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Dark GDK / [LOCKED] When is DGDK going to be fixed?

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Morcilla
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Posted: 28th Sep 2006 12:47
I'm still unable to release...
OSX Using Happy Dude
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Posted: 28th Sep 2006 13:49
I was wondering that myself last night...

Visit my web site to download Humans On A Planet & BallZ
Miguel Melo
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Posted: 28th Sep 2006 19:24
Unable to release what?

I have vague plans for World Domination
y2ksw
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Posted: 29th Sep 2006 01:04
I'm really waiting for the fog color fix. Is the release coming ... uhm ... before xmas?
Morcilla
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Posted: 29th Sep 2006 13:17
Miguel, check my web page www.mpl3d.com or the thread at the WIP forum.
Miguel Melo
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Posted: 30th Sep 2006 00:56
Morcilla, this is great stuff! I had no idea what you were up to: this is looking absolutely awesome.

Yo penso que tienes un sucesso en tus manos!

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Miguel Melo
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Posted: 30th Sep 2006 02:28
*Sigh* No mention of the GDK in Newsletter 45... still no full 6.2 released...

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OSX Using Happy Dude
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Posted: 30th Sep 2006 11:32
Thought 45 was out tomorrow - or do you know the contents of it ?
As it doesn't mention GSDK, what else is in it ?

Visit my web site to download Humans On A Planet & BallZ
Miguel Melo
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Posted: 30th Sep 2006 12:48 Edited at: 30th Sep 2006 12:48
Strange... din't you get it in the mail? It has:

(1) Hands On DarkBASIC Pro Vol. 2 (2) Dark Shader Preview (3) Physics Compo (4) FPS Creator News: Be Careful, Animated Sprite Pack, Update 1.0.3 and Fall of the Fireflies (5) Styx and DBPro 6.2c (6) eXtends 1.2 and TreeMagik G2 (7) Kalime (8) WORLD (9) DBPro Mastery: Invaders Part 1 (10) From the Forums (11) Lee's Tip of the Month (12) Bezerk 3D (13) Medieval Village (14) Gopher Packing (15) DBPro Tips: Cameras do Scrollers (16) The Winner (17) Outro

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OSX Using Happy Dude
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Posted: 30th Sep 2006 13:54 Edited at: 30th Sep 2006 13:58
Na - never have.

I wait for the online version...

So, no GSDK mention then ? Not even a peep ?

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Miguel Melo
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Posted: 30th Sep 2006 16:20
Nope. Search for "DK" and no hits. Guess no talk of Donkey Kong either...

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Morcilla
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Posted: 30th Sep 2006 17:14 Edited at: 30th Sep 2006 17:15
Miguel, thanks a lot for your comments.

My project is waiting -ready- at least since June, that is going to be 4 months.
And, you know, XP isn't living forever, so I lost 4 months of possible sales.
Miguel Melo
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Posted: 30th Sep 2006 20:37
That's a real bummer Morcilla... I wasn't aware that you were sitting on a complete product waiting for the DGDK update. Ghosting is the main problem for you isn't it?

I'm currently re-starting a project that I would like to take through to completion to, maybe, release commercially and it's situations like yours that make me wonder if I should cut my losses and migrate my code over to, say, Ogre3D... which is something that I really don't want.

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Morcilla
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Posted: 2nd Oct 2006 12:12
Yeah, ghosting is the main problem.

At the beginning it was the shaders, I told Richard Davey, and my project was mentioned in newsletter Issue 36 - January 2006. Which I appreciate very much, that meant they got involved with the problem.

Eight months later, the update was here, but how can I release without some other standard functionality?
Ghosting is the most noticeable, but I'm sure that there are more undiscovered issues, like those regarding to object size, changing legacy code behaviour, and I have +50.000 lines of code.

I'm the last one who wants to migrate to any other engine. But the current situation may force me to choose another one for future projects.
fubarpk
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Posted: 2nd Oct 2006 16:26
Miguel just checked your webpage looks good, ive been waiting for the ghosting and alphatransparency too, I just come here hoping for a release date of fixed DGDK disappointed no mention in newsletter. I hope its out soon. I still think xps life will live much longer and if the backward compatibilty works with DGDK programs in VISTA you shouldnt have any problems with your software lastibility. Im studying so i dont get much time to code lately but i sure like to and curious to find out if my transport of code from DBPRO was done proper. Still have to port accross the sliding collision code. But the rest is pretty well done and the menu just needs its options screen designed. But still far from finished as i want to use some cloth effects so i guess i will be waiting along time for that upgrade.

