More on Nintendo's Revolution---- Nintendo back-catalogue of games will be downloadable for free??

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Raven

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Posted: 5th Jun 2005 06:30

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Quote: "That "decision maker" is responsible for half of what made nintendo good and you can work out why! And now he's gone bonkers!"

.. do you even understand the structure of how these companies are set-up?

Sorry, but Miyamoto is just the Nintendo version of John Carmack when all is said and done. If the previous CEO hadn't stepped down he would still be just another programmer rather than head of the most powerful games company in the world.

What exactly has changed? Nothing.
If you know anything about the man, you will know that he has been making comments similar to what he has for over a decade. An out-spoken genius, and quite frankly that's what Nintendo fans love about him.

We're almost 20years on since he gave the world Donkey Kong and he's still creating games that thrill the imagination; and make you think outside of the box. Giving us new genres each and every Nintendo incarnation.

Donkey Kong & Mario on the NES
Mario Kart on the SNES
Super Smash Brother on the N64
Pikmin on the GameCube

he has a way of creating titles are just plain fun.
Nintendo did what they promised last console, they brough games to the end-user cheaper than ever before.

£70 - NES
£60 - SNES
£50 - N64
£35 - GC

The consoles themselves have proven time and time again that they are tools that are fun to be used and developed on.

Revolution is going to be just that as far as gaming goes..

it's not going to be a graphics revolution, providing cinematic rendered graphics at resolutions that most people in the western world would kill to have on thier monitors or televisions.

it's not about providing ranges and range of identical games that have come before.

it's about completing what the Nintendo DS started!
You look at the NDS as some failed console, that isn't worth much right?

No doubt as a dedicated Sony Fanatic, there is nothing BETTER than watching a widescreen movie at 600x240 .. yeah I can so see the appeal squinting at a small screen trying to see that water realistically shaded.

What the NDS has brought to the market is a wave of creativity enabled by the technology, and not limited to purely what is on the screen. The technology that allows seemless multiplayer gameplay through wireless connections even to connect online for any wireless terminal.

You can connect with friends seemlessly for awesome multiplayer action absolutely anywhere, or simply use it to send message to your friend and access the internat. This includes being able to use Cellphone that are capable of Bluetooth which most are nowadays.

You also have touch screen technology, this allows more freedom conserning the controls. Providing you with and extra depth to a game, rather than Sam Fisher tapping a direction to pick a lock you could have to have a real challenge like having to move the lock in 3D and tapping on the weak points in order to get the lock to unlock.

Or now you could have an electronic lock where you can rewire it withing a certain time limit..

The whole new levels of interactivity you have allow you to really see and experience a new range of games based on a very interactive style of play.

I'm sorry if you find you have to bad mouth another console to make yourself feel better about the lies that Sony have told you about the Playstation 3; but personally I look forward to the Revolution.

I'm going to be happy knowing that Nintendo don't plan to jack up game prices like all these other companies are saying they *HAVE* to do. I'm also going to be happy know that I'm not going to be expected to pay almost half a grand for a console that will likely sit in the corner of my room unless I like the mirage of identical game being developed for it.

I'm also going to be happy knowing that the past 20years of gaming that I've experienced so happily can be relived and even see improvements from it's previous glory.

Nintendo might not've got on the Online gaming wagon, but in typical Nintendo Style; they're not doing it by half as some cheap upgrade.. they're adding it as a facet to provide it as a service worth using not as something you have to try justifying the cost of.

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Richard Davey

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Posted: 5th Jun 2005 10:22

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Quote: "Is anyone agreeing with me? Is anyone on my side? I'm lonely!!"

Not really because you're talking nonsense, having twisted one Nintendo execs personal opinion* on game length into some kind of future Nintendo policy (or equally similar insanity).

* one which actually I completely agree with, some games *are* too long having been padded out with crap just to be able to make a "20 hours gameplay" or similar claim. Nintendo make some of the longest games in the world.. not because they take "40 hours" to complete, but because you play them again and again and again, over and over. That's real game making - a talent long lost by most.

Two Worlds and in Between
Hot Metal and Methedrine

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BearCDPOLD

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Posted: 5th Jun 2005 16:34

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Quote: "I dare you to argue with me! What are you gonna do with no LONG games!"

I'll jump for joy. I'll finally have time to reach their conclusion. I often enjoy playing games on easy so I can get through them quicker, see all that they've got to offer in a smaller amount of time.
So what am I gonna do with no short games? Raise my GPA.

You're not making friends quick.

Think of Nintendo's superiority as coming in a ratio known as Quanlity Density. Quality Games : Total Games.

Their quality density is quite low. All I get out of them is GTA ports, Halo, and Bioware and Bethesda, oh yes and of course Psychonauts. I play a little Splinter Cell 3, but even that gets old. I have some 20-odd games and only play 2 or 3 of them on any regular basis.

Playstation:
I'm going to get a PS3, and get all the games that I wanted to play for PS1 and 2 but never found good enough to justify buying a whole console for them. Of course I'm not the expert on playstation. The sheer fact that they can't even get me to buy their console lowers their Quality Density significantly.

Nintendo:
I'd give them a 19 : 20, because I didn't get into Animal Crossing. Otherwise they own you. The only Gamecube games I don't play are Animal Crossing and third-party titles that I could have probably gotten on XB as well.

