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3 Dimensional Chat / [LOCKED] Sharpening Skills

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Shadow Robert
17
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Joined: 22nd Sep 2002
Location: Hertfordshire, England
Posted: 10th Nov 2002 06:14
i kinda got a little bored with coding constantly ...
still waiting for Xtom to lemme know what he wants. oh well nm eh

anyways if kentaree reads this before i getta speak to him later, i've kinda gone and done something stupid and erm lost those models of yours :$ however ... i'm gonna see about making them again, wasn't too happy with them as they were anyways >
i was writing down the entire list, thought F**K me thats alot of models hahaa, i think you're gonna have to tell me the most important ones to gameplay ... however ofcourse Vegeta will be one of them

well back to the model -> http://members.lycos.co.uk/timesaga/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=17

there is it all the banta about it is there...
Anata aru kowagaru no watashi! http://members.lycos.co.uk/TimeSaga/smile/wack.gif[/img]
Puffy
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Joined: 4th Sep 2002
Location: United States
Posted: 10th Nov 2002 11:31
texture him... O_O texture him...

AMD Athlon XP 2100+ OC to 3Ghz/1.5gigs ram/128mb ti4200/120gigs hd/19" monitor/Sound Blaster Audigy Platinum EX/2.5mbs Sat Con... I joined in!
Shadow Robert
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Joined: 22nd Sep 2002
Location: Hertfordshire, England
Posted: 10th Nov 2002 14:41
not quite what i ment by comments hehee
besides i'm not sure what he is suppose to be exactly...
you tell me what he is and i'll texture him like that

Anata aru kowagaru no watashi!
Kentaree
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Joined: 5th Oct 2002
Location: Clonmel, Ireland
Posted: 10th Nov 2002 23:14
Don't worry Raven, while I'm still busy developing tools (and that will probably be a while ) the models aren't an absolute necessity, so take your time and dont rush them. Obviously, the main characters from the series are badly needed: Goku, Gohan, Piccolo, Vegeta, Future Trunks (well, maybe not a major character but I like him ), maybe some of the humans (you decide) and probably Frieza, Cell and Buu (any form for the moment).

Sarcasm is an artform
Shadow Robert
17
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Joined: 22nd Sep 2002
Location: Hertfordshire, England
Posted: 11th Nov 2002 02:06
Kentaree... what the hell is up with your Av ... you live in the UK don't use Tripod use Lycos!!
swear man far better service than anything in the states

Anata aru kowagaru no watashi!
Kentaree
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Joined: 5th Oct 2002
Location: Clonmel, Ireland
Posted: 11th Nov 2002 22:35
Fixed it! Thanks for the tip!

Sarcasm is an artform
Shadow Robert
17
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Joined: 22nd Sep 2002
Location: Hertfordshire, England
Posted: 11th Nov 2002 23:37
just finished getting some basic shots of of the skin up...
still no head (but then i'm gonna take a while on that)

link up above if people wanna see

Anata aru kowagaru no watashi!
Puffy
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Joined: 4th Sep 2002
Location: United States
Posted: 15th Nov 2002 07:39
nice he is textured... what modeler and how do you make textures raven O_O im into using blender maya bryce 3d studio max cinema 4d milkshape3d and lightwave... but i dont know how to make my own textures like that O_O so my stuff compensates for being highpoly... sigh...

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Shadow Robert
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Joined: 22nd Sep 2002
Location: Hertfordshire, England
Posted: 15th Nov 2002 09:08
textures for me is pretty simple right now - i'm really not a good pixel pusher

the model is made in 3D Studio Max 4.26 (i'd prefer Maya, but we use Max at work) - and once i've finished a mesh i'm relatively happy with, i begin to map out basic sections by faces that need to blend together - so the main jacket front/back for snake needs to go together so i take the front faces of his body and plain map them onto a blank UV Space, i then take the rear faces of and do the same but upside down to match the top. Then i take the top his shoulder the part inbetween and map that in the same way.
The result is 3 maps all flattened to a view which need to be as a single map but not mis-shapen, so you have to keep a mental note of its shape to keep the perspective - and begin to join them up. so now it looks like i've taken the front, top and rear of his body and just layed it out like a carboard box.
From this i then shape it slightly so the sides stick out to shape it better... once happy it then export that using Texporter in a pretty high resolution, usually 1024x1024 and print it out
(if i used a tablet i probably wouldn't print it out but, i still don't have one hehee)

