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Music & Sound FX / Qmidi v2 requests

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chunks chunks
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Posted: 8th Aug 2008 16:54
cool thanks rudolpho

little update .

Ive managed to get control of the windows mixer to do the input levels and such , but there might be a problem ive used the mixer api on xp but i think it`s different on vista .

If that is the case i will have to do the commands with both api`s an put a check for operating system in .

I will test it first as i have vista and xp .

chunks

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Rudolpho
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Posted: 8th Aug 2008 18:19 Edited at: 8th Aug 2008 18:24
Man, why won't they ever fix the sound memblocks??
Converting a sound to a memblock works fine with most files I've tried, but if you're to convert them back, it must be 8bit mono, or the program will crash.

Anyways, I think I'll have to write a plugin for this; the image memblock approach wasn't very quick either.

Here's the code (uncommented though; I hope it's not too unclear)


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Rudolpho
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Posted: 8th Aug 2008 18:31
By the way, here's an application I've been writing on since yesterday. As you can see, it's possible to open and view most files (as well as play them back, using the supplied ridiculously big control buttons). When I was about to start adding actual editing options, it turned out, as I said before, that you can't convert most memblocks back to sounds again

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SoftMotion3D
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Posted: 8th Aug 2008 18:34
Nice! Thats why qmusic v2 crashes if you try to convert memblocks to sounds again......i was wondering why they had to be mono.

That would be cool to rewrite that section
chunks chunks
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Posted: 8th Aug 2008 19:51
nice work rudolpho , wish i was as good as that , well done.

gonna study that tommoro to see if i can get my head round it.

does the app open wav files or is it for show because i can`t seem to load one lol

It`s gonna be one big fat exe with all the plugins lol.

by the way i found a fft peak meter which displays all the freqs looks cool but it shrouded by mfc garbage, i was gonna have a go at deciphering it ,prolly too much for me

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Rudolpho
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Posted: 8th Aug 2008 20:02
Well, it was pretty logical when everything came around, actually.
Just imagine the amplitude as a function of x, where x is ranging from 0 to however many samples there is in the file. Then, just plot a graph using the x and y values

Oh yeah, about opening, you right click in the black area.. maybe not all that obvious

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chunks chunks
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Posted: 8th Aug 2008 20:22
nice work just tried it ,works quite well ,just need to dump dbpro now and do it c++ lol .

we will just have to keep making plugins to give db a rest .

ive been throwing things around today struggling with mixer api getting there though.

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SoftMotion3D
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Posted: 8th Aug 2008 21:58
About the editor:

So far there will be 3 types of music that can be pasted/edited/created into the editor.

1)wav files
2)digital wav instrument files
3)midi

The digital wav files gives off the same idea from v2 where all the tones are recorded to a single file. Then can be used as if it was midi by drawing in notes.

Also with the editing i was thinking of doing 2 views..
1 with music notation
2 with square boxes filled in where the play notes would go. eg.qmusicv2 or v3 used that.

We can use a digital picture for wavs but i think i just need to find the sound sample length and how it would be changed by changing the sounds playback speed.

Unless we can edit the actual wav sound data maby we should just leave it to a pre drawn one?

Unless you guys think its easy to do? Just seems like more and more code we will have to keep adding.

Anyways i hope to have qmidi v2 working this weekend.

It will at least be midi playback ready......wavs will come soon.

I will provide a screenshot once again and maby a downloadable test try out.....to see what should get changed and stuff.....will need input
SoftMotion3D
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Posted: 9th Aug 2008 06:53 Edited at: 9th Aug 2008 06:54
Here is a screen shot of it loading 1 of rudolphos tracked songs.

Take not that when a song is loaded it displays the copyright box info before editing.

Each bar is the length of 64 note positions.

By default it loads into chunks that big....but with the editor you will be able to split them into smaller chunks and even just save chunks.

Also if you havent noticed ... it shows 3 pages at a time 64*3 notes on a page.....when you scroll over it goes over by 64 notes at a time.

more updates to follow on the progress

Oh! Also you will be able to move those chunks around and they will stay playing as the same instrument.

