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DarkBASIC Professional Discussion / New to Dark Basic and Need Tools

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Arrow
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Joined: 1st Jan 2003
Location: United States
Posted: 6th Jan 2003 09:16
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Ok, I'm an Extreme novice here, so bear with me. I just ordered DBP and I'm probably gonna need some programs outside of DBP (like 3D tools, sound makers, ect.). I ordered via the internet, and since I live in the USA (wish I didn't) I got some time to find them. Do you guys got any sugestions on what I need, cash is a factor so programs like Maya are out. Also what are your guy's systems specs up to? Am I going to need a ton of RAM? Thanx for the help in advance.
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the architect
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Posted: 6th Jan 2003 10:18
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U will find:
Quarke for quake-good level builder but needs to be configured. However it is free, it does work and does not expect royalties.
Pakscape or Wally to develope your pakfiles.
Milkshape 3d to create your entities- Monsters, objects etc
It is not free ($29) but the demo will allow you to give it a go and it will provide your modelling needs. It is used by anyone who makes mods for quake, half-life etc
A bitmap editor although Wally should do.
I have found these to be easy to use once you overcome the truama of unfamiliality. Persevere cos it's well worth it.

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Kangaroo2
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Posted: 6th Jan 2003 23:58
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Milkshape, Paint Shop Pro, Cartography Shop. Last 1 not essential but nice. All are cheap

* If the apocalypse comes, email me *
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the architect
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Posted: 7th Jan 2003 01:08
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cartography shop does not even scratch quaRKE.
My advice is learn the harder option. It will let you
render light, add your own textures. Best of all is
its free!!!!!!!!!!!

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rapscaLLion
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Posted: 7th Jan 2003 02:53
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Cartography shop... not worth it ATM.
There are loads of free tools out there, for 2D graphics I suggest Photoshop (that one isn't free), and if you can't afford that, GIMP is free I believe.

Alex Wanuch
aka rapscaLLion
Kousen Dev Progress >> Currently Working On Editors
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Arrow
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Posted: 7th Jan 2003 15:18
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Ah, arigato, comrades. I got photoshop, but still trying to master it. Where would go about finding Quarke, Wally and/or Pakscape? Is there a web site for them or will I have to do a bit of digging? Speeking of which, I'm gonna sound real green here, what are Pakfiles? Anywho thanks for the info, by the by, how much memory is this stuff gonna use up? I'm starting to run low on Hard drive space, would get more but bills are tight this month.

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Van B
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Posted: 7th Jan 2003 15:30
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Well, if you feel like seamless textures and smooth transitions - visit my website (www link below signature) and grab VANseam and VANtrans. They should make things a bit easier, VANseam is an art package for making seamless textures without fuss, VANtrans turns 2 seamless textures into blended matrix tiles. Both are free and written in DB.

Why not take a look a JTEdit too, it's a .x file modeller - haven't used it much but I think it's free, and the author is a forum member here. You should be able to find a topic about it quite easily.


Van-B
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the architect
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Posted: 8th Jan 2003 04:52
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DATS EASY
Go to the resources on this sight, you will find they will point to to everything. I strongly dvice you stick to the tools I suggested as it is easy to go downloading everything and not learning anything!

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the architect
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Posted: 8th Jan 2003 04:56
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PAK FILES are like zip files. You put the BSP files and any textures in a PAK file and dark basic extracts the BSP using the load bsp command. PAKSCAPE is a matter of making a new pak file and dropping all your files in it. Before you BSP are levels in games and you can Edit your own using QuaRKE. Dont bother with the BSP compiler in Dark Basic Pro tools. Quarke is well worth the effort instead.

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Arrow
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Posted: 8th Jan 2003 05:10
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Where can I find this QuaRKE? I've searched google, but no luck in finding it.

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Benjamin
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Posted: 8th Jan 2003 13:25
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The new version of Cartography shop is out and i got it for free coz i already got version 2.0

xxxpetratxxx
B. R. W
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the architect
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Posted: 8th Jan 2003 14:49
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Hito
Cartography will set you back $40. Dont pay.

http://dynamic.gamespy.com/~quark/

This will do the job. Just perservere. It's worth it.

