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Work in Progress / Carnage Game Show

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Pincho Paxton
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Posted: 9th Jul 2012 16:43
Yeah, you should put a 3rd person camera on the screen as an option.

Fallout
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Posted: 9th Jul 2012 21:36
You couldn't play in 3rd person because of all the weapon mechanics, how the aiming works etc. It'd be a different game. But there will be the death cams to get close ups on the dying when things go wrong.

More dynamic objects completed now. Explosion shockwaves, burning and exploding barrels and a few sound fx improvements.



Matty H
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Posted: 9th Jul 2012 23:06 Edited at: 9th Jul 2012 23:07
I love the closing walls, the sound fx add so much too.

Are you using force fields for explosions or have you implemented your own system? Since your character is dynamic I was wondering if this stops you from using force fields, or is your character a lot heavier so explosions affect him just the right amount?

Would I be able to use one of your videos to promote Dark Dynamix? I have not got the time(or the media) to do a video that looks as good as that.

Pincho Paxton
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Posted: 9th Jul 2012 23:22
Looks great as usual.

JLMoondog
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Posted: 10th Jul 2012 02:23
Looking awesome! Only one concern..door collision. That can be a life or death situation. In all of your videos I've seen you get stuck on the door, it only lasts about 1s but that's enough time to be pumped full of bullets. As a player this would become frustrating real quick. Though since I haven't played the game yet I can't really comment much further.

TheComet
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Posted: 10th Jul 2012 04:45
@ Fallout

Could you pop me an e-mail to the address attached to this account? I'd like to send you something but I can't find any way to contact you.

TheComet

FireIndy
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Posted: 10th Jul 2012 06:49
Everytime I come to look at this, you have made lots and lots of progress! What are you writing this in by the way? DBPro, .NET, C++? Also a question, when you are say, on level 2, and shoot over a railing, does it automatically just shoot down 1 level? I'm just curious on how the bullets travel.

Fallout
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Posted: 10th Jul 2012 10:13 Edited at: 10th Jul 2012 10:18
@Matty - As usual with me, I didn't bother to look through the command set and just ran off and implemented it myself. I'll have a look at forcefields today and see if they work for me. The main issue with my manual system is it doesn't take into account collision with other objects, so an explosion on one side of a wall will affect objects on the other side. I can fix this with some ray casting, but if forcefields can deal with that, that'd be awesome.

As for using videos, feel free. I'm going to try and get rag dolls implemented this week, so when I start posting videos of that stuff, that might be good to show it off.

@Pincho - Thanks chap!

@Moonster - There is some ironing out that needs to be done there. There are a bunch of reasons for my door foolishness:
1. Normally I'm not paying attention and I am a fool
2. The camera angle is often more angled than the game camera will be, so it's easier to see the effects I'm working on. This makes it a bit harder to see doorway entry points.
3. Doors are designed to be the minimum gap a player can get through, so they're purposefully small to allow for claustrophobic level design. If you want to make a fast free flowing level, you can just leave doors out entirely and build larger openings.
4. I've not set any material properties for the player yet. I can probably make him more slippy and slidey.
5. I'm forcing the player about with set velocities. I might be able to smooth things up by using different forces.

So basically, yes, it's not as smooth as it could be, but it should all be ironed out.

@TheComet - Emailed.

@FireIndy - It's C++ DGDK. The aiming system depends on which weapon you're using, but the basic principle is: a ray cast to the cursor to determine the height PLUS the height the player is holding the gun.

So if you're on flat ground, the cursor will hover over the floor. The player will aim at this floor position plus the height of his gun, making him shoot in a straight line. This ensures that, if you fire with the cursor close to you, the player doesn't just shoot at his feet. The bullet will travel forwards.

If you go to a ledge and shoot down a few stories, the player will aim down because the raycast for the cursor will detect it's lower. The bullets will never hit the point you're aiming with the cursor though, because of the "plus weapon height" bit that is added onto the aiming. It'll go slightly passed that point. This works fine for shooting at players though because their chest/shoulder height will fall perfectly onto this point.

The same thing goes for walls, objects and ledges. The cursor detects the height and the player shoots above this height, ensuring you'd hit somebody standing on that object in the chest, rather than hitting the floor at their feet.

The last thing I'm going to implement is a target detection system which figures out if your cursor is over a player, barrel, crate, or other shootable. You'll then target the centre of that object when your cursor is over it. You'll notice in the last vid I had to run to the top of a stair case to shoot the explosive barrel that I'd pushed along. Currently there's no way for me to hit a barrel lying on it's side if I'm on the same level as it, because the gun won't aim down. You'll also notice the bullets never hit the ground beneath the cursor. That's because, when they are in the crosshair, they're at "gun height", so travel on a bit further until they hit the floor.

Big post!

FireIndy
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Posted: 10th Jul 2012 16:20
Ahh, that's pretty cool. Have you started implementing any multiplayer components yet? Just curious, because I always found it harder writing my singleplayer stuff, and then try to throw it into multiplayer. Maybe that's just me

If, you haven't, here's what I'm basing my server off of:
https://developer.valvesoftware.com/wiki/Source_Multiplayer_Networking

It's a little confusing, but since you have such an awesome looking game so far, I think that you should continue to go all the way with this It requires some threading, but totally doable with other libraries like boost, etc. Looks good though!

