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Music & Sound FX / Qmidi vr 1.0 progress

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chunks chunks
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Posted: 23rd May 2008 23:37
I know i shouldn`t post it here but heres a prototype for project 2

toshiba satellite 1.6 core duo + nvidia geforce go 7300
windows vista ultimate.

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SoftMotion3D
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Posted: 24th May 2008 02:12
cool...lol

we can start a new post once we have some more stuff made

i will program a map editor...how does that sound?

then we can all make levels for it
SoftMotion3D
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Posted: 24th May 2008 02:17
media we need.....

bad boats
planes
spikes..... you know the game im sure lol...

oh!!
maby we should make a few level editors for those diff type of maps?

i will throw a proto type together for water fall levels
This one will be fun
chunks chunks
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Posted: 24th May 2008 02:25 Edited at: 24th May 2008 03:03
updated : tried doing the level where you move the mines from one square to the other with the enemy chasing and taking the mine off you .

haven`t done the enemy yet i think i will purchase dark ai , do ya know if it`s any good .

demo attached

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SoftMotion3D
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Posted: 24th May 2008 02:32 Edited at: 24th May 2008 02:35
do you wanna make some tunes for this with qmidi ?
this will be a fun little project
chunks chunks
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Posted: 24th May 2008 03:00
i will have a go , shall i keep them retro style similar to the original ?


how we gonna play them back ?

is the .mid export near yet

toshiba satellite 1.6 core duo + nvidia geforce go 7300
windows vista ultimate.
SoftMotion3D
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Posted: 24th May 2008 18:24
we can just play back as mp3
chunks chunks
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Posted: 25th May 2008 01:37 Edited at: 25th May 2008 03:49
here`s a few bit`s of media feel free to edit and make them better .


what 3d package do ya use ?

How ya getting on with the maps , i,m working on getting a good smooth boat movement + the music .

have you any idea`s for a name , i cant think of anything.

sorry for hijacking your qmid thread would you like me to email the stuff instead in future .



{edit]

i certainly can save them as 3ds as i also have max ,just use ac3d cause its easier for statics which also exports to 3ds.

will start a new thread then ,where do you post your images.

chunk chunks

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SoftMotion3D
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Posted: 25th May 2008 03:15 Edited at: 25th May 2008 04:12
I started a new thread in the wip section

Nice models. I will be using 3d studio max to do some animations.

Can you save your models in 3ds format?

If so we can better cross edit eachothers work

I do have a model converter i suppose but it doesnt convert animations.

I do however have a converter that converts 3ds to x format with animations intact.
SoftMotion3D
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Posted: 25th May 2008 03:16
How is the midi converter going rudolpho?
Rudolpho
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Posted: 26th May 2008 10:37 Edited at: 26th May 2008 10:40
I'm working on it.
There's still some problems, but at least it exports with version 1.4 this time. However, parts occasionally get left out and all instruments are messed up.
So it still seems that there is something more to the file format that I don't read / read in the wrong order.

As of currently, I'm sick and haven't been able to do much work on this. This is also my last week in school before the grades are set, so I've got some work I need to do there too.
But, if not earlier, I should be able to get into this in better detail come friday, since I won't have anything else to do after that.

Edit: fifth page

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Rudolpho
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Posted: 26th May 2008 15:12
Allright, I translated my reading code directly to DBPro.
Maybe you could search it for errors, Sheldon?


Also, how about "paying" for this plugin by writing a history essay?

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Posted: 26th May 2008 16:03
history essay?....lol


i will take a quick look when i get home from work at this code
SoftMotion3D
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Posted: 27th May 2008 02:31 Edited at: 27th May 2008 02:33
Rudolpho
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Posted: 27th May 2008 11:03
Hey.... if y is the track / channel in the pitch part, then why does it begin at 0 (the other ones begin at 1 and since there are only 10 tracks...)?
Is index 0 or index 10 not used then?

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SoftMotion3D
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Posted: 27th May 2008 16:08
lol 0 is not used ....that is the same as octaves

there are the 2 bits that were probly messing you up

0 from octave can be ignored
0 from pitch y can also be ignored
Rudolpho
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Posted: 27th May 2008 16:58
Allright, well, I've made some progress here, I think.
Try out the attached application and see if you could nail down some bugs (there's ought to be several, I suppose...).

