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DarkBASIC Discussion / The DB Classic Programming Challenge Thread

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Sinani201
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Posted: 5th Jan 2008 20:50
Does anyone know how to move a sprite? I know it sounds like a stupid question but the commands directory doesn't mention moving sprites...

Seriously, how do you make the little blue text come up below your message?
TDK
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Posted: 6th Jan 2008 15:51
Quote: "Does anyone know how to move a sprite?"


Just use the Sprite SpriteNum,X,Y,ImageNum command with new values for the X and Y variables.

TDK_Man

Sinani201
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Posted: 6th Jan 2008 18:45 Edited at: 6th Jan 2008 20:35
Thanks!
EDIT:
Here's my entry so far:


There are some problems with the code, like going into the sand when underwater, and I still haven't made the program to deduct air when your character is underwater.

Seriously, how do you make the little blue text come up below your message?
Pixelator
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Posted: 6th Jan 2008 20:31
Quote: "Does anyone know how to move a sprite?"


is this really Sinani???

Sinani201
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Posted: 7th Jan 2008 05:18
Quote: "is this really Sinani???"

lol, I just didn't know you could use the sprite command like that! I haven't used sprite commands for a while, so I just had to ask that, even though I knew I'd get extremely embarrassed!

Seriously, how do you make the little blue text come up below your message?
demons breath
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Posted: 8th Jan 2008 13:19 Edited at: 8th Jan 2008 19:09
Quote: "So, the lack of interest suggests that a DBC Programming Challenge thread"


I think it was partly just the time of year's quite busy, and partly that I personally haven't found the last couple of challenges as interesting as the water physics/paint program etc. stuff we had a couple of months back; seeing as I've had very little time without some sort of obligation I've found it hard to do more than make a very primitive start on a Challenge and then I never had the motivation to go back to it instead of just relaxing or catching up on my sleep or playing guitar etc. Plus I had all my stuff from christmas to fiddle about with so that takes up some time as well...


EDIT: This one seems more interesting though; I might give it a go but I won't upload one unless it's reasonably finished, unlike the last couple...

"A West Texas girl, just like me"
-Bush
Tone3e
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Posted: 10th Jan 2008 04:24
I have tried this out. Started on an entry but it is crap so I dont want to enter it at the moment. I will definitly oin the next one no matter what.

It is when I am weak, when I am truly strong.
Libervurto
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Posted: 11th Jan 2008 00:57 Edited at: 11th Jan 2008 02:03
The fact that we can't use media is really bugging me for this one, I want a fish!!

[edit]
I'm feeling a bit down as I seem to have hit a wall with DBC, I have done all the basic stuff and now need to move on, there's still a lot that I don't know about DBC but I can't seem to find any advanced tutorials. Could someone point me to a good one?

I can't think of anything fun to do with this challenge, if anyone has a good idea that they either can't or wont make then please post it and i'll give it a shot
thanks

[edit 2]
This doesn't qualify as an entry yet but I thought you'd all like to see my snazzy text effect

feel free to use the function if you like it

jason p sage
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Posted: 11th Jan 2008 03:25
OBese You are ready for DBPro or (gulp) DarkGDK! You do a lot of cool things... I think for putting it all together to bigger projects you might like either or both DarkGDK/DBPro. honestly - I like them both. I'm using DarkGDK for my "main" stuff only for speed reasons... but I test every idea usually in Dark Basic Pro first... as its faster I think to rip out little test apps and proof of concept...like turn this change vertex that, texture this...cool...then I know it works ... then I bring it to DarkGDK.

I admit its a bear at first the C++ syntax..but once you get it a little, and the DarkGDK commands work so much like DBPro and DBC... it kind of helps you cuz you KNOW THIS then learn that you KNOW THIS etc...

Sinani201
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Posted: 11th Jan 2008 05:29
@OBese87
MAJOR "SCREEN FLASHING" PROBLEM! I have tried everything I could, but unfortunately you made it nearly impossible to get rid of.
Besides that, the entry is looking good! I can't wait! But make the text come up more quickly.

Seriously, how do you make the little blue text come up below your message?
Latch
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Posted: 11th Jan 2008 10:43
@OBese
Quote: "The fact that we can't use media is really bugging me for this one, I want a fish!! "

Quote: "I'm feeling a bit down as I seem to have hit a wall with DBC"

Have you done much with 3d? Since you seem to have a pretty good grasp of 2d, you can really enhance 3d with some 2d tricks and images.

