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Geek Culture / 19 year old kid locked up in jail for sarcastic joke.

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Dark Java Dude 64
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Posted: 10th Jul 2013 04:48 Edited at: 10th Jul 2013 04:49
As of now, I think the US is going too far to prevent terrorism and the like. Yes, terrorist crimes are large and public, but the reality is, we live in a pretty screwed up world. Is it really worth it to take measures like arresting people and jailing them for half a year because of a threatening joke they posted somewhere online just so that we can prevent more things like 9/11, the Boston Bombing, and other things such as school shootings? Call me an evil person, but I don't think so. It would seem likely to me that if before 9/11 a thing like this were to be said online, technology permitting, he would have gotten a mere warning at most. One could argue the terrorists are winning right now because they're causing us to pull into our cowardly shell. Again, call me evil, but I think we are trying too hard to prevent mass crimes. They're going to happen, and when they do, they'll be bad. That's just the way it is. In school, they always taught us that you're innocent until proven guilty. Where did that go? Yeah, maybe they are guilty of posting a threat even if they were joking or being sarcastic, but I think any reasonable person would agree that they didn't do anything morally deserved of jail time.
easter bunny
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Posted: 10th Jul 2013 04:59 Edited at: 10th Jul 2013 05:02
edit: this wasn't a response the DbD79, so please don't take it as one.

If the police didn't arrest him, and the next day, he did what he said he'd do, whose fault would it be?

Obviously, even if there was the remotest chance that he was serious,[even though he said he was kidding], they should bring him in, which they did.
But, after they ascertained that he was innocent, they should've freed him. Plain and simple.

My verdict: They were right to lock him up, they were wrong to keep him locked up for 6 months.

Dark Java Dude 64
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Posted: 10th Jul 2013 05:03
I agree with what you said pretty closely. Nothing at all wrong with interrogating the person to find their true intentions.

Pretty much the logic used by authorities in this case is something along the lines of, "Oh he said something that makes him a potential terrorist? GIVE HIM JAIL FOR SIX MONTHS YEEAAAHH WE HAVE LOTS OF POWER MUAHAHAHAHA"
rolfy
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Posted: 10th Jul 2013 05:50 Edited at: 10th Jul 2013 05:58
IF he actually said he was joking and IF he was cleared of any intent to do what he said, then he should be given access to a lawyer and any good lawyer would have him back on the streets in a matter of days.
The real issue here is how you can be held indefinitely if terrorism is suspected, so welcome to the world as it is now where intent can be interpreted as terrorism and all rights are rescinded, this kid was held without trial. I am not sure he has even been convicted of anything yet.
This power is abused all over the States and UK with even five year olds being handcuffed and escorted out of school for being unruly. Abuse of power is nothing new and there are repercussions for those that abuse it, albeit too late for those on the receiving end. However saying what he did he had to be incarcerated till they are satisfied he isn't a threat and these things take a lot of time when your only 19 and have no previous, he was an idiot for saying what he did and is paying the price, but he was the one who said it and far as I am concerned it's better he be locked away than take the chance he would go through with it.

Six months may seem like a long time but anyone dealing with authority will know how long it takes to get them to do what's required, whatever it is. I suspect there is more to this and if anyone is answerable, himself or authority then the publicity around it should ensure its appropriately dealt with, meantime I can only agree he be held as he has. Till we have full facts, then I might feel outraged at the injustice if he is proven innocent and it was known from the start, I wouldn't want to risk anyone's kids lives on the strength of HE said it was just a joke and I have seen nothing in print saying he even did. Only his parents, which is understandable but not exactly convincing.
Libervurto
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Posted: 10th Jul 2013 06:55
I can't quite believe the warped logic and paranoia of some people's comments here. A vague post on facebook is not a signal of intent. He made no direct threat to anyone, I don't know how they can even hold him legally! What are they charging him with? "Conspiracy to possibly murder some kids at some place at some time"? It's laughable! Whether or not he said "jk lol" is irrelevant, there is no crime here.