Crazy Donut Productions
Current Project: A Redneck game

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Raven

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Posted: 5th Jun 2005 16:53

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Quote: "I'll jump for joy. I'll finally have time to reach their conclusion. I often enjoy playing games on easy so I can get through them quicker, see all that they've got to offer in a smaller amount of time. "

Heh.. generally speaking I don't play games on Normal or Hard Mode.
Really don't see the point; So many games are just to stupidly hard requiring you to be pretty awesome marksmen or be able to fluently duck while throwing yourself around a level or something stupid.

I like the way Nintendo's game have one difficulty and GRADUALLY make the game harder. It's not like your just thrown into a game that is rock solid from the start. I've never liked the whole Easy - Medium - Hard, Bull.

On Hard I die... QUICKLY, On Medium I get further but always reach on annoying section where I die because there was just half a healthpack too less so I'm left trying to complete a section a vetran would need all the health on; but to redo it I've gotta restart the entire damn game.

So your left with easy to actually get far enough, but then the later levels become TOO easy. Oh but wait the developers thought that might happen... so they take away your ammo and health so your left constantly running out of clips because you ACTUALLY a pretty poor shot.

I mean sorry but I've grown up on FPS, but I still can't get out of the habit of shooting someone in the chest. Simple because it's the biggest area of them. There used to be no reward for a headshot.. now unless you get it you have to waste your entire [censored] clip on an enemy just to take them down.

I dunno that's my lil rant anyways.

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robo cat

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Posted: 5th Jun 2005 18:18

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To be honest, game length of Nintendo games is not really an issue. Would you rather play 1 hour of Pikmin 2 or 5 hours wondering round San Andreas just to get somewhere. (Apologies for the slight exaggeration).

If next-gen games are going to rocket in price then Revolution will have the upper hand for two reasons:
1) They promised cheaper games and I believe they will do so
2) They have an online library of free games (free will be more important if next-gen games are pricy)

Quote: "I mean sorry but I've grown up on FPS, but I still can't get out of the habit of shooting someone in the chest. Simple because it's the biggest area of them. There used to be no reward for a headshot.. now unless you get it you have to waste your entire [censored] clip on an enemy just to take them down."

FPS gameplay tends to suck like that nowadays. I started playing XIII on the PC and it got dull VERY fast. It would've been equally fun to just get a screen shot off the web. Stick it as my desktop background and time how long it takes me to move my mouse onto each head and click. The only decent part was using the chairs as weapons but these were only useful in set pieces with blatently stupid guards.

Sure, Nintendo games are short, but they are a roller coaster ride from start to finish. They don't simply make the game with fun zones and the pad it out with empty corridoors and faceless goons. Pikmin 2 NEVER has a dull moment, there aren't any boring floors in the dungeons. Where they kept some dungeons to 5 floors, a PS2 game would've padded it out to 15 floors by adding some eye candy in the middle. There are multiple pieces if treasure on each floor, this could've easily been dumped in places outside which require lots of walking back and forth to get, but they didn't. Another example, is Resi 4. Every room is there for a reason and brings a different experience. The game is only 20 hours, some people say, but that is long when you are actually PLAYING for the whole 20 hours. The cutscenes require you to react meaning you still feel as if you are Leon in the cut scenes. There is ZERO padding between locations. Take the Village and the Farm at the start of the game. Most developers would've seperated this by a long country walk. Although it might look cool, it would be fairly dull. I'm sure this would've been the case if it wasn't initially planned as a Gamecube exclusive. The game keeps the adrenaline pumping for the ENTIRE 20 hours - there is no simple wandering back and forth between locations, the route is direct around the game and you never face the same challenge twice. For those who've played it, can you even remember the bit with the guys in the flamethrower dragons that you snipe. That was a hugely cool part yet they just blended it in without trying to make it stand out, which made it fantastic.

PS2 has one game which I would actually buy. PES 4 is a great quality game and the best football game out there. This is because it just lets the player get straight into master league and start playing. There is no unnecessary padding, such as comulsory tutorials or HAVING to complete certain tedious leagues before unlocking the teams and Master League. Its also a great game and I can't wait for it to come out on DS. Hopefully, they will use the touch screen well. I'm hoping that you'll be able to plot waypoints for your teammates runs by dragging the stylus in a line from them - that'd rock, and again shows the potential of DS hardware over that of the PSP.

Simple... yet fun!

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Raven

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Posted: 5th Jun 2005 19:12

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I agree with Resident Evil 4.. it is close to one of those 'perfect' games really.

I played it again on Easy, but that said.. the Resident Evil idea of making it hard = Zombies take more shots while at the same time taking away your valuable ammo. Yeah like hell I wanna play like that. I waste so many shots trying to get the damn later on to the people, let alone the fact that they take so much to take them down it's ridiculous.

It's not a complaint just that I'm bad at it. The game was awesome from start to finish; and to be honest it was the first game I didn't think 'christ thank god it's over' or 'wtf? where's the rest?'

The ending wasn't disappointing, it was pretty awesome. Leaves me safely knowing there is a new one, and hopefully another Nintendo first

It's also one of those games where you feel you HAVE to play it again, and the bonus missions. heh
I mean you blend that all with the awesome graphics, and fun gameplay.. not to mention gritty realism of the game.

It's strange that things a simple as having to use an Infra-red scope to kill certain enemies else they were unkillable; or how your actions in certain parts of the game came back to help you later.. or just seeing the towns folk going about thier business until they saw you.

It just all came together to make it by far the best £35 I ever spent!