You know, you can build a mesh, triangle by triangle and you don't need to use memblocks (as they are not allowed in the challenges). Use the make object triangle command. Each vertex of each triangle can be plotted. The trick is to come up with a formula to figure out where you want your vertices, and then draw triangles, add them as limbs, and then make the whole lot into a single object (unless you want the individual triangles movable). It takes a bit of work but once you get the premise down and you get a basic function figured out, it doesn't take much to alter it to create other forms.

A generic fish body, for example, might be viewed from the side as 6 stacked boxes (3 on top of 3), stretched along the x axis whose ends are tapered for a head and a tail. So let's count the vertices:

starting from the lower left at 0,0,0 we have 6 vertices that look something like this before they are tapered:

.__________..__________..__________.

The dots that are next to each other represent vertices that share the same location. Now if we go up two more rows and do the same thing, we have all the vertices for one side of the fish body. Later on we would "pinch" the ends a bit by changing the y positions mostly, but also the x and z so that they taper and we had round out a bit of a head (or use half a squished sphere later).

.__________..__________..__________.
.__________..__________..__________.
.__________..__________..__________.

It's our job to take this idea and convert it into a formula that will give us vertices. First off, we can see that there are 3 sections and 4 ends. This means that there will be 4 actual vertex locations and if each section is evenly spaced, the distance to each x will the total body length of x/3 . If you don't want them even, then you would have to supply a modifyer (total length/3 * some percentge). Our code might look something like:



That's only one side and it doesn't account for tapering the head and tail. You could actually use some trig (elipse math) for this, or you could hard code it since it's such a small mesh and you'd only be changing 12 vertices or so. You can do the other side the same way just accounting for verts#(v,2) = -2 (this is the z value which I have the depth = 4). Now, I mentioned earlier that the fish body could be viewed as 2 sets of 3 boxes stacked on each other. This is where creating the triangles comes in. For each visible box face, there will be 2 triangles. You have all the vertices, now you have to come up with a way to reference them to plot the triangles for each box.

I'm being distracted over here and am going to have to go. If I have a chance I'll finish this up - but actually, you are armed with a least enough info to get started and test a few things out.

This may be a simpler way for the fish body: Use a cylinder for the body, a sphere for the head (color half of it black and set transparency on) and a cone for the tail. Use flattened cones or triangles for the fins and tail fans. Gotta go! Sorry.


Enjoy your day.
TDK
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Posted: 11th Jan 2008 16:01
Quote: "I can't seem to find any advanced tutorials. Could someone point me to a good one?"


That's a fairly general request. What sort of 'advanced' topics are you looking for tutorials for?

TDK_Man

Libervurto
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Posted: 12th Jan 2008 00:30 Edited at: 13th Jan 2008 03:03
@Latch
That looks interesting, I may play around with those ideas later

here's my entry so far, I'm only posting again because I'm stuck; The movement code doesn't work, if I remove the curvevalues it works fine but with them it doesn't work. I don't understand what is wrong here.



[edit]
I've changed the way it moves and it's working now.
It's a bit messy but at least it works.




[edit]
@Latch I played around with your idea using a single triangle. I had the idea of making objects that stretched and bent by deleting and recreating triangles with different vertices.
As I write this I realise that using a memblock would be better but does deleting slow the computer?


Robert The Robot
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Posted: 15th Jan 2008 20:48 Edited at: 15th Jan 2008 20:50
Things look like they're coming on well. Haven't been online in the last few days, so I've not had the chance to run all this lovely, complex looking code (I'm correcting that right now in amongst a lot of exam revision ).

But anyway, I thought I'd upload what I've managed to get so far. It's not brilliant (the scrolling matrix was kind of borrowed from CaveRunner) but I don't think it's all that bad. Just use left and right arrow keys (or "a" and "d") to move left and right, upkey (or "w") for accelerate forwards and click the mouse to blast a submarine to pieces.

(By the by, in case you don't realise, the enemy submarines are the strange blue orbs that float in front of you. I could have liked a proper sub model from the DBC standard media, but I can't figure out how to convert it to a memblock and hardcode it in.)

Enjoy!


On our way 'ome, on our way 'ome!
Latch
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Posted: 15th Jan 2008 23:15
@Robert
Pretty cool! I've got an entry on the back burner that is kind of similar. Hopefully I get it to a point where I want to present it.

