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Geek Culture / Music Sharing fight against the evil recording industry

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aprilfan
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Posted: 27th Jun 2003 01:37 Edited at: 27th Jun 2003 01:44
So 4 college students were recently brought to court, and are now facing $17,500 in settlements. The association will use software to find people distributing copyrighted material, identify what service providers they use to connect to the Internet, and then use expedited subpoena procedures granted to copyright holders through the Digital Millennium Copyright Act, Oppenheim said. The subpoena will force the service providers to hand over their customers' personal information.

A giant company thats trying to threaten you into buying its CDs...
The end is near for the RIAA and this is it's last ditch effort, screw inocent peoples lives over for no reason!?!? I don't understand! Maybe someone from the fantasy world that the RIAA lives in can help me out.

This affront on the consumers dignity and privancy is insane, evil, and at best doomed to fail. Post your support for the common music listener who is now going to be sued for millions, by a heartless multi-million dollar company! This may be the last post I get to make before I sell the computer to pay for the impending costs of the trial and settlement...


-Anjin san

The Great Schism.- The Earths reaction to Heavons invasion.
Ian T
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Posted: 27th Jun 2003 01:46
The recording industry is one of the cruelist industries in the world, to its artists and its customers. I've been sharing for years and I'm not going to stop now. They're dying, and I'm glad of it.

--Mouse

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aprilfan
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Posted: 27th Jun 2003 01:48
Heck yeah! thats waht I want to hear! thanks for getting the ball rolling mouse!

The Great Schism.- The Earths reaction to Heavons invasion.
Kangaroo2
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Posted: 27th Jun 2003 02:10 Edited at: 27th Jun 2003 02:11
I buy CDs, I also download Mp3s - But if I download something I never actually share it - you can actually get in serious trouble for distributing, even just by having people download through Kazaa Personally I think the industry IS very greedy and isn't known for treating people well - god knows I've worked in it

That said, when I do become an internationally recognised artist I'll be kinda annoyed if I don't sell any copys BUT its the most illegally downloaded track of the time

Bunnies aren't just cute like everybody supposes, They got them hoppy legs & twitchy little noses,
And what's with all the carrots? What do they need such good eyesight for anyway?
BatVink
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Posted: 27th Jun 2003 02:18 Edited at: 27th Jun 2003 02:19
Quote: "I've been sharing for years and I'm not going to stop now"


...so, they've already got your admission, first name, date of birth, location and email address

Thanks in advance.
All the Best,
StevieVee
Arrow
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Posted: 27th Jun 2003 03:26
Ya know they passed up a plan to just add a small surcharge on to your ISP and let you dl all the media you want. They went through this when radio and tv came out and they used the above methiod, why do you think they got commercals? They're pushing the limits of the law, if they go any futher it will be comsidered hacking, which kinda what's me see them go that far, just to get caught. Then we'll see which is stronger, Recording Companies Lobbiest's bribes or the Patriot Act.

Teenage Male Geek + Female Remotly Intersted in Common Geek Activities = Teenage Male Jackass
QuothTheRaven
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Posted: 27th Jun 2003 04:36
That same "evil corporation" just lost 1/3 of it's profits to internet pirating...and they want them back, mind you. Don't blame companies for being angry about going bankrupt.

Darken the skies, we are god
http://www.DelvarWorld.com
Arrow
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Posted: 27th Jun 2003 05:06
They're being greedy, even added a $1 surcharge to connect to the net, they'll more than make up for it, but it won't get them the most cash. Ya know, I don't think they're losing profits to the net, I think people just aren't buying the crappy music that's coming out.

Teenage Male Geek + Female Remotly Intersted in Common Geek Activities = Teenage Male Jackass
Ian T
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Posted: 27th Jun 2003 05:14
'...so, they've already got your admission, first name, date of birth, location and email address '

Too true, and that's the FBI at the door, with Ashcroft waving a M16

And quoth, for once Arrow is right. This is not a 'normal' industry. It gives hardly any profit to songwriters and singers, it uses them as tools and not people. Compared to getting your music out the way you want, selling a piece of software publishers don't like is EASY.

