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FPSC Classic Product Chat / Commercial license? and my naievity of not reading the license.... ouch

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Stevie
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Posted: 13th Feb 2005 23:39
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Unfortunatally i have been one of the nieve ones, and ordered fps, (although i dont have it yet) without reading the license. The reason for this, is that i switched from db pro, to the torque game engine, cos i was disatisfied with the performance of db pro, and its slow updates. Soi visit here to see whats new from time to time as i love the db pro community (torque one sucks!!!) - and i was delighted to finally see the release of the fps creator - but as i say, cos i have not had a major involvement on the forumns, i am not up to date with the 'simple' issues!!!

I have ordered, but just read i cannot sell my games - why on earth is this. I may consider cancelling my order because of this. The thing that may save the day, is some kind of guide as to how much the commercial licence will be.

This is crazy actually, using the torque game engine, it just costs £55 - and u do not have to pay any kind of license fee, if ur profits are under $250,000!!!!

What is going on here
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Deadwords
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Posted: 13th Feb 2005 23:56
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If you buy the Early Adopter, you will can upgrade to the Version 1.0 for a small cost. Someone that not buy the EA version will pay everything (i think 60-70$ for the version 1) but someone who buy the EA will pay like 20-30$ i think...

Don't cancel your order cause i think that with the version 1, you will can sell your games. If you're not sure, contact FPS Creator to see.

PDAC 4 Ever! http://www.pdac-online.com
Current Project: House Maker 1.0
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Stevie
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Posted: 13th Feb 2005 23:58
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Thanks Skalex - i dont want to cancel!!!!!! i love the look of fps creator. I didnt think the commercial license would be as cheap actually - i thought i may run into £100s of pounds.

Cheers
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MikeS
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Posted: 14th Feb 2005 02:02
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Chances are it'll be a pretty small fee to sell your game. Besides, if you make a game you think is really worth selling, chances are you'll make a profit.



A book? I hate book. Book is stupid.
(Formerly known as Yellow)
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uman
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Posted: 14th Feb 2005 02:22
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You cannot sell games made with FPSC (any version) unless you purchase a commercial licence. The cost of a commercial licence has not yet been decided upon.
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Jiffy
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Posted: 14th Feb 2005 15:14
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I have no idea how you cant understand - no offence, it's just that ofcourse you cant just sell them. TGC has put alot of time and money into it - the coding and the objects do cost money - if you just sold them, you would be making money off their coding, and to not pay a reasonable price for that coding would simply be unfair. FPS Creator was made for fun - but if you want to make money off of it you will need to pay more.

Curiously, how simple is it to create a game with the torque engine? If it's anything less than utterly easy, I think it makes sense.

Last night I was looking up at the stars and said "Where the hell is my roof?!"
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Logan 5
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Posted: 15th Feb 2005 00:25 Edited at: 15th Feb 2005 00:29
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Torque is incredibly easy if you want to create all your own media and learn Torque Script (a C-like language), learn how to code your own triggers, learn to use an engine that is only networked, learn to use the Torque Mission Editor, write your own music, etc. Other than that...

Other than that, Mrs. Lincoln, how was the play?

Basically dark.
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Thade
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Posted: 15th Feb 2005 05:32 Edited at: 15th Feb 2005 05:54
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Quote: "TGC has put alot of time and money into it - the coding and the objects do cost money - if you just sold them, you would be making money off their coding, and to not pay a reasonable price for that coding would simply be unfair. FPS Creator was made for fun - but if you want to make money off of it you will need to pay more."


Borland have put even more money and time into Delphi ! What if you could only write programs for your friends and family with it?

The Ogre-Team has put tons of hours in their freeware 3Dengine - and you can sell stuff you produced with it no matter if you make trillions or more...

Microsoft spent a lot of time and money to create outlook - there is no restiction that you can only write letters to your Mom with it And you do not have to get a special licence if you "misuse" it for ordering a pizza...