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ReneGade RG

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Posted: 5th Jun 2005 19:20

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Quote: "Quote: "Is anyone agreeing with me? Is anyone on my side? I'm lonely!!"

Not really because you're talking nonsense, having twisted one Nintendo execs personal opinion* on game length into some kind of future Nintendo policy (or equally similar insanity).

* one which actually I completely agree with, some games *are* too long having been padded out with crap just to be able to make a "20 hours gameplay" or similar claim. Nintendo make some of the longest games in the world.. not because they take "40 hours" to complete, but because you play them again and again and again, over and over. That's real game making - a talent long lost by most"

Quote: "Quote: "I dare you to argue with me! What are you gonna do with no LONG games!"
I'll jump for joy. I'll finally have time to reach their conclusion. I often enjoy playing games on easy so I can get through them quicker, see all that they've got to offer in a smaller amount of time.
So what am I gonna do with no short games? Raise my GPA.

You're not making friends quick. "

Quote: "Renegade - You should really learn to put all your comments inside of just one post, as people get annoyed easily when somebody posts 3 times in a row.

And I don't know what you're harping about. Because a game is short doesn't mean it's a crappy game, ok? I think it's stupid how the industry goes by hours anyhow--- I mean it would take me a year to get through some of those massive RPGs if I was inclined to take one on. But the reviewer may say it's a 20-30 hour game.

And I for one will not be spending more than $70CDN on a new title, so I guess I will have to wait for the new console games to go down in price."

For god's sakes, I'm only trying to debate something and I'm getting insulted by every person, I am lonely! If you think I'm talking nonsense, good for you! ....And the reason I make multiple posts is because I'm just that kinda person who forgets to put something down! Do I hurt somebody? No!

You don't agree with me? OK! But you don't treat me like a total idiot!

It's amazing you're reading this, surprise... you still are.

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ReneGade RG

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Posted: 5th Jun 2005 19:22

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I'm not trying to provoke! I'm not trying to offend! OK?

It's amazing you're reading this, surprise... you still are.

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Raven

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Posted: 5th Jun 2005 19:31

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There is a small button underneath your avatar which is called 'Edit'

you can feel as lonely as you choose to be. right now your arguing with quite a few people; that generally leads to many having opposing views.

not to mention Sony / X-Box fan-boyism isn't something that is really enjoyed around here.

I mean you went on (at length) on how the PS3 is great .. because, but I don't understand what the hell all the technical abilities of the machine mean; and well it's my job to! So how the hell someone who is finding it hard to find the edit button can possibly understand the technicals of the next-generation hardware better than an actual developer .. well the mind boggles.

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ReneGade RG

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Posted: 5th Jun 2005 19:47

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...Back to the debate.

I agree that FPSs nowadays are getting repetetive!
But there are those that do and will stand out! Multiplayer in most FPSs can be very fun! FPSs can be tactical and sometimes do require some skill! And I admit 13 sucks!

If I'm not provoking anyone, I'll continue!

Yes, PSP didn't change games at all! looking back, it ruined the whole handheld experience! Games were almost too identical to home games that there was no gap and they were much harder to make, squeezing them into a minute screen!
But the DS was incomplete! Drawing pacman all the time was actually considered a full game, which it wasn't! Pac Pix sucked!
Nintendo didn't finish the DS and that's why it sucks! Now, you people have changed my mind! 360 is useless! PS3 for hardcore graphics and Revolution to hardcore entertainment!

If I have provoked anyone in this post, I am sorry! I wish to continue this debate!

It's amazing you're reading this, surprise... you still are.

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Eric T

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Posted: 5th Jun 2005 19:50 Edited at: 5th Jun 2005 19:51

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I actually like XIII, though I had it on the PS2. I may have just been wowed by the cel-shading though, as it was my first experience with a full on action game being cel-shaded.

And I did beat it... no cheats. Kinda pissed with how it ended. Where is XIII-2 BTW? Or did they trash the project?

Edit: Only had it on PS2 because my PC was biting the dust at the time. And it did control nice for a PS2 FPS.

LEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEROY JENKINS!!
http://blog.myspace.com/erict An Alternative to Mouse's blog. Now with more lowbrow opinions.

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ReneGade RG

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Posted: 5th Jun 2005 19:56 Edited at: 5th Jun 2005 19:58

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Quote: "I actually like XIII, though I had it on the PS2. I may have just been wowed by the cel-shading though, as it was my first experience with a full on action game being cel-shaded.

And I did beat it... no cheats. Kinda pissed with how it ended. Where is XIII-2 BTW? Or did they trash the project?

Edit: Only had it on PS2 because my PC was biting the dust at the time. And it did control nice for a PS2 FPS."

See, it does provide entertainment! Point proven! Even though it sorta suck!

Someone is sorta on my side! Yaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay!!!!!

I haven't offended anyone, have I?

It's amazing you're reading this, surprise... you still are.

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Eric T

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Posted: 5th Jun 2005 20:03

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I'm not on your side, I was just pointing out I like XIII.

I didn't do anything but read the last post in this topic TBH, and I felt like responding to level up my massive ego.

LEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEROY JENKINS!!
http://blog.myspace.com/erict An Alternative to Mouse's blog. Now with more lowbrow opinions.

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robo cat

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Posted: 5th Jun 2005 20:30

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Resi 4 is just incredible value for money. Another good example is the mine cart scene. That was simply incredible and must have been a lot of work on their part. However, the great thing is that they didn't pad it out and re-use it. It was like a 15 minute or so scene and that was the end of the minecart stuff. Most games would've had loads of minecart sequences once they had written the code for it.