i then get a thin pretty poor quality peice of paper that i can see through to the UV Map i've just printed.
On that i take my time and carefully sketch out what i want the jacket to look like, once i'm happy enough i'll then scan it into Paintshop Pro (at work i'm suppose to use photo, but i paid for a copy of paint for myself at work as only i use it )
in there I'll take some time to accentuate parts, get rid of the scan gunk ... then i'll use 3 RGB layers
first one i brush the fill colour for the area. the second layer is where i accent details with black&white airbrushing. last one is the lightmap, where i give everything character ... make it round and shadowed and such.
Then save that (as i know i'll want to use it later on in that editable state) and copy a merged version.
That is then finally placed upon the UV map and becomes what you see on the model once it is scaled down, softenly sharpened slightly from the scale bluring

also reducing colours from 24bit to 8bit 256 Octree Reduced Colour Bleeding give some nice blending effects, especially when you up the colours again and adverage blur at a high resolution then scale down

i've still alot to learn about texturing from chiq, but thank god she's a patient teacher eh

Anata aru kowagaru no watashi!
Shadow Robert
17
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Joined: 22nd Sep 2002
Location: Hertfordshire, England
Posted: 15th Nov 2002 09:12
Oh... for my car btw (posted somewhere in this forum thread) was almost completely textured using a High Polygon veiw version

this was prior to me getting a tool called BumpTexture which allows Max to do this itself, but basically I made a pretty high 20,000 polygon version of the BMW 3Series - which isn't much good for gameing so i created a lower polygon one of about 800polygons ... but i render'd the high polygon one in each of the main veiws "front,side,top,back" and used that to create the actual texture on the one in the post

as i said BumpTexture will actually do this for you, but most people don't have like $500 just for something that cool

Anata aru kowagaru no watashi!
Puffy
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Joined: 4th Sep 2002
Location: United States
Posted: 15th Nov 2002 09:48
yeh pay for it yeh -_- i pay for all of my software... ALL OF IT... O_O

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Shadow Robert
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Joined: 22nd Sep 2002
Location: Hertfordshire, England
Posted: 15th Nov 2002 10:36
try this on for size...
my purchases per year are for extended business licences (so i can work from home and use the work for work)
for

Softimage, Maya Unlimited (plus addons), 3DS Max 4 (plus addons), PaintShop Pro, PhotoShop Pro, Illustrator, Norton Internet Security & AntiVirus, Microsoft ActiveSecure, Gmax Developer, PhotoSuite, LapLink and MS Office

thats just software wise, i'm always having to purchase extra hardware to keep up rendering very quick - and to work in higher resolutions with more applications quicker.

trust me if you see my bill each year, even with VAT deducted you'd cry as much as I feel like most days

its annoying how offsite users have to update licences and not be able to purchase a product once and be done with it, stupid business crap

Anata aru kowagaru no watashi!
Puffy
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Posted: 16th Nov 2002 05:48
yeh that would suck...

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AlecM
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Joined: 26th Aug 2002
Location: Concord, MA
Posted: 22nd Nov 2002 22:39
nice model. there are a few weird things on it. The shoulder blades are kinda funky.

Goto http://www.shellshockede.com
Simple
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Joined: 28th Aug 2002
Location: United Kingdom
Posted: 24th Nov 2002 13:56
I don't agree - this is not a very good model.

I think maybe you shuold try a book ( Dynamic Anatomy by Burne Hogarth ) this would help you sharpen those skills !!

The arms + elbows are out of shape ( Especially around the elbow joints )

Shoulders need work ( too square )

Hands + wrists - you need more practice on those

Back of the knee joints need pulling out a bit ( looks like his legs would collapse if he walked on them )

The in-step is too steep.

You need to study anatomy a bit more, before you can come up with a decent humanoid model I think.

I'm not going to comment on the texture, cos it looks like it's just cut+pated on from another picture.

Spec - AMD Athlon 1000mhz - 256mb DDR - Gforce2mx 400 TV out - 30gb HD - 19" Compaq - DVD rom - CDRW - Firewire - ATI TV card - All linked to another PC with higher spec
actarus
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Joined: 29th Aug 2002
Location: 32 Light Years away
Posted: 24th Nov 2002 18:09
Gone!(the model's link)

Still,I liked it(yeah I had the time to watch).

The style is good but I found it just a bit disproportionned.

Shadow Robert
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Joined: 22nd Sep 2002
Location: Hertfordshire, England
Posted: 24th Nov 2002 20:36
i'm being lectured by Simple this is RICH
but not unexpected, was told RGT was down again - possibly not comming back so i can expect some of the same lol

there are alot of obvious mistakes on the model, getting used to alot of the controls of Max... for animation purposes and polygon counts this is why they're relatively low and blocky. Simple Tesselation and then LOD actually work quite well to fix the problems, but i need to figure out how to cut them in more accurate places as for some reason the cuting tool is odd to use.