I can't imagine being in fear of making a joke, no matter how dark, because I might be arrested. Whoever said "it's like walking into an airport and joking about having a bomb" it really isn't, there is a gargantuan chasm of context there! The equivalent to that would be if he had posted his message on a school's facebook page.

I'm shocked that some otherwise intelligent people are defending such blatant tyranny. Your arguments of "he should have known better", and such, are straight out of an Orwellian nightmare. "Toe the party line or you are an enemy of the state."
easter bunny
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Posted: 10th Jul 2013 07:50 Edited at: 10th Jul 2013 07:52
Quote: ""it's like walking into an airport and joking about having a bomb" it really isn't"

sort of true, it's much easier to tell if someone's serious in reality than in the cyber world (facial expressions etc).

but in the cyber world, if I said something like this:
I can ride a unicycle lol jk not really.
You would probably believe me, actually, that was a lie, I can ride a unicycle.


Because there was the slight chance he was serious, the police didn't really have a choice did they??
If the police didn't arrest him and the next day, 97 kids were murdered by a cannibalistic psycho, and the police knew it might happen.......

like I said before, I'm not going to repeat it.

Kevin Picone
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Libervurto
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Posted: 10th Jul 2013 08:36
Quote: "Because there was the slight chance he was serious, the police didn't really have a choice did they??
If the police didn't arrest him and the next day, 97 kids were murdered by a cannibalistic psycho, and the police knew it might happen..."

No. That is the same as saying everyone is a potential criminal so they should be under constant surveillance. Should the police investigate every case when someone jokingly says, "I'll kill you!"? (I don't know about America but in the UK that is a common thing to say if someone has embarrassed you or something like that.)

What the kid said is not grounds for the police to suspect him of planning to commit a crime.
Dark Java Dude 64
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Posted: 10th Jul 2013 09:07 Edited at: 10th Jul 2013 09:21
You make a really good point. Here in the US, "I will kill you" isn't exactly common but is said, although many hyper sensitive people enjoy getting offended over such things. However, no one goes to jail over it, but honestly, that might change soon at the current rate...
easter bunny
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Posted: 10th Jul 2013 09:25
Well, I've not doubt that if you jokingly said to a judge that you'd kill him directly after he sentenced you to 3 years, he'd give you another few

But it is a good point, though there's still the issue of saying it online where it's harder to decide if it's joking or not......

Seppuku Arts
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Posted: 10th Jul 2013 09:47 Edited at: 10th Jul 2013 09:49
Quote: "Who decides it\\\'s a threat a joke or sarcasm...you or the customer? You forgot to mention you would most likely be arrested and face charges if you got all cathartic on customers...would you view this as unfair if you were only joking?."


I don\\\'t think it\\\'d be likely if i was joking with the customer. If i said something like the last customer was a whiny git who deserves to be shot in the head. It would be inappropriate and my boss might give me a telling off but hardly a jailable offence.

As for threat vs sarcasm, context plays a big part. An angry customer shouting, swearing, name calling suddenly making violent remarks would clearly indicate threat.

We can look at the context of this guy in the news and see that he was joking, should there be doubt, yes he could be interviewed and they could try to find evidence to see if he\\\'s serious, but as far as I can see no evidence suggests this.

All he\\\'s done is made a comment that\\\'s made him suspicious of a potential crime. I don\\\'t see how it\\\'s a punishable offense.

If the abusive customer I had kept calling and harrassing us, I\\\'d understand. When I told him I don\\\'t tolerate threats he actually stopped and later apologised. He might not have meant it, he might have been charged for an offense if we wanted to, but 6 months in prison would be too much, I would expect something like a fine.

I\\\'ve seen people in the UK say worse things than the kid on LoL and not be considered a threat.

Quik
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Posted: 10th Jul 2013 09:52
Quote: "Because there was the slight chance he was serious, the police didn't really have a choice did they??
If the police didn't arrest him and the next day, 97 kids were murdered by a cannibalistic psycho, and the police knew it might happen......."



I am quite sure that there's better ways to handle it. Is it really the only solution to this, to throw a kid in jail - without trial, without looking into the matter more? they knew what was going on - go to his house, look for suspisious stuff - go to the school - be prepared if something were to happen - there's LOTS of other ways to handle this.

