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FPSC Classic Product Chat / V118 Public Beta 17

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Deathcow
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Posted: 29th Oct 2010 00:26
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AH ok I see, thanks Red eye. So once we upgrade to 118 final, it will not be compatable with older versions of FPSC. I'll have to keep that in mind then once I start using 118 final once it is out.

Another thing I noticed is that 118 beta 3 is building bigger levels for me that I couldn't build in 117.

DC

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A dude
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Posted: 29th Oct 2010 01:12
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Is there camera shake and animated menu in this?
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DarkJames
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Posted: 29th Oct 2010 01:18
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Not In Beta 3

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defiler
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Posted: 29th Oct 2010 01:47
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@ NBT: Thanks dude, that makes me feel better about compiling

Limitless Box studios current project: Lost Contact

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Flatlander
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Posted: 29th Oct 2010 04:03 Edited at: 29th Oct 2010 04:06
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Marc said this in another thread:

Quote: ". . . update 1.18 will contain the $PH internal variable, which retrieves the player's health
"


So, will the entire variable system from PB be included or just some?

I reject your reality and substitute my own!

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Michael Thompson
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Posted: 29th Oct 2010 05:44
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Does anybody know when beta 4 is due?

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Marc Steene
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Posted: 29th Oct 2010 09:51
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Quote: "So, will the entire variable system from PB be included or just some?"


I remember seeing a document online somewhere which listed out which new scripting commands will be in the next update, but cannot find it now. It will be pretty much the whole PB variable system, with all actions, conditions, internal variables, and the ability to reference variables with %.


[b]FPSC MIGRATION: http://forum.thegamecreators.com/?m=forum_view&t=142497&b=21
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defiler
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Posted: 30th Oct 2010 01:29
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@ Marc: wont PB sales go down?

Limitless Box studios current project: Lost Contact

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Bigsnake
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Posted: 30th Oct 2010 01:54
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Quote: "wont PB sales go down?"


I find it good that PB is going into FPSC Vanilla because I beleive that it is totally unfair that it is a sold mod making loads of money just so people can script better for their games, especially if people can't buy it.

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BlackFox
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Posted: 30th Oct 2010 02:17
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Quote: "I find it good that PB is going into FPSC Vanilla because I beleive that it is totally unfair that it is a sold mod making loads of money just so people can script better for their games, especially if people can't buy it."


You're kidding, right? I guess it is also totally unfair that Microsoft or other companies (us included) manufacture software and sell at a price. So if we decided to put a price on our RPG Mod, you feel that would be unfair? Or what if Lee and group decided to charge for updates? It is all along the same line. Model Pack 38 is it, the Metro Theatre pack, has shaders that come with it, correct? Is it a fair assessment to say that it is unfair bond1 is charging for that? Meaning to have some cool shaders we have to buy them, but it's unfair to charge for a product to give some great shader capability in our games. (Apologize to Bond1- I was using your model pack as an example, as we are getting ready to buy it just for that very reason).

If people can't buy software, what is the alternative? Buy it, or find a free "facsimile" of the product. I think your comment is a bit unfair towards Plystire and s4real, who started PB moving. Creating a rift over a paid mod being fair or not won't solve anything.

- BlackFox

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Plystire
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Posted: 30th Oct 2010 02:41
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Quote: "I find it good that PB is going into FPSC Vanilla because I beleive that it is totally unfair that it is a sold mod making loads of money just so people can script better for their games, especially if people can't buy it."


Not sure if you're complimenting one of my decisions or scorning it. Either way, it seems you've never been properly introduced to the capitalistic world that you live in.


The one and only,


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Flatlander
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Posted: 30th Oct 2010 06:11 Edited at: 30th Oct 2010 06:14
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Actually, Bigsnake lives in a more socialistic country rather than a capitalistic country.

Even though Blackfox is from Canada which is a little more socialistic than USA he at least understands Capitalism.

Edit:

Also, Bigsnake is probably a teenager and doesn't have a lot of money. So, you can be anywhere in the world and have that problem.

I reject your reality and substitute my own!

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Plystire
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Posted: 30th Oct 2010 08:19
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Guess I should have said it in another way then. Let me rephrase:
The world runs on currency, doesn't matter the form. And no matter where in the world you may be, products of any shape or form are traded for currency. That is just the way the world works and the sooner you come to terms with that the better off you will be.


