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thenerd
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Posted: 12th Sep 2009 22:53
my mistake. the newest wrapper is here:

http://forum.thegamecreators.com/?m=forum_view&t=154086&b=5


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Monk
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Posted: 12th Sep 2009 22:55 Edited at: 12th Sep 2009 22:58
Whats the collision like with Newton?

One of my biggest possible problems were rolling objects like barrels. Its the sort of object that you can't really use sc_sphereslide for so I was short of ideas for how to do it. Does Newton do poly to poly collisions?

If it does, Ill scrap my idea totally and start from scratch with Newton and take the time to learn it.

thenerd
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Posted: 12th Sep 2009 22:57
yup. and sphere, box, and any other collision type that ever was.


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kaedroho
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Posted: 12th Sep 2009 22:58
Try to use convexes as much as possible. Their much faster than ordinary meshes.

Monk
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Posted: 12th Sep 2009 22:58 Edited at: 12th Sep 2009 23:00
Good Im downloading now =)

Btw, I didnt think anyone had seen that link in my sig

thenerd
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Posted: 12th Sep 2009 22:59 Edited at: 12th Sep 2009 23:01
this is a convex.


Quote: "Try to use convexes as much as possible. Their much faster than ordinary meshes."

yup.


on a slightley less mature note,

my truck is broken!!!! (see screenie)


playing around with the newton demos.


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Monk
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Posted: 12th Sep 2009 23:00
Lol maybe because you have minus loads?

What are convexes?

thenerd
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Posted: 12th Sep 2009 23:01 Edited at: 12th Sep 2009 23:04
its a simplified version of a mesh.
here is a 2d example, say all the points made up a polygon. the outline would be a convex.


(see edited post with other pic)


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Monk
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Posted: 12th Sep 2009 23:10
Yeah sorry I didnt mean to post the question twice...
Convexes sound good (like the drawing) but we'd have to be careful we didn't drop anything on the windscreen...

The demos have sold Newton to me, they do the different shapes well, but the cones don't seem to work as well as the rest of them.

thenerd
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Posted: 12th Sep 2009 23:12 Edited at: 12th Sep 2009 23:13
Quote: "Yeah sorry I didnt mean to post the question twice..."
no apolaigy needed.

i am having a bad day for spelling.


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Monk
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Posted: 12th Sep 2009 23:14
Ill spend more time looking at the demos sometime but not now...



thenerd
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Posted: 12th Sep 2009 23:18 Edited at: 12th Sep 2009 23:18
fine with me...
im working on my other project today.




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Dared1111
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Posted: 13th Sep 2009 13:50
Sure thing. I'll try that one

Signature? There is no signature!
kaedroho
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Posted: 13th Sep 2009 13:54 Edited at: 13th Sep 2009 13:59
A convex is not a bounding object.

Its an object where all the faces point outwards. This is so that the collision system only needs to check if a point is behind every face, if it is, then there's a collision. Mesh collision is a lot more complicated.

Take your car for example, it cant make the windscreen because otherwise the bonnet wont detect any collision, any collisions inside the bonnet will show in front of the windscreen, making a collision not be detected. A solution for this is to split your car up into 3 parts. Dark Physics can have multiple convexes connected together to make a single object. phy make rigid body dynamic convexes.

More info:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Concave_polygon

thenerd
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Posted: 13th Sep 2009 14:06
ok, sorry for my misleading definition, that is what i always thought it to be.


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Monk
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Posted: 21st Sep 2009 17:26
thenerd,

How is your Newton experience coming along? I'm quite enjoying it actually. Everyone who said it was easy and I should have used it all along was spot on =)

HavokDelta6
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Posted: 21st Sep 2009 18:07
Hey sorry just a quick thing here, we're actually doing this in school like atm in physics so i am not just, ... targeting people, Above the monk said:

F = MA (for the y-axis)
A = 1/23 m/s^2

V = U + AT
V = U + 13/46 m/s

right... normally no problems but I like accurate data.


v = u + at is wrong because that will really muck up the result using it raw.

v = u + a[delta]t

because its change in time, where U is the velocity when time was current time - [delta]time

sorry for using delta but I don't know where the triangle symbol is

Delta means change in


and the correct expression is ms-1 or ms-2 for acceleration

For anyone doing this at home, or not really understanding them, the actual result is in distance units per time unit

so if your distance is meters and time seconds meters per second -> m/s -> ms-1

this is just units / frame -> uf-1 presumably

To convert frames to seconds its 1 / screen fps() which is fine, unless it lags and screen FPS is zero, then DB will crash and say "div by zero at line x" so... heads up there.