In this case, in my opinion, it just seems like the police took the lazy route.



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Dark Frager
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Posted: 10th Jul 2013 09:56
Quote: "it just seems like the police took the lazy route."


This.

Come on now. We're all human beings with a working brain. If you're gonna throw someone in jail, just because you can, even after you've done numerous investigations then that's just proving the police(or federal system whatever it's called) is messed up, since they are wasting and stealing 6 months of someone's life. Surely that's more of a punishable offense than making a silly joke on the internet?

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easter bunny
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Posted: 10th Jul 2013 10:18
Quote: "I am quite sure that there's better ways to handle it. Is it really the only solution to this, to throw a kid in jail - without trial, without looking into the matter more? they knew what was going on - go to his house, look for suspisious stuff - go to the school - be prepared if something were to happen - there's LOTS of other ways to handle this."


actually, agreed, I didn't mean arrest, I really just meant look into it.

MrValentine
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Posted: 10th Jul 2013 10:55 Edited at: 10th Jul 2013 10:56
Quote: "Come on now. We're all human beings with a working brain. If you're gonna throw someone in jail, just because you can, even after you've done numerous investigations then that's just proving the police(or federal system whatever it's called) is messed up, since they are wasting and stealing 6 months of someone's life. Surely that's more of a punishable offense than making a silly joke on the internet?"
[EDIT WEIRD ISSUE WITH QUOTE BLOCK]

^ This

I had a class mate who was locked up for several months without even as much as a trial [as far as I know... I do not have the full picture] I was no longer at the college at the time [I got bored of the drunk tutor] anyway I got a phone call one day from a prison, for some reason he felt he needed to call me [Probably because he borrowed me his entire music collection of Asian music CD's] and anyway the point of the story he was jailed because of his finger prints being found on a dodgy credit card some 'gang' [not stating ethnicity for compliance] were counterfeiting and such, the story he gave me was a car drove up to him and they passed him something during a quick conversation as such and he made the mistake of grabbing whatever it was... an honest mistake but there you go... and as a result he missed out on his PAID FOR education of several thousand pounds/dollars... so, he missed out on a lot, went back home [He was a foreign student] and I never heard from him again since about 2005-6 however I got in touch with him in the last year [was sifting through my email contacts to try a clean-up and as it happens I came across his email and sent him a message] and he is working in a very nice place and dating a lovely girl... so happy ending and he is doing ok, but the authorities ruined his life as far as I am concerned... so not just a case of a short amount of time, but a lifelong effect for not looking deeper at the facts...

I can fully understand why people have issues with Authority and such but it pains ever more when they make simplistic mess-ups where a simple IF/ENDIF would easily bring the conclusion of a false CASE/ENDCASE...

Anyway I was only going to tag myself in to this thread just to keep track as it is quite interesting, but then I read the above and it reminded me of my poor class mate as mentioned already...

Regarding the OP and general profile of this thread, I did not read the article and as such cannot really comment, hence I shall just continue reading the remainder of this thread as it goes on...

Sorry for the long post but there you go...

Cornflakes anybody? [Kellogg's and all too]



Thraxas
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Posted: 10th Jul 2013 14:57
Quote: "I reworded the post to less hostily demonstrate my opinion on the matter. Once again, I'm sorry if I offended you.
"


I wasn't offended

Unfortunately for this guy it seems he's the one who is going to get he punishment to set the tone for what is and isn't acceptable. There has to be a first. Anyone can try to defend what he said as joke or as sarcasm but it fails on both counts.

It wasn't funny. Perhaps I'm too old but even when I was younger I wouldn't have thought a "joke" like this was funny. Or even have defended a friend who thought it was funny.

By agreeing with this I'm not giving up my freedoms. I'm not so naive as to think that I'm truly free.
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Posted: 10th Jul 2013 15:17
Thraxas: Would you agree though, that the matter could have been handled better?