The one and only,


Only those who sow the seeds of their desires will reap their benefits later.
However, I have seeds of my own to tend to. I don't have time to be someone else's watering can.
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defiler
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Posted: 30th Oct 2010 08:20
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@ F L A T L A N D E R :Canada is Socialistic, well hey i even live in Canada and did no know that

I blame my social studies teacher

Limitless Box studios current project: Lost Contact

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Red Eye
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Posted: 30th Oct 2010 13:58 Edited at: 30th Oct 2010 13:58
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nvm...

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Gibba gobba
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Posted: 31st Oct 2010 01:37
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what needs to be added into 1.18 is the slider system. you can already adjust ambiance with < and >. instead, the x10 slider menu should be integrated, allowing adjustment of ambient light, water level, water color, water fog(murkiness), and that awful post-processing. also, the character destroy scripts need to include ragdoll for all. the ragdoll physics also need to be improved by a longshot. and of course, allies shouldnt be controlled by script, but instead by the entity properties like in x10. i also think people might get tired of having limited downloads on the tgc store. I just went through a horrible defrag and had to reinstall everything on FPS Creator

Changing the world of game making, one line of code at a time!
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Tyguy80s
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Posted: 31st Oct 2010 01:17
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I kinda agree with gibba gobba but I need to tell him some things to.

The X10 slider thing is pretty much a convience but I guess that'd be cool to have (It's not needed).

Water level and color is in progress I belive. The thing is, the development team still needs to fix the water alittle. Have you tried it out yet? Murkiness is probably something that can be done easily but I would definitely add that in 1.19 or something of the likes. I don't exactly like post-processing myself but I think it would be cool to be able to update the post-bloom.fx for each level or something of the likes.

The charcter scripts don't need ragdoll THAT much but if you think so, visit my custom script thread here. You'll find a couple of scripts. I sorta agree with you on the ragdolls but right click the character (or monster/whatever) and change it's weight settings and get it to fall alittle faster. Controlling allies by script is actually better. You can have up to about five teams or so rather than 2 or 3.

Now the limited downloads is to make sure no one is leaking into the internet and other security reasons.

You have to think though, this is Direct X9. It can't do everything but T.G.C is trying their best to do so. The best thing you can do is either wait, try and help solve your own problems, and even try to learn to script in FPSC or DBPro and create some of your own features.
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Bigsnake
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Posted: 31st Oct 2010 04:45 Edited at: 31st Oct 2010 04:48
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Quote: "what needs to be added into 1.18 is the slider system. you can already adjust ambiance with < and >. instead, the x10 slider menu should be integrated, allowing adjustment of ambient light, water level, water color, water fog(murkiness), and that awful post-processing. also, the character destroy scripts need to include ragdoll for all. the ragdoll physics also need to be improved by a longshot."


Lee and Hockeykid only included the water as a beta test I beleive so they had no intension of a 100% miracle from chuck norris for perfect water

I would agree the Ragdoll needs improving no dout about it, it seems to work fine for around 2-3 seconds then the ragdoll just freezes in place and sometimes you can kick it around. I'm hoping that FPSC should be at least 97% bug free by the end of 2010, even if lee doesn't get the major features that everyone keeps bugging him about, I would be happy with a perfectly working FPSC while Lee takes his time in making the update.

I would edit the code myself if I had Dark Lights and Dark AI, Would be usefull to have them aswell

Quote: "Actually, Bigsnake lives in a more socialistic country rather than a capitalistic country."


I can't say all of England is socialistic, if you get into places like London and any other major cities around then they are quite capitalistic, I do live in a town that is more socialitic then capitalitic though

Windows 7, Amd Athlon 7750 Black Editon (64 bit,3ghz + Dual Core), ATI Readon HD 4870 1gb Edition, 4gb Ram.
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Gibba gobba
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Posted: 31st Oct 2010 05:47
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Quote: "You have to think though, this is Direct X9. It can't do everything but T.G.C is trying their best to do so."


You saw that, but look at Half Life 2! It runs on DirectX 9 and it's a thousand times more powerful than FPS Creator right now(I should know. The highest my computer can run is 9.0 and I own like 5 Source games.)!

Changing the world of game making, one line of code at a time!
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defiler
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Posted: 31st Oct 2010 07:44
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@ Gibba: probably cause they had multiple coders and testers to work it out.

Limitless Box studios current project: Lost Contact

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Red Eye
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Posted: 31st Oct 2010 12:31 Edited at: 31st Oct 2010 12:33
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Quote: ""You have to think though, this is Direct X9. It can't do everything but T.G.C is trying their best to do so.""


Omg... who said that ?

TGC is doing good, but that doesnt delete the fact that they are focussed on other things tooo... FPSC doesnt have priority, as it shouldn't, IMHO.

