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Geek Culture / Touch lamp switch?

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Osiris
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Posted: 23rd Jan 2005 09:38
does anyone know how to make one so i can replace my wall switch with a little protruding metal box with lights on it that light up when someone is touching it?

Ilya
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Posted: 23rd Jan 2005 09:39 Edited at: 23rd Jan 2005 09:40
NVM...

Quote: "I've seen the word programming and I'm not sure what it means. Anybody please explain?"


Quote: "We shouldn't sacrifice the truth to preserve "balance"."
Osiris
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Posted: 24th Jan 2005 04:56
does anyone have any ideas?

thanks

Oraculaca
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Posted: 24th Jan 2005 06:55
Stick to making games and not meddling with electricity

Osiris
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Posted: 24th Jan 2005 10:21
Quote: " Stick to making games and not meddling with electricity"


its pertty hard to when your an electrition!

i just wanted to know if there was any better way of going at it then i am going at thants all

Coding Fodder
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Posted: 24th Jan 2005 11:49
Quote: " Stick to making games and not meddling with electricity"


I would enjoy seeing anyone program games on babbage's counting machine.

@ osiris
I spent 2 years as an electrician as well and have four years of electronic engineering stuff that I am in the process of forgetting, so I am curious to know what your current plan is. Your question is a little fuzzy to me so tell me if I get you straight.

You want your room light to toggle on and off when you touch a metal box and you want some LEDs to light up when contact is being made.

The simplest thing to do would be to pull the guts out of a lamp that already has the toggle feature and rewire it into your box. That does not give you LED's though. I will have to think on it. I Like.

Something really catchy that makes people stop and think about the meaning of life and say to themselves "My but thats clever"
Osiris
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Posted: 24th Jan 2005 12:05
perfectly, i know how to jerry rig a touch switch but i completely forgot what the circut switch is called that is made for this sort of thing

Coding Fodder
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Posted: 24th Jan 2005 12:10
Which sort of thing? the BIG light or the led's

Something really catchy that makes people stop and think about the meaning of life and say to themselves "My but thats clever"
Osiris
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Posted: 24th Jan 2005 12:20
well i have an idea for the leds couldant i just have the power rnning through the switch power the leds and, and that switch i was talking about, i ment the one thats put into touch lamps

Shadow Robert
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Posted: 24th Jan 2005 12:40
A touch sensor? As in for waving your hand across and the light turns on / off?
I have that in my room, cause well you know you get bored sometimes and have the maplin catalog infront of you. It's kinda hard not to want to play with silly things. Instant problem was my door opens up past it, plus people walk in directly past it. So in retrospect it turns on / off all the bloody time and is now quite annoying.

I was thinking of sorting it out so that it's a touchpad instead so you actually have to touch it, but basically still lazier than flipping a switch heh
Goes quite nicely with the lighting rig I have in here though, because when my step-dad came down (who's a DIY nut), put in a recessive ceiling in the centre.. from that we then gave it a lip where a collection of 4 neon tubs are. They're only low-power things from philips that take ages to heat up, so you need to turn them on about 20minutes before you'll really need them; but once lit up they bounce against the light coloured walls to really give a much brighter light than a 100w bulb.

Next project is combining the computer desk with the cupboard so that I can basically slide things out from hidden places. Dislike clutter so-so much

I could be wrong about what you want, but usually speaking Maplin will have whatever you need. Often not too expensive about it either.

Oraculaca
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Posted: 24th Jan 2005 15:27
Quote: "its pertty hard to when your an electrition!"


Then you should know how to spell it.

Quote: "I would enjoy seeing anyone program games on babbage's counting machine."


Eh? you hardly stick a screwdriver into the back of your psu when your programming , do you?
All im saying is it is all too easy to kill yourself or others through poor circuitry. Having passed my Electrical Apprenticeship 10 years ago and having worked in an Engineering capacity since, I am more than aware of the dangers of electricity especially when you stumble across a 'Heath Robinson' job done by half assed cowboys. So forgive my misplaced concern , if you are a spark in sure youll figure it out.

OSX Using Happy Dude
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Posted: 24th Jan 2005 21:40
JohnG - can you change your signature. People dont tend to like their ones being copied without permission.

Lost in Thought
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Posted: 24th Jan 2005 21:59 Edited at: 24th Jan 2005 22:32
@ JohnG's sig

@Osiris If you can find a 130 in 1 electronics lab from Radio shack it has what you want in it. I think it is called a motorcycle effect or such (I was about 11 around 13 years ago when I tested something similar only I was turning on a remote control car). You touch a wire and the harder you squeese it the sound changes. You can modify this slightly to incorporate a small relay to close when the frequency gets high enough. I'll see what I can dig up.