I can see though, that i might have viewed this differently, if i lived somewhere where I was actually in danger of this kind of stuff happening, i mean - the closest to terrorist attack in sweden the last few years, has been a failed suicide bomb attempt.. it may very well be that I feel too safe, and thus my views are skewed



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Matty H
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Posted: 10th Jul 2013 15:24
There is no way someone should be locked up for saying words. I am really surprised how people are ok with this, being stupid and saying stupid stuff is not a crime.

That said, if the police had to investigate this then he should be prosecuted for wasting police time, or if the police found some evidence then he should be prosecuted for planning a crime.

There was a similar case in the UK when someone jokingly said they were going to blow up an airport, celebrities like Stephen Fry had to back him and the stupidity of the whole thing was eventually realised by most.

KeithC
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Posted: 10th Jul 2013 16:38 Edited at: 10th Jul 2013 16:46
My feelings are a bit mixed on the issue.

On the one hand; the guy (19 years old, and fully accountable adult) made a VERY distasteful and hurtful comment, especially in light of recent events over the years. Even as a joke (and apparently, the "lol, j/k" bit isn't solid), it's sick and twisted. Sure; we have all said things such as "I'm gonna kill that guy" or "I would kill for this thing". But how many of us have said "I'm gonna kill a bunch of little children and eat their hearts", even as a joke?

People can cry all they want about free speech; but there are limits. When you cause someone else harm (emotionally, career-wise, etc.), you've crossed the line. Free speech doesn't give you the right to do harm to others (think about the Westborough Baptist idiots). Would you say what you say on the internet, to someone's face? You can say what you want in life; but there are ramifications for it. There always will be. Whether you agree with that or not is irrelevant, when someone finds out where you live and shows up at your doorstep.

This is why I feel that people who hide behind keyboards, while badmouthing others, are cowards. They would NEVER say anything derogatory to people's faces, for fear of having their teeth pushed through their skull; or in worse case scenarios, a gun shoved in their face.

We don't know the full story (I know; the news is always right, and up to date (sarcasm)) yet. You guys also seem to have little knowledge as to the process here regarding jailing, versus imprisonment. People spend varying amount of time sitting in a jail cell awaiting trial. It's impossible to give someone a trial right off the streets. This is how it works; some even sit in jail for a year or more while awaiting trial (there are only a certain number of judges in a courthouse, and others are in line to be seen).

My personal opinion (having been a Corrections Officer at a Medium to High security State Prison for going on 6 years), is that prison will do nothing for this guy (if it's true he has no previous record). I see what this place does to people, and they don't come out a better person (for the most part, there are exceptions). It's all about survival there. Many of the people here (judging by your postings over the years) wouldn't make it past the first week, without locking up for protection. Gangs are all around me inside; many come from Detroit or Flint (which happen to be number 1 and 2 for murder in the entire U.S.). This guy would probably end up getting sliced up his first week there (they usually cut you with a razor from your ear to your chin, deep enough to go through your entire cheek...that way you can't hide it later with clothing, you'll be marked forever). Anything that has to do with harming children is the lowest form, in an inmate's eyes.

In my opinion; the police did the right thing, in lieu of what's been happening in our Country. A few decades ago would have been different. However; I think once his trial happens, time already served, a bit of community service and a court-appointed therapist should be it. I don't think prison time will be in his future.

Whatever the outcome may be; this is definitely a precedent-setting case.

Quote: "i mean - the closest to terrorist attack in sweden the last few years, has been a failed suicide bomb attempt"


Didn't you guys just a few years ago, have a man walk up and gun down numerous people on an island? Youths at a retreat, I believe.

Also; for those interested, there's a thread over at PC discussing this issue: http://www.polycount.com/forum/forumdisplay.php?f=41&order=desc&page=2

-Keith

Quik
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Posted: 10th Jul 2013 17:02
Quote: "Didn't you guys just a few years ago, have a man walk up and gun down numerous people on an island? Youths at a retreat, I believe."


not in sweden - in a neighbouring country. I was meaning specifically in my country - of course, i have been somewhat scared at stuff happening in finland (school shootings) and that specific event - because it is so close to heart.



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KeithC
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Posted: 10th Jul 2013 17:31
Ah; my mistake then. I looked it up; 85 people killed on an Island in Norway.