Colt produced pistols... what if they made it just for fun and you could only shoot down your friends and family with it? For other purposes you had to get a commercial licence - lol

My opinion: They shall not sell it if they are anxious someone could make some money with it...

And how successful will a game be, if hundreds of super developers sell quite the same game with the same entities ... and and the same AI ... and same textures ... ???

So you have to put your own effort, your own ideas, your own programming, your own levels, textures and entities into it to make it outstanding ... and all that just to show your daddy what a clever boy you are? Ridiculous...

Thade: "Is there a soul in there?"
Sure not !
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Lost in Thought
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Posted: 15th Feb 2005 05:49
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The difference between all of that and FPSC is that it does almost all the work for you. You can literally make a game in minutes. It will be a basic game that probably no one will buy but still it just shows you how much of their work you are using. I do think they should have different licenses if you don't use any of their media or scripts though. If you make your own media and scripts, then it is more like a programming language. It is not entirely impossible to make something like this just in DBP. It will be harder because you will need to make a few dlls to be faster than DBP but you could make a slower version in DBP.

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Thade
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Posted: 15th Feb 2005 06:00 Edited at: 15th Feb 2005 06:09
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There are lots of other packages around you can make a game with in minutes (as they claim)...
And for FPSC - That's the only reason why they can make money with it ... otherwise no-one would even take a look at it...
Seems you did not get the point and got Lost in Thought somehow...
The message is: You can only use it as a (admitted good) base to develop something good anyway. And then its your work.
Compared to the result its the hammer you need to build a house... and only a hammer - not so much more ...

Thade: "Is there a soul in there?"
Sure not !
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Chenak
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Posted: 15th Feb 2005 06:12 Edited at: 15th Feb 2005 06:24
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Quote: "Borland have put even more money and time into Delphi ! What if you could only write programs for your friends and family with it?

The Ogre-Team has put tons of hours in their freeware 3Dengine - and you can sell stuff you produced with it no matter if you make trillions or more...

My opinion: They shall not sell it if they are anxious someone could make some money with it...

So you have to put your own effort, your own ideas, your own programming, your own levels, textures and entities into it to make it outstanding ... and all that just to show your daddy what a clever boy you are? Ridiculous..."


delphi, ogre or whatever are NOT drag and drop game creators with extremly simple scripting. So to compare FPSC with those languages just shows you have no idea what you are talking about.

FPSC is aimed at people who want to have FUN creating games in a few hours with little need for programming. I bought a copy for my brother, he loves it, but he knows he wont become a millionaire using it and he's 12

Quote: "Seems you did not get the point and got Lost in Thought somehow...
The message is: You can only use it as a (admitted good) base to develop something good anyway. And then its your work.
Compared to the result its the hammer you need to build a house... and only a hammer - not so much more ..."


Did you make the 3d engine, level maker, lightmap generator, particle system, the weapon system, the movement, the scripting language, the sound, the AI, waypoints, menu handlers and god knows whatelse? nope this is all made for you.

All you have to do is insert media, create an interesting level and mess around with the scripts and you have a game. If you want a commerical game you have to do most of the hard work yourself im afraid. Use dbpro and do all of it yourself. Hammish has an open source FPS somewhere, use that as a base and build from there
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uman
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Posted: 15th Feb 2005 06:18
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You should wait and see what people can make with FPSC - down the road I expect to see some commercially viable games, but its likely to be some time if you want to see some with outstanding results.
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Zeroframe
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Posted: 15th Feb 2005 06:21
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@Thade, I will not buy FPSC either until a com. license is available. Its true that some engines do come with a few models, template scripts and textures. 3D Gamestudio does this and the Commercial version w/license is about $200.00.
The only stipulation is that you have to display their logo for 1 sec in a splash screen in your game unless you buy the Pro version.