Some info on the plugin in its current state:
Reads QMidi v1.4 files (finally)
Only reads v1.4... (but you probably won't need earlier versions anyways; it shouldn't be too hard to add in such an event, just tedious)
Exports fully functional midi files
...as far as I know; you have to help me test it
The midi files loop exactly as the QMO files does (no extra delay at the end as was the previous case)
Octaves, patches, volume, pan and modulation are (to my knowledge) exported as intended
The pitch bending is currently ignored by the plugin. Sheldon would have to explain this in better detail I think; I couldn't really make it out from your example.
Easy to use plugin commands (I think ):
Convert to midi Qmidi filename, midi filename.
Tell me if you'd like some other commands

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chunks chunks
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Posted: 27th May 2008 21:41
I`ve just tested your demo , it works fine with the qmo file you provided but with the ones iv made it produces a silent midi file is there something i have missed ive got the latest qmidi ..


iv`e attached the offending file
chunks

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SoftMotion3D
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Posted: 28th May 2008 00:14
i check this out the second i get home

pitch bending .... also i will check out and give ya more info on.

This is soo awesome

Rudolpho can you please email me so i have your email acount

Mine is : smd_3d@hotmail.com

And i will get you some cash for writting me that export
SoftMotion3D
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Posted: 28th May 2008 08:28
ok so i am getting some songs to work and others that dont...

i will continue to do some testing.

As far as tempo goes why not add that as part of your conversion command so i will program the changes to make the speed correct.

just let me know the ranges and i can program them all in for ya.

looks like this is going to be realy good
Rudolpho
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Posted: 28th May 2008 11:09 Edited at: 28th May 2008 11:13
Yes, I noticed that some songs won't work too... that's pretty strange; you'd think that if it works on some files it should work on the others too as the format would be correct.

I've added some more commands in the meantime; you now have


I guess we'll have to look into this further then...

@Sheldon: as you could guess from my copyright notices, my adress is jams_soffstudio@msn.com

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SoftMotion3D
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Posted: 28th May 2008 16:21
ok here is glitch 1 for ya

looks like if you modify octive data it messes around with tempo play back

here are 3 examples

octive high slows down
octive low slows down
and octive middle (normal) plays back proper

so there is glitch one....i will do further testing.

@ rudolpho ...do you except paypay at all? So i can make a donation to ya

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SoftMotion3D
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Posted: 28th May 2008 16:29
also second glitch.....

it sounds like the speed is not consistant. You here the odd extra delay in between some notes.

maby some of the note types last longer then they are suppose to?
SoftMotion3D
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Posted: 28th May 2008 16:38 Edited at: 28th May 2008 16:40
Oh 3rd glitch....lol

you can not save a song that is bigger then 255 notes (no more then 4 pages of music)

else it will not even play....just crash
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Posted: 28th May 2008 16:48 Edited at: 28th May 2008 16:50


that is all i can find for glitches.....nice job

the tempo stuff i will over ride and re-adjust when people hit save to midi.

ok so this is what i know about pitch stuff.

you modify one....you modify all...lol

so every normal note should set pitch to 64
if it has a up marker then it will set pitch to 84
and if it has a down marker it will set pitch to 44

i noticed that if you dont set it back to 64 all music data on that track is off on the notes

also make note of the values that change the pitch. (0=normal/1=up/2=down)
SoftMotion3D
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Posted: 28th May 2008 20:02 Edited at: 28th May 2008 20:03
Cool news This will be in the news letter not at the end of this month but the next


All credits will be given to the three of us
Myself (Sheldon MacDonald)
Rudolpho
Chunks


Sweet!!

Any specific song you guys want showcased?


Also here is the first song i composed for cobra triangle

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chunks chunks
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Posted: 29th May 2008 10:47
that`s good news sheldon ,you could use my song dancer i think that`s the best one i`ve done.

iv`e also done a blues track but it`s not quite finished yet.

well done again mate it`s worth all the hard work ya put in .

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Rudolpho
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Posted: 29th May 2008 12:49
Quite a few glitches, as expected, then...
I've looked into the 256 bar limit; it would seem likely that I used a single byte value to store the maximum bars. However, it is indeed a longword, so further debugging would have to be done here...
On the other glitches, I can't find any adequate reasom for them, like the octaves altering delay values... that's just odd (seeing as the two have absolutely no connection; the octave settings are all set at the beginning, with a delay of 0).
Chunks blues would at least now be known not to work because it's longer than 256 bars.

@SM3D: No, all note types have the correct delays.
I will look into the pitching soon.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Off plugin topic
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Nice with the newsletter issue
I might write a song when I get time.

Also, I had the idea that maybe we could write some sort of a sampler application that would respond to some set midi device (perhaps it would even be possible to write an exclusive device emulator) for use with QMidi so that people could use some different sounds. Or even make their own if they like.
What do you think?
It would probably be rather some work though.