-Keith

Quik
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Posted: 10th Jul 2013 17:36
Think we already had a discussion about that, back then here, watched quite a few documentries about it at school - it was quite a ruckus here about it - understandably so, I mean - we get news about US all the time, but... it doesnt really hit - because of how far away it is - making it feel.. detached, not really meaningful to my situtation - however, whenever something like that happens.. it's a big deal.



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Libervurto
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Posted: 10th Jul 2013 17:54 Edited at: 10th Jul 2013 17:59
Quote: "Sure; we have all said things such as "I'm gonna kill that guy" or "I would kill for this thing". But how many of us have said "I'm gonna kill a bunch of little children and eat their hearts", even as a joke?"

That is very literal-minded. The guy was obviously saying the most absurdly awful thing he could imagine, and he though he'd made it absurd enough that no one could possibly take him seriously.

Quote: "This is why I feel that people who hide behind keyboards, while badmouthing others, are cowards. They would NEVER say anything derogatory to people's faces, for fear of having their teeth pushed through their skull; or in worse case scenarios, a gun shoved in their face."

This could be interpreted as a threat, a sign that you are a potentially dangerous and violent criminal/terrorist and should be locked up in case you harm someone.

Quote: "I think once his trial happens, time already served, a bit of community service and a court-appointed therapist should be it."

He has already been assaulted several times, he is due compensation not a sentence.

I don't buy this "better safe than free" attitude. If the police had done nothing and he had gone and killed 97 kids and... yes, eaten their still-beating hearts, () then when this facebook post was inevitably brought up the police would simply explain that he made no direct threats and there was no reason to suppose that he literally meant what he was saying. The police can't be expected to investigate every single dubious comment on the internet.

Quote: "a VERY distasteful and hurtful comment"

Maybe so, but do we really need to lock people up for insensitivity?

Quote: "Anyone can try to defend what he said as joke or as sarcasm but it fails on both counts. "

How exactly does it fail? What crime has he committed?

Quote: "It wasn't funny. Perhaps I'm too old but even when I was younger I wouldn't have thought a "joke" like this was funny. Or even have defended a friend who thought it was funny."

If telling unfunny jokes was a crime my Dad would be serving life!

If only he had used sarcastrophes this whole misunderstanding could have been avoided.
Correct punctuation saves lives.
xplosys
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Posted: 10th Jul 2013 18:06
@KeithC

Thanks for shedding some light on this from an inside perspective. This guy is in jail awaiting trial, not convicted and doing prison time without due process as some of you seem to suggest. Of course, that does make it more interesting and when you're run by emotions as opposed to reality, much more fun to talk about. There's really not anything that unusual going on here.

It's common for those accused of a crime to be in jail awaiting trial. It's just the media circus, doing a good job of tugging at your heart strings that makes this so controversial. And has been mentioned already, if you lived in a community that has been devastated by an event recently, you might have different "feelings" on the matter.

For those of you who see no difference between "I'll kill you!" and what this guy said, I don't know what to tell you. Perhaps more life experience will help you see it.

Brian.

I am the underground.
KeithC
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Posted: 10th Jul 2013 18:22
Quote: "The guy was obviously saying the most absurdly awful thing he could imagine, and he though he'd made it absurd enough that no one could possibly take him seriously."


The individual who killed all those children at Sandy Hook had no prior history, and (until it was later revealed) had no mental health history (that was public). Yet this individual went on a killing spree, taking out our most vulnerable.

You don't know this person; you do not know what he was thinking. You are making assumptions yourself.

Quote: "This could be interpreted as a threat, a sign that you are a potentially dangerous and violent criminal/terrorist and should be locked up in case you harm someone. "


You seem to interpret things as you see fit, don't you? I've noticed this pattern with you on various threads.

Quote: "How exactly does it fail? What crime has he committed?"


As quoted in another thread/site:

Quote: "Texas Penal Code as applied to this case:

Terroristic Threat:
(a) A person commits an offense if he threatens to commit any offense involving violence to any person or property with intent to
(5) place the public or a substantial group of the public in fear of serious bodily injury
(e) An offense under Subsection (a)(4), (a)(5), or (a)(6) is a felony of the third degree.