fubar
Mike Johnson
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Posted: 2nd Oct 2006 16:35
What specific problems are you having with the GDK? If you can provide clear, detailed information regarding the issues you have encountered it will help us to resolve them. It will also be helpful if you can provide a small demonstration program that highlights the issue.
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Posted: 2nd Oct 2006 16:43
The best source for GSDK dodgyness can be found here : http://forum.thegamecreators.com/?m=forum_view&t=88632&b=22

Visit my web site to download Humans On A Planet & BallZ
Morcilla
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Posted: 2nd Oct 2006 20:55
Quote: "you shouldnt have any problems with your software lastibility"


Thanks for your encouragement, fubarpk. I hope so, but I guess I cannot be sure until I test it.

Quote: "If you can provide clear, detailed information regarding the issues"


Mike, I'm going to prepare some simple code examples and have them emailed to you shortly. Nevertheless I think everyone should collaborate as well.

Dear Mr. Moderator, I agree, that link is the best source right now.
Mike Johnson
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Posted: 2nd Oct 2006 21:53
Thanks for sorting out some code examples. It makes Lee's and my job much simpler when we can see the problem straight away rather than trying to hunt it down.
Morcilla
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Posted: 3rd Oct 2006 19:56 Edited at: 3rd Oct 2006 19:58
I attach a .zip file with the following DGDK 1.6.2c/vs2003 examples:

- Ghosted objects do not appear (although cloned ghosted do)


- "dbObjectSize()" returns 2x the value of the DGSDK v1.1.1 behaviour
- "dbObjectSize()" returns the original size of the source object for cloned objects


- Escape key always quits to desktop


- Fog is always black


- Sync rate is always fixed to monitor refresh rate


- Shadows run through other objects, command is obsolete for DBPro migrations


There are images included.
I emailed the .zip file to Mike.

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Mike Johnson
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Posted: 3rd Oct 2006 19:57
Thanks for providing the examples Morcilla. I will look into them this week.
Morcilla
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Posted: 3rd Oct 2006 19:59 Edited at: 3rd Oct 2006 20:18
That's a quick reply. Please check your email soon.
Thanks in advance Mike.
Miguel Melo
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Posted: 3rd Oct 2006 20:22
This is really good stuff, Morcilla! Short, sweet and to the point.

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Morcilla
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Posted: 3rd Oct 2006 20:29 Edited at: 3rd Oct 2006 20:31
Thanks Miguel

Strange thing that escape key issue. It always quits me, but I remember that you were having the opposite behaviour (no way to quit), perhaps it is that I use VS2003?
Mike Johnson
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Posted: 3rd Oct 2006 20:36
The email has turned up now If anyone else has anything to submit please do so in the next few days.
Miguel Melo
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Posted: 3rd Oct 2006 20:46
I have an explicit escape statement like you have there to break out of the loop, and I am pretty sure that it's that that breaks out. I'll double check this evening and let you know.

BTW, when I emailed Lee I mentioned your project's situation as being a particularly unfortunate one, seing as you had a really cool software ready for release but being held back for months because of the update. I hope you don't mind that... in hindsight, I feel I should have checked with you first if I could mention your case as an example. After all, no one asked me to be the GDK Workers' Syndicate Leader...

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Morcilla
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Posted: 3rd Oct 2006 21:05
Miguel, lol.
Of course I don't mind. Thanks a lot for you attitude, it is highly appreciated.
Miguel Melo
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Posted: 4th Oct 2006 00:08 Edited at: 4th Oct 2006 00:13
Regarding the escape thing... you are right. My code is bailing out of the

while ( LoopGDK ( ) )
{
if ( dbEscapeKey ( ) )
break;
<snip>
}

implicitly, when I press ESC (i.e. LoopGDK() returns false). Not by obeying the break!

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APEXnow
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Posted: 4th Oct 2006 02:04
Does this occurr when calling dbDisableEscapeKey() ?

Paul.

Morcilla
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Posted: 5th Oct 2006 15:09
Quote: "Does this occurr when calling dbDisableEscapeKey() ?"


I made a quick test and it seems that returns the escape key to the previous behaviour, so it is a workaround. Good.

Quote: "If anyone else has anything to submit please do so in the next few days"


I think we don't get this proposal very often, so please, everybody review the pending issues!!!

I was going to make a list with them but,
where has gone the sticky thread about bugs?