Also when you selevt a chunk you can go into full screen editing on it

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Rudolpho
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Posted: 9th Aug 2008 17:30
Sounds all good
Do you mean that we can have up to 1/64:th notes now then?
That would really be good in such an event

Maybe it's name should be changed, if it is in fact only halfly midi-based too?

Also, I'm trying to work out some sort of wave handling using C++ (it's hilariously bothersome to do just the smallest thing in there...)
I think I'm about to get the hang of the wave file format by now anyways.

You guys don't happen to know how to access DBPro's memblocks from a plugin by the way?
That would probably be very helpful.

Lol, you're hardly going to be able to call this "a midi composer programmed in DBPro" any longer, Sheldon.

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Rudolpho
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Posted: 9th Aug 2008 17:58
Oh yeah, by the way chunks, the blockAlign member of the waveformat structure is the size (in bytes) of one sample in the stream. That is, if we have 2 channels, then two samples must be processed at the same time and hence this value is (channels * bitsPerSample) / 8.
Just thought that we should have that cleared up, finally

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chunks chunks
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Posted: 9th Aug 2008 22:09 Edited at: 9th Aug 2008 22:22
i used a sdk by Aaron Miller to access db`s commands ,but i am unsure how you would access the data in memblocks from within c++.


The sdk i used uses load libary to get into the db`s dlls.

well cleared up.

I`ll do a little sneaking see if i can get somthing working .

by the way does the compiler you use have load libary.


try this header it allows you to access all the dbpro commands.

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Rudolpho
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Posted: 9th Aug 2008 23:15
Ah, I see.
But that just wraps the DBPro functions (as far as I can tell), so basically, calling the same functions, it would take almost the same time as doing it from DBPro, no?
I had more imagined to create a memory block within C (which I assume would be rather quicker than from DBPro, even if the DB memblock commands are very fast) and then just point a DB memblock to this. But I'll test around a bit with the sdk, and we'll see

I assume that load library is the same as link it? In such case, yes.


For my part, I've been looking through how to play a wave file from within C++. After reading tutorials on a really low level (sending the data yourself to a waveOut device) for countless hours, I'm.... tired and well, hardly the wiser. :/
I guess I'll go back to just trying to extract information and, if possible, edit the data and let DBPro do the playing, after all

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chunks chunks
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Posted: 9th Aug 2008 23:42 Edited at: 9th Aug 2008 23:50
playing wav`s isn`t too bad with directsound i did a plugin before to do this but never released it, now my damn laptop broken iv`e lost it .

wasn`t too difficult though , you load the wav`s in with the multimedia file in out commands and send them to direct sound buffer to be played or manipulated.

what would work is if we could retreive the dbpro`s sound buffer ,as i believe it uses direct sound for wavs then you you would have access to the data for use in c++.

it might be worthwhile looking through the sounddebug.dll to see if it gives a function to get the buffer.



Edit..

i found these exported functions in the sound dll which might be of use.

?GetSoundBuffer@@YAPAUIDirectSound3DBuffer@@H@Z
?GetSoundData@@YAXHPAK00PAPAD0_NPAUtWAVEFORMATEX@@@Z
?GetSoundInterface@@YAPAUIDirectSound8@@XZ

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Rudolpho
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Posted: 10th Aug 2008 00:16
Sounds interresting. Keep on investigating
DirectSound is something from directX?

I tried to use the windows api to create an audio stream, which wasn't too easy. But it just occurred to me that the tutorials I found all was about streaming from the harddrive; it must be a lot simpler to just load the whole thing into memory at once (I don't think DBP does any audio streaming either, right?)