(a) An individual adjudged guilty of a felony of the third degree shall be punished by imprisonment in the Texas Department of Criminal Justice for any term of not more than 10 years or less than 2 years.
(b) In addition to imprisonment, an individual adjudged guilty of a felony of the third degree may be punished by a fine not to exceed $10,000.


Assault:
(a) A person commits an offense if the person:
(2) intentionally or knowingly threatens another with imminent bodily injury
(c) An offense under Subsection (a)(2) or (3) is a Class C misdemeanor

An individual adjudged guilty of a Class C misdemeanor shall be punished by a fine not to exceed $500.

Harassment:
(a) A person commits an offense if, with intent to harass, annoy, alarm, abuse, torment, or embarrass another, he:
(1) initiates communication by telephone, in writing, or by electronic communication and in the course of the communication makes a comment, request, suggestion, or proposal that is obscene;
(2) threatens, by telephone, in writing, or by electronic communication, in a manner reasonably likely to alarm the person receiving the threat, to inflict bodily injury on the person or to commit a felony against the person, a member of his family or household, or his property;
(c) An offense under this section is a Class B misdemeanor.

An individual adjudged guilty of a Class B misdemeanor shall be punished by:
(1) a fine not to exceed $2,000;
(2) confinement in jail for a term not to exceed 180 days; or
(3) both such fine and confinement."


Quote: "He has already been assaulted several times, he is due compensation not a sentence."


Doesn't work that way in the really-real world. He could have asked to lock-up for protection from the start; but waited till he was assaulted several times before the staff locked him up for protection themselves. If we compensated everyone that has been beaten down while locked up; not only would we be broke, but people would try to get incarcerated and then assaulted.

-Keith

Libervurto
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Posted: 10th Jul 2013 18:40 Edited at: 10th Jul 2013 18:48
Quote: "And has been mentioned already, if you lived in a community that has been devastated by an event recently, you might have different "feelings" on the matter."

Are you saying that people should be imprisoned for insensitivity, or that paranoia is justified?
It was distasteful, I don't think anyone disagrees with that, but that's no reason to treat him this way. Any sensible person could tell that this was not a legitimate threat to anyone's safety.

Quote: "This guy is in jail awaiting trial, not convicted and doing prison time without due process as some of you seem to suggest."

He's still in jail and has been assaulted several times. The details of the legal process are irrelevant.

Quote: "For those of you who see no difference between "I'll kill you!" and what this guy said, I don't know what to tell you. Perhaps more life experience will help you see it."

Let's not start patronising each other, sonny Jim.
I didn't say there was no difference between the two, they are different words for a start (), but under the same logic you would have to investigate everyone who says "I'll kill you!" or you are introducing some arbitrary requirement for how graphic a description must be or how relevant to current paranoia it is before it needs to be investigated. You're saying that "I'll kill you!" doesn't need to be investigated because there is currently no public hysteria surrounding it, but mention schools and you set off the paranoia alarms because it's been in the news recently.

Off topic: simply by saying, "I am a terrorist.", I become a terrorist if you are now worrying about what I might do!

[edit]

Quote: "You seem to interpret things as you see fit, don't you? I've noticed this pattern with you on various threads."

Sorry? This shows that you really are a very literal-minded person. I was demonstrating that interpretation is subjective, I do not think you are a violent person for using violent imagery in your comments. Everyone interprets things "as they see fit" that's why it's called interpretation.
Quik
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Posted: 10th Jul 2013 18:43
Quote: "Off topic: simply by saying, "I am a terrorist.", I become a terrorist if you are now worrying about what I might do!"


oh crap, send in the swat team!



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KeithC
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Posted: 10th Jul 2013 18:46
Quote: "Any sensible person could tell that this was not a legitimate threat to anyone's safety."


Again; you're making assumptions, using only facts the media has (force) fed you.

Quote: "He's still in jail and has been assaulted several times. The details of the legal process are irrelevant."


Irrelevant to you; but not the law that has been established for quite some time now. This guy isn't special; it's happened to countless others who have broken the law (which I have already pointed out to you, in the above post).