Would have to say the part i really actually hate about it are the feet/shoes, i made them almost 20times over - couldn't get them right which was a shame.

Maybe if i get anytime again i'll rework some of the mesh, but for now its fine as is (^_^)
This is kinda why I dislike Max for organics thou, the setup for me atleast seems geared more towards CAD with the orgranic stuff thrown in as an after thought for high poly users...

I think I outlined alot of other problems with the model on the post, most of which arn't as noticeable as those in the Twin Towers game once it was fully textured - which isn't bad due to my lack of time for actually doing this.

but there is alot more work to be shown off very soon, really need to package Ciyanna and get it off to the testers to find any fatal flaws before release - I hate coding and i was promised help with it, but once again people bloody bailed on me.

Anata aru kowagaru no watashi!
Simple
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Location: United Kingdom
Posted: 24th Nov 2002 21:33
Lecturing you ..... hardly.

Just pointing out the obvious flaws with your model.

For someone who claims to be in the profession and who portrays himself as someone who thinks he knows everything about 3D modeling ...... this is very amateur work.

You say that if you get the time, you will re-work some of the mesh, and/or fix the obvious flaws in it.... But the simple fact remains, for someone who claims to be a pro ... you shouldn't be producing such low quality meshes in the first place.

What makes it even more funny is the fact that you then go ahead a post this sub-standard work

The work of a pro modeler >>> I don't think so <<<

Maybe you should stick to vehicles !!! and leave the complicated character modeling to people who know what they are doing

Spec - AMD Athlon 1000mhz - 256mb DDR - Gforce2mx 400 TV out - 30gb HD - 19" Compaq - DVD rom - CDRW - Firewire - ATI TV card - All linked to another PC with higher spec
Shadow Robert
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Joined: 22nd Sep 2002
Location: Hertfordshire, England
Posted: 25th Nov 2002 14:45
hahaa... your as rude and arrogant as ever, and i kinda feel you have some personal issues here.

i'm pretty sure if you have any doubts about my skills, then i can either make a real peice of work or you could ask others about work they've seen which has deliberatly never made it onto the forums.

until you understand the point in NOT showing professional work and "perfect" work within forums suchas this then I guess you're attitude is always going to cloud what you actually decide to take in from what is written.
Especially as I just checked to make sure, but the post in my forum where the model is actually outlines most of the problems you noted it also notes what kinda of model this is and the reason for creating it.

But I guess you're too high and mighty to bother reading posts now

Anata aru kowagaru no watashi!
Van B
Moderator
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Posted: 25th Nov 2002 15:01
Hehe, just like old times .


Van-B
actarus
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Posted: 25th Nov 2002 15:52
-hahaa... your as rude and arrogant as ever

Ahem!

Simple
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Location: United Kingdom
Posted: 25th Nov 2002 16:05
I read your posts from your forum ( just excuses for a bad mesh in my opinion )

Theres no need for you to try and make a real peice of work... as i've seen plenty of your models. I also have no need to ask others about your work, you will only point me in the direction of people who like you and who will have a biased opinion. We both know people who will praise your work, and mine. but thats not really what this is all about.

You seem to only be able to take criticism which go's in your favour. if someone points out flaws in your model, you get all defensive.

As for rude and arrogant.... well that go's both ways between you and me anyway.

I don't really have a personal issue either.... although the conflict we had before was cut short due to you getting banned from the RGT forum ( for being rude and arrogant )

At the end of the day.... if you can't take criticism of your work which doesn't go in your favour, then don't post badly made meshes and ask for "any ideas"

I'm sure that if the RGT forum doesn't get up and running again, and I start to post some of my work here.... you will critic my work in the same way.

I have no need to look up to you like some newbies do here. And i'm not scared to criticise your models. if I think it's good, then I will say so, and if it's bad, then I will say so ( and why ) just like I did in my first post here.


And Van-B >>> yeah, just like old times !!!

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Shadow Robert
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Posted: 25th Nov 2002 16:31
But Simple you haven't pointed out anything i hadn't already
just because it isn't all layn out for you in simple text here doesn't mean you're the first to notice, and the way you have worded it certainly isn't showin' you in a very good light here

I'm to say one last thing and please think about it carefully rather than thinking of another ordain reply,
Why have I released pictures of a model and outlined almost all of the more noticeable flaws?