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the architect
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Posted: 8th Jan 2003 14:54
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If your going to write applications you are going to have
to clear that hard drive for textures, models, tools etc

I have given up gaming to pursue programming in the full. I
am tired of writing Mods for everyone elses games.

How KEEN r u?

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indi
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Posted: 8th Jan 2003 17:12
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I have some misc tools on my site in the code sections

open source also if u want to know how i did it.

http://www.lunarpixel.com

http://www.lunarpixel.com/dt/
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Arrow
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Posted: 9th Jan 2003 03:54
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Thanx for this site, I'm downloading Quark as we speak. I dought 2GB is enough room, but hopefully I can get a 80GB hard drive this weakend. I would still have about 15GB but a XP update messed up my com and sealed away half my hard drive. Unforcantly, while I'm all for open source, I don't even know how to set up a web site, GREEN!!!! Sorry for not posting this under the newbie section. You guy's been a real help, thanx.

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Van B
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Posted: 9th Jan 2003 10:06
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Architect,

I know your trying to help, but you've got a real attitude about it - some people have been making games for years and can suggest whatever programs they think helped them.

For a start, WTF is wally? - is it really the best option for 2D graphics? - I seriously doubt it.

And, how much does it cost to use quark to make your levels, I mean legally - there's gonna be a huge licence fee.

Bear in mind that this is a game making community, not a mod making community - our tools are largely different.

I strongly suggest Hito listens to everyones advice.


Van-B
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John H
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Posted: 9th Jan 2003 14:06
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xxxpetratxxx
The new version of Cartography shop is out and i got it for free coz i already got version 2.0

Why didnt I!!!!

RPGamer

Current - RPG: Eternal Destiny : Help Wanted!
http://www.halbrosproductions.netfirms.com
Dont ask those questions! Read the help files lazy!
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Scilynt
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Posted: 9th Jan 2003 15:35
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A little off-topic but to reply to Van-B, Wally is a free texture editing prog, mainly used for game mods. I suppose it doesn't have much use against PS and PSP. And Quark is completely free, and I'm pretty sure has no license fees at all.

Cya
Sx2
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Benjamin
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Posted: 9th Jan 2003 15:55
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i got an e-mail from someone with the file addresses

xxxpetratxxx
B. R. W
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Arrow
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Posted: 9th Jan 2003 19:24
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Well, I checked the readme files in Quark and there is nothing about licence fees. All it talked about was editing the original source code was ok. By the by, I checked out Cartography shop and I didn't like it. However I could use some tutorials for Quark and Milkshape. Oh yes, I like VANseam, thanks for the tool.

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the architect
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Posted: 10th Jan 2003 02:51
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Van B
QuaRKE clearly states it has NO liscence fee and is free!
Wally allows you to create any kind of texture file and pak file such as WAD. It is free!!! If u use your head you will find that MD3, MD2 etc are best edited using MOD tools. Probably why Lee Bamber as made DBPro very compatible with most mod making tools for Quake games and I think what is good enough for ROTW, Medal of Honor and Quake 3 is good enough for me. Mod making tools tend to be free and made by people independant of the companies.

And I have been programming computers since 1983! when I could program spectrum MACHINE code!

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the architect
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Posted: 10th Jan 2003 02:53
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Van B
But I have checked out your advice on the textures. CHEERS!

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the architect
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Posted: 10th Jan 2003 03:09
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Hito Hentai
check out milkshape site again. You have to download the tutorials and manual seperatly.
Quarke also has tutorials. Check out the sight again.
If your stuck or want more MOD sites for quake and halflife may be able to help. Remember that although you are not actually making a mod the files and maps etc are compatible with DBPro

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Kangaroo2
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Posted: 10th Jan 2003 03:09
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I too programmed Spectrum in machine code, and was just 7 years old

I have Quark and it is cool, I just like Cartography shop's interface and I find it simpler for what I do. I think $40 is a fair price I know why VanB thought you had to use liscence fee's, most other editors for Quake/Unreal/HalfLife you DO have to pay various licence fees to use them proffessionally. I THINK Quark doesn't have them though so you're right to recommend it as a free resource.