@OBese
Quote: "deleting and recreating triangles with different vertices.
As I write this I realise that using a memblock would be better but does deleting slow the computer"

You'd definately get more flexibility with a memblock... Lot's of deleting and recreating can slow things down.

The following is maybe an entry. Maybe after it looks like a fish!
Here's stage two of the mesh creation (fish mesh?). This shows the creation of the triangles. The black cubes are just there to mark the vertices. I have the triangles set to wireframe and the cpu controlling the sync so you can see how the triangles are filling in. One of the things left to do is figure out the skewing for the head and the tail. Then it's on to creating the triangles as limbs, then compiling everthing as one complete mesh. If one dosen't have the enhanced version of DBC, they can still create meshes using this or a similar method without having to worry about memblocks. The drawbacks are the normals are the same for every triangle and it takes a little doing to figure out the uvs.



Enjoy your day.
Sinani201
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Posted: 16th Jan 2008 02:09
@Latch
Nice! Although it looks more like a pencil than a fish...

@Robert The Robot
Looking good! Although my submarine is losing health for no reason... I think... is this supposed to happen?

Seriously, how do you make the little blue text come up below your message?
Libervurto
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Posted: 16th Jan 2008 04:28 Edited at: 16th Jan 2008 04:31
I just realised that the only reason mine is underwater is because I say it's underwater haha

@Robo Rob
That's cool, i like how the camera tilts as you move

Latch
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Posted: 16th Jan 2008 16:50
@Sinani
Your entry's coming along nicely. When's the next update?
Your entry reminds me of an old game called sub attack or something like that. Basically you'd be a sub underwater, there would be destroyers moving from left to right at the top of the screen and they would drop depth charges. You would in turn shoot torpedos at them while trying to avoid the depth charges.

Enjoy your day.
Tone3e
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Posted: 17th Jan 2008 02:14
I really like robrt the robot's entry. Its awesome. I think thst Latch is not to far fromo making a decent looking fish there.

[center]
Come see the WIP!center]
Sinani201
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Posted: 17th Jan 2008 05:43 Edited at: 17th Jan 2008 05:52
Quote: "When's the next update?"

I just added the enemy code, although it's not that good. I also get an error every time I successfully shoot the enemy, Bob does not exist. Does anyone have any idea what a Bob is?



Besides the error, does it look good?

Seriously, how do you make the little blue text come up below your message?
Libervurto
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Posted: 17th Jan 2008 12:18
@sinani
a bob is the same as a sprite
the does not exist error is because you are asking DB to return data about a sprite you haven't made yet
i.e.

this would return an error

Link102
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Posted: 17th Jan 2008 15:58 Edited at: 17th Jan 2008 16:03
my enry until I decide to use the lake idea I had:

how do I fix the backfin triangle (object>mesh>limb), it is onesided

Robert The Robot
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Posted: 17th Jan 2008 16:02
Hi everyone, glad you liked my 'entry'.

@Sinani
Quote: "Looking good! Although my submarine is losing health for no reason... I think... is this supposed to happen?"

Every time an enemy sub (blue sphere) disappears through the ocean sphere, a random number between 1 and 5 gets knocked off your health. If 4 or 5 enemies vanish together, then you can lose up to 20 points (in practice, it's a bit less). This might be what's happening - then again, you might just be missing a submarine placed at an extreme X coordinate...

@Obese
Quote: "That's cool, i like how the camera tilts as you move"

Thanks for the compliment, but the bulk of the code for it was ...ah... borrowed from the Cave Runner demo. I just tweaked it a little so the camera twisted round at more of an angle.

On our way 'ome, on our way 'ome!
TDK
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Posted: 17th Jan 2008 16:42 Edited at: 17th Jan 2008 16:45
A bob is the name for a sprite on the old Amiga computers - which Lee used to work on before writing DB.

Pretty early on in the development of DB, he changed the name to 'sprite', but a couple of references were left behind by accident.

So, if you see the word bob, just read 'sprite'.

[Edit] Doh! I hate it when the forum shows you the last page of a thread... but it actually isn't! You waste your time answering a question and when the screen refreshes you see the rest of the posts and it's already been answered!