Well I kinda grow tired of this and I'd rather not this post become flamebait because that would be unfair on those who actually are gaining some experience from this, i'm gonna just leave it to stew

i wonder should i have Oatso Simple or Frosties for breakfast? Ack why can't i be a Sim and have my mind made up for me hehee

Anata aru kowagaru no watashi!
actarus
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Location: 32 Light Years away
Posted: 25th Nov 2002 16:50
Forget about it guys.

I agree with Simple because I always want to show my work at it's best therefore waiting until the model is almost flawless(none is) but I never really get technical help in doing so such as what Raven gives out in his posts...in his words.In fact,if you can read his posts with a good step back and take what you want/what is good,he probably is one of the most helpful persons around here as far as 3d arts are concerned.

You guys make me think of two well known cola companies...stop that. lol

Simple
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Posted: 25th Nov 2002 16:53
Quote: "
I'm to say one last thing and please think about it carefully rather than thinking of another ordain reply,
Why have I released pictures of a model and outlined almost all of the more noticeable flaws?
"


OK... thought about it carefully... you obviously didn't read my last post properly, so I'll say it again so you might comprehend a simple statement.

>> ( just excuses for a bad mesh in my opinion ) <<

If your trying to twist it so your now saying that your model was made like that on purpose to teach people where not to go wrong.... thats pretty lame

You basically made a model, then posted it up with all your excuses for the bad mesh cos you couldn't do any better.

Like I said before.... stick you vehicles, cos organic is not your thing.

The only experience to be gained from this model is how NOT to do things. But i'm sure that was not your real intentions.

I too grow tired of this tread... and someone who can't except he's NOT right all of the time. So lets let it stew then ( until next time )

Spec - AMD Athlon 1000mhz - 256mb DDR - Gforce2mx 400 TV out - 30gb HD - 19" Compaq - DVD rom - CDRW - Firewire - ATI TV card - All linked to another PC with higher spec
Puffy
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Posted: 26th Nov 2002 21:16
*paints raven across his chest* im rootin for the home team... who wants to gamble...

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Mirthin
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Posted: 26th Nov 2002 23:49
Ho ho, Busted! flamebait

Who wants cake? I've got a little slice of hell for everyone.
Shadow Robert
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Posted: 27th Nov 2002 00:08
FFS ... way to go Simple
god what the hell is wrong with people sometimes!
I swear ... GRRR
Thank god thier own forum is back, perhaps now they can leave us all to actually have some fun again.

Anata aru kowagaru no watashi!
Van B
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Posted: 27th Nov 2002 01:40
Awww come on Vegeta, this forum has never been more lively than over the last few days.


Van-B
Puffy
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Posted: 27th Nov 2002 07:30
its been about as lively as it always is... you guys just went along with someone who prob did something stupid over here... i bet if 10 people start saying rgt forums are boreing in this place it will spread like wildfire... then you guys will get a hold of it and just like were saying... its not true...

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Van B
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Posted: 27th Nov 2002 10:01
So Darth, your saying this forum is always this busy?

Nah mate, got to disagree, I've been comming here for a few weeks, and the last couple of days have been extra busy here - not that this is always a good thing though.


Van-B
Puffy
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Posted: 27th Nov 2002 11:32
never said they were extremely busy... just that there not boreing.... =D hehe

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Van B
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Posted: 27th Nov 2002 12:23
Ahh, when I said Lively, I meant busy . I know this forum isn't boring.


Van-B
Puffy
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Posted: 27th Nov 2002 13:57
=P thx... hehe... i just cant stand the forums over there... they kicked raven and indi ... thats not cool... and after i was being chewed out for stuff i didnt do i just kinda left... =\ plus keeping track of two websites would be suicide...

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actarus
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Posted: 27th Nov 2002 17:38
I must be damned suicidal then,I'm a part of the Jedi council in the starwars.com galaxy,Milkshape forums(not alot though)this one and RGT...

Plus I used about 10 different engines and their respective forums at my debuts.

Plus I use any forum that'll be giving me the infos I need.

/me shoots the final bullet in his head

Just remember that you're standing on a planet that's evolving
And revolving at nine hundred miles an hour!
Mirthin
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Posted: 27th Nov 2002 18:16
Van B, if you want busy, check the General forum. A shame isn't it, that there are so many unrelated DB posts, but they can be quite fun sometimes.

