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Geek Culture / Leadwerks Engine evaluation kit now available

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Airslide
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Posted: 20th Sep 2008 05:38 Edited at: 20th Sep 2008 05:48
Wow. The development cycle is virtually exactly what I want. You even have that little console window come up and show what's being loaded in (I do that in my DBP projects using IanM's plugin).

Expect a new purchase soon

EDIT: Oh, I love how much work you put into your character controllers. When playing the Island demo (and the underground one) I never noticed any odd hick-ups or anything with the movement, and it felt very smooth and well-written. I also noticed that they respond well to other objects in the environment, such as the barrels in the demos, where as the Dark Physics character controllers only seem to move things when they get stuck inside of something else and their collision body causes the other one to go crazy

Cyrain
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Posted: 20th Sep 2008 05:56 Edited at: 20th Sep 2008 06:01
Though I can't mess with the evaluation kit 'til I get a new computer(or otherwise), I think Leadwerks' rendering platform looks absolutely stunning, and I hope I can get my hands on the eval-kit soon!

Also don't you mean Nvidia 7800 in the OP? I didn't know the 6800 had SM3?

EDIT: Can the SDK be ported for rendering on say any given game console(Wii, PS3, Xbox360, PSP, etc)? Also can people co-develop with XNA libraries?

If not, is there a possible future release for these kind of features?

My .02

Game Development....the possibilities
Airslide
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Posted: 20th Sep 2008 07:31
On the Wiki feature list it says that possible future features include support for other platforms including Playstation 3, Xbox, Mac and Linux.

Cyrain
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Posted: 20th Sep 2008 11:37
Ok, gotcha!

Game Development....the possibilities
Cyrain
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Posted: 22nd Sep 2008 17:50
Also it says you can use virtually any programming language, does that mean we can use the DBPro compiler?

Game Development....the possibilities
Leadwerks
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Posted: 22nd Sep 2008 19:14
Yes, if you wrote code to load the DLL and get all the functions.
Airslide
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Posted: 23rd Sep 2008 05:23
Wouldn't loading it in DBP be rather redundant, especially since Leadwerks is OpenGL and DBP is Direct X9? You're essentially adding a second renderer that won't be used...

Mahoney
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Posted: 23rd Sep 2008 05:30
That's why it's not an advertised feature.

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Leadwerks
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Posted: 23rd Sep 2008 07:53
Added a material editor so you don't have to edit text files anymore.
Cyrain
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Posted: 23rd Sep 2008 17:00
If it uses OpenGL then why is a DirectX10(Nvidia 8800) Recommended?

Game Development....the possibilities
Mahoney
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Posted: 23rd Sep 2008 19:51
Quote: "If it uses OpenGL then why is a DirectX10(Nvidia 8800) Recommended?"


1) Shader Model 4.0

2) Raw power.

Windows Vista Home Premium Intel Pentium Dual-Core 1.6 Ghz 1GB DDR2 RAM GeForce 8600GT Twin Turbo
Leadwerks
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Posted: 23rd Sep 2008 20:26
AMD has their first OpenGL3 drivers out now, but they are still behind in functionality right now. By the spring I expect them to be about the same.
Cash Curtis II
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Posted: 23rd Sep 2008 23:31
I had downloaded the 2.12 update from page 1 and it still doesn't work. I'd like to experiment more with this but if it's not going to work on my computer when it used to then there's not much more I can do. Is there something I'm missing for 2.12 that wasn't needed for the initial release?


Come see the WIP!
Leadwerks
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Posted: 23rd Sep 2008 23:36 Edited at: 23rd Sep 2008 23:37
I hope you are uninstalling/deleting the 2.1 eval kit before installing the updated 2.12. The OpenAL installer has to be run if you are using Windows Vista.