The link above doesn't work anymore:

Quote: "This thread has been deleted from the forum by a moderator."


Uh.
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Posted: 5th Oct 2006 15:52
Dont know - dont think I deleted it

Apart from the already mentioned problems, I cant think of anything else much wrong with it...

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Miguel Melo
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Posted: 5th Oct 2006 21:00
Quote: "where has gone the sticky thread about bugs? "


Something's afoot... I sense great disturbance in the force.

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Morcilla
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Posted: 5th Oct 2006 21:35
Uh, I really hope not.

These are the problems already reported to Mike with examples:

- Ghosting
- Object size
- Fog
- Shadows
- Escapekey
- Sync rate

And these are the ones still pending of examples, if applicable (I had a local copy of the lost topic ):

--------------------------------

1. The header file ‘DarkSDKBasic3D.h’ defines a function called dbTLVertexSystemMemoryAvailable

This function is defined in the lib file as dbTLVertexSystemMemoryAvailableAvailable

--------------------------------

2. Again, same header file, a function called
dbObjectSetDisableTransform,
and yet it’s defined in the Basic3D.lib file as:
dbSetObjectDisableTransform

--------------------------------

3. The function dbWriteToRegistryS defined in ‘DarkSDKInput.h’ has three arguments. The third argument is defined as a DWORD. The lib file expects this to be a char *. Can the header file be corrected to point to a char * please.

--------------------------------

4. In ‘DarkSDKText.h’ defines a function called dbValR. The header defines the argument as char *. The lib file Text.lib is expecting an unsigned long. Can you fix the library please.

--------------------------------

5. Also in ‘DarkSDKText.h’ defines a function called dbCompareCase. The header defines the second argument as a DWORD, yet the library expects a char *. Please fix.

--------------------------------

6. File "Globstruct.h" - This points to a globstruct on Lee's machine (#include "......Dark Basic Pro SDKSharedCoreglobstruct.h").

--------------------------------

7. CallDLL - The function name needs to be a DWORD, for some reason...

--------------------------------

8. dbPositionMouse doesn't always seem to work. The vertical value adds in the title bar height, and possibly the X values takes in the windows horizontal position...

--------------------------------

9. the weird fps speed up (can be seen to coincide with an audio event)

--------------------------------

10. dbSetObjectTransparency(), makes whatever color you set transparent, render with blue edges (backdrop color). And also theres a zdepth problem there, other transparent objects show through closer transparent ones eg, you know with trees, the edge of the leaves will all be blue and you can see background trees through the trunk of a closer one.

--------------------------------

11. atls.lib wasn't it's dependency supposed to of been removed? - express user. (note: what about quartz.lib)

--------------------------------

12. In the file 'DarkSDK.h' can this line:

#define _CRT_SECURE_NO_DEPRECATE

be replaced with this please:

#ifndef _CRT_SECURE_NO_DEPRECATE
#define _CRT_SECURE_NO_DEPRECATE
#endif

If a project has this macro defined in the C++/Preprocessor section, it causes the warning macro redefinition for files that include DarkSDK.h. Please realize that some files in a project may not necessarily include the DGDK header, hence the warning isn't issued when compiling that file.

--------------------------------

From the bugs forum:

--------------------------------

13. dbSaveTerrain crashes : Crashes always (GPF). Tried also to save the advanced terrain sample which comes with DB Pro.

--------------------------------

14. dbColorAmbientLight : In DBPro this command can take a RGB range of 0,0,0 to 255,255,255.
However, in the GSDK there is a colour reset at 127,127,127
So, 128,128,128 appears black, but 127,127,127 is white

--------------------------------

15. dbLoopMusic ( 1 ); do not loop the mp3 music



--------------------------------

16. Limb problem : Another odd problem was with object limbs. If I make an object limb, and then scale the object, the dbLimbOffsetXYZ() commands don't reflect the scaling. I don't know whether or not they're supposed to, but it confused me when I tried it.



Please report to the community if you send or plan to send any example to Mike, so other people can concentrate in pending issues.

And please remember:

Quote: "Quote: "If anyone else has anything to submit please do so in the next few days"

I think we don't get this proposal very often, so please, everybody review the pending issues!!!"
Mike Johnson
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Posted: 5th Oct 2006 22:35
I don't know what happened to that other thread. Should not have been deleted.
APEXnow
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Posted: 6th Oct 2006 00:19
I was also supprised to see the thread gone. Only a Mod could have done it... supposedly.

@Morcilla, nice job there mate, a few I recognize.