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SoftMotion3D
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Posted: 29th May 2008 13:11
Once we get this midi export working i was planning on making vr 2.0 that would look more profesional. Maby we can work together on that one as well.

I was thinking of just using the same type of format just making it look alot better.

but if you got some more ideas we can try to put them in there too.

Did you see my examples of changing the octave data. It did slow down for sure!
but it looks to be coming along nicely
Rudolpho
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Posted: 29th May 2008 14:26 Edited at: 29th May 2008 14:28
Well, I'll try to fix the export first anyways, but yes, in a second release it would probably do good with some bells and whistles.

Oh yeah, I forgot; no, I don't have PayPal :/

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SoftMotion3D
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Posted: 29th May 2008 19:13
would you be interested in working on v2 with me after we get this fully operational? Im sure chunks would be interested as well.
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Posted: 29th May 2008 19:23
Sure, this kind of stuff is pretty interresting

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Posted: 30th May 2008 05:05
i have some ideas of even composing with multiple instruments at once to make it sound cooler.
chunks chunks
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Posted: 30th May 2008 11:34
@rudolpho
im gonna have a look at vsti ,the sdk is free you can add tons of cool sounds if its vsti compatible.

i`ve been looking for an excuse to get stuck into this.

@sheldon a good idea for the gui is to make everthing a bit larger, somtimes when there is a lot of notes evrything gets a bit confusing and hard to see.

i probably need glasses lol

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Rudolpho
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Posted: 30th May 2008 17:23
@Chunks: that sounds neat. Something to look into.

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Rudolpho
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Posted: 31st May 2008 01:44
Allright guys, I think I've solved the slow-down issue
I've only tried it with two songs as of yet, so it would be nice if you could give it a try too (I've attached the converter app running the new plugin).
The thing was that it only did reset the delay value when more than one event happened at the same time.

I'll look into the remaining glitches tomorrow

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SoftMotion3D
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Posted: 31st May 2008 03:11
sweet
Rudolpho
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Posted: 31st May 2008 14:08
I think I've fixed what was pointed out:
No extra-delay caused by only one event happening at once (like with the octaves).
Tempo data can be replaced with whatever value.
Songs longer than 255 bars can be exported.

However, I've noticed that some songs result in stuck notes when converted. If you could help me nail down the reason for this, it would be great.

Also, notice that non-version 1.4 files will crash the application.

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SoftMotion3D
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Posted: 31st May 2008 17:02 Edited at: 31st May 2008 17:05
looks realy good to me

So here is what i found out about the last glitch.

Once and a while you hear the song skip a set of notes.

Listen to chunks song carefully (dancer) and you will hear it miss 1 beat once and a while. It may have something to do with the 255 note flag. It happens about once every 256 notes played...

(i think but im not sure)
Now this would be the reason for your odd notes that stay stuck in.
Cause that may be a point in the song to shut a note off and its being skipped.

take a look and i bet that will fix it

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SoftMotion3D
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Posted: 31st May 2008 17:06 Edited at: 31st May 2008 20:23
Edit: I just looked into chunks song and the error happens about ~192 notes into the song....then again in about 192 notes later

Edit 2: Here is the updated editor as of May 31/2008

Fixed a few editor glitches....

http://www.jeku.com/sheldon/qmidiv1r1.zip
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Posted: 1st Jun 2008 00:04
Here is Canon in D
Tracked by me.....it rymes...lol

I could only do the first part since the tempo changes in parts of the song.


here it is.

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Rudolpho
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Posted: 1st Jun 2008 00:07
That's odd... I can't hear any direct obvious errors in 'Dancer'.
What regards Equinoxe, it is full with missing bars and stuck notes exactly from where the refrain kicks in though.

After some checkups, it seems that only about half as many note off events are actually written as the amound of note on events in that song.
Still, there's some 500 more note on's than off's even in chunk's song, and still I hear no stuck notes there.

I guess I'll have to check my counting variables...

Nice new touch up of the editor by the way.
Maybe it looks a tad to black though?
I think you should go with either some metal gray tone or blue... but that's just my opinion.

By the way, there seems to be nothing common among the bars after which the problems kick in... in some songs it's even after the 256:th bar.

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Rudolpho
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Posted: 1st Jun 2008 00:25
W...t...f...c.............
(What the flying cow)
Try this version out!

It seems like it's finally working

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Posted: 1st Jun 2008 03:31
sounds good....yup!

I am thinking of doing a setup for custom colors.

So any user can change the colors around.