I would also ensure that you have recent drivers from NVidia.
Airslide
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Posted: 24th Sep 2008 02:31
Cash - my guess is the problem is OpenAL. The original Leadwerks demo that was posted awhile back didn't work for me, although I since ran into a program that required me to install OpenAL, and the evaluation kit works. I'm not certain, and I wouldn't bet on it, but it seems like a likely solution.

On that note, perhaps (if this is the problem) it would be good to display an error message stating that OpenAL can't be found?

Leadwerks
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Posted: 24th Sep 2008 02:34
The problem is that on WindowsXP, you can just drop OpenAL32.dll into the same directory as the engine and it works, but on Vista you have to actually run the OpenAL installer.

If the OpenAL32.dll is not found in the system or application folder, the engine says "OpenAL not installed.". If the DLL is found in the application folder, but it hasn't actually been installed, a crash occurs. This is why I removed the DLL and made the OpenAL installer required.

My guess is he installed 2.1 (which includes OpenAL32.dll), then installed 2.12 over it (which doesn't include the dll) and hasn't ever installed OpenAL, so that causes a crash.
trogdor
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Posted: 25th Sep 2008 04:50
I just got a new machine at work.

Dell OptiPlex 755 Desktop Core 2 Quad Q9300/2.50GHz
4GB,Non-ECC,800MHz DDR2
256MB ATI RADEON HD 2400 XT
Windows XP PRO SP3

and found out that I do need to install OpenAL on the new XP for the 2.12 to work.

also I tried the latest ATI 8.9 drivers. There are still display artifacts, but it's not upside down like it used to be with the old drivers. Maybe the next driver will take care of it.

If you give someone a program, you will frustrate them for a day; if you teach them how to program, you will frustrate them for a lifetime.
Leadwerks
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Posted: 25th Sep 2008 07:08 Edited at: 25th Sep 2008 07:08
Yes, I was told the 8-10 drivers in October would fix the error...I guess they emailed me a couple days before 8-9 was released, and those must have been already done.
Leadwerks
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Posted: 27th Sep 2008 05:52
Here's part of a tutorial which demonstrates some GPU ray tracing effects:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7AZ0SgEKtZs
Roxas
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Posted: 27th Sep 2008 20:18
Ah really nice! The final results in that could be used on rocky roads in example?

Also any plans about linux support ?

Leadwerks
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Posted: 27th Sep 2008 20:26
It would be possible. I am not sure if there is a market for it, but we would have a near-monopoly if I distributed a build for Linux and Mac.
Roxas
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Posted: 28th Sep 2008 15:39
It is to better support multiplaftrom because it gives you more respect too.. Say linux developer is no better than windows developer if he releases his project only for linux

Tho it would be really good to make this multiplaftrom for developer aswell But im pretty sure you can run this trough wine for now because it runs on opengl.

Leadwerks
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Posted: 30th Sep 2008 22:33 Edited at: 30th Sep 2008 22:34
trogdor
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Posted: 16th Oct 2008 07:17
HELP!!!
I tried the latest ATI 8.10 drivers.
Now the demos dont work the window open then closes back to the menu where you select island or underground.

If you give someone a program, you will frustrate them for a day; if you teach them how to program, you will frustrate them for a lifetime.
Leadwerks
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Posted: 16th Oct 2008 08:49
I have not tried them yet. Will test soon.
trogdor
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Posted: 27th Oct 2008 20:17
Any news?
Did AMD really muck up the ATI drivers this time?

If you give someone a program, you will frustrate them for a day; if you teach them how to program, you will frustrate them for a lifetime.
Leadwerks
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Posted: 28th Oct 2008 10:23 Edited at: 28th Oct 2008 10:24
Well, they fixed one major issue and I haven't tested my ATI cards on drivers 8.10 yet, but I will get to it soon.

Driver-wise, the next couple months may be a little weird, because we are on the cutting edge as far as rendering technology goes, and I have to work together with ATI and NVidia. The only other deferred engine I know of is STALKER, but I have written a lot of material explaining why I think deferred lighting is so superior.