Also, I was so shocked in the mercenaries mini-game that I got to play as Krauser. Not only did they bother to put all the animations in, they also had to impliment the bow AND his cool arm attack. Capcom weren't at all lazy in this game. Every character had his own 'Kick' type ability rather than just reusing Leon's. This level of detail throughout the entire game is just incredible. Take the guy pushing the wheelbarrow in the village, they actually bothered to add a dust effect to the wheel - despite it only being used once in the game. In general, the scenary didn't appear to be re-used, as it is in most games. EVERY room seems to have its own look and feel. They also don't force you to look at the detail as its just subtle and there to enhance the experience. At the start, theres a cabin with a corpse and a pitchfork through its face. Its quite and impressive model, yet its NEVER reused elsewhere - as most games would've done. They don't force you to appreciate the effort thats been put in. Not everyone goes back at the start to examine the car wreck at the bottom of the cliff. Not everyone watches the officers body being dumped in the lake. Not everyone experiences the section with 2 chainsaw ladies just after the Luis cabin scene. Theres a few outdoor sections where you are there for about 15 seconds - such as the bridge after the collapsing Salazar statue - and yet there is a great level of detail on the outsides of the buildings and on the ground miles below. Yet, they don't draw your attention to it, it just happens that a few people might point their camera in that direction. I could've paid £60 for this game and still would've said it was great value for money. If someone asked you to write an account of what happened to you in the game, you'd get up to the monastry perhaps, but then you'd start forgetting set pieces and entire sections because they blended in so seamlessly. Can you even remember the bit where you ride the massive truck, the cave FULL of flying insects or the bit in the rubbish dump with the regenerators. There great sections but they just get lost in the sheer scale of the game!

Simple... yet fun!

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ReneGade RG

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Posted: 5th Jun 2005 20:48

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Quote: "I'm not on your side, I was just pointing out I like XIII.

I didn't do anything but read the last post in this topic TBH, and I felt like responding to level up my massive ego.
"

No, but you pretty much proven my point!

It's amazing you're reading this, surprise... you still are.

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ReneGade RG

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Posted: 5th Jun 2005 20:49

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Quote: "Resi 4 is just incredible value for money. Another good example is the mine cart scene. That was simply incredible and must have been a lot of work on their part. However, the great thing is that they didn't pad it out and re-use it. It was like a 15 minute or so scene and that was the end of the minecart stuff. Most games would've had loads of minecart sequences once they had written the code for it.

Also, I was so shocked in the mercenaries mini-game that I got to play as Krauser. Not only did they bother to put all the animations in, they also had to impliment the bow AND his cool arm attack. Capcom weren't at all lazy in this game. Every character had his own 'Kick' type ability rather than just reusing Leon's. This level of detail throughout the entire game is just incredible. Take the guy pushing the wheelbarrow in the village, they actually bothered to add a dust effect to the wheel - despite it only being used once in the game. In general, the scenary didn't appear to be re-used, as it is in most games. EVERY room seems to have its own look and feel. They also don't force you to look at the detail as its just subtle and there to enhance the experience. At the start, theres a cabin with a corpse and a pitchfork through its face. Its quite and impressive model, yet its NEVER reused elsewhere - as most games would've done. They don't force you to appreciate the effort thats been put in. Not everyone goes back at the start to examine the car wreck at the bottom of the cliff. Not everyone watches the officers body being dumped in the lake. Not everyone experiences the section with 2 chainsaw ladies just after the Luis cabin scene. Theres a few outdoor sections where you are there for about 15 seconds - such as the bridge after the collapsing Salazar statue - and yet there is a great level of detail on the outsides of the buildings and on the ground miles below. Yet, they don't draw your attention to it, it just happens that a few people might point their camera in that direction. I could've paid £60 for this game and still would've said it was great value for money. If someone asked you to write an account of what happened to you in the game, you'd get up to the monastry perhaps, but then you'd start forgetting set pieces and entire sections because they blended in so seamlessly. Can you even remember the bit where you ride the massive truck, the cave FULL of flying insects or the bit in the rubbish dump with the regenerators. There great sections but they just get lost in the sheer scale of the game! "

err....random

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robo cat

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Posted: 5th Jun 2005 21:31

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I was agreeing with Raven that Resi 4 is a near perfect game. Its also an example of how an apparently short game thats fantastic quality throughout is better value than a dull game thats been padded out a lot. This means that when Nintendo say they want shorter games, they mean more compact titles - such as Pikmin - which are better than long drawn out repetitive games. I was also reminiscing about Resi 4 a bit aswell.

This doesn't mean there won't be any new zeldas, it will mean they will be compact without the long walking from one location to another. Instead they will make sure the action is spread throughout the whole game - unlike Wind Waker which was the exact opposite.

Simple... yet fun!

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ReneGade RG

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Posted: 5th Jun 2005 22:32 Edited at: 5th Jun 2005 22:36

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Quote: "I was agreeing with Raven that Resi 4 is a near perfect game. Its also an example of how an apparently short game thats fantastic quality throughout is better value than a dull game thats been padded out a lot. This means that when Nintendo say they want shorter games, they mean more compact titles - such as Pikmin - which are better than long drawn out repetitive games. I was also reminiscing about Resi 4 a bit aswell. This doesn't mean there won't be any new zeldas, it will mean they will be compact without the long walking from one location to another. Instead they will make sure the action is spread throughout the whole game - unlike Wind Waker which was the exact opposite."