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chunks chunks
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Posted: 10th Aug 2008 00:33 Edited at: 10th Aug 2008 00:51
yes its in the directx sdk , the code i used before loaded it into memory for playback , i will post a few snippets from the sdk docs if you don`t have it.

the getsounddata function looks promising looks like it fills the waveformatex struct .
edit..

ive been looking through the gdk includes and found this its usually same for dbpro .

void dbGetSoundData ( int iID, DWORD* dwBitsPerSecond, DWORD* Frequency, DWORD* Duration, LPSTR* pData, DWORD* dwDataSize, bool bLockData, WAVEFORMATEX* wfx );


void dbSetSoundData ( int iID, DWORD dwBitsPerSecond, DWORD Frequency, DWORD Duration, LPSTR pData, DWORD dwDataSize, WAVEFORMATEX wfx );

this means you can probably load the sound in c++ do your stuff then
set it to a loaded sound in dbpro and visa versa .

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SoftMotion3D
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Posted: 10th Aug 2008 18:55
Hey chunks..... here is your recording dll

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SoftMotion3D
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Posted: 10th Aug 2008 18:56
Also it may need this to work ?

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Rudolpho
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Posted: 10th Aug 2008 20:50
@chunks: Sure, some snippets would be nice.

I've spent quite some time on a dll that currently can retrieve the wave info without actually loading it in and convert it to a memblock first. I eventually needed a break from the continuos stream of error messages and silent crashes though, and decided to use QMidi to track David Bowie's The Man Who Sold The World.
It went rather well, I dare say

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nojbox87
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Posted: 10th Aug 2008 23:33
Hi there.

I requested this on the other thread that was for this program and thought i should mention it here. Could V2 have the ability to print sheet music? It would be greatly appreaciated if you could

Jon

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SoftMotion3D
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Posted: 11th Aug 2008 19:07
yes it will be able to print sheets
chunks chunks
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Posted: 11th Aug 2008 23:26 Edited at: 12th Aug 2008 00:02
I have made some headway with retrieving dbpro`s sound data from within a plugin c++ .

The attached file contains the plugin test source c++ , plugin, dbpro project .

basically it means you can load a sound in dbpro retrieve the sound data , do some magic in c++ then set it back to a dbpro sound,if it works. you should be able to do this the other way round too.


in the dbpro project i managed to get the datasize and it matches

get memblock size()-28.

anyways rudolpho have a look see if you can make it usefull.

be sure to check the new functions in the dbcommands header.

also found these links for low level audio.


http://bcbjournal.org/articles/vol2/9807/Low-level_wave_audio__Part_I.htm
http://bcbjournal.org/articles/vol2/9808/Low-level_wave_audio__part_2.htm

http://bcbjournal.org/articles/vol2/9810/Low-level_wave_audio__part_3.htm

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SoftMotion3D
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Posted: 12th Aug 2008 06:09 Edited at: 12th Aug 2008 06:10
hey guys check out my 20 liner game....lol...its funny.


http://forum.thegamecreators.com/?m=forum_view&t=128056&b=11


download from my last post in there.....the first ones are older versions.
chunks chunks
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Posted: 12th Aug 2008 18:11 Edited at: 12th Aug 2008 18:13
more news, iv done some code to retrieve a dbpro sounds data + you can retrieve all the info in the waveformatex structure .

the dbgetsounddata command stores the sample data as lpstr so u can mess with it in c++ then use dbsetsounddata to put it back into db.

instead of the dbcommands header you can use load libary to load the sound dll.

anyway the code shows a function to retrieve the duration of a wav + commented out the code to get the data from waveformatex.



thanks chunks

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Rudolpho
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Posted: 12th Aug 2008 23:36
Well, I've got a lot to do these days, but I'll try to look into it as soon as I can. Seems like good work anyways, chunks

Also, I had an issue trying to read a dword from a file and then returning it to DBPro... for some reason, the return is a number so large it can't even fit in a dword
(Stranger still, when reduced to three, two and finally just one byte, the value did change slightly, but still remained at around 60 billion).
You don't happen to know what was up with this, do you?

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chunks chunks
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Posted: 13th Aug 2008 02:04
not a clue ,is there any tricks you know how to do in c++ now we can retrieve this info eg permanent effects ,amplitude ,compression and such ,im no good at that stuff it boggles my mind lol.

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Rudolpho
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Posted: 13th Aug 2008 14:20
Hm... I guess a reverb effect could be simulated by XOR:ing a linear or exponential (better) decrease of the last 10 000 or so samples to the current one... that probably doesn't sound very clear, it's hard to explain...