--Mouse

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aprilfan
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Posted: 27th Jun 2003 06:45
THEY don't care, and THEY are not going to stop until they drive US all into the ground or THEY drive themselves into the red.
No one is safe anymore when the CEO vows to prosecute even minors.

The Great Schism.- The Earths reaction to Heavons invasion.
Ian T
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Posted: 27th Jun 2003 07:12
Actually, almost everyone is safe, IMO. There isn't enough cash in the USA to fine all the people sharing music. The threat is pretty much the same-- they're trying intimidation by picking targets at random.

--Mouse

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aprilfan
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Posted: 27th Jun 2003 07:17
yeah probably, but it will suck if one of us are the random ones...

The Great Schism.- The Earths reaction to Heavons invasion.
bitJericho
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Posted: 27th Jun 2003 09:07
Quote: "That same "evil corporation" just lost 1/3 of it's profits to internet pirating...and they want them back, mind you. Don't blame companies for being angry about going bankrupt."


HAHAHA who's fault is it that the 'evil corporation' is losing 1/3 of it's profits? They shouldn't take the internet as a threat. Cassette tapes gave the same threat because of the easy copying...what the industry should do is start selling their music online under some sort of music format... make it just as easy as Kazaa or any other sharing utility and they will recover.. people will stop sharing music like they are now because there is an easy, cheap and legal solution...

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8truths
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Posted: 27th Jun 2003 09:36
The "evil corporation" is thing is total bullshit.

Let's say, "Dumb corporation".

1. Because today's music is shit. Granted, so were old Robert Johnson albums, but at least his broke, black Mississippi ass deserved the money, unlike, say, Justin Timerlake or Mick Jagger.

2. Market forces. $18 is too much for a CD. When all is said and done, the price increases of the past decades have simply been offset by piracy. You reap what you sow, and the recording industry is getting theirs for being dumb.

3. "Dumb consumers" who need to stop pirating software and form the occassional consumer advocacy group. Failing that, there is always the cabin in Montana / mail bomb option.

I wish coporations were evil. Evil implies enough sense to serve a purpose and play a role. These jag-offs are just the usual dumb rich -- people too thick to program an OS, but with lifestyle obsessions that require Bill Gates-level bank reserves.

But, what do you expect for an industry that has several veins coming into it from organized crime?

MrTAToad
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Posted: 27th Jun 2003 12:31
...so, they've already got your admission, first name, date of birth, location and email address
You wouldn't be stupid enough to give your proper details would you ?

Good news everyone! I really am THAT good...
http://www.nickk.nildram.co.uk/ for great plug-ins - oh my, yes!
empty
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Posted: 27th Jun 2003 12:56 Edited at: 27th Jun 2003 12:57
Quote: "
what the industry should do is start selling their music online under some sort of music format
"

Although the music industry should do that, it's rather stupid to believe that this will stop piracy.

Yes, there's something wrong with the music industry, however, music piracy doesn't only affect the big bosses but artists at any level (from the superstar to a band trying to get a deal) as well.

Ogres have layers.
bitJericho
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Posted: 27th Jun 2003 13:26
Quote: "Although the music industry should do that, it's rather stupid to believe that this will stop piracy."


i never said it would stop...but it sure wouldn't hurt any

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empty
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Posted: 27th Jun 2003 13:51
Quote: "
i never said it would stop...but it sure wouldn't hurt any
"

True, but as long as you can get the same music for free, most people wouldn't pay for it anyway.

Ogres have layers.
Kangaroo2
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Posted: 27th Jun 2003 16:55
Hmm yeah I think I would feel a lot more guilty about file sharing if I didn't know the pitiful Royalties most companies give their artists

Bunnies aren't just cute like everybody supposes, They got them hoppy legs & twitchy little noses,
And what's with all the carrots? What do they need such good eyesight for anyway?
Ian T
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Posted: 27th Jun 2003 19:00
'Because today's music is shit.'

HAHA, that's what you get for not listening to country music!

*Turns volume up*

--Mouse

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Joeyjoejoe Shabadoo
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Posted: 27th Jun 2003 19:07
It burns
Ian T
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Posted: 27th Jun 2003 19:29
Good to know. ONLY THE RICHEOUS WILL SURVIVE!