That is not what Miyamoto meant...God, please go on Gamespot.com and read the thing before arguing with me!

And miyamoto was involved with Windwaker anyway! If what you said is true, then Miyamoto is a self-hater!

It's amazing you're reading this, surprise... you still are.

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ReneGade RG

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Posted: 5th Jun 2005 22:39

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...And by the way, I'm gonna pre-order the PS2 version of Resi 4!
I played it on the GC, pretty good game!

It's amazing you're reading this, surprise... you still are.

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robo cat

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Posted: 6th Jun 2005 01:39

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Quote: "And miyamoto was involved with Windwaker anyway! If what you said is true, then Miyamoto is a self-hater!"

Not necessarily, they didn't just think "lets make some really tedious sailing". It opened up some fun gameplay - such as raiding towers - but unfortunately it did provide unecessary padding. The song that lets you teleport should've been the first song and there should've been the ability to port to any grid reference, but that would've ruined the fighting of sharks and pillaging those floating submarines.

Simple... yet fun!

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Raven

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Posted: 6th Jun 2005 03:24

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Quote: "And miyamoto was involved with Windwaker anyway! If what you said is true, then Miyamoto is a self-hater!"

No. What makes him a special breed of developer / dreamer is the fact that he doesn't create experiences that he personal would like.

If you think about Zelda, how long is it?
I mean I completed Ocarina of Time in around 12hours, Mask or Majora in 15hours, The Wind Waker in 12hours..

The fact is that Zelda isn't a long game, but your not left at the end of it thinking 'where's the rest?'. The game keeps fresh and new.. a game like Half-Life 2 though you feel slightly ghiped that it is very very short padded out by ridiculously long vehicle sections that don't really add to the story.

I also wasn't a fan of the fact there wasn't really alot of story. The environments and game kinda sit there saying 'there is alot of depth here' but when your actually playing it's about as deep as a paddling pool. That disappointed me.

Quote: "...And by the way, I'm gonna pre-order the PS2 version of Resi 4!
I played it on the GC, pretty good game!"

Not the same experience. The GameCube works because it's so atmospheric, designed around the controller to be easy to handle.

Pisses me off enough there's a Playstation 2 version in development, but they've not even been able to put half of the detail the GameCube has. It's going to loose so much atmosphere as a resul.

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robo cat

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Posted: 6th Jun 2005 05:22

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I read somewhere that they are changed the texture depths from 32bit to 4bit!!! If thats right then that'll be a MASSIVE blow to the graphics since its got some very nice and detailed textures in it. To lose many of the colours would make it look much worse. It also said they won't do all the lighting effects - such as the merchant's blue flame tinting your shoulder blue if its near to it.

Quote: "Ocarina of Time in around 12hours, Mask or Majora in 15hours, The Wind Waker in 12hours.."

Presumably that is just shooting through. Ocarina of Time and Majora's Mask are much longer and better if you include sidequests. I assume you didn't find ALL the gold skulltulas and get every single sidequest. Those sidequests were fun. The side quests in Wind Waker, however, were lame in that they mainly involved delivering goods from one island to another...and then there was the pictograph challenge thing!!!

Quote: "a game like Half-Life 2 though you feel slightly ghiped that it is very very short padded out by ridiculously long vehicle sections that don't really add to the story."

Only have the free demo of it and having played through the first section and Ravenholm, that was enough for me to have a lot of fun, but any more would be repetitive.

Quote: "No. What makes him a special breed of developer / dreamer is the fact that he doesn't create experiences that he personal would like."

I agree he is a special breed, but you're not 100% correct. In an interview he said he only wants to make games that he can sit down and play with his kids - meaning he won't be creating Mario GTA in the Mushroom Kingdom.

Zelda is huge if you do every sidequest but it doesn't have much replay value unfortunately. Other than Resi 4, the best value for money I've had is either Super Mario Bros. 3 on the SNES (must've completed that hundreds of times

) or Hitman 2 (oozing replayability).

Simple... yet fun!

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RalphY

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Posted: 6th Jun 2005 05:31

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Can someone point ReneGade 12345 in the direction of the edit button, or just ban him, would probably be easier...

Personally I don't like long games either, developers tend to design a game that can justifiably last about 10hrs and just stick in pointless levels to pad out the experience to 20hrs. If there's no story or reason for killing 100's of people that all look the same over and over again with the same weapons in the same way what's the point? why not just play the same level again?

My favorite game happen to be some of the shortest, Monkey Island series, Max Payne 2, Silent Hill series; and its these that I complete and find myself coming back to, why? because they actually last the length of the idea, never a dull moment

. This is something that Nintendo is good at, they make games that last the length of the concept and/or are just plain fun to play.

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Raven

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Posted: 6th Jun 2005 05:42

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Quote: "I agree he is a special breed, but you're not 100% correct. In an interview he said he only wants to make games that he can sit down and play with his kids - meaning he won't be creating Mario GTA in the Mushroom Kingdom."

As I said above, GameSpot are not known for thier 'accuracy' in interviews.
Though I do agree, I would LIKE to make games that I can at the end of the day have fun playing. Sometimes that just isn't the case though.

If you think about it, from that comment that simply covers Multiplayer games. Yet Mario isn't multiplayer, neither is Zelda.
I think people are trying to read far too much into what is being said. Remember it's all relative.