TDK_Man

Libervurto
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Posted: 17th Jan 2008 23:02 Edited at: 17th Jan 2008 23:03
@TDK
haha, you can still use bobs in DB can't you? Is there any difference at all?

TDK
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Posted: 17th Jan 2008 23:18 Edited at: 17th Jan 2008 23:22
Yes - a sprite is just another word for a Blitter OBject!

Here's my attempt at underwater and it's pretty awful. Ignore the naff controls - I was more interested in getting it to look like it was underwater and wasted a lot of time trying to use ghosted plains and all sorts of effects. It didn't look right so I ripped it all out!



[Edit] Oops - forgot the instructions...

Number keys to set speed, (0 to stop). Cursor up and down to surface/dive.

It's supposed to be under the ice sheets at the south pole...

TDK_Man

Latch
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Posted: 18th Jan 2008 02:19
Fish Mesh Entry:

Ok, here's the last installment and an actual entry for the fish mesh. The pupose of this was just to show that a mesh can be constructed triangle by triangle without memblocks and you are not just limited to the single shaped primatives. Using this or a similar method you can construct pretty much anything if you can figure out the math and the plotting.



Enjoy your day.
Latch
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Posted: 18th Jan 2008 02:47 Edited at: 9th Apr 2008 06:09
Ok, here's a WIP... I think I wanna incoporate some fish into this one... Use the arrow keys to control the vehicle. Backwards - forwards bank left and right in both directions. It's written for 1.13 but if you want to control the lighting for 1.20 uncomment the appropriate lines at the end of the _build_sub subroutine.




Enjoy your day.
Sinani201
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Posted: 18th Jan 2008 04:22 Edited at: 18th Jan 2008 04:36
AWESOME!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! The fish mesh looks awesome!!!! nice job!!!
EDIT:
Here's my entry without the Bob error. Although when you kill the first enemy, two come up (which is supposed to happen) but they're both invincible.


Seriously, how do you make the little blue text come up below your message?
jason p sage
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Posted: 18th Jan 2008 14:06
@TDK - Sprite Versus Bob (blitter object)

This I find funny because I coded on c64 - and the original manual and the assembly language reference manual called them Sprites. I never used Amiga - so I think its funny... that's all...

Libervurto
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Posted: 18th Jan 2008 14:26
@TDK
I like the bubbles everywhere but I couldn't move, have you coded that yet?

@Latch
That is awesome! The meshes look really good I wasn't expecting them to look anything like fish! Nice manta sub too

@Sinani
I think your movement should be quicker, it seemed to take an age to get the sub in the water, also you should have a point where your torpedoes die if they go too far so if you miss you can still fire
apart from that everything worked

TDK
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Posted: 18th Jan 2008 18:44 Edited at: 18th Jan 2008 18:47
Quote: "[Edit] Oops - forgot the instructions...

Number keys to set speed, (0 to stop). Cursor up and down to surface/dive.

It's supposed to be under the ice sheets at the south pole..."




Quote: "This I find funny because I coded on c64 - and the original manual and the assembly language reference manual called them Sprites."


That's because the Vic20/C64/Atari 8bit machines didn't have a 'blitter' chip. They only first appeared in the 16/32 bit Atari ST and Commodore Amiga.

TDK_Man

Sinani201
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Posted: 18th Jan 2008 23:56
Quote: "you should have a point where your torpedoes die"

I think I do! If the missle falls out out of the screen, your sub should be able to shoot a new one...
Quote: "I think your movement should be quicker"

I'll work on that.

Seriously, how do you make the little blue text come up below your message?
Zorek
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Posted: 19th Jan 2008 08:06
i wish i could join this challenge but the problem is i'm still learning. so maybe later.

all for me and non for all!!!
Sinani201
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Posted: 19th Jan 2008 18:46
That's what these challenges are about! Learning more! When you start making an entry, you are supposed to be educated. Of course, looking at your other thread, I can see what you mean by "learning," but you could always at least try to make an entry.

Seriously, how do you make the little blue text come up below your message?
Tone3e
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Posted: 19th Jan 2008 20:20
Latch, your entry is awesome. Great sub. THe fish meshes are just genius. I also liked the effect byb TDK, but Latch incorporated a sub which makes it look cooler.

[center]
Come see the WIP!center]
Libervurto
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Posted: 19th Jan 2008 23:58 Edited at: 20th Jan 2008 00:06
@Zorek
Like Sinani said, make something and enter it
even if it is totally noobish you'll still learn a lot very quickly
also looking at other entries is a great way to learn from others.