Er... ummm... no, I'm not a fanatic, I... umm...



--Mouse

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the_winch
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Posted: 27th Jun 2003 22:51
There is plently of music that won't get you in court for sharing and wont give money to people like the RIAA.

If you really want to make a differnece boycot all RIAA music, don't share it,buy it,sell it,listen to it or talk about it. Delete it all and never even think about it again.

If enough people did this they wouldn't exist for very long.
If only people would spend their money responsably, but when people are prepared to kill to save a few £ it's unlikly they will care about a few people going to court.

Quote: "what the industry should do is start selling their music online under some sort of music format"


I don't believe this will ever happen the people pulling the strings are too out of touch and too stupid. Also the public do not want to pay to download music they want music for free.
8truths
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Posted: 27th Jun 2003 23:01
What everyone really needs to do is go to a cafe and listen to a college freshman play half-assed pick on her guitar while reading awful poetry about her ex-boyfriend.

Then, the RIAA would be able to demand $30 an album from all of us, and we'd ante up.

The mail bomb option stays open, but the target changes to small cafes in towns with state-run universities.

Ian T
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Posted: 27th Jun 2003 23:18
'If you really want to make a differnece boycot all RIAA music, don't share it,buy it,sell it,listen to it or talk about it. Delete it all and never even think about it again.'

Yes, but enough people WON'T do that. Sharing music people WILL do and it clearly IS making a difference... see?

--Mouse

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empty
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Posted: 28th Jun 2003 00:38
Quote: "
Hmm yeah I think I would feel a lot more guilty about file sharing if I didn't know the pitiful Royalties most companies give their artists
"

Well, it's not only the royalties they have to pay for their artists but most of them (artists) deserve better contracts, that's true.

Ogres have layers.
Arrow
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Posted: 28th Jun 2003 01:06
"for once Arrow is right"
Just once?

I still think the $1 extra surcharge to your monthly ISP bill would be the best solution. The music industy is about as evil as an organization can be. They're also trying to shut down internet radio even if they have no rights to the media being played. They're looking for a monopoly, plain and simple.

Teenage Male Geek + Female Remotly Intersted in Common Geek Activities = Teenage Male Jackass
Ian T
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Posted: 28th Jun 2003 01:31
'Just once?'

I think that makes 3 on my Big List of Occasions when Arrow had a Good Point, actually.

--Mouse

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Solidz Snake
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Posted: 28th Jun 2003 03:06
lmao!

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the_winch
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Posted: 28th Jun 2003 03:55
Quote: "I still think the $1 extra surcharge to your monthly ISP bill would be the best solution."

Why should I pay the RIAA for anything? I don't pirate their music I wouldn't even listen to it if the radio wansn't on at work. I ak all for paying for what I use why should everybody else get a free ride?

Quote: "Yes, but enough people WON'T do that. Sharing music people WILL do and it clearly IS making a difference... see?"


It's not making a difference the RIAA are still there and will be for a while. You want to get rid of them stop using their product. All that happens is they loose some money. Where will you get the music from if there is no money?

Quote: "What everyone really needs to do is go to a cafe and listen to a college freshman play half-assed pick on her guitar while reading awful poetry about her ex-boyfriend."


Or maybe they could go listen to a lot of talented bands that will play for a crate of beer a small amount of cash and perhaps some drugs.

Perhaps I am biased because the music I listen to is unaffected by any clamp down on sharing. I still can't see sharing stuff the RIAA don't want you to is the answer to anything. Want to make a difference change the law to make it legal.

I would wonder if the reaction here would be any different if it was game sharing being clamped down on insted of music.
8truths
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Posted: 28th Jun 2003 04:53
"Talented bands"? In a cafe? Is life THAT different in the UK?

In the US, that sort of band plays Friday night in a bar with peanut shells on the floor, a cold draft coming from the bathroom, 50-yr old women who smoke like it's still the 1800s on the make, a guy with a glass eye hitting on some woman who's afraid to call the police, and the smell of piss drifting through an exterior wall.

Come to think of . . . nah . . . that bar was in Canada.

Cafes are where people with unresolved issues about their parents go to bitch thru their poetry.