Fallout
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Posted: 10th Jul 2012 18:05
That looks like a good source mate (no pun intended). Thanks for that. No, I've not started on multiplayer yet, and like you I'm aware that when I do, there will be a lot of core changes which will be a pain. I think in an ideal world you want to start with a solid multiplayer base and develop all the additional things as you go. I'm pretty sure that's how top MP games are developed.

Anyway, that's not far off now though. There are a few other little missions and priorities for the project first, and then I'll be taking the jump into MP.

For now, I've updated the exploding barrels to make them much cooler. They can kind of double up as weapons now. A bit like claymores. Adding a control to grab items to move them more easily and a kick control would make this all a lot easier.



TheComet
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Posted: 10th Jul 2012 18:31
Fuzz
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Posted: 16th Jul 2012 18:02
Looks great!

Dimis
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Posted: 17th Jul 2012 13:36
Everything looks great Fallout! I like the flames and generally all fire effects. Great work!


Fallout
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Posted: 17th Jul 2012 15:16
Thanks for the continued comments gents.

I've been slaving over rag dolls (sounds weird!!) for the last 3 or 4 days. It has been a struggle, but I finally have them working to an extent ...



I have issues with my timing system, with the actual rigging, with the collision capsules and with the joint limits. Basically, the whole thing could be a lot better, but I think this vid provides a glimpse at the cool fun possibilities of rag doll related deaths.

Matty H
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Posted: 17th Jul 2012 15:37
That looks great

I will be working on an update soon for Dynamix, I will keep in touch with you and try to improve a few things where possible.

Fallout
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Posted: 17th Jul 2012 18:42 Edited at: 17th Jul 2012 18:42
Thanks Matty. The rag dolls are pretty easy to setup by following your example, but only once you've got past the gotchas. I found my default model would not work for various reasons. Firstly, it was scaled down in game, which I could not get around, and secondly the way it was rigged seemed to cause lots of problems. In the end I rerigged the model myself in milkshape and that worked.

The main issue I'm having is rag doll stability with my variable timing system and ever decreasing frame rate. I think what I may have to do is play with the timing further, and impose a fixed step timing system on the server. At least that way I can make sure the server has a reliable simulation and then send the details over to the client to fix their unpredictable one.

I'm thinking maybe a standalone server would be the best way to go, to take out slow down from graphics rendering, but that'll make the game less accessible for casual players setting up their own game.

It's definitely a difficult issue. If the server has fixed timing for physx reliability, but drops below the chosen frame rate, every player will suffer and the whole thing will break down. Enforcing that fixed timestep means many slower compos won't be able to host games. I'm going to have to make some tough decisions at some point!

Stab in the Dark software
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Posted: 18th Jul 2012 03:09
I believe under the Geneva Convention you need to give those ragdoll models a blindfold and a
cigarette before executing them. Of course first light the cigarette with the flame thrower.
Carnage is looking very professional and you have inspired the DBpro community.

[img][/img]


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The coffee is lovely dark and deep,and I have code to write before I sleep.
Fallout
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Posted: 18th Jul 2012 10:07
Those rag dolls don't deserve your compassion mate! They were born to die!

Thanks for the compliment though. Inspirational is definitely high praise.

Pincho Paxton
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Posted: 18th Jul 2012 10:53 Edited at: 18th Jul 2012 10:55
You make things so well that it is hard to make any suggestions. All I can say is that it looks amazing as usual.

Andrew_Neale
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Posted: 18th Jul 2012 23:57
Looking great all round, but I have to say, I absolutely love the ragdolls in the crusher. I think it is probably a slight glitch in the physics that the walls go slightly further than they should be able to with the ragdoll in the way but it ends up just looking more gruesome. Always nice when bugs/glitches look intentional.


Previously TEH_CODERER.
Fallout
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Posted: 19th Jul 2012 15:16
The walls go a bit further because of the rag doll setup. I need to iron out the rag doll collision a fair bit.

I've updated the crusher. It still needs a professional artist's touch, but at least it's a bit more serious looking.



Fallout
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Posted: 19th Jul 2012 21:21
GORE!!! Gore system now added to the rag dolls. There are a few things that need improvement (I need to remove the wall debris effect which appears on the player), but things are looking horrible once more.



Pincho Paxton
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Posted: 19th Jul 2012 21:27
Eww, I was eating a sandwich! The police have been round again digging up your back garden haven't they?

Fallout
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Posted: 19th Jul 2012 22:32
They never find any bodies! Not whole ones anyway.

Dimis
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Posted: 19th Jul 2012 23:28
At least give the rag dolls a knife or something. They deserve a fighting chance.

Still everything is looking great!


Olby
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Posted: 20th Jul 2012 01:30
That's just brilliant, I also do have some ideas of creating a gory game. Still remember my first night with SoF. Those where the days of limbs.

Btw. why is the player getting damage when the rag-doll is shot. Is it instanced?