It's like Lee Bamber saying in an interview, "Obviously what I would like to do is to change every single game effect to be purely Shader based."

In-fact that isn't far from something he did say several months back, but the reality is that the end-users don't want Pure Shader solutions; and as such we've been recently given a Non-Shader solution to Blend Mapping.

So you have to take interviews, at more face value than thinking 'ooh there is some deeper meaning'. You also have to make not of words like WANT, LIKE, and COULD.

Because often when these words are used, it's because they know that these are personal views; not reality of a situation.

"I would like to see Hand to Hand combat added to Tomb Raider Chronicles, and I hope that makes it in to the final version. We still have some bugs to work out though." - That was something I said exactly to both PC Gamer and GameSpot.

While PC Gamer quoted it to 'There is a possibility that Hand-to-Hand combat might see it's way in to Lara Croft's latest adventure', GameSpot quoted me as to saying 'Hand-to-Hand combat will be in the 5th Tomb Raider Game from developer Core Design.'

I know exactly what I said, but that's not what was translated; and as you can image we recieved A LOT of angry e-mail and letters from fans asking us what the heck happened to the 'promised' feature.

It's all subjective.

Quote: "I read somewhere that they are changed the texture depths from 32bit to 4bit!!! If thats right then that'll be a MASSIVE blow to the graphics since its got some very nice and detailed textures in it. To lose many of the colours would make it look much worse. It also said they won't do all the lighting effects - such as the merchant's blue flame tinting your shoulder blue if its near to it."

Yup. 4bit Texture Quality, No Bump Mapping, Single Light Source, No Shadows, No Fog, No HDR, No Bloom, No Camera Blur, No Depth of Field, No Physics.

There are probably some more things, but in general the Playstation 2 version looks far more like Outbreak. Although nice for the PS2, it's hardly even close to the atmosphere.

What's more is they've changed some of the voice actors. So the PS2 version will sound different, because the original voice actor who played several key roles said he wasn't going to do it as a protest against Capcom making the GameCube Exclusive as a PS2 game.

(which I fully support his action btw)

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robo cat

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Posted: 6th Jun 2005 06:43

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Quote: "GameSpot are not known for thier 'accuracy' in interviews."

The bit about Mario GTA was just my analysis of it. That statement was from a Gamecube magazine, not Gamespot, and was a massive interview which I assume to be word for word. You have a point about the multiplayer though, but I think he means showing his kids the game he made.

Quote: "There are probably some more things, but in general the Playstation 2 version looks far more like Outbreak. Although nice for the PS2, it's hardly even close to the atmosphere."

Just checked out the PS2 screenshots for the first time and I see what you mean. The village looks all bright and cheerful. I also think those screenshots won't show the worst of it and have been selected because of that. A few sections will look awful without the special effects:
- The water sections of the village
- The liquid pools in the monastry
- The lave filled zone in the monastry
- The bit where you play as Ashley
- The bits in the village at night where its only lit by their torches

Theres plenty of other areas which rely on the special effects and I have no idea how they will be able to get those to look even half-decent without them.

The change of voice acting will also be a problem seeing as that had some of the best voice acting I've seen (or heard more appropriately) in a game. Good on to the person who decided not to work for the PS2 version. It won't be the same with different voices.

Simple... yet fun!

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ReneGade RG

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Posted: 6th Jun 2005 07:06

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Why has this turned into a conversation about resi evil 4?
I'm confused!

It's amazing you're reading this, surprise... you still are.

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Raven

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Posted: 6th Jun 2005 07:16

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Quote: "The bit about Mario GTA was just my analysis of it. That statement was from a Gamecube magazine, not Gamespot, and was a massive interview which I assume to be word for word. You have a point about the multiplayer though, but I think he means showing his kids the game he made."

It would explain the more 'kid' friendly looks they have, though still doesn't means that Renagades original point is any more accurate.

But yeah, Resident Evil 4 on the Playstation 2 isn't going to have the same effect. I don't doubt it'll be fun but what makes the GameCube version so great is the whole package not just the graphics, or the controls, or the voices.

By far it's a landmark game, but unfortunately because it's on the GameCube. Sony fans just won't accept it as a series title.

I've never seen a more rabid group of fanboys.. and this is comming from someone who is an Avid Nintendo and NVIDIA 'fanboy' himself. Even the ATi nuts have nothing on the sheer number and craziness of Sony fanatics.

Most of whom aren't even willing to give the game a chance. Remember having an argument with one, because he said that Resident Evil 4 was just a crap game; I mean he was trying to tell me that God of War had better graphics. Although that's not the on facet of the game, for these fanboys it seems to be a major point, but the simple matter is.. Screenshots are one thing, on your HDTV. Seriously Half-Life 2 and Doom 3 would have a hard time trying to keep up with the graphics detail that has gone into each environment for Resident Evil 4.

It truely is just the whole package. From the Shenmue-Style reaction movies, and dodging, to the range of weapons. The game just flows, and the way you can upgrade your weapons gives it just a sweet tactical element.

Gah! Definately hard to express how awesome it is, and trying to explain to a fanboy why it isn't suck seems to be like trying to convince people that Windows is actually stable.

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BearCDPOLD

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Posted: 6th Jun 2005 16:23

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Quote: "Yes, PSP didn't change games at all! looking back, it ruined the whole handheld experience! Games were almost too identical to home games that there was no gap and they were much harder to make, squeezing them into a minute screen!"