I used to have a "friend" who dragged me to shit like that (we haven't talked in years). What I would have given to see one crappy garage band, let alone the offer of a good band! Never at a cafe.

Ian T
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Posted: 28th Jun 2003 06:20
Actually, there's a pretty decent one down here where some pretty okay folk bands play on friday nights. It's not amazing, but it dosen't grate against your ears. They used to serve good food too... but they changed their menu, and a lot of people smoke inside now, so I don't drop by any more.

At least I've still got the little coffee shop .

--Mouse

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MikeS
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Posted: 28th Jun 2003 06:31
I download a couple songs off the internet, if I like them, I go buy the cd, if I don't, I delete them.

Simple as that, what's the music industry got to lose?
(don't anwser that last question I already know what you'll say)



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aprilfan
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Posted: 28th Jun 2003 23:05
Hey, if they clamped down on game sharing I would say the same thing. But game sharing is a little different, there is no ULTIMATE POWER like the RIAA in game programming... Heck if I ever finish a half decent game I will feal honored if it's cracked! I mean that takes a will to have my product that surpases buying it, the work to crack it is a sign of the quality and the desire to own my software... I don't know am I alone in my fealings about the honor of having your game cracked?

Information is becoming more and more free, it started with radio, and then tapes that could copy the songs on the radio, I have never had the RIAA bust in my door and take me and my tapes to court... And they won't because they can't invade my home and privacy. But they seam to think it's ok to strong-arm MSN into giving my records to them, the records I was assured would be private when I signed the contract with MSN. You can bet your ass Discreet and macromedia wouldn't have been able to get those records from verizon. But the RIAA can. Why?

Just think about it, what if Blizard had wanted those college students records? I bet they would have been shot down in a second. But the RIAA can bully, strong-arm, bribe, threaten, and go around the law, when the unjust law dosn't work for them. I have started boycotting CD's published by Sony and other affiliates of RIAA and You guys who agree should do so too. The_winch was right, they aren't getting anymore lawsuit funding from me.

-Anjin san

The Great Schism.- The Earths reaction to Heavons invasion.
Shadow Robert
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Posted: 29th Jun 2003 00:04
Quote: "That said, when I do become an internationally recognised artist I'll be kinda annoyed if I don't sell any copys BUT its the most illegally downloaded track of the time"


you notice though that the tracks people make available on Kazaa and such are tracks that either you can't buy in the country you live, else its artists who already are millionaires...
i mean not being funny but if i'm work 6.5 million like Mariah, preaching about how my fans are everything to me ... then taking them to court because they don't give me the $0.05 for that single track they've downloaded.

personally i buy CD's ... i buy DvD's ... but i also download ALOT of music which i'm just unable to get my hands on, or i wouldn't actually get otherwise.
Not to be funny but there ain't no way in hell i wanna buy an album for $20 which only has a single song i like on it, and if you want it in single form thats $5!?

if they want to truely cut piracy they have to think about not screwing us over ... i mean seriously how can these companies be struggling because of piracy?
its like the computer games industry, we all know people pirate games rather than paying for them - and to a degree that does piss me off ... but on the other hand we're not exactly underpaid for what we do, i earnt over $100k last year for sitting on my ass and knocking a few matricies together to ressemble worlds people would believe. If alot of people pirate the game, then i don't blame them after all it was like $55 - which is one hell of alot of cash for a kid, and for people who are expected to shell out on so many titles per month. Yet the money still does roll in quite well enough to pay some very fat wage packets for everyone.