Who wants cake? I've got a little slice of hell for everyone.
Simple
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Posted: 27th Nov 2002 19:58
Quote: "
=P thx... hehe... i just cant stand the forums over there... they kicked raven and indi ... thats not cool
"


Actually, only vegeta was kicked ( for being rude and arrogant... that was cool !! ) indi left of his own accord.... but now he's come back.

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Galiem
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Posted: 27th Nov 2002 22:19
Aye Carumba!!! The dancing dog has hypnotized me!!!

actarus
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Posted: 27th Nov 2002 22:55
Doesn't beat the Spiderman,MazingerZ and the rest dancing continental or something on Tiranissu's sig.

Just remember that you're standing on a planet that's evolving
And revolving at nine hundred miles an hour!
Puffy
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Posted: 28th Nov 2002 02:09
nope simple indi was kicked.. its in the general forums somewhere... he got a mean email from guy saying shiz... =\ i was almost banned... for stuff i didnt do... =( i just dont like it...

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Simple
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Posted: 28th Nov 2002 02:56
No Daftpuff, he wasn't kicked ....... he left of his own accord so as to let things cool down after a bad thread.

And he's back on the RGT forum now as indi ( he's just not a mod anymore )

Well, thats what the RGT members where told by the other mods.

But anyways... who cares, indi was always a nice guy ... he's back now ( veggie was a different story )

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Puffy
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Posted: 28th Nov 2002 05:21
O_O hehe... how did you make that bullet through head happyface... i know vegeta left by himself too... us over here heared a different story... oh well... guess the mods didnt want to start up a riot...

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actarus
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Posted: 28th Nov 2002 06:07
Doe this work...



Just remember that you're standing on a planet that's evolving
And revolving at nine hundred miles an hour!
actarus
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Posted: 28th Nov 2002 06:08
muhaha



Just remember that you're standing on a planet that's evolving
And revolving at nine hundred miles an hour!
Puffy
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Posted: 28th Nov 2002 06:43
awww come on show me how you did the lil dead happy face =D hehe...

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Van B
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Posted: 28th Nov 2002 12:32
I'm cheating:


DarthPuff, I think you have Indi and Vegeta mixed up, Indi left, Vegeta was booted.


Van-B
Simple
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Posted: 28th Nov 2002 12:39

rambo

:-\
puzzled


ponder


ogre


old-man


alien


angry


ninja


bandit


beard


board


calm


cat


cheeky


chinese


confused


cool


cross-eyed


cry


cyclops


dead


devious


disappointed


ditsy


dog


embarrassed


ermm


evil


evolved


gasmask


glasses


grin


happy


hurt


jaguar


knocked-out


laugh


lick


mad


nervous


normal


paranoid


pirate


robot


sad


scared


shocked


silly


sleeping


smiley


smoker


speechless


square-eyed


rambo


classic


angry


cheerful


depressed


tired


vampire


wink


wink

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Simple
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Joined: 28th Aug 2002
Location: United Kingdom
Posted: 28th Nov 2002 12:41
OH, and Van-B is right

Spec - AMD Athlon 1000mhz - 256mb DDR - Gforce2mx 400 TV out - 30gb HD - 19" Compaq - DVD rom - CDRW - Firewire - ATI TV card - All linked to another PC with higher spec
Shadow Robert
17
Years of Service
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Joined: 22nd Sep 2002
Location: Hertfordshire, England
Posted: 28th Nov 2002 15:33
i don't think anyone should be talkin' and making accusations about myself and indi regarding RGT as the only people who really understand the situations are well us and the mod/admin directly involved.

As neither me or indi have wanted to comment on the events, please try not to drag what has and hasn't happened speculations and flaming out of the forums.

As this post has gone such arrai off topic and into some kinda lil vendetta flame ping pong match - i think it would be wise if one of the mods deleted it to prevent further problems (^_^)

Anata aru kowagaru no watashi!
Simple
17
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 28th Aug 2002
Location: United Kingdom
Posted: 28th Nov 2002 16:48
I do beleive I was directly involved ...... as it was me you accused of lying and cutting up a model, and claiming I made it which started off the flame war over there.

At the end of the day... I proved you wrong and you didn't like it.

As for this thread getting out of hand..... I do beleive that you headed it off in that direction with your remark about me, after I criticized your model.

You just don't like me criticizing anything you do.... but you think it's ok for you to do it to others.

It's SIMPLE >> whats go's around, comes around <<

Spec - AMD Athlon 1000mhz - 256mb DDR - Gforce2mx 400 TV out - 30gb HD - 19" Compaq - DVD rom - CDRW - Firewire - ATI TV card - All linked to another PC with higher spec

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