Sephnroth
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Posted: 6th Oct 2006 01:57
i'll try and get some examples together before i goto bed tonight, but im pretty sure of the following:

SetSphereMappingOn() - it seems to be picky about what I can apply it to when it didnt used to be. Its working on my games powerup objects but doing nothing much to my world when i tested it on that.

SetShadingOff() is not disabling sphere mapping from what i can tell. RainbowShading is making things disapear and SetShadingOff() is not causing them to reappear.

this is mainly from memory so i will double check these a bit later tonight and for all those that checkout as broken I will zip and attach the sample code for

VRMan3D
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Posted: 6th Oct 2006 10:39
Heya Morcilla,

Your solar system app is looking very nice indeed. Well done.

As far as dbDisableEscapeKey(), that has always been the behaviour as carried over from DBPro. If you don't put that command in your app, escape will exit it immediately. But with the dbDisableEscapeKey() command, you have to check for esc yourself and exit on your own. ALSO, this provides an optimization to your app (slight) since it's not always checking for escape itself.

Now if only they could fix the ghosting bug.... How long could it take to fix what they broke with that? This has been an integral part of their products for a very long time, I'm surpised it wasn't flagged in testing before the latest gdk release. Could someone please make an incremental update that fixes ghosting? Pretty please? =) Thanks! =) Currently I'm just converting over a couple of my larger DBPro apps to DGDK and hadn't run into all the bugs you found yet, but nice job bringing them to their attention. I was just about to set up fog and shadows again in my 3Desk app... Ack....
As for the objectSize, seems to me that the size returned works just fine - or at least the same way it works in DBPro. If you make a cube then want to stick something on the edge of it, you would take the size divided by 2.0 from the origin of the obj. Still works that way. And seems like that is correct by my calculations. But Maybe I'm outta my tree and off my rocker =) It wouldn't suprise me.

-=VRMan=-

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VRMan3D
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Posted: 6th Oct 2006 11:13
Regarding ghosting and transparency in DGDK (the latest version) I was hoping that perhaps dbSetAlphaMappingOn would temporarily solve my problems. Alas, dbSetAlphaMappingOn seems to be also broken. I'm going to try to attach an image to demonstrate what I mean, since it's easier if you just look at the picture. But here's what happens: You make an object alpha blended transparent with the above command, and it does indeed sort of become transparent, but only the matrix terrain shows through the object (ha ha!) instead of everything like other objects. So in my picture you will see what appears to be a textured block with another block stuck to the edge of it. Instead of seeing the textured block through the alpha blended block, you see what looks like a hole through the textured block, giving you a view of the matrix terrain but not the sides of the textured block. Like I said, a picture is worth a thousand words so check out the pic to see the bug.

Cheers,
-=VRMan=-


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Miguel Melo
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Posted: 6th Oct 2006 11:33
Oh dear... Mike really has got his work cut out with these fixes...

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Posted: 6th Oct 2006 11:47
Thats what they get paid for

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VRMan3D
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Posted: 6th Oct 2006 11:56
Yeah indeed that is what WE pay them for Everytime I look at that picture I snapped it does make me LOL. It would take me a lot of hard work to try and get that effect on purpose hehheh.

I do want to thank you guys for doing all the hard work you do (the developers of DbPro and DgSdK). I used to have to code all this crap in straight C using Dx Retained Mode (blah) or even worse D3d Immediate Mode (mega blah!). So yes, I hope you fix bugs like ghosting and transparency soon, but I just wanted to remind you how much we appreciate it! Keep on keepin' on!

Cheers,
-=VRMan=-

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Posted: 6th Oct 2006 13:28
A bit more testing wouldn't go amiss either...

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Morcilla
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Posted: 6th Oct 2006 21:56 Edited at: 6th Oct 2006 21:57
VRMan3D,

Thanks for your comments.

Ok, then I guess we can forget the EscapeKey issue.

But I tried Object Size with DBPro 5.9 and it returns the same values as DGDK v1.1.1 but different ones than DGDK 1.6.2c :



Has it changed since version 5.9? Then I think there should be a legacy command for compatibility.

Here is the code for DBPro testings (code for DGDK is here, attached in page 1, with the other problems reported):



Quote: "dbSetAlphaMappingOn seems to be also broken"


It is great if we find the hidden problems at this moment, but I Mike asked us for some code. I sent him both (image & code).

I recommend you to provide some sample code to reproduce your image bug.