The games industry is just as pirated as the music, so why are the music the only ones making this much of a fuss? Microsoft are probably the most pirated company in the world, they're trying to combat this but they're not taking people to court because their loosing millions a day.

as for the artists saying "oh i'm so worried my album is going to be pirated before release!" ... someone explain to my just HOW THE HELL can someones album be pirated prior to release? That would mean a finished & edited version would need to be available for someone within the company that also has access to put it online ... just like software companies they've gotta start to actually look INTERNALLY rather than EXTERNALLY for pirates, because ALL of the pre-release pirates are from people who have signed contracts that they won't distribute without permission.
You can't blame the people who spread it on for the initial leak, pirate are like journolists - they have no sense of what is right and wrong, or what is acceptable ... they just wanna look the big man by getting out software you cant' even buy yet.
If people knew that they'd target individuals you'd actually find less and less musics & software posted online from the sources.

personally i think there should be like a time limit music and games sharing - something like after a year of release your allowed to place it legally for sharing with programs like Kazaa and eDonkey.
after a year artists rarely make more money from thier albums (as they oftenly forgotten) this would also eliviate the need to stock such huge supplies.

personally i'd buy more music online if each track i wanted was like $1.00 - $13 for 13 tracks, seems fair ... but you see the current prices they sell for - christ, i'd rather buy the bloody CDs just for value.

I pride myself that i don't kill... well not without a good reason
Kangaroo2
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Posted: 30th Jun 2003 00:08 Edited at: 30th Jun 2003 00:09
I agree.

I'll just make sure my album is 100% good tracks and worth the money.

Plus most fans'll just buy it for the ultra sexy pictures of me anyways

Bunnies aren't just cute like everybody supposes, They got them hoppy legs & twitchy little noses,
And what's with all the carrots? What do they need such good eyesight for anyway?
Shadow Robert
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Posted: 30th Jun 2003 01:07
lol... well you've yet to prove your sexiness mate
but i think your friend bunni is kinda fine hehee

hey i've spent most of the day working on the OST for 7th Day Project, has been a bitch editing and getting all of the artists to agree to it, it's certainly an interesting soundtrack - gonna be putting up a sample of it on the website, didn't know i'd sampled so much music for the game though.

22 Tracks - 1hr 19mins
has music from all over the globe, America - Russia - Japan (not brits unfortunately lol) ... man i wish i could give this to someone else to checkout if the tracks fit right though, because its got
Industrial Rock, Rave, Gothic Rock, Dance, Euphoria, Classical, Hiphop ...
just such an insane mix, but funnily it all mixxes together bloody well (well cept for tracks 5&6) but thats only cause when i downloaded track5 from AOL it screwed up the end, we're still trying to figure out if it was actuall AOL or whether it was the recording studio, but no matters i'm probably gonna fade it with 6 to make it blend as they're the same tempo and similar style should work quite well.

will be uploading the 20second intro's though so someone can get a clue about it (just gotta figure out howto save 10sec intro's)

I pride myself that i don't kill... well not without a good reason
indi
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Posted: 30th Jun 2003 06:22
uncook the mp3 if it was a case of this aspect.

many years ago when u downloaded an mp3 for a pc you had to uncook them which removed weird ticks and hisses that appeared when it was downloaded, sometimes half the song would skip to the next track also.

www.google.com

mp3 uncooker

Shadow Robert
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Posted: 30th Jun 2003 10:13
yeah i'll try, its one of our mp3 machines thats gone wrong i know that much - its only the last 15seconds where it fades out ... but still noticeable enough

Yarbles
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Posted: 30th Jun 2003 12:52
I see alot of people debating the morality of piracy in this thread, but that completely misses the point of what this "fight" is truly about.

Piracy is a red herring issue; it's smoke and mirrors put up by the record indutry conglomorates and those who don't really understand what is at stake here.

This fight is a power-struggle about distribution and even more so, exposure. Plain and simple! The people that control exposure and distribution control the industry and reap the rewards. Currently, the major forms of exposure for music artists are radio and television and the major form of distribution are CDs sold in stores. But, the Internet is here and it's growing, who knows exactly what the future may hold, but already it is a fairly viable source for exposure and a great source for distribution. Oh did I mention, it's cheap, cheap enough that somebody with the know-how could afford to compete with the big boys from their own basement!

There are many artists currently selling their product themselves directly on the Internet, but that is adhoc and uncentralized. A large, centralized disribution channel for music is a much greater threat. The music industry cannot afford to allow a centralized media distribution service to flourish online unless it was controlled by them. They'll be damned before a broke basement hacker takes away their "Gazillion dollar" power of distribution and exposure. That's why they killed Napster and are attempting to kill all the others like it currently. It's about their survival in their current form.