-Keith

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Posted: 10th Jul 2013 18:47 Edited at: 10th Jul 2013 18:47
oh yes, a law that has been in place for ages must be perfect and cannot be critisized.

edit: oh and yea, better put it here: That was being sarcasm.



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xplosys
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Posted: 10th Jul 2013 18:50
Lol... sonny Jim must have some negative connotation, yes?

Quote: "I didn't say there was no difference between the two,"

I didn't say I was talking to you.

I understand that this is controversial and everyone has different feelings, based on their own life and experiences. I'm not saying my opinion is the only one, I'm just offering it. I'm not saying you or anyone else is wrong, I'm only disagreeing. Don't get defensive and "Kill ME!"

Brian.

I am the underground.
Dark Frager
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Posted: 10th Jul 2013 18:50
Quote: "Again; you're making assumptions, using only facts the media has (force) fed you."


What? I just think that's opinion. And besides, it's a pretty accurate assumption. Only a handful of people probably thought that was a legitimate threat. You can't really lock someone up because they have a different sense of humor.

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KeithC
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Posted: 10th Jul 2013 18:52
Quote: "oh yes, a law that has been in place for ages must be perfect and cannot be critisized."


On the contrary; it's criticized all the time, especially by the criminals I talk with everyday. It's always "someone else's fault". Someone "made" him type that threat.

-Keith

xplosys
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Posted: 10th Jul 2013 18:54
Quote: "You can't really lock someone up because they have a different sense of humor."


If it is you contention that he does indeed have a different sense of humor and that's all that it was, then the rest of your statement has already been dis-proven because... obviously... you can lock someone up for that.

I am the underground.
KeithC
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Posted: 10th Jul 2013 18:54
Quote: "You can't really lock someone up because they have a different sense of humor."


So killing innocent children and eating their hearts is funny?

-Keith

Libervurto
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Posted: 10th Jul 2013 18:56 Edited at: 10th Jul 2013 19:01
Quote: "Lol... sonny Jim must have some negative connotation, yes?"

Ironically, I feel like I'm being taken too seriously in this thread.

@Keith - I'm not trying to be facetious, I honestly don't understand how someone could read the following and take it as a serious threat:
Quote: "Yeah, I'm real messed up in the head, I'm going to go shoot up a school full of kids and eat their still, beating hearts"

Could you explain this to me? Maybe you have a deeper insight into the criminal mind having worked with them.


[edit]
Quote: "So killing innocent children and eating their hearts is funny?"

Again, you are being way too literal-minded. It's the same reason people find cartoon violence funny and like to run people over in GTA, because it's so exaggerated and abstract it is ridiculous.
Quik
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Posted: 10th Jul 2013 18:56 Edited at: 10th Jul 2013 18:59
Quote: "So killing innocent children and eating their hearts is funny?"


in text it is,
for some people

edit: as a side note: I've seen countless brutal-kidmurdering-animations on the internet, I can safely say: I've laughed my shoes off multiple times.



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KeithC
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Posted: 10th Jul 2013 19:00
Quote: "in text it is,
for some people"


You're right; again, I work around people like that everyday...they're called criminals. It all started with them thinking that it was no big deal...then they acted on it. It sounds like we're both arguing for the sake of argument again. You feel that joking about killing kids is acceptable for some people, and I disagree.

Either way; I don't think this guy will be posting too many "jokes" online when he gets out. Lesson learned, I suppose.

-Keith

Matty H
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Posted: 10th Jul 2013 19:01 Edited at: 10th Jul 2013 19:02
Quote: "So killing innocent children and eating their hearts is funny?"


It's not funny and was probably supposed to be shocking and not funny.

Anyone seen 'nightmare on elm street', not too controversial but it's about a child abuser coming back from the dead to kill his victims, not sure if there is heart eating but some things come close.

This is entertainment and shocking, much the same effect this 19 year old was trying to achieve.

I am presuming there is no other evidence against this person, otherwise it may be quite correct to keep him out of harms way.

Libervurto
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Posted: 10th Jul 2013 19:04 Edited at: 10th Jul 2013 19:05
Quote: "It all started with them thinking that it was no big deal... You feel that joking about killing kids is acceptable for some people, and I disagree."

