was 18. There was no point in my area as the welsh party (Plaid Cymru) always won at the time. Still, had to have a laugh. Have some recollection of me and my mates being told to put our beer cans in the bin or sling our hooks. I can't remember much else, because I'm afraid I was very, very, drunk...

Cheers

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Ian T
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Posted: 29th Oct 2004 02:34
Quote: "Mouse, you are a fool."


Hate to break it to you, but it typically doesn't bode well for an argument when it's opened with an ad hominem. Let's see how this holds up.

Quote: "How does the Patriot Act stand for the rights of the people?"


Immediatly you sidetrack the topic from Republican policy to the actions of Bush and Ashcroft. Since I never allegated what you imply, I have no reason to defend it.

Quote: "How does Bush increasing the size of the government since Clinton left office stand for small government?"


And sidetrack the issue to Bush's policies...

Quote: "How does running up the biggest debt in history stand for fiscal responsibility?"


And take it completely off topic to what I was talking about.

Quote: "Bush is not a Republican. I'm a Green"


His party would know that rather better than you, then.

Quote: "How does experimental nation-building stand for anything but a large parent government taking care of everything?"


You pull the old 'spreading the Amerikkkan Empire' ploy out of nowhere; typical, but fallacious, and completely without evidence. So far this is looking like a typical Argument by Scenario (that's logically incorrect).

Quote: "How does the Department of Homeland Security stand for anything but an Orwellian nightmare?"


God forbid we have a department to defend America from terrorist attacks. Better resurrect Philip K. Dick quickly!

Quote: "Your normal paradigm of right/left good/evil does not apply this year. We are under attack by a revolutionary force."


Once again; big words, no evidence for the case.

Quote: "How can you possibly justify torture in concentration camps"


Appeal to Fear and Coincidence. I don't need to formally riposte this, I think; suffice to say it's the same logical structure as saying that police forces are works of evil because crooked cops exist.

Quote: "suspension of the Bill of Rights"


Fun fact: Clinton declared eight national emergencies which granted him un-Constitutional power during his eight years of presidency. None were canceled. Another fun fact: You're still wildly off topic, when will you get back to the argument I actually presented?

Quote: "secret arrests"


An interesting mix of the above two fallacies.

Quote: "and unprovoked invasions of nonthreatening nations"


Threats to use nuclear power, development of illegal biological weapons and use of those same weapons on religion enemies, complete lack of cooperation with UN investigations and repeated, well documented harboring of terrorist organizations is nonthreatening... ah, sure.

Quote: "in the name of lower taxes(?) Your lower taxes, (even if they reall are under Bush) aren't going to mean much when they come to place you in the camps."


This is one of the funniest things I've read all year.



Ahh! They're coming to get me!

And again, since this is wildly off topic to my actual arguments, there is no need for a formal response.

Quote: "Doesn't it BOTHER you that the Bush regime is subverting our democratic process?"


It's an administration, not a regime; the regime would be the large government system that your darling left has created over several hundred years.

Quote: "Okay, maybe you trust Bush with dictatoral power, but what about his successor?"


Finally a valid argument, and an important one about the dangers of a totalitarian government system even under a benevolant leader. Unfortunatly for you it still has zilch to do with the argument at hand.

Quote: "These are fundamental tenants of America."


I take it you're refering to our Bill of Rights. Well, yeah.

Quote: "If a democrat were destroying the Constitution like Bush is, you would be calling for civil war."


Except Bush isn't destroying the constitution. Once again, you pull a 'everybody knows this' "fact" out of your... hat, with no evidence, no sources and thusly and soforth a fallacious conclusion.

Quote: "What is wrong with you? Why can't you see that it is possible that a Republican president who claims to be Christian might have bad intent?"


This is probably the worst, though not the funniest, of all the arguments I've seen here yet. Let's address its problems one by one.

1. You assume I support Bush because of his Christianity. I'm not a Christian; I don't consider myself to follow any organized religion.

2. You assume that I support Bush in denial of the obvious evidence against him you yourself have simply made up every 'argument' in your topic.

3. You assume I don't think Bush might have some 'bad intent'. I have never once defended his personal integrity in this thread.


Some pointers for you in the future.

In a debate, do not make assumptions, much less wild assumptions.

If you have to make assumptions, do not apply stereotypes to your opponent when making them. It rarely produces good results.

Do not sidetrack the issue into related matters. It is illogical.

Thank you.


Here we go again!
Whaddaya mean there's no such data type as a flaot?[/i]
JoshK
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Posted: 29th Oct 2004 02:50 Edited at: 29th Oct 2004 02:52
What the hell was that? You have the reasoning of an alcoholic.

Sometimes I think Bush could say "Yeah, I let 9-11 happen, because I needed it to support my agenda", and the Bush supporters would find some way to bend their values to accomodate this, and still support him.