Redmotion
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Posted: 30th Jun 2003 15:24 Edited at: 30th Jun 2003 15:33
I think we have to be realistic here. If you owned a record label, would you want people copying work you invested a lot of money in? Would you like it if someone nicked a game you had slaved over for 2 years and sold it for a £5 a pop? (=money for nothing) No. Of course not.

The problem is: companies wanting as much as they can get. The only people who have suffered are the artists. Hopefully, the internet and modern computer-based technologies/recording will empower artists to bypass these companies altogether and take ALL the money for themselves.

Creatives have always been SCREWED by the distributors/companies who take advantage of people desperate to be successful/heard/seen/etc. As you can see : the average bandmember makes little or no money in the first few years, and the companies make a small fortune:

"Recording artists are paid on the basis of a royalty from record sales, and, at the beginning of each contract year, cash advances on account of future royalties. ROYALTIES These vary according to the strength of your bargaining position, but 10- 14% of retail selling price is about average for a new band. RSP is the selling price in the shops, minus VAT and a percentage packaging charge record companies require artists to contribute towards marketing costs. The end result is that, if a CD retails for £12, a band could earn between 70p and £1.00 per CD sold. The cost of recording and other advances you have received will be subtracted first from any royalties due. " From: http://www.stormpages.com/supportbands/recordingcontract1.html

So you see, the artists, more often than not, even have to pay for the recording themselves...

Dual athlon 2000 MP - 1GB ram
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It is too late now..BECAUSE YOU HAVE NOT BEEN PLAYING ATTENTION.
Kangaroo2
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Posted: 30th Jun 2003 16:55
"well you've yet to prove your sexiness mate"

Working on a new album now man, and with it I'll be making a website to sell it, so I'll link y'all to that, and I shall be heralded king of all dbers

Bunnies aren't just cute like everybody supposes, They got them hoppy legs & twitchy little noses,
And what's with all the carrots? What do they need such good eyesight for anyway?
jeffmosesuk
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Posted: 30th Jun 2003 17:05
I have always used kazza etc for the purpose of downloading music and divx movies to see if i actually like it first then go and purchace the original if i like it. I would say that 99% of people that download copies would not actually go out and buy the origional anyway so cant see the companies loosing out that much.

Plus you have the added hastle of waiting for the things to download, a DVD is not exactly quick to download on a 56k dial up and the actual files are very rarely 100% quality and then you have all the complete nobs that put fake files on ? Why share and waste your bandwidth with rubbish

Basically we are going further and further down the road of being charged for uploading etc. BT's price fixing on ISP's is shocking (if your in uk). Remember the internet used to be free and in my mind always should be !

Shadow Robert
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Posted: 30th Jun 2003 22:58
Jason i'm not disputing the fact of piracy, but look at the companies which are actually making the huge fuss and the artists who are making the huge fuss...

EMI, BMI, Virgin, Rockstar, etc... and the Richest of the Rich artists.
If they were doing this to protect the little firm, or that even the little labels said "yeah, we're getting sick of this" but no... Evanescences label deliberatly released ALL of the tracks on thier new album onto the internet in the new "demo" form, stratigically placing them so that so many people download them that you don't know which are real tracks from the album and which aren't.

Incase no one has heard what a demo track is, the first section of the track is setup is a recursive loop of an annoying sound (telephone ring for example) the Media player or Winamp plays it randomly.

Evanescence don't seem to have made much of a loss and thier label is also not exactly struggling anymore - people will alway pirate music, i mean technically just recording an CD to tape so you can play it in the car is piracy (and people have been done for it before) ... i agree the resellers & black marketeers should be stoped, but i don't think that the record companies should take thier frustration out on the people that are more likely to actually do out and buy an album they like after hearing it online...

i think as the years go on the companies that figure way to allow people to have what they want just enough to make them actually spend money will be the ones that are going to survive this rampant piracy times

...

and Sam ... i thought i was your fwiend you can't share some of that godly talent over yahoo! lol

aprilfan
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Posted: 1st Jul 2003 00:45
Thats a good point Raven.

Chevelle also released an album on the internet in the Demo form(annoying beeping throughout the song) and it wasn't so bad I eventually found a real one but it was a great way to TRY the song out and until the law suits began I was going to BUY the album.