You're my new best friend. The only good use I've seen PSP put to is storing naughty pictures.

I don't agree with you on DS though. It's a little too early to judge the quality of the system. More and bigger-name games need to come out for it, such as that new Castlevania, which by the looks of it is uber-sexy.

Crazy Donut Productions
Current Project: A Redneck game

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robo cat

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Posted: 6th Jun 2005 17:38

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Quote: "still doesn't means that Renagades original point is any more accurate."

Fin by me, was never defending his point. His point implies Nintendo sat down and thought 'lets make some really tedious sailing sections to make the game longer' which they just wouldn't have done.

Quote: "Why has this turned into a conversation about resi evil 4?"

Because it shows how the Gamecube can produce graphics better than PS2 which is always useful in a debate against a sony fanboy.

Quote: "said that Resident Evil 4 was just a crap game"

One of my friends who is a PS2 fanboy (GRR!) said it was crap because its too arcady and isn't remotely scary. I made him play a few selections:
- the bit with Salazar's right hand (or is it left) man
- the bit with the dog's in the hedge maze
- the bit playing as Ashley
He soon changed his oppinion about it not being scary.

Simple... yet fun!

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Raven

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Posted: 6th Jun 2005 17:55

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heh.. well I didn't find the game scarey, but then I've been playing Resident Evil since it was released on the Playstation (what '96?)

Nothing really made me jump, but the bit with Salazar's right hand did have me worried a bit. I mean I used like all of the CO2 canisters on it... almost all of my ammo and the damn thing just wouldn't drop. Eventutally just kept running around the table until the lift came. heh

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robo cat

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Posted: 6th Jun 2005 18:09 Edited at: 6th Jun 2005 18:11

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Most of the game isn't the usual sort of scary in that it doesn't make you jump - like in previous Resis with dogs jumping through windows - but I find it still gets the adrenaline pumping. Its actually more tension and adrenaline than fear - which is a similar effect but better and harder for the developer to achieve. When your running away from the right hand man it is pretty tense as you wait for the lift to arrive. I think the adrenaline and tension is great in the game and a good move from the relatively cheap tactics of stuff just jumping out of nowhere.

Quote: "almost all of my ammo and the damn thing just wouldn't drop"

Lol. I realised after the first shot just pinged against his face that he was probably indestructable. Instead I just back away slowly forcing him to attack long range with his sting. This means you can just dodge his attacks with ease.

Another scene that is pretty worrying and tense is the bit with IT in the cages. Again, if he didn't have his dodgeable attack it would've been a lot harder. That was much more clostraphobic than the bit with Salazar's right. Its funny how it hasn't been mentioned yet, despite being a brilliant set piece.

Simple... yet fun!

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Raven

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Posted: 6th Jun 2005 18:29

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which particular 'it' are you refering to?
The 'Unclean' ones or the 'Regenerators'?

I think the Regenerator, the first one that didn't explode after you killed it's sybiots.. that was was very tense.
Especially as you open that chest and there's like the bit of it just kinda wriggling; : shivers : some really freaky bits.

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Eric T

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Posted: 6th Jun 2005 19:08

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Resi 4 was a bit more atmospheric scary, but it still had its fair share of "Resiscares" (As they are dubbed) in it. I still didn't find it scary, and I really haven't been scared by a game since Silent Hill 2 in the elevator in the hospital. I don't care who you are, when that radio show pops on, its freaky as hell

I do think RE4 is going to suck bad on the PS2. The controls will be nowhere near up to par to the GC's controls (They were perfect IMO). The graphics are also going to be a problem. I can only imagine the Church will look so dull...

Then again, you never know, maybe they have some uber secret technique to......... wait this is capcom

LEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEROY JENKINS!!
http://blog.myspace.com/erict An Alternative to Mouse's blog. Now with more lowbrow opinions.

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robo cat

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Posted: 6th Jun 2005 20:02

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Quote: "which particular 'it' are you refering to?"

The one called IT. I know what you mean about the regenerators.

I took down all the parasites only to think "What the f***! It still doesn't die!" not realising I had to shoot it again. Initially I just ran from them until I met the one in the freezer. The IT is the one he says will play with you or something like that. You're in the cages suspended in mid air which drop down into the pit of darkness. You have to shoot the switches to open the doors.

Quote: "The graphics are also going to be a problem"

If its restricted to one light source, this will mean they won't be able to do the village at night where you have to see by the villagers torches. A lot of the areas of the game - such as the bit with the guys manning the dragon flame throwers - just won't be able to be done without the special effects. Also, I read that it will have a reduced body count. This might make the version of Mercenaries for PS2 have less people attacking you, which will make it too easy to survive and too hard to rack up a huge combo.

Simple... yet fun!

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Raven

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Posted: 6th Jun 2005 20:11

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heh yeah now i remember what your on about... neither of the mosters i was thinking.

god those 'Unclean' ticked me off, they were like the hardest things to kill.

when IT came back up the cliff I was thinking 'OMFG! I'm so screwed!' but it was like a few hundred TMP rounds.. jobs a good'en.
was expecting more of a challenge. The puzzle itself was definately one of the more interesting though.

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robo cat

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Posted: 6th Jun 2005 20:32

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By Unclean, do you mean the villagers with tentacles coming out of their heads?

If so, if theres lots of them a flash grenade will kill them all in one!