I'm pretty optimistic about the near-future for things like this though, for a few reasons:

-OpenGL3 support is coming in the Spring. Basically the idea is to drop half the API which consists of very outdated techniques, and just focus on making good drivers that support modern techniques.

-Our rendering code is very stable at this point. A year from now I don't think our lighting shaders will look much different. So that means little problems get fixed and probably no new ones get created.
Airslide
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Posted: 29th Oct 2008 05:31
If STALKER used deferred lighting aswell, then I know you must have an excellent lighting system (wait - I've seen it - you do ). That game was pretty good graphically overall, but what always popped out at me was the lighting. I never had any slow down with the with it, and I really liked how it was so obvious that it was dynamic. Not a lot of games give me that feel, but the moving foliage, rotating lights, swinging lamps, flashlights, everything, came together extremely well, and really showed how powerful the lighting system was.

Anyways, sorta going off topic there

Raven
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Posted: 4th Nov 2008 15:59 Edited at: 4th Nov 2008 16:00
Both demos run on my Radeon HD 2600 XT (Vista 32bit Cat 8.10 Fusion Live Active), but both have these artifacts... and aren't particularly quick either.

Odd thing is no matter the resolution I set or features, fullscreen or windowed they always get the same framerates.

25-35fps "Underground"
5-6fps "Island"

Turning off the Volumetric Light Scattering removes the coloured noise I seem to experience; but the zdepth/stencil buffer intersecting lines are always present no matter what I set.

If I had to guess, I'd say you're using a 32-bit buffer over a 24-bit one... that would explain the garbage data being drawn during the volumetrics, although the stencil drawing is a new one to me. Don't have enough experience with OpenGL to guess the issue, it could be that it's the range data again being expanded outside the range the card is used to... but as the stencil is a floating point value only grading the amount of collision it could be that anything outside of this range is showing as pure white pixels when handed to the draw buffer which does handle 32bit colour.

Just a thought, but god knows; just going on what I can see really.

[edit] Oops forgot the image hehe



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trogdor
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Posted: 5th Nov 2008 22:18
OK,
I installed the latest ATI 8.10 hotfix for farcry2, and stalker...
and now the demos work again.
not perfect, but better than not working at all.

I found that if I set the shadow quality to high, the gray lines/noise on the screen goes away.


The water is still looks wrong in some areas


If you give someone a program, you will frustrate them for a day; if you teach them how to program, you will frustrate them for a lifetime.
Leadwerks
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Posted: 8th Nov 2008 05:23 Edited at: 8th Nov 2008 05:24
The reason the water looks like that is that GLSL uniform default values are not support with AMD cards, although they are supposed to be.

I am resolving driver issues, small bugs, and adding a few features for the next update. Here's a preview of the 3D water:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HrUEnT277WQ
Leadwerks
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Posted: 3rd Dec 2008 04:41 Edited at: 3rd Dec 2008 04:42
New tutorial on rendering water is ready. This covers underwater rendering and physics, too, and is over 30 minutes in length:
http://vimeo.com/2411794

See the tutorials page for files and PDF article.
Rampage
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Posted: 6th Dec 2008 06:02
Just downloaded and tried it out and all I have to say is...WOW!! Man, it is WICKED! I can play with everything on highest settings, just not the light scattering because everything goes black when I try that. It roughly stays around 120fps or up for me . Be sure for a couple of purchases man. Thanks...


"Welcome to the forums, MasterXMP. Your game looks like garbage..." - Game Maker
Leadwerks
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Posted: 1st Feb 2009 22:15 Edited at: 1st Feb 2009 22:16
Working on version 2.20 now...
http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_qGOtgeHf7S0/SYYKumjZeSI/AAAAAAAAAIo/jQZqiNOsC4w/s1600-h/screenshot0014.png
Demon Air 3D
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Posted: 4th Feb 2009 19:03
Awsome post here when its done
Leadwerks
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Posted: 20th Feb 2009 01:25 Edited at: 20th Feb 2009 01:25
2.20 and a new evaluation kit is just about ready.