-Anjin San

The Great Schism.- The Earths reaction to Heavons invasion.
Kangaroo2
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Posted: 1st Jul 2003 01:02
aww sorry man We certainly are 'fwiends' I've just not loaded Yahoo Messanger on my new hard-drive yet, (got it about 2 weeks ago, STILL installing all my old stuff on it As soon as I do, I'll say hi, and now I know I'm missed, I'll put it on high priority

Bunnies aren't just cute like everybody supposes, They got them hoppy legs & twitchy little noses,
And what's with all the carrots? What do they need such good eyesight for anyway?
Shadow Robert
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Posted: 1st Jul 2003 02:32
well i got ahold of the demo's way in advance of the album reaching the UK for evanescence - i'd heard a little about them but whilst they'd be getting big in the states i'd been in the UK, the day it was released i bought it ... 3-4weeks as UK number1 isn't a bad rep - that means its outselling everything else for that period, so lol yup doubt it did them anyharm to have everyone want it


Sam sod yahoo, ya know i have msn on 24/7 get grab yourself msn6 and page us next time your on lol

empty
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Location: 3 boats down from the candy
Posted: 1st Jul 2003 13:38
Quote: "
but look at the companies which are actually making the huge fuss and the artists who are making the huge fuss...
EMI, BMI, Virgin, Rockstar, etc... and the Richest of the Rich artists.
If they were doing this to protect the little firm, or that even the little labels said "yeah, we're getting sick of this" but no...
"

Who'd listen to small companies and "second row" artists on this subject?
BTW I haven't seen more independant labels dying than in the last 3 or so years. Plus indi labels need publishing and distribution deals with the big companies in order to successfully chart a single or an album. Who do you think distributes Wind-Up Records (Evanescence's label)?

I awoke in a fever. The bedclothes were all soaked in sweat.
She said "You've been having a nightmare and it's not over yet"
Shadow Robert
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Posted: 1st Jul 2003 18:46
Quote: "Who do you think distributes Wind-Up Records (Evanescence's label)?"


everyone... currently the biggest retailer of Evanescence is Amazon - and they don't make much of a fuss from piracy.

the indi labels going under at the moment isn't caused by piracy, it caused by the bigger companies pushing out thier sales with the manufactured pop which can get better advertisment coverage as they can afford to spend more on it.
think about it, unless a label has something bloody special under thier hood then people just will never hear about them without advertisement but they can't afford to advertise and when they do it always looks like a cheap & tacky job (as they can't afford quality)

i'm not saying the smaller companies would be listened to, but if it were the big companies "backing up" the smaller companies i think this would be less about just thier profit margins and more about the industry as a whole.

on the surface it is a pretty simple affair to say "oh well this causes this and such" but when you look deeper all the big companies are looking out for are thier profits and no-one elses.
They look billions on these manufactured pop groups as they only have a limited shelf life and the money they make doesn't outweight what they cost to run until they've been around for a year ... most only survive 3 then they split up.
The way i see it the industry won't start to make a decent profit again as a whole until we have REAL music filtering in again.

bands like A and Coldplay are great, but they're overshadowed by crap like "3 Tiney Ladies" or other poppy crap things.
When the industry starts to promote REAL artists again, then i will bet you a dime for a dollar that the industry will report its profits up. Perhaps not inandating us with like 20new artists a year per label, i mean c'mon but again unless they just don't stand a chance.
i find myself listening to ALOT of new music, from unknown artists all the time - who imho should be on a label selling like hotcakes, but they just done get the coverage they need and die into obscruity with a crushed dream.

empty
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Posted: 1st Jul 2003 19:25
Quote: "
everyone... currently the biggest retailer of Evanescence is Amazon - and they don't make much of a fuss from piracy.
"

I'm not talking about retailers but distributers. In the music industry distribution means more than just selling stuff to the retailers (most indi labels don't even have the money to actually produce all the cds that are needed for a commercially,world-wide successful band- I don't even know one).

I awoke in a fever. The bedclothes were all soaked in sweat.
She said "You've been having a nightmare and it's not over yet"

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