VAN-B: VANseam and VANtrans are MAD useful tools man! I haven't tried them b4 but kudos man, thank you!

* If the apocalypse comes, email me *
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Van B
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Posted: 10th Jan 2003 03:17
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Cheers Kangaroo .

Architect, sorry for beeing such a grumpy git :/, Quark looks bloody great, definately a great choice for DBPro. I don't think hito should consider an FPS for a first game though, too many beginners have started one then disapeared or started something else.

I would decide what my ultimate game would be, then consider each part and do some relevant mini projects, tech demos etc to learn the language first. Simple hierarchy limbed models are easier to master too, before looking into bone based animation, modelling is just as difficult as programming, and can take longer to get good results.


Van-B
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Arrow
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Posted: 10th Jan 2003 19:37
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Thanks for all the help. I've allread made a desent hand on MilkShape that's about 100 ploy, looks like the ones from Metal Gear Solid 1. I'm having troublt setting up joints for the wrist but I bet thost turorials will help out. After I get DBPro down I plan to make a RPG but that's probably the hardest kind due to the fact few have made demos of them.

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Arrow
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Posted: 10th Jan 2003 21:35
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Ok, I downloaded the Quark help files. Where should I unzip it to?

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mimesis
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Posted: 10th Jan 2003 23:46
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I can't belive people having problems finding
programs like quark,wally etc. by search.
Whats the problem? dusty telephone lines?
Here in Norway we keep our lines cold and very conductive
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the architect
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Posted: 11th Jan 2003 02:28
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Cartography is gong to be excellant when it is developed further but it has to few features for taste at the moment. I was however impressed by its simplicity and I do check the site every now and then to see how it's progressing.
Its just that Quarke is FREE!

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the architect
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Posted: 11th Jan 2003 02:30
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hentai
watch the poly's. They can waste away your life.
Ive made too many modals that were over sculpted!

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the architect
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Posted: 11th Jan 2003 02:38
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I had decided to make a shell program first. i.e. the quality etc is going to be naff to begin with. However with clever planning I will be able to develop the 3D and textures later and use reusable routines that will load my levels and characters seperatly. Therefore to begin with I'm only worried about the main programming. I intend to make the program easy to understand so other people can quickly develope thier own FPS on them. All they'll have to do is fill in the relevant information on a form (in NOTEPAD) and then cut and paste the text into the corresponding routines...sigh! So simple. AI is going to be a bugger though. Any tips for me ley me know. I begin them next month and although I have a few routines worked out some suggestions would be truly appreciated.

Any one read Sven Hassel.

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the architect
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Posted: 11th Jan 2003 02:40
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Sorry If I keep posted but I lways remember something when I come off.

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the architect
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Posted: 11th Jan 2003 02:40
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Like then!

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Van B
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Posted: 11th Jan 2003 02:53
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Carto shop is dead .

The author is discontinuing it, there's an post about it somewhere. He decided not to develop it because of the better options available for .bsp.


Van-B
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Arrow
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Posted: 11th Jan 2003 07:28
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No worries on the poly count, that one was really a test, I'll probably do as the N64 and give them simple fists, About finding Quark, there are other programs that fall under that name, namely Quark Express. Plus I live an hour drive to a place that resembles civilsation, 3 hour to a desent computer shop (my quest for a new Hard drive starts tommarrow). Oh yeah, where do I put the help files for Quark so I can use them?

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Kangaroo2
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Posted: 11th Jan 2003 16:29
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np man. And I agree with your advice on starting a game, and also about programming. Realistic animation is the b*tch for me

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the architect
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Posted: 15th Jan 2003 04:23
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If you look at one of my posts you will find I have put in a link. It will take you directly to quaRKE itself. Check out the case details.

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