Havok

hope i helped someone

also a good page for Equations of Motion

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Equations_of_motion

there, now that you know a triangle means delta which means change in you should be fine, the little subscript i means initial so v and a little i is initial velocity, but this is often just called "u"

lastly i don't know why s means displacement, (distance basically)

GCSE results:
2 a's 3 b's AND
5 (FIVE) a*'s ^_^
Monk
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Posted: 21st Sep 2009 18:17
Quote: "and the correct expression is ms-1 or ms-2 for acceleration"

Thanks for pointing our delta (kind of implied) but the units were already right. And ms-1 is better put as ms^-1 or m/s is often better on computers.

Displacement is not basically distance if you're old enough to be coding.
Displacement is the amount of (hate to phrase it this way) distance from the origin.
Distance is the amount of distance you have travelled.

Hopefully a little example will clear up my explanation.
If you travel 50m North, then 50m East and then 50m South, what is your displacement and distance?

Displacement - 50m (how far away you are from your start position)
Distance = 50 + 50 + 50 = 150m (the cumulative distance moved)

Its good that you are applying the lessons you have learnt =)

kaedroho
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Posted: 21st Sep 2009 18:20
Quote: "and the correct expression is ms-1 or ms-2 for acceleration"


its ms^-2 or m/s^2 both are the same value, both mean the same thing.

Monk
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Posted: 21st Sep 2009 18:22
I think he meant ms-1 (ms^-1) for velocity and ms-2 (ms^-2 or m/s^2) for acceleration, he just didn't specify

kaedroho
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Posted: 21st Sep 2009 18:24 Edited at: 21st Sep 2009 18:24
You dont really need that for coding, unless your commenting.

The actual code looks a little different

Velocity=Velocity+Accelleration*time
DistanceMoved=Velocity*time
Position=Position+DistanceMoved

Monk
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Posted: 21st Sep 2009 18:27
Why bother with the middle man, can you not just cut out the DistanceMoved variable? saves a little bit of time.

HavokDelta6
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Posted: 21st Sep 2009 18:53
Displacement basically being distance is the only real appliction inside a main loop, i was trying to simpify, also from experance in using them, using it with distance and speed tends to be of more use then calculating displacement and thus velocities

GCSE results:
2 a's 3 b's AND
5 (FIVE) a*'s ^_^
Monk
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Posted: 21st Sep 2009 19:18 Edited at: 21st Sep 2009 20:04
Quote: " i was trying to simpify"

Ditto with the delta thing.

Quote: "distance and speed tends to be of more use then calculating displacement and thus velocities"

I don't know, DBPro returns the positions as displacement in each axis from 0, and I use acceleration -> velocity -> position because of this, not acceleration -> speed -> position.

thenerd
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Posted: 21st Sep 2009 22:10
Quote: "thenerd,

How is your Newton experience coming along? I'm quite enjoying it actually. Everyone who said it was easy and I should have used it all along was spot on =)"

Newton rules! i have just been playing around with the commands, getting it to work and becoming familiar with it. Really quite a powerful engine!


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Monk
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Posted: 21st Sep 2009 22:16
Quote: "Newton rules! i have just been playing around with the commands, getting it to work and becoming familiar with it. Really quite a powerful engine!"

If I hadn't been quite so stubborn to start with, the physics could be set up by now
However, it shouldn't be long.

thenerd
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Posted: 21st Sep 2009 22:43
and i have not been working on the level editor, too much school work. but i am going to try to get going more on it now.


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Monk
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Posted: 21st Sep 2009 22:52
Quote: "and i have not been working on the level editor, too much school work. but i am going to try to get going more on it now."

I would say the same today, but I only had two lessons and went home at break

thenerd
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Posted: 21st Sep 2009 22:59
yeah. I hate and love school at the same time.


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kaedroho
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Posted: 21st Sep 2009 23:00
HavokDelta6, you dont happen to be taking Maths mechanics A level do you? I took that and were being taught the exact same thing as you said earlier.

thenerd
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Posted: 21st Sep 2009 23:06 Edited at: 21st Sep 2009 23:07
random update:

been playing with object placement, you can now place trees!