Demon Air 3D
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Posted: 20th Feb 2009 11:55
YES! ive been waiting for this
Leadwerks
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Posted: 20th Feb 2009 21:31 Edited at: 21st Feb 2009 21:33
Can you please give this a try and tell me your results? Make sure your graphics drivers are up to date before running:
http://www.leadwerks.com/ccount/click.php?id=63
Virtual Nomad
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Posted: 21st Feb 2009 07:12
installed openAL and couldn't get either demo to work. island played about 1 sec of sound then gone. black screen/never saw anything. underground started up but the whole (windowed and FS) screen was flipped 180 degrees. at first i thought we started upside down on the ceiling until i saw the barrels... went to bare minimum settings and got the same. i then double-checked ATI and saw new drivers released today (feb 20th) so DL'd and installed.

now both demo's cause VPU recovery and don't respond. sound effects playing on underground (island still plays 1-2 secs of sound before 'nothing').

haven't messed with anything else in the eval kit.

i did test other (commercial) games and everything fine there.

are there any log dumps i can send or anything you want me to try?

specs in sig.

Virtual Nomad @ California, USA
AMD Phenomâ„¢ X4 9750 Quad-Core @ 2.4 GHz . 8 GB PC2-6400 RAM
ATI Radeon HD 3650 @ 512 MB . Vista Home Premium 64 Bit
Leadwerks
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Posted: 21st Feb 2009 08:12
ATI released a new set of drivers that expose some new OpenGL3 functionality, but they did it wrong, and it causes the engine to crash.

I will just disable instanced rendering if ATI hardware is detected.
Serge Adjo
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Posted: 21st Feb 2009 12:55 Edited at: 21st Feb 2009 12:56
Quote: "Can you please give this a try and tell me your results? Make sure your graphics drivers are up to date before running:
http://www.leadwerks.com/ccount/click.php?id=62"

er the links doesn't work for me man

pascontent.
RanQor
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Posted: 21st Feb 2009 20:55 Edited at: 21st Feb 2009 21:02
I had a lot of graphical corruption in the 2.12 eval kit...
I'm trying the 2.21 now.

http://www.leadwerks.com/files/LEEval2.21.exe

Edit:
Island demo tries to launch, but immediately closes. Underground demo looked good though.
kaedroho
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Posted: 21st Feb 2009 21:02
Whats with the left handed guns??? I litterally cant stand looking at that screenshot. If I was playing a game with a left handed gun, I would SCREAM!!!

I wonder if theres anymore people like me who are way to used to having weapons on the right.

bitJericho
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Posted: 22nd Feb 2009 00:32
It makes sense to me, since I'm left handed My gripe is that the guy's arm looks like plywood

I'll try the demo out tonite, though

"I acctually quite like this site. And noone will know because this is a secret..." - Anonymous
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Leadwerks
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Posted: 17th Mar 2009 06:46 Edited at: 17th Mar 2009 07:06
New evaluation kit is ready here:
http://www.leadwerks.com/ccount/click.php?id=64



Thraxas
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Posted: 23rd Mar 2009 13:49
If I have previously downloaded an evaluation kit and it has expired will this reset that?

I ask because due to personal circumstances I never actually got to properly try out the evaluation kit last time I installed it, then when I went to use it, it was expired

BiggAdd
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Posted: 24th Mar 2009 03:58
Screens look fantastic! Unfortunately my Graphics card isn't.

I really should upgrade at some point.

Leadwerks
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Posted: 24th Mar 2009 23:44
Thraxas, I don't know for sure. Probably.
Thraxas
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Posted: 25th Mar 2009 06:00
Quote: "Thraxas, I don't know for sure. Probably.
"


Yes it did... Excellent, now I can have a proper play with the evaluation

Michael P
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Posted: 17th Apr 2009 23:00
Those screenshots look so realistic, are you sure you didn't photo an island in real life?

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