Last are we going to have pitch bending? If not thats ok....not a big deal.
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Posted: 1st Jun 2008 06:59
Cool ...so when do i get the new plugin? I will start programing it in asap

I will try to have a few more things put in and some more options for the final v1 release.

I think i will make a new post for it as well. And hopefully the mod will post it as a top thread

Then we can start on v2 lol!


Maby the 3 of us can sell v2. Lets keep that in mind while working on that one
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Posted: 1st Jun 2008 11:13
I will try to add the pitch bending today.
However, I haven't tried yet, I'm just speaking, but wouldn't "setPitch(44)" just detune the tone? I thought you needed to gradually change it to get the bending efect?
But as said, I don't know as of yet; I'll check it out for myself after breakfast.

If there won't be any particular bugs arising from the installation of the pitching (I will back up the source though, so don't worry too much ), I could probably send it to you today.
I won't make any promises though, seeing how the simplest tasks have caused huge problems so far

Is there something else that should be included; maybe putting the authors name in the midi file (you can add text comments to it) or some other commands?

About version two, however, I wonder if we shouldn't throw up a personal message board or something, seeing as we now have a 200-post thread merely discussing the development of this and 99% of those posts are done by us three
Maybe it is better to have a development thread were we only post info on completed added features or updates and maybe ask for suggestions (instead of something like "try this" -> "no..." -> "hm..." -> "aha!" which is probably discouraging most readers to even bother with a thread such as this... unfortunately).
I also think, if we make a more "standard" development thread, it should be on the WIP board - there just isn't that many users on the music board

This is just a suggestion, but think it could look a tad more professional (no offence to this thread though; it's been needed, just that mayhap not everybody else have needed to see it). Also, if we are in fact aiming for charging for the finished product, it would seem unwise to post nearly all the details to everyone to see (and possibly rip off - not that I think anybody actually would, but who knows? )

I've got a server and can throw up a phpbb or something in an hour, should we go for this.


Finally, the custom colours is a good idea
The only problem I've encountered whilst doing such things, is the blueGui buttons, that is locked to their standard colour...
It is however possible to override using images for them, but then you have to put the text on those yourself. Good luck with anyways; it would be a nice feature

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Rudolpho
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Posted: 1st Jun 2008 12:17
Here's an idea on what you could do with the tempo on playback by the way:

You have your tempo setting in BPM.
That means quarter notes per minute, so multiply by 4 to get how many 1/16:th notes that would repressent.
Now, a minute is 60000 milliseconds, so (60000 / (tempo * 4)) = delay time between two 1/16:th notes.

I think that should work and through that, you would have a real BPM tempo in the editor as well
(And it would be directly compatible with the midi plugin).

To support older files written on the delay = (250 - tempo) standard, you could perhaps have a checkbox to let the user choose which method to use.
Just an idea

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Rudolpho
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Posted: 1st Jun 2008 14:16 Edited at: 1st Jun 2008 14:17
It took quite a few changes to the main sequence writing, and the midi files get about eight times larger than without it (still, they only take som kilobytes each, so I don't think that really matters), but here it is...

With pitch bending!

Enjoy; write if you would want anything else in it Sheldon; otherwise I'll send it over tonight along with my famous logo

Edit: I could make it take much lesser memory, but that would take a while. Maybe we could leave it be like this until the next version?

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SoftMotion3D
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Posted: 1st Jun 2008 17:08 Edited at: 1st Jun 2008 17:11
i wouldnt worry about the sizes. Why dont you run a check to see if any pitch bending is even done in the song and if not use the old save method?

Just an idea since i dont think alot of songs use pitch bending...


Should we limit this version to x amount of pages? That way v2 may be more appealing to purchase? Or do we just call it free and stop adding more features to it? I did promiss that this vr would be for free so i cant back down on that.

Yes this thread is retarded huge and im sure if any mods realy wanted to they would lock this thread...lol

i will make the final release of this program in the program anouncements forum. Then we should let this thread get locked.

v2 we can just send emails or something.

Do you want your logo flashed at the start?
As far as upgrading this vr anymore i think we can just call it done and start fresh with a new project
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Posted: 1st Jun 2008 17:27 Edited at: 1st Jun 2008 17:28
Just another thing that might be needed before concealing version 1; if you could add sustain pedal controls (that would work like the pitch bending in the editor); it is really needed for piano pieces.

Apparently, it wasn't in my midi plugin, so I've compiled a new version (download at the midi plugin thread).

Use set sustain pedalport, channel, state if you choose to use it

"I kören hörs de brummande busarna Björnligan och Gondolen"
Graduation in less than one week.

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