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Monk
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Posted: 21st Sep 2009 23:11 Edited at: 21st Sep 2009 23:12
Quote: "HavokDelta6, you dont happen to be taking Maths mechanics A level do you? I took that and were being taught the exact same thing as you said earlier."


Its one of the first and easiest things you get taught. Friction gets more interesting later, but thats only because everythings on a slope. You don't cover much more in mechanics

Btw, nice progress thenerd. What was your fps at that point?

thenerd
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Posted: 21st Sep 2009 23:14
140 with no trees,
i did a benchmark, 15 with 1000 trees.


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Monk
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Posted: 21st Sep 2009 23:16
Quote: "i did a benchmark, 15 with 1000 trees."


... ... Speedy

thenerd
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Posted: 21st Sep 2009 23:33
Speedy? not really. 15 fps is horrible for a game.


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kaedroho
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Posted: 21st Sep 2009 23:36 Edited at: 21st Sep 2009 23:37
Do you instance or clone the trees?

I'm making a dll to control object LOD switching. the commands will be a lot like DBPros LOD commands, but there will be no limit on LOD levels.

thenerd
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Posted: 21st Sep 2009 23:43
clone them. every tree is an entirely different object. i may change that though, and i definitely will find a palm tree.


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thenerd
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Posted: 21st Sep 2009 23:50 Edited at: 21st Sep 2009 23:52
i found a great model to temporarily use until we find a more detailed one...
like it?



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HavokDelta6
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Posted: 22nd Sep 2009 00:20
Not yet no. But it'll be covered, and Distance is more useful then displacement in almost all cases in DBP, except where displacement is actually wanted; and in most results distance and displacement will be the same anyway, as objects cant go back and forth during a frame anyway.


Also you told me you were 14 on MSN... @ Kaedroho

GCSE results:
2 a's 3 b's AND
5 (FIVE) a*'s ^_^
thenerd
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Posted: 22nd Sep 2009 00:25 Edited at: 22nd Sep 2009 00:28
he is sixteen. i think. he might be tricking us all and he is really 14. i don't know.

[edit] just a random idea:
we could use kaedroho's shooting engine for weapons, maybe?


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BMacZero
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Posted: 22nd Sep 2009 01:56
I'm in AP Physics if you can't figure something out...just thought I'd mention that



Monk
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Posted: 22nd Sep 2009 09:25
Which level is AP?

BMacZero
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Posted: 22nd Sep 2009 16:44
The highest one at my school (most school around here go Normal -> Honors -> AP).



kaedroho
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Posted: 22nd Sep 2009 21:03
Havok, I'm 16 I don't know where the 14 came from.

I would reccomend to use instancing as much as possible. Instancing doesn't copy the mesh data vertex buffer. Instead, it shares a vertexbuffer using less vram and actually, gains a lot of FPS.

thenerd
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Posted: 22nd Sep 2009 21:50
yes, i will take your advice and try to do that.


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mitch793
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Posted: 25th Sep 2009 20:09
I havent been on here in ages: IT GCSE can take its hold a little.
Anyway, attached is a prototype of an SMG model.
Any Suggestions to improve it?

If you can't find it, code it yourself!

[url=http://steamcard.com/]
thenerd
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Posted: 25th Sep 2009 21:44
the picture's upside-down.

like it, maybe making everything a little less rectangular, the grips especially. but other than that its good.


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BMacZero
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Posted: 26th Sep 2009 02:02
It is quite boxy - for the most part it's what we call a "cardboard cutout" - it has no depth to it. Try to narrow the handgrips and make them a little rounder.

This is a bit more abstract and could be tough, but try to also integrate the barrel of the gun into the body. Right now it just seems to stick out the end. If you look at a reference picture:



The barrel is visible all the way down the length of the gun.



mitch793
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Posted: 26th Sep 2009 12:45 Edited at: 26th Sep 2009 12:46
Quote: "It is quite boxy - for the most part it's what we call a "cardboard cutout" - it has no depth to it. Try to narrow the handgrips and make them a little rounder.

This is a bit more abstract and could be tough, but try to also integrate the barrel of the gun into the body. Right now it just seems to stick out the end. If you look at a reference picture:"

It was just a prototype.
Anyway, does anyone mind if they do that for me because i forgot to save the wings file and im crap with blender
EDIT: I forgot to attach the model

If you can't find it, code it yourself!

[url=http://steamcard.com/]
thenerd
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Posted: 26th Sep 2009 13:31
I am going to have a go at it right now.


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