Anyway,
I have already asked this question on the forum and was told that it would still be awhile until a com. license is ready for FPSC.
Most likely when V1 is ready for distribution, so just hang on a bit longer- I think its in their best interest to get it sorted.
-ok, Im done rambling now.
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Thade
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Posted: 15th Feb 2005 06:22
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Well - maybe you are right - but then they should not put it together will all the developer tools on one website...
I somehow got the impression it was meant to develop software and not a certain "FPS Lego for Kids"

Thade: "Is there a soul in there?"
Sure not !
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Thade
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Posted: 15th Feb 2005 06:29 Edited at: 15th Feb 2005 07:22
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Quote: "Did you make the 3d engine, level maker, lightmap generator, particle system, the weapon system, the movement, the scripting language, the sound, the AI, waypoints, menu handlers and god knows whatelse? nope this is all made for you"

Chenak that is the only reason why it costs money... without that you'd have a 0 Byte File ...
And you can get all that stuff you mentioned free on the web - not in one package - but free and for any usage...
The question for me (and Stevie who started this thread with the same thought in mind...) is: Is it worth the price to impress friends and family or would we be better off if it would cost a few dollars more and we could use it?

Quote: "If you want a commerical game you have to do most of the hard work yourself im afraid."

Always fascinating and a pleasure to listen to the wise telling their experiences and to profit from their knowledge ...

What do you think I am doing since 30 years now? I created in 1986 exact that - a tool you can write your own games with - with all media and all you needed (thousands of animated sprites, backgrounds, sounds) - but with no restrictions... (and that's why I take part in that discussion and it's the only reason why)
Btw.: (Not to show off only to explain) I sold about 20000 copies for $59 which was not bad these days - since it was only for the Commodore 64 - and only in Germany and Austria and without internet banners, popups and newsletters - just plain ads in computer mags...
I think it
Quote: "just shows you have no idea what you are talking about"


Thade: "Is there a soul in there?"
Sure not !
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Cellbloc Studios
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Posted: 15th Feb 2005 06:41
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I look at it as $56 US, what I would normally spend on a dinner at Outback with the family, that I can create a working demo game in a short amount of time EITHER to show a potential publisher OR when the commercial licence comes out, to actually sell it using it.

-This...is my boomstick!
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Lost in Thought
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Posted: 15th Feb 2005 07:17
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@Thade I will be the first to admit I sometimes do get "Lost In Thought" hence the name. Why don't you make a version of FPSC and sell it for $56 with all the features and media (not the same exact media of course but you get my meaning) it contains and not put any restrictions on it. If you do I will buy 10 copies.

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Chenak
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Posted: 15th Feb 2005 07:24 Edited at: 15th Feb 2005 07:27
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If you write a tool and sell it with no restrictions thats your choice really.

TGC decided not to include a commercial license for the EA version, thats their choice. Its the EA version, not the full version. You never know, the full version might have a shareware/commercial license or it might just be a £20 upgrade. IMO it is worth it even if you cant sell what you make as of yet. Its just fun
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Thade
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Posted: 15th Feb 2005 07:30 Edited at: 15th Feb 2005 07:34
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@Lost in Thought - My son and I, we're working on something different - a certain 3D Community with lots the features you find in FPSC - and this since 2 years now - and it is nearly finished

@Chenak - and I can still say my meaning in a free country what I think about it, right? And that's all I did. And if a Commercial License will be $10000 or $100000 or 10ct you do not know as I don't know...

Thade: "Is there a soul in there?"
Sure not !
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Lost in Thought
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Posted: 15th Feb 2005 08:55
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Cool let me know when you get it done. If it's as good as FPSC, I'm serious I'll buy it.

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Aoneweb
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Posted: 15th Feb 2005 09:51
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If its as good as FPSC, we'll all buy it.

Toshiba Sattelite, 2GHz,Nvidia GeForce4 420go, Windows XP Home. www.aoneweb.com
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SoulMan
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Posted: 15th Feb 2005 10:11
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@Thade - Really? Then why not show off your so called work.
SoulMan

This is as backwards as is This
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