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APEXnow
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Posted: 6th Oct 2006 23:05
Morcilla, an excellent deductive test with images mate, that's exactly what the bug list needs.

Paul.

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Posted: 7th Oct 2006 01:02
Yeah Morcilla, I'm dealing with exactly the same Size issues in my project. I've resorted to doing VERY funky things with scale instead. In my project, not being able to get the true size on each dimension of a scaled object is a major setback. (I allow the user to scale objects in a very similar fashion to SecondLife if you've ever tried that... So I needed to position 'handle' objects on the sides of the object to be scaled - this was kind of tough without dbObjectSizeX() working.)

What's even worse (and what makes your results even more confusing) is that the current incarnation of the GDK doesn't take into account object scaling AT ALL when you ask for the size of an object. This is really a bummer, but fortunately, like I said, I figured out some formulas to get what I needed by just messing with scale.

Here's a little more detail regarding what you posted above:
Because you are using a Sphere (planets heh) for your tests, it is returning the half the object size. A box will return a full size value. Not sure why they did it that way. The first number you report, Object Size 1: 2.5 - this is the original size, 10, divided by two because of your 50,50,50 scaling, divided by two because who knows why hehheh. So in a way, this is kind of correct if you take into account the sphere returning the radius, not the diameter. Uh ok, I just ran your program and changed the scale to 25 and I get the same number so looks like my wonderful DBPro doesn't take into account scaling either. =(

If you ran the same program with boxes instead I'm pretty sure that it would return a size of 5... OH DEAR, I just tried it and it returns as size of 8.66. Whatever ha ha. I'm running DarkBasicPro 6.2c. And when you Make Box 1, 10,10,10 or Make Cube 1, 10 it's returning a size of 8.66 for the original and the cloned object. Also notably it returns that whether or not you scale it by 50%.

Anyhow, I feel as though your final screenshot of the DGDK 1.6.2c is returning the 'most correct' value of all three. But alas, it's misleading (ha ha), I call it the 'most correct' because in my mind it should be taking into account your 50% scaling of the object, therefore giving you 5.0 for the diameter size (not radius). But it's not taking into account the scaling at all. Instead it's just giving you half of the original size of the sphere. And of course if it were taking into account the scaling of your cloned object, the result shouldn't be 5.0 either.

What might help you out in the meantime, Morcilla, is to use the 'dbObjectSizeX' command. It still doesn't take into account object scaling, but it will return the correct size of your sphere (well 9.99999904633, assuming it's still equally spherical =).

Quote: "I recommend you to provide some sample code to reproduce your image bug. "

I thought of doing that, but since it requres textures to demonstrate (any texture) how do you recommend I do that? (the screenshot is from a massive project) I suppose I could be clever and just make a texture from a screen image grab, but quite honestly I thought the bug was self explanitory = any object that you dbSetAlphaMappingOn, gets screwed up. Any any ghosted object vanishes as you pointed out.

I'm really hoping that they fix the ghosting issues soon. My project is really hurtin' without it.

-=VRMan=-

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VRMan3D
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Posted: 7th Oct 2006 01:41
Cylinders don't have caps?

I guess it's the first time I have used the command dbMakeObjectCylinder to make one.



I tried it in DBPro 6.2 and it doesn't have end caps either so perhaps that's the desired result?



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Posted: 7th Oct 2006 01:44 Edited at: 7th Oct 2006 01:45
I presume it is... And unless the view size is small, I do believe its not being rendered correctly (you should see a bit of the other half of the object).

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VRMan3D
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Posted: 7th Oct 2006 03:06
Well the normals point 'outward' so you wouldn't see the inside of the sides othe cylinder. But the caps are definitely missing. Easy enough for me to make one in Max, but thought I'd point it out.

So is this actually the spot we should be posting bug reports by the way? I found a couple others but if there's a more appropriate thread could you please provide the url HappyDude?

Best regards,
-=VRMan=-

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Morcilla
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Posted: 7th Oct 2006 13:56 Edited at: 7th Oct 2006 13:56
All bug reports should be sent -with code- to Mike Johnson (TGC 3D Developer) in the next few days:

mike@thegamecreators.com

If you have more bugs or not sure, please post some sample code and explain it so other people can get involved.

If there is any media to include, you may pack it together with the code in a .zip file.

Please, report also any mail sent to Mike, so we can concentrate on pending bugs.
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Posted: 7th Oct 2006 19:06
Be good if there is an update soon...

Visit my web site for real bangin' stuff. Word.

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