Here are some schematics you may find interesting also
Main site is here
http://www.discovercircuits.com/C/capacitance-sw.htm

And circuits are here

http://www.discovercircuits.com/PDF-FILES/NewPDF/120v1out.pdf

http://www.discovercircuits.com/PDF-FILES/fingersw.pdf

[edit2] I didn't know there were so many electricians into programming. Somone should start an electrical problem thread somewhere Here is an old problem that is so simple but most people just look over the answer.

http://mapmasterz.com/problem.png

Good luck with your light switch.

Coding Fodder
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Posted: 24th Jan 2005 23:18
LIT Nice page. Osiris. The second link he provided is a scematic that does what you want. To opperate your LEDs you would want to take the signal from the output of D5. You probably want to isolate them with another resistor- PNP transistor. of course use a resistor to limit the current to an acceptable level through the LEDs, you will have to look at the specs of your components.

Good Luck,

Something really catchy that makes people stop and think about the meaning of life and say to themselves "My but thats clever"
Oraculaca
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Posted: 24th Jan 2005 23:50
Quote: "JohnG - can you change your signature. People dont tend to like their ones being copied without permission."


Just for you Squidgy.

OSX Using Happy Dude
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Posted: 25th Jan 2005 00:11 Edited at: 25th Jan 2005 00:19
It is still very similar to Ravens one - I would suggest changing it some more. At the moment it could be classed as 'passing off'.

It would also be best not to make fun of members in your signature either.

Oraculaca
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Posted: 25th Jan 2005 00:36
Hmm there is no mention of Raven in it, and the colour scheme is different and the wording is completly different ,so unless Raven has a copyright on the font and the word 'studio' , I dont really see the problem.

OSX Using Happy Dude
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Posted: 25th Jan 2005 00:39 Edited at: 25th Jan 2005 00:40
On the contary, I see a problem - it is still extremely similar to Ravens on, both in style and colour. You have only added an O In Raven to try and make it slightly different.

Oraculaca
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Posted: 25th Jan 2005 00:52
Quote: "it is still extremely similar to Ravens on, both in style and colour"

well I suggest you get your eyes checked for it is purple #8D6E90 to be precise, a colour which is different from Ravens choice of Gray.

Quote: "You have only added an O In Raven to try and make it slightly different."

The name of my studio is 'Rave On Studio' so I dont see the problem with having that in my signature.

As you will see from Ravens logo, he has a rather distinct graphic in the background and as I have already stated completely different text disregarding the word studio. So again I see no problem, other than a mod being over zealous and pedantic.

OSX Using Happy Dude
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Posted: 25th Jan 2005 00:54
Quote: "The name of my studio is 'Rave On Studio'"

If so, make the spaces bigger.

Oraculaca
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Posted: 25th Jan 2005 00:57
Quote: "If so, make the spaces bigger."


lol when did this forum descend into a Facist Regime? Or have you donned your art critic hat today? I dont believe my 'spaces' are being offensive to anybody.

Shadow Robert
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Posted: 25th Jan 2005 01:30
Quote: "lol when did this forum descend into a Facist Regime? Or have you donned your art critic hat today? I dont believe my 'spaces' are being offensive to anybody."


When users complain, about being plagerised. Also, yes the font used is my own design of Arial; even with image editing you are still using it without permission.

OSX Using Happy Dude
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Posted: 25th Jan 2005 01:33
If it keeps the peace.

OSX Using Happy Dude
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Posted: 25th Jan 2005 01:34
I'm going to refer this to No 1 - if people cant Live In Harmony...

Oraculaca
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Posted: 25th Jan 2005 02:56
Quote: "the font used is my own design of Arial"


since when do you have rights on stretching and squashing a standard font. All youve done is overlay a slightly darker version on top, hardly your own design.
This is recreated from scratch with a standard Arial font, hopefully free from any Raven copyright infringements.

Rob K
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Posted: 25th Jan 2005 03:35
Usually I would severely critcise any plagarism, but I think this is a case of "what goes around comes around."

Unfortunately I don't have the link to the thread where Raven denied any plagarism in his suspiciously NVidia-logo like sig, which memorably featured the caption, "Redefinign what it means to play". Apparently the misspelling of the first word was entirely intentional.

I am sure Raven understands that imitation is the sincerest form of flattery.


BlueGUI Windows Plugin
OSX Using Happy Dude
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Posted: 25th Jan 2005 04:21
I think we shall should have a new rule that stops plagarised and/or copied and modified signatures of any sort.

Damokles
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Posted: 25th Jan 2005 04:55
Quote: "I think we shall should have a new rule that stops plagarised and/or copied and modified signatures of any sort."