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The Storyteller 01
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Posted: 31st Oct 2010 15:14
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Does the 1.18 beta 3 allready include the PICKOBJECT condition, which is supposed to be in the final 1.18?

In case you find my grammar and spelling weird ---> native German speaker ^^
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Bigsnake
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Posted: 31st Oct 2010 16:12 Edited at: 31st Oct 2010 16:14
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Quote: "I own like 5 Source games"


I own all the valve games

Quote: "Does the 1.18 beta 3 allready include the PICKOBJECT condition, which is supposed to be in the final 1.18?"


I don't think it does yet, I'm not 100% sure though because I don't do much scripted, I just use FPSC as a layout designer for source SDK

Quote: "TGC is doing good, but that doesnt delete the fact that they are focussed on other things tooo... FPSC doesnt have priority, as it shouldn't, IMHO."


Yeah that's true, FPSC is just a tiny thing that they created to help newbies out in game development to hope that they would move on to DBpro or any other proffessional game engine so FPSC pretty much isn't their #1 priority.

Quote: "You have to think though, this is Direct X9. It can't do everything but T.G.C is trying their best to do so"


Directx9 can Only differences between 9 and 10 is that 10 can randomise particles and other aspects of games, allow shaders on every aspect of the game and can help with the game's framerate. Dx11 only fixes some bugs that DX9 and DX10 has.

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Red Eye
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Posted: 31st Oct 2010 16:55 Edited at: 31st Oct 2010 16:56
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Quote: "Yeah that's true, "


I obious agree with that lol.

Quote: "FPSC is just a tiny thing that they created to help newbies out in game development to hope that they would move on to DBpro or any other proffessional game engine so FPSC pretty much isn't their #1 priority."


Tho i dont agree with that..

Do you really think TGC made that for noobies? Seriously...lets not forget TGC isnt a very small company... They mainly produced fpsc with the hand of dbpro for comercial puporses (markt focussed,simple fast gamemaking solution, and other keywords make it attractive for kids and other users to pay for it) [money purposes]. xD
And ofcourse they putted all their hart and love into FPSC.


Quote: "Directx9 can Only differences between 9 and 10 is that 10 can randomise particles and other aspects of games, allow shaders on every aspect of the game and can help with the game's framerate. Dx11 only fixes some bugs that DX9 and DX10 has."


And dx10 dx11 can DO LOADS of better things... altough that doesnt indeed mean dx9 is powerless , its actually very powerfull.

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Bigsnake
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Posted: 31st Oct 2010 17:56
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Quote: "altough that doesnt indeed mean dx9 is powerless , its actually very powerfull."


Exactly, it was the biggest step in Game Development

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Hockeykid
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Posted: 31st Oct 2010 18:57
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Hey Guys,
For those who haven't seen it yet heres a new feature that has made its way into V118. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CIlsEmNtcBQ

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Seth Black
FPSC Reloaded TGC Backer
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Posted: 31st Oct 2010 19:29
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@hockeykid,

...that's a very cool addition, indeed.

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Bigsnake
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Posted: 31st Oct 2010 23:12
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Nice

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Pirate Myke
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Posted: 1st Nov 2010 03:36
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I must say that had to be an animation nightmare to get that all so smooth. Great work to the modeler.

Only limit is the limit on your mind.

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Gravysam
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Posted: 1st Nov 2010 15:35
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cool!
ill install once my desktop is fixed!

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A dude
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Posted: 1st Nov 2010 21:27
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I found a bug. the characters could go through walls!
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GreenDixy
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Posted: 1st Nov 2010 21:55
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i can confirm the walk through walls

======================================

GreenDixy Productions http://GreenDixy.Com
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Gencheff
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Posted: 1st Nov 2010 21:56
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I seem to have the same problem,but only if Dark AI is used

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seppgirty
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Posted: 1st Nov 2010 23:23
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Quote: "Hey Guys,
For those who haven't seen it yet heres a new feature that has made its way into V118."


OMG !!!!! is that machine gun gonna be a stock model? that video was sweet... who ever made it is damn good

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Susysyay
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Posted: 1st Nov 2010 23:57
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I am having a problem. Whenever the player takes damage, the eyehud (the red border indicating damage has been received) does not show up. The visuals dont appear even for that split second. I still take damage and hear the hurt sounds, but the EYEHUD does NOT appear. Can anyone confirm or offer a possible fix?