Quote: "was expecting more of a challenge"

I think the purpose of him was purely the puzzle in the cage. Having to kill him at the end was just to get revenge after it terrorises you in the cage I think.

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ReneGade RG

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Posted: 6th Jun 2005 22:08

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I guess the PS2 version of Resi 4 is gonna suck! Oh well.... Better get a GC!

It's amazing you're reading this, surprise... you still are.

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Toby Quan

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Posted: 10th Jun 2005 01:47

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Quote: "Nintendo back-catalogue of games will be downloadable for free??"

This statement has just been disproven:

http://www.gamasutra.com/php-bin/news_index.php?story=5653

Quote: "Speaking at a Nintendo-hosted business conference in Japan, Iwata said, "There are Internet-based rumors indicating that the [Revolution's] Virtual Console will be available for play for free, but we have no plans to distribute without charge.""

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Jeku

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Posted: 10th Jun 2005 02:39

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Dayum. Too bad. If they followed through and released the old catalogue for free, it would cement the Revolution with success from the get go.

--[R.O.B.O.I. and FireTris Coming Soon]--

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Kevin Picone

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Posted: 10th Jun 2005 02:56

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Interestingly, in recent (yesterday for me) a news interview with Nintendo Australia (on a radio program called Cybershake), a Nintendo rep said that their older back catalog would be free. It's actually a fairly interested interview about the Rev. It should be hosted on their website http://www.cybershack.com.au for those willing to dig it up.

Kevin Picone
[url]www.underwaredesign.com[/url]
Play Nice! Play Basic (Release V1.073 Out Now)

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OSX Using Happy Dude

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Posted: 10th Jun 2005 03:27

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Now they are saying it wont be free.

Atomz is at http://homepages.nildram.co.uk/~nickk
http://spaces.msn.com/members/BouncyBrick/

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Raven

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Posted: 10th Jun 2005 03:49

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Actually they didn't say anything of the kind.

Quote: "Speaking at a Nintendo-hosted business conference in Japan, Iwata said, "There are Internet-based rumors indicating that the [Revolution's] Virtual Console will be available for play for free, but we have no plans to distribute without charge."

Apart from the fact the entire sentance is a gramatical nightmare, what they're saying is that to use the "Virtual Console" service won't be free.

There is nothing said about the individual games.

It'll probably be a Subscription based service. Say $6 per month like Fileplanet is, but all of the content you use is free.

So while the game are technically free, the use of the service won't be.

Another thing we have to remember is that the comments were made purely for the Asian market, not the world-wide market. People quickly forget how Nintendo's business model over there is extremely different because the prices of things like the Internet, Broadband, Cell Phones, etc.. is so much cheaper.

For example Pokémon Gold, Silver and Crystal all have Cellphone capabilities so you can play using a direct connection modem. Nintendo felt that the cost would be too great for europe and american, and as such the functionality was stripped.

The likelihood that because they will be catering more for people with much slower connections, and pay-per-month service for Europe, Australia and America would loose the service business. Instead we would pay a one-off fee, no doubt included in the cost of our version of the console. As again we often (especially Britian) pay far above the cost of hardware sold.

Just a case of the right service for the right market I think.

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Jeku

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Posted: 10th Jun 2005 04:07

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Well until the console is officially released in our market, we will not know for sure. This wouldn't be the first time a console developer has pulled a switcheroo after making fat bogus statements during the E3 hype.

Like Raven suggested, I wouldn't be surprised if it was some kind of subscription service, or a credits based system like some sites have. Pay $10 and you have 100 credits to download games. Some games might be cheaper and some more expensive. That would be pretty cool actually

Although with just 512MB of flash RAM in the console, I guess I won't be able to download ALL of the first-party N64 titles :-P

--[R.O.B.O.I. and FireTris Coming Soon]--

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Toby Quan

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Posted: 10th Jun 2005 05:27

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Okay, sign me up for:

Super Mario 1
Super Mario 2
Super Mario 3

And not those 16-bit remakes on Super Nintento - I want the real dealz.

Then, I'll take Metroid!

I'll pay $$$ - Just tell me where to sign!!!

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robo cat

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Posted: 10th Jun 2005 05:44

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Presumably any server they have running to provide them downloads will be kept incredibly busy. They might have the games for free but you have to wait in a queue but you could upgrade to a premium service where you have priority etc. Thats a possibility.

They may make the games free and make money through advertising. They could get an advertising deal so that it pops up various adverts while it downloads. This is what I am most hoping for since Nintendo would make lots of money - seeing as the adverts would get LOADS of viewers - and the the customers would get free games. Hint, hint,Nintendo if you're listening using some magic fairy powder (which we all know you have).

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Jeku

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Posted: 10th Jun 2005 23:46 Edited at: 10th Jun 2005 23:47

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OK I just got some money for graduating from Uni, so I bought my wife a lot of clothes and got myself a DS

Cool thing is it came with a free game--- unfortunately it was Star Wars EP. III but hey, it was free! Then I picked up a copy of Super Mario 64 DS or whatever it's called. Haven't played it yet since I plugged it in overnight.

Total came to $273 CDN, which isn't too bad. There's a nifty blue DS out now, which my wife tried to talk me into getting, but I held my foot down haha. It didn't come with the Metroid demo OR the free game, so what's the point? And it's the same price.

Gonna play on the train this morning.

--[R.O.B.O.I. and FireTris Coming Soon]--

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Geek Culture / More on Nintendo's Revolution---- Nintendo back-catalogue of games will be downloadable for free??