Sounds almost impossible to me ... because if you do, there would have to be a limit to know "what is plagiarism and what not, to which degree" and so on.
Then you fall into your own trap, because
- some people may try to begin ambiguous sigs just to proove wrong
- some people will argue when somebody makes it inadvertently, or do it as a joke.
- ...

Raven posted something before TCA's Remark. He didn't say anything about the sig. I believe if Raven had a problem with it, he could have said it himself. But of course, it's possible that he sent an email to TCA, to be sure his offense was not public, but I don't think it's Raven's way. I always saw him as somebody who dares to say what he thinks.
But maybe I'm wrong.

- Mind the gap -
Lost in Thought
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Posted: 25th Jan 2005 05:04 Edited at: 25th Jan 2005 05:14
This is a perfect example of how one person can totally ruin a thread. Thanks alot JohnG If you don't like someone there is no need in making fun of them. Treat others as you want to be treated. Not as they treat you. Don't even start any BS about having a "Rave On Studio" Your first sig was exactly like Ravens except for he bottom line. You were clearly making fun of him. Everyone has to grow up sometime. Why not today?

[edit]
Quote: "I think we shall should have a new rule that stops plagarised and/or copied and modified signatures of any sort."


Change that to

I think we shall should have a new rule that stops children or childish people from making sigs and or threads making fun of other forum members.

OSX Using Happy Dude
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Posted: 25th Jan 2005 05:04
Quote: "But of course, it's possible that he sent an email to TCA"

Which he did.

Oraculaca
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Posted: 25th Jan 2005 05:17
Quote: " This is a perfect example of how one person can totally ruin a thread. Thanks alot JohnG "


I believe that it was Squidgy that made the first comment.

OSX Using Happy Dude
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Posted: 25th Jan 2005 05:20
Certainly was...

Lost in Thought
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Posted: 25th Jan 2005 05:20 Edited at: 25th Jan 2005 05:22
But it was your sig that inspired it. Grow up and take responsibility for your actions.

[edit] You are correct though if I were in his place I would have deleted your post and put a warning there. And when you changed your sig to still make fun of a user in a different way I would have just banned you and forgone all of the rest of these posts.

Coding Fodder
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Posted: 25th Jan 2005 08:28
Twenty posts Later I would like to find out if osiris is making any progress on a very cool little project. Does being the only one in 20 post to be interested in the original topic make me a double poster?

Maybe we could set up a thread called "digressions"

Something really catchy that makes people stop and think about the meaning of life and say to themselves "My but thats clever"
Osiris
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Posted: 25th Jan 2005 09:32
oh sorry i was gone for a bit. anywho yes i drew up some blue prints for it and i think i may be able to put those three leds in there i just need some insight, could i hook up thoose leds directly to the switch (with resistors of course) and run them off of the power that comes out of the wall, or would that be too much?, havent done this sort of project in a while

Neofish
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Posted: 25th Jan 2005 09:41
Quote: "(with resistors of course)"

I almost shouted "NOOOOO" before I saw that

Osiris
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Posted: 25th Jan 2005 09:45
lol , cant forget them, i cant even count how many times i blew up leds by hooking them up directly lol

Coding Fodder
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Posted: 25th Jan 2005 10:28
Yes you could do that. If you aren't after elegence. That will light the LEDs only when your room light is on though. I was under the impression that you wanted them to light only while there was actual contact.

Something really catchy that makes people stop and think about the meaning of life and say to themselves "My but thats clever"
Osiris
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Posted: 25th Jan 2005 10:33
ah yes how would that work?

Coding Fodder
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Posted: 25th Jan 2005 12:58
The switch for the light is edge triggered. Otherwise the light would continually flip/flop between on and off. Look at the schematic on the page that Lost In Thought provided way up 25 posts ago or something. I don't know if you saw it because of all the silliness. Even if you are using a prefabricated switch it will help you understand how these sorts of circuits works.

The schmidt trigger detects a rising voltage and tells the flip flop to change its state. It will only deliver a pulse to the flip flop so you need to catch the signal that someone is touching the metal somwhere upstream of the Schmidt trigger. That is why I suggest hooking your wire to the output of D5.

Becuase you don't want to mess the signal up you probably want to isolate your LEDs with a transistor or a opamp working as a unit follower.

If you can open up the premade unit and get to the guts you can poke around with a voltage meter or logic tester to find a point that corrosponds logically to the one in the diagram.

I have never pulled one apart so I am interested to hear what you find

Something really catchy that makes people stop and think about the meaning of life and say to themselves "My but thats clever"
Shadow Robert
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Posted: 25th Jan 2005 16:40
i would've thought rather than a resister circuit using a dimmer switch (regulates through a different method but i forget what, simply set it to a level just below 'exploding LEDs' If it is hidden behind the scenes you can have the main sensor flip an internal switch (perhaps a positioned electromagnet with a weight) that sets it to that level?