-Winner of the X10 Revival Competition, Susysyay
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MK83
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Posted: 2nd Nov 2010 00:37
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Please fix the WinZone

mk83 Productions
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knxrb
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Posted: 2nd Nov 2010 01:42
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Quote: "I am having a problem. Whenever the player takes damage, the eyehud (the red border indicating damage has been received) does not show up. The visuals dont appear even for that split second. I still take damage and hear the hurt sounds, but the EYEHUD does NOT appear. Can anyone confirm or offer a possible fix?"

That's a known bug and should be fixed in the next beta

Quote: "Please fix the WinZone"

Same as above answer.

knxrb
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tant
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Posted: 2nd Nov 2010 01:55
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Is there a ragdoll for 1.18??

if so, how can i get it working?

Thanks

tant
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Soviet176
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Posted: 2nd Nov 2010 02:17
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Where there be a tracer round effect in one of these updates? anything to do with visible bullets now that we have animated chain belts lol

Putting fear back into sliced bread since 4th May 2010
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defiler
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Posted: 2nd Nov 2010 03:13
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knxrb: how do i set up the GUI thing for editing the title, etc instead of entering the x and y values?

Limitless Box studios current project: Lost Contact

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knxrb
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Posted: 2nd Nov 2010 03:18
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Quote: "knxrb: how do i set up the GUI thing for editing the title, etc instead of entering the x and y values?"

At the moment there's no help files for the commands but I'm working on those now and also a drag and drop menu editor that writes the scripts and adds effects for you.

It's currently in beta stages and will be released soon.

knxrb
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Scene Commander
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Posted: 2nd Nov 2010 09:21 Edited at: 2nd Nov 2010 09:54
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I think all the new features are great, but am I alone in thinking that the engine needs to address a couple of major problems before adding more.

Firstly and most importantly in my eyes is performance

I've a few ideas myself, maybe others might have thier own they could suggest.

A "dynaminc entity hide at a distance system would be good", I wrote something similar for WASP mod (if anyone remembers that) and I saw around a 10fps improvement, mine wasn't that effiecent as I didn't work on it for long, but I'm sure something better could be added fairly easily.

In addition, a LOD system would really improve things. This would need to take into account the current models so it would only kick in if LOD models were available. But my thinking would be to allow for additional models in the FPE file along the lines of:

model=xxxx
model1=xxxx
model2=xxxx

Possibly even allowing for a final billboard model.

For additional efficency this system could and really should allow for texture reduction at a distance.

It would also be a nice addition to see the ability to "fade" dead characters after a user set number of seconds instead of the current system of disappear or not. The fade timer could pause if the player was within a certain distance to prevent the sudden disappearance of corpses.

It might also be time to consider implementing Sparky's excellent collision system which seems to me to be a more effective and speedier option.

I'm sure I've only touched on the surface of the various options and that others could add to this.

Secondly, I think more time now needs to go into developing the AI. Ok, it's come a long way, but they really only use an improved path finding sysyem. They still walk through wall/objects, they ignore waypoints a lot of the time and sometimes stare blanky at the player. I think that part of the problem with this is that the FPI system is inherently slow to execute and sometimes the AI is simply waiting for instructions. Maybe some hard coded AI which didn't rely so much on the FPI commands, although it's a fine and difficult middle ground between freedom of design and effiency.

These are just my opinions and aren't at all a negative comment on the excellent work so far, but I think they are the most important next steps if we are to see an engine that even begins to approach our expectations.
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Bigsnake
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Posted: 2nd Nov 2010 09:52
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Quote: "OMG !!!!! is that machine gun gonna be a stock model? that video was sweet... who ever made it is damn good"


No it's a weapon by EAI who made some nice weapons in model pack 9 & 10 and also makes weapons for the store

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Stefos
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Posted: 2nd Nov 2010 12:31
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Quote: "In addition, a LOD system would really improve things. This would need to take into account the current models so it would only kick in if LOD models were available. But my thinking would be to allow for additional models in the FPE file along the lines of:

model=xxxx
model1=xxxx
model2=xxxx "


Am I right in thinking that Valve use a LOD and especially for water ? I guess this would improve the water issues, well anyway I don't know to much about all this !

http://www.comix-sandbox.com
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Dark Goblin
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Posted: 2nd Nov 2010 13:52
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LOD is used in somehow all actual engines.
Its something FPSC really does not have and thats the problem with the performance.
Also a newer physics engine would not be that bad.
Okay ODE is good, but there is a better way of dealing with physics (and please not DarkPhysics -.- ).