Assume that we have a 44.1KHz wave file and want a reverb that lasts two seconds. We would then have to go through something like


That code probably won't work at all, but I think that principle might work

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chunks chunks
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Posted: 14th Aug 2008 01:08
some code to load the file in c++ then set it into dbpro



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qfactor
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Posted: 14th Aug 2008 03:45
Hi,

Regarding Qmidi wishlist, would it be possible to support SoundFont format (.sf2)?

Q
Aaron Miller
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Posted: 14th Aug 2008 09:07
About my SDK: dbGetMemblockPtr() is how you would access a memblock's pointer directly. From there it would be MUCH faster to do the handling in C/C++. I'll be trying to release another SDK soon with some higher-level templates which actually use components of DirectX such as DirectInput (My input plugin uses that) and Direct3D and wraps them in classes. They are actually faster than DBPro's commands.

Now - as for QMidi, will you please add the following timing features? Instead of tempo only (Choose between) NOTES PER SECOND or TEMPO. And, if possible, allow some way to see at what point in time a particular note will play. (What millisecond, what minute, what second).

Also, really quickly, does anyone happen to know how many notes play per second at a tempo of 200? What algorithm would I use to find this notes-per-second value for any tempo? Thanks.

I'll be searching google as well, but I figured I'd ask here in case that fails.

Cheers,

-naota

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Rudolpho
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Posted: 14th Aug 2008 10:57
@qfactor: Maybe, but probably not. I'll try to look into it quickly and try to determine whether it would be possible, but probably, you'd need something VST like to do that, unless your soundcard supports it on it's own.

@Aaron: Ah, thanks

Now as I recall, QMidi's tempo setting isn't actually in BPM (which points to how many quarter notes passes per minute; in other words you have 4 times this value per 1/16:th note, the shortest duration QM can currently handle).
I think that QMidi instead sleeps for 500 - tempo * 2 between each one of these 1/16:th notes, or bars, if you like to refer to it that way.

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Aaron Miller
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Posted: 14th Aug 2008 12:57
Milliseconds I assume? Thank you, btw.

Main reason why I ask is because I've decided to make one custom GH song and it's difficult to get the timing down right.

Cheers,

-naota

I'm not a dictator to those that do stuff for me by will. Only those who don't.
SoftMotion3D
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Posted: 14th Aug 2008 17:01
Yeah! qmidi vr 2 is going to be set on beats per minute just to make things easier.

I also have a new idea for v2 that will allow a user to apply effect scripts to a track. Eg. like a programing script that could tell the editor to make modifications to the tracks volume/modulation/echo...blending you name it.

what do you think?
Rudolpho
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Posted: 14th Aug 2008 20:03
Yep, milliseconds (would be rather slow with minutes, don't you think? )

@Sheldon: I suppose that could really come in handy, BUT it should really be a "manageable" script or whatever you call it.
That is, they work like insert modules and have an interface, so that they can be used, saved and shared with other users.
This kind of feature is in the Kontakt sampler, for instance.
Sibelius has a similiar feature, allthough those scripts (or rather plugins) isn't directly editable in the program itself.

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Aaron Miller
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Posted: 14th Aug 2008 20:05
@Rudolpho
I meant minute/second/millisecond notation-wise. I millisecond of 1378992 isn't that clear

@SMD_3D Interactive
Keep up the good work.

Cheers,

-naota

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chunks chunks
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Posted: 14th Aug 2008 20:14
@ rudolpho

how would you do calculations on wav data when the data type is LPSTR im still a c++ newbie,i know i would prolly have to cast it,but i don`t know how .

thanks chunks

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Rudolpho
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Posted: 14th Aug 2008 20:44
@Aaron: I was just joking

@Chunks: I'm probably a bigger newbie myself
They discourage it's use everywhere, but most of the time, reinterpret_cast <char*>(&dwordVariable) works.
But who knows, maybe that's why I get these phoney large numbers too...