Joking about something doesn't mean you think it's acceptable or no big deal. Once again, you are being very literal here.
The Zoq2
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Posted: 10th Jul 2013 19:11
Does it have to be the kind of joke that you laugh about. To me it seems like this "kid" has been playing LOL and been accused of being a psyco or something like that, to show how exagerated it is to call someone a psyco over a game, he wrote this. It was never supposed to be the kind of joke that you laugh about.

Also, what if they court decides that he is not guilty of anything, will he get any sort of compensation for being in jail for half a year over nothing or well they just release him and say "to bad about that half a year of your life we ruined". I have no idea how that works in the US
KeithC
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Posted: 10th Jul 2013 19:16
Oh; I'm quite sure his lawyers are already working on a wrongful imprisonment suite as we speak. People have won those before, though it will never give you your time back...nor erase the memories of time spent inside. I'm guessing that no one here has spent time locked up before; so you really have no actual idea, as to how dangerous and tough things are. As I said in the other thread; once the door closes behind you, and you realize that you are all you've got....it's very sobering.

-Keith

Quik
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Posted: 10th Jul 2013 19:22
Quote: "You're right; again, I work around people like that everyday...they're called criminals."


I am the biggest criminal ever, it would seem. Seriously.



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KeithC
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Posted: 10th Jul 2013 19:25
Quote: "I am the biggest criminal ever, it would seem. Seriously."


You sure are! I'm gonna have to lock you up in the TGC jail now; count time's at 1600 and 2100 on my shift, so you'd better be in your bunk or I'll put you on toplock.

-Keith

Benjamin
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Posted: 10th Jul 2013 19:25
Well all I can say is, I'm glad to live in a country where there's no fear of being locked up for making a sarcastic, passing remark, without hope of a quick trial or compensation for being wrongly imprisoned without evidence. I realise that it was a silly thing to do in the present climate of paranoia, but that doesn't warrant this kind of punishment. Nor does he deserve to be used to "set precedent".

I can't really take the debate any further since as you say, there's no hard evidence that he said he was joking (nor is there any evidence that he actually made any kind of threat, just what the media are force-feeding people).

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KeithC
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Posted: 10th Jul 2013 19:27
I'm glad you live in your Country too, Benjamin.

-Keith

Libervurto
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Posted: 10th Jul 2013 19:39 Edited at: 10th Jul 2013 19:39
@Keith - You are probably the best positioned person to talk about this in support of the police. Could you explain how the message can be taken seriously? I'm not being facetious, I genuinely can't see it:
Quote: "Yeah, I'm real messed up in the head, I'm going to go shoot up a school full of kids and eat their still, beating hearts"

Could you explain this to me? Maybe you have a deeper insight into the criminal mind having worked with them.
Quik
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Posted: 10th Jul 2013 19:40
Quote: "count time's at 1600 and 2100 on my shift, so you'd better be in your bunk or I'll put you on toplock. "


Noo >: I'm gonna be a rebel! Give me a spoon people!



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mr_d
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Posted: 10th Jul 2013 19:44 Edited at: 10th Jul 2013 19:46
Don't you all just wish that something like the Minority Report was real and that people could be locked up for Pre-Crime? lol
Society would be safe and even if mistakes happen in say 0.1% of the time, this would be OK as that is the price of a Safety for the rest of the 99.9% of Society. jk (or am I?)
EDIT: Ooops, forgot to put in my lols and jk and smiley faces...

Dark Frager
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Posted: 10th Jul 2013 19:44
Quote: "So killing innocent children and eating their hearts is funny?"


I didn't say it's funny. I just said just because you don't find the joke funny, doesn't mean you can lock someone up, no matter how sick or twisted it is. Under the law then maybe yes you can, but that's a really silly law.

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Quik
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Posted: 10th Jul 2013 19:47
Quote: "Society would be safe and even if mistakes happen in say 0.1% of the time, this would be OK as that is the price of a Safety for the rest of the 99.9% of Society."


0,1% - i think you're being quite optmistic about that...



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