I can only answer to Scene Commander.
I totally agree with you

... efxMod Developer!
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Marc Steene
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Posted: 2nd Nov 2010 14:24
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Quote: "It would also be a nice addition to see the ability to "fade" dead characters after a user set number of seconds instead of the current system of disappear or not. The fade timer could pause if the player was within a certain distance to prevent the sudden disappearance of corpses."


I think this can already be achieved by adding a delay with an etimer, and perhaps combine it with plrdistfurther and the AirMod condition which detects whether an object is visible on the screen.

Also, a "billboard" action would be nice which would forever rotate the entity towards the player without needing to be a character. I think this may be achievable already with PB but it would be nice to have it condensed into a single action.


[b]FPSC MIGRATION: http://forum.thegamecreators.com/?m=forum_view&t=142497&b=21
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Scene Commander
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Posted: 2nd Nov 2010 15:24 Edited at: 2nd Nov 2010 17:15
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Quote: "I think this can already be achieved by adding a delay with an etimer, and perhaps combine it with plrdistfurther and the AirMod condition which detects whether an object is visible on the screen."


I believe that the problem with the current code is that the engine suspends the object, which takes it out of the checking loop. If I've understood the code correctly, I think some recoding would be required for the above method to work. I'm happy to be corrected, but I've not managed to get this working via scripting.

Also, while I understand that it may be possible, it would still be far faster to achieve directly from the engine, and as stated, I believe performance improvements to be paramount.

Thinking about the idea of billboards.. The original decal system works in a very similar way, rotating to face the player. I'd have thought that it would be possible to adapt that, although to me it seems pretty slow for what it does.

Still, just my thoughts..
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Bigsnake
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Posted: 2nd Nov 2010 19:22
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Quote: "Thinking about the idea of billboards.. The original decal system works in a very similar way, rotating to face the player. I'd have thought that it would be possible to adapt that, although to me it seems pretty slow for what it does."


I really hate the player facing decals, they creep my out in a way, Dunno why they just do. I would much pefer the static ones (Which I do change hte scripts so they are if using decals)

Windows 7, Amd Athlon 7750 Black Editon (64 bit,3ghz + Dual Core), ATI Readon HD 4870 1gb Edition, 4gb Ram.
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Hockeykid
DBPro Tool Maker
16
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Joined: 26th Sep 2007
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Posted: 2nd Nov 2010 22:48
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Quote: "It might also be time to consider implementing Sparky's excellent collision system which seems to me to be a more effective and speedier option."


Sparky's is a collision library, ODE is a physics engine. They are two very different things

Quote: "Secondly, I think more time now needs to go into developing the AI. Ok, it's come a long way, but they really only use an improved path finding sysyem. They still walk through wall/objects, they ignore waypoints a lot of the time and sometimes stare blanky at the player. I think that part of the problem with this is that the FPI system is inherently slow to execute and sometimes the AI is simply waiting for instructions. Maybe some hard coded AI which didn't rely so much on the FPI commands, although it's a fine and difficult middle ground between freedom of design and effiency."


Well if people actually bothered to make their own Dark AI scripts they would see how good the system really is. The FPI scripts that came with the newest updates are really really bad. To be honest I used those mostly for debugging while Errant did me a favor and wrote some proper ones (but those actually never made their way into the update ).

Anyways Errant is a frequent user of the new AI system and I can tell he quite enjoys it. You'll be able to see just how good scriptable Dark AI is when his Task Force characters come out as I do believe he will include some nice Dark AI scripts with them .

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Flatlander
FPSC Tool Maker
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Posted: 2nd Nov 2010 23:34 Edited at: 2nd Nov 2010 23:48
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Quote: "Well if people actually bothered to make their own Dark AI scripts they would see how good the system really is"


Through RPG Mod I have discovered that a lot of people don't want to script. Folks the code's there to use just use it. Look, if you had to do it from scratch using DBPro you would have to have two to three times the line of code just to do simple things. Hockeykid has done all that DBPro coding for you. You now just have to use the more simplified scripting code to accomplish some great AI. I believe that's the same thing with the water effects. You need to learn (through trial and error) how to script it. Placing it properly would probably be important as well.

Quote: "Errant did me a favor and wrote some proper ones (but those actually never made their way into the update"


Maybe they could make their way into v118 official release?

Addendum:

I was just looking at the google code page and have noticed that about 2 hours ago a new "bloom" shader was uploaded that will be a part of v118. This new bloom shader appears to be Bond1's adaptive shader. Good news.

I reject your reality and substitute my own!

Add more adventure to your game -- use RPG Mod
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