I've got a question for you as well: you don't happen to have the ASIO sdk, do you?
I've tried registering at Steinberg.com twice, but it just gives me an error message when I try to log in, even though I've got e-mail verifications and everything

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chunks chunks
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Posted: 14th Aug 2008 21:21 Edited at: 14th Aug 2008 21:22
i did on mi lappy but its gone i will try to get it for ya , thanks

Its very complicated but a good asset just like vst though no decent examples .

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Rudolpho
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Posted: 14th Aug 2008 22:16
Thanks
Yeah, but then again, what isn't complicated when it comes to this?

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chunks chunks
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Posted: 14th Aug 2008 22:26
same for me i cant sign in either + i made a new account i`ll have a search to see if i can get it elsewhere

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Rudolpho
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Posted: 14th Aug 2008 23:35
Very annoying. You'd think they would notice and fix that, should it be an overall flaw
Well, thanks for helping me search
It seems to be very hard to come by though; every site I've seen this far just refers to steinberg's.

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SoftMotion3D
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Posted: 15th Aug 2008 00:08
rudolpho....question?

Have you ever tried qmusic v2?

im thinking we should just integrate qmidi with that and we should be good.... maby with a few more options of coarse...

qmusic is in the threads some where maby on the second page or so.

the only problem was that it only supported 16 bit mono recordings for the memblock stuff.

but maby i can do some mods to that format and get away from using the mono wavs to stereo.

Im going to overhaul the look of v2 again...i will have a screen shot soon.
Aaron Miller
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Posted: 15th Aug 2008 04:19 Edited at: 15th Aug 2008 05:51
@Rudolpho
Oh. Sorry it was about 2:30AM or 3:00AM when I said that, was a bit tired.

EDIT
Okay, I'm having a little trouble figuring out the tempo thing. What tempo in QMIDI would be right for having exactly 16 notes played per second? I've been trying to figure out the algorithm but I'm really not good at math. Thanks for all the help.

Cheers,

-naota

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SoftMotion3D
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Posted: 15th Aug 2008 19:16
16 NOTES PER SECOND?!!

Thats crazy fast....i dont think qmidi can run thet fast?

lets calc that out....

well 220 will give you 16.6 a second
well 219 will give you 16.129 a second

so you probably want to go with 219 .....and yes its crazy fast!

you could almost make sound effects at that speed....

also you need a faster computer for that speed to operate properly.
make sure you have downloaded the latest upgrade of v1 since it runs a bit faster.
SoftMotion3D
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Posted: 15th Aug 2008 19:18
oh to calc that out here ya go


1000/(500-(tempo*2)) gives you notes per second
(1000/(500-(tempo*2)))*60 gives you beats per minute
Aaron Miller
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Posted: 15th Aug 2008 19:43
Thank you very much SMD_3D

I wouldn't actually be playing 16 notes per second rather playing a few notes per second. And about the slower computer issues - I can record it to a WAV file (SO glad you built that into QMidi).

Oh btw, about the sound effects check these out.

Cheers,

-naota

I'm not a dictator to those that do stuff for me by will. Only those who don't.

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Aaron Miller
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Posted: 15th Aug 2008 19:43
And one more.

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SoftMotion3D
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Location: Calgary,Alberta
Posted: 16th Aug 2008 05:40
hey i updated the editor for everyone

(this has a few minor glitch fixes i found and allows the tempo to go to 250 (the fastest your computer can process it)

Also has most of the songs made so far in this download.....for those that cant use qmidi online.

have fun......


http://www.jeku.com/sheldon/qmidiv1r1.zip
Aaron Miller
18
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 25th Feb 2006
Playing: osu!
Posted: 16th Aug 2008 12:34
@SMD_3D
In one of your old versions my computer processed it at a tempo of about 400 just fine.

As for the 250 tempo THANK YOU. I find that useful when doing sound effects.

And of course, thank you very much for QMidi.

Cheers,

-naota

I'm not a dictator to those that do stuff for me by will. Only those who don't.
flickenmaste
16
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 2nd May 2008
Location:
Posted: 17th Aug 2008 00:41
techno sounds so i can make techno!!!!


[url=http://userbarmaker.com/][img]

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