Lost in Thought
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Posted: 26th Jan 2005 00:22
A dimmer switch is basically just a variable resistor wired in series with a light. More voltage will go to the component with the most resistance. The advantage of using this method over a resistor circuit is it runs cooler for the most part as it is larger. But when dealing with Resistored LED circuits there isn't much heat anyway.

Shadow Robert
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Posted: 26th Jan 2005 00:35
Yeah, but he wants it to go through the main lighting circuit if I understand correctly. This means either that resister CB is going to have alot of them, or he is going to use a capcitor(sp?) in order to get the power down so it does make the LEDs explode.

I mean what we're talking here is getting a power feed of 240v on whatever the circuit breaker is (usually 500w isn't it?) down to a handful of LEDs each needing ~.2w @ 1v ... been a while since i messed with LEDs but still weren't talking a HUGE step down.

What's more has he through about the through-put, because some lighting systems are designed with multiple lines for 2/3-way switches. This can lead to problems, atleast in my experience with them.

I dunno that just all seems what'll be the biggest problem rather than the switch itself.

Lost in Thought
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Posted: 26th Jan 2005 01:44 Edited at: 28th Jan 2005 19:17
Depends on where he's at. Lighting voltage (residential) is only 120V here. If he wants to put an LED on the incoming power. One resistor will do.

The resistor value, R is given by:


R = (VS - VL) / I

VS = supply voltage
VL = LED voltage
I = LED current

So If he has a 2V 50mA LED hooking it up to 120V he will need a 6W (or greater) 2.4k ohm resistor. I would use a 10W (or greater as it will last alot longer) 2.4k ohm resitor. This will make circuit current be less than 50mA (appx 0.499?) and the resistor will be running at appx 5.8W (half its rated wattage) so it should last a while.

In the UK I think the volage is 240V?

4.87k ohm @ 20W resitor should do it (probably have to go to a sand/ceramic type or wirewound,though with the wirewound the inductance from using it with AC voltage will throw it off a bit).
Will run at appx 48.9mA and 11.7W

[edit] This is of course assuming he is using a 2V 50mA LED.

Shadow Robert
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Posted: 26th Jan 2005 01:59
yeah 240v mains, but I think the lighting is 110-120v..
I think I know what you mean now lol the joys of a poor memory. Yeah that would be better and a hellova lot smaller heh

Really what he'd want would be to simply tap the line rather than directly feed through. I know that using a Coaxial there are tools to simple cut apart lines and reattach parts, in-line. Are there any tools similar to that for the powerlines?

Lost in Thought
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Posted: 26th Jan 2005 02:14 Edited at: 26th Jan 2005 02:15
He could use a small transformer to lower it to any voltage. But transformers build more heat. Always remember when using the formula above on AC circuits the calcs will be a bit off. Make sure and use a mA meter to confirm current. You could use a tranformer along with a full wave bridge rectifier to make the calcs DC. I'll have a look at that schematic a little later. It probably already steps it down for you.

[edit] Could a mod please delete all of those offtopic posts?

Coding Fodder
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Posted: 26th Jan 2005 05:20 Edited at: 26th Jan 2005 05:24
Whoa!! you guys are making this sound way more complicated than it is. He does not have to worry about the voltage being 120 or 240 or whatever. The solidstate electronic components operate on 5-12 volts DC. The touch sensitive circuit will have a voltage regulator built into it. All he needs to do it use that. Look at the link that LIT posted earlier. I think that it is the second link. It is a beautiful bit of design.

As for tools to cut apart Romex cable, I think, as an electrician, Osiris will have a good pair of dikes (spell check on that) and to reattach..? That is why God made wire nuts.

oh I just saw this in LITs post
Quote: "It probably already steps it down for you."


Yes it does.

[edit] D1 is a zener diode with a twelve volt break down voltage.

Something really catchy that makes people stop and think about the meaning of life and say to themselves "My but thats clever"
Osiris
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Posted: 26th Jan 2005 05:39
i guess hooking up the LED's and having them only light up when i touch it will be a problem so maybe i could do just have them on when the light is on because who cars, the light is already on

Coding Fodder
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Posted: 26th Jan 2005 05:46
yah but the effect would be cool. Imagine all the people annoying the heck out of you by turning your light on and off and on and off just so they can see the LEDs light up when they touch it. It would make the switch seem smart. Easy for me to say, I am not building one.

Something really catchy that makes people stop and think about the meaning of life and say to themselves "My but thats clever"
Osiris
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Posted: 26th Jan 2005 05:48
yeah thats why im reluctant to give that up ill still try to work it out though

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