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Flashing Blade
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Posted: 29th Oct 2004 03:13
If I was a bookie I'd be offering about 1/50 on that this thread gets locked very soon.

Politics and religion will always turn ugly.


The word "Gullible" cannot be found in any English Dictionary.
Rob K
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Posted: 29th Oct 2004 03:20 Edited at: 29th Oct 2004 03:22
I think I'll let it roll on for at least a few more pages yet, give people a chance to really wind themselves up for the entertainment of the rest of us

By the way, if anyone is interested, first person to email me on or after November 2nd with proof that they voted for Kerry gets a free pint on me (Terms and Conditions Apply). The US' policies have a significant impact on the UK, so I'd like to have my say.


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Damokles
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Posted: 29th Oct 2004 03:34
I think I know why mouse is talking like that.
Here, look : The truth

- Mind the gap -
geecee3
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Location: edinburgh.scotland.
Posted: 29th Oct 2004 03:36
Being from Scotland, I have lived under a Back door Dictatorship all my life. It's called westminster. They use scotland with it's population of 6 million to provide 66% of the UK armed forces. they sold off all scotlands oil and gas reserves to US companies. They introduced a TAX called the POLL TAX, 2 whole years before the rest of the UK. But it's not just scotland. wales and northern ireland have also had repeated shaftings from a westminster government. and now the european union is trying to have a go at dictating our lives. will the power struggle ever end? not as long as there is personal gain for the lamers who sit at the top of the tree dictating what we are allowed to do as individuals, just because they THINK it's right. Who says they are right? themselves, that's who. the more power an individual posesses, the more they have to loose. They will try to protect their own interests and jobs before helping the common man better his world. It's no longer about what PEOPLE want. It's about big business, money, and shareholders.

It's all crap. and voting for them is just encouraging their already over inflated ego's and wallets.

I don't vote. there is no point. people in power will always protect what sustains their way of life at any cost. even if that cost is WAR under false pretences.

regards, geecee3.
JoelJ
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Posted: 29th Oct 2004 03:45
Quote: "How does running up the biggest debt in history stand for fiscal responsibility?"

let me tell you something, its called WAR, you cant fight a war without money.

Quote: "Sometimes I think Bush could say "Yeah, I let 9-11 happen, because I needed it to support my agenda", and the Bush supporters would find some way to bend their values to accomodate this, and still support him."

everytime i hear(or read) someone say that, i want to freaking bash their retarded faces in. you can really REALLY offend someone saying that. people DIED in that accedent, REAL PEOPLE JUST LIKE YOU. and their families are STILL alive, and some of their families/friends could be reading this post, and those people really dont want to hear that thier own country killed THOUSANDS of its citizens, i dont care what you believe REALLY happened on 9/11, but keep it to your self, seriously.

and for anyone hear who are against Bush for going to war.
The president really has NO SAY weither we go to war, yes its his idea, but in order to take it to war, it has to go thru the senate. Who was a senator during this time? oh! John Kerry! what did Kerry vote? GO TO WAR! IM WITH THIS WAR ALL THE WAY! YES!!!

realize you voted in your OWN senators, THEY are the people who took us to war.


<[jimmy]> pulling nose hairs is the worst pain in the world
Damokles
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Posted: 29th Oct 2004 03:49
geecee3, you make me think about a famous guy, who said :
"When you vote, you only choose the next person who is going to eploit you. To change it, we shall find something else than elections"

- Mind the gap -
ionstream
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Location: Overweb
Posted: 29th Oct 2004 03:50
Josh, why did you need to start a flame war? Your not going to sway anyone's vote by posting that horribly photoshopped image. Your just going to make the Republicans mad and the Democrats feel secure.

This image is not visible to idiots.

Ian T
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Posted: 29th Oct 2004 03:54 Edited at: 29th Oct 2004 03:54
Klint's just trying to start a flamewar in the thread. Something along the lines of 'you have the reasoning of an alchoholic' with absolutely no evidence for the case tends to be the defense of someone who does not have logic or reason on their side.

He's hardly doing Kerry proud though, at least that guy knows how to debate .


Here we go again!
Whaddaya mean there's no such data type as a flaot?[/i]
Pricey
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Posted: 29th Oct 2004 03:56
If I were american I would most certainly vote for Mr.Bush, simply for the rights of the unborn child.

Rob K
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Posted: 29th Oct 2004 03:57
Quote: "I don't vote. there is no point. "


Ultimately out of the 6 or 7 parties which stand in most areas in the UK, there must be one which represents your views more closely than the others. For you it may be a case of choosing the lesser evil.


Quote: "The president really has NO SAY weither we go to war,"

Quote: "yes its his idea"


This is a contradiction, is it not? Using the same reasoning, you could say that your parents have no say in whether or not you are born, because after conception there are so many other processes which have to be undertaken successfully in order to produce... you.


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