We might rip your entry apart, but at least we'll rip it into useful pieces for you

just kidding, unlike the code snippets board etc we wont shout at you for posting something noobish

@Everybody
My little organism moves without any propulsion so I'm going to try and add some moving limbs to it, these will hopefully make it look more aquatic too.
How long is this challenge going on for? I think challenges should be left open longer like this

Sinani201
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Posted: 20th Jan 2008 00:10
I think the deadline is at the end of the month.

Seriously, how do you make the little blue text come up below your message?
Latch
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Posted: 20th Jan 2008 03:41
Sinani, Obese, Tone
Thank you.

Quote: "I think challenges should be left open longer like this "


Actually it is nice to have this long away deadline. One can work on a few ideas every couple of days when there's time.

Here's a little 2d sub:


Enjoy your day.
demons breath
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Posted: 20th Jan 2008 11:29
@Latch: That post you did about making things from triangles was really helpful - I gave it a go after I read it, but I couldn't post back here 'cos my internet's been down since. I'm not naturally artistic though - this is all I managed for a fish mesh;



I guess the best that you can say about it is that it's kind of recognisable haha

"A West Texas girl, just like me"
-Bush
Latch
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Posted: 22nd Jan 2008 19:22
@Link102
Interesting... part fish, part potatoe? Just kidding! It's quite cute, and very happy!
Quote: "how do I fix the backfin triangle (object>mesh>limb), it is onesided"

I believe when you make a triangle as it's own object, the normals only point in one direction - but culling is automatically turned off so you can see both sides:



with culling on (the default for most objects):



When you attach it as a limb, it inherits the object settings of the main object. So you have to turn the culling off on the fish body so you can see both sides of the limbs:



@demons breath
That's pretty good! Makes me feel like my fish mesh function is more complicated than it has to be!

@sinani
I added a couple of syncs, and changed your program structure a bit, mainly breaking it into a series of subroutines:



Enjoy your day.
Sinani201
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Posted: 24th Jan 2008 02:32
@Latch
Thanks! That sped it up a lot! It also sped up the generation of the good sand, but I took it out because it took to long to generate.
Here's the entry with Latches edit, and better sand:



Seriously, how do you make the little blue text come up below your message?
Latch
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Posted: 25th Jan 2008 21:55
@all

Does anyone have any working code making long streams of kelp or other under water plants? Ideally a 2d texture on a plain. It could serve two purposes: as an entry for this underwater challenge, and as something I want to stick into my manta-sub program to add some underwater character. Rocks, sea urchins, coral reefs, etc. would all be great!

Enjoy your day.
Libervurto
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Posted: 25th Jan 2008 23:42 Edited at: 26th Jan 2008 00:42
There was a fractal fern thing that Phaelax made a while ago for a challenge.
I'm looking up procedural generation right now so I may be able to cook something up that looks good (if I get the hang of it)

[edit]
does anyone know how to do procedural stuff?
This is the best thing I can find and I don't get it at all
http://cgempire.com/forum/tutorials-101/tutorial-procedural-texture-generation-basics-1121.html

Pixelator
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Posted: 26th Jan 2008 16:05
going to have to bail out of this one- too much going on for me.

Your signature has been erased by a mod. Reduce the size!
Link102
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Posted: 26th Jan 2008 18:26
@ obese, you're saying you want to create noise and fractal functions for textures, so you can create a sea plant? With just about 5 days left?

Libervurto
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Posted: 26th Jan 2008 22:05
@Link
Quote: "@ obese, you're saying you want to create noise and fractal functions for textures, so you can create a sea plant? With just about 5 days left?"

yees... lol
well no I just love that kind of programming and want to learn how to do it

Link102
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Posted: 27th Jan 2008 14:00
well, you'll need to make a few noise functions
google for perlin noise or noise tutorial
noise
reef made by noise

Libervurto
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Posted: 27th Jan 2008 17:20
Thanks link
I'll have to take a proper look at this later, looks better than anything I've found
what does this mean?
Quote: "x<<13"


Link102
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Posted: 27th Jan 2008 18:03 Edited at: 27th Jan 2008 18:04
<< is an insertion operator
It is used to tie strings and variables togeter when outputting something.

I think it works like this:

x=9
x<<13
x outputs 913

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