Intel Core2Duo 2.2GHZ, 2GB, GeForce 8600M GT 1280MB, Windows Vista Ultimate SP2, PureBasic 4.61 + DarkGDK 2.0
JLMoondog
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Posted: 20th Jul 2012 05:30
Quote: "I've updated the crusher. It still needs a professional artist's touch, but at least it's a bit more serious looking."

Yah, what's going on with that?

Fallout
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Posted: 20th Jul 2012 09:52 Edited at: 20th Jul 2012 09:53
Quote: "At least give the rag dolls a knife or something. They deserve a fighting chance."


One day they'll have AI and flamethrowers of their own. I'm getting my kills in while I can.

Quote: "Btw. why is the player getting damage when the rag-doll is shot. Is it instanced?"


Not exactly, but kind of. When a rag doll object is created, it's created using a player object's settings. So it gets it's gore texture and eventually it's limb rotations and all that kind of stuff. So basically, since I only have 1 player in the game, the rag doll is being setup from that player and they're sharing the same texture data.

Quote: "Yah, what's going on with that?"


Still not at that stage dude! Still hacking stuff together and haven't yet designed final level components and all that kind of stuff. Occasionally I just get sick of looking at my crap models and try and improve them a little bit. What projects are you up to at the moment?

JLMoondog
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Posted: 20th Jul 2012 14:34
Quote: "What projects are you up to at the moment?"

None...

Agent Dink
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Posted: 22nd Jul 2012 06:36 Edited at: 22nd Jul 2012 06:38
This is looking absolutely fantastic! Very inspirational to watch the progress!

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Marvey
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Posted: 24th Jul 2012 16:53
really nice work fallout!
swissolo
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Posted: 27th Jul 2012 22:12
Fallout! Where is your valued member title? Anyways, how have things been progressing?

swis
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Fallout
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Posted: 27th Jul 2012 22:18
Thanks chaps! @Swissolo - I think valued member is for people who contribute to others more than make game ... at least, I think. If not ... gimme gimme!

Progress has been spread out on different areas. I made some physics tweaks, gore tweaks, started work on a water based death trap (so I can try out water type shaders) and have also been doing some design work. So there's not much to show right now. Hopefully will have some updates next week. Should be putting in some hours this weekend too, so will try and move stuff along!

swissolo
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Posted: 27th Jul 2012 23:31
Quote: "@Swissolo - I think valued member is for people who contribute to others more than make game ... at least, I think."

Haley earned a valued member badge by mass releasing projects in AppGameKit, it seems like the same would apply for your work! Plus it appears that a number of people have benefited from your work along the way anyways.

swis
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Fallout
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Posted: 27th Jul 2012 23:34
Ok, keep going with the Fallout promotions. Your payment is in the mail.

Fallout
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Posted: 30th Jul 2012 19:43
Quick update. Working on some death traps. This one should go hand in hand with the dismemberment system when it's in. Nicknamed the 'crotch slicer' for now , a blade comes out from the floor then shoots along the corridor before disappearing again.



JLMoondog
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Posted: 30th Jul 2012 20:29
OH, I started to giggle like a little kid.

Pincho Paxton
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Posted: 30th Jul 2012 22:47
I have you now Mr Bond!

Fallout
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Posted: 31st Jul 2012 17:30 Edited at: 31st Jul 2012 17:31
haha. Yes, groin lasers Mr Bond!

@Josh - Will you still be giggling when you get your jewels sliced in two during a multiplayer game!?! We shall see!

Here's the acid pit trap, minus the acid, which will be some sort of shader water. Not the most amazing model, but it'll do for now. Connect whatever trigger you like, and when it's set off, the platforms drop away. Send players into a nice cleansing bath.



JLMoondog
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Posted: 31st Jul 2012 17:41
Does this hint towards Bio-weaponry?

Fallout
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Posted: 6th Aug 2012 19:32
It could well do mate.

First glimpse at the slicer. I'll be adding spark effects and getting it to hack off limbs in the next update. These are arranged to they trigger each other perpetually. Obviously you could do this in a far more creative way and also arrange them so that they're more dangerous.



RickV
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Posted: 8th Aug 2012 01:03
Ha! Very cool Fallout, love it!

Rick

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Fallout
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Posted: 8th Aug 2012 01:07
Thanks Rick. I got spark effects in today and am now overhauling the code which handle rag doll and player creation. That should allow me to make the actual player die, rather than spawning a single rag doll, and also add additional AI players. Then I'll get the slicer to dismember our hero! Then onto the acid pit.

xcal1ber
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Posted: 8th Aug 2012 10:29
Man this looks really awesome!! Tried the demo and had a lot of fun with it and the game keeps looking better and better.

Zcal1ber
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Posted: 16th Aug 2012 18:08
Thanks xcal1ber. Soon these vids should start showing the gameplay and demonstrating the improvements over the demo. So much to do though!

Here's a first glimpse at the acid trap and the acid refraction shader. This shader will probably be used for an acid type weapon and perhaps other things too. TODO includes some acid steaming particle effects and off course screaming death when you actually fall into it.



Pincho Paxton
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Posted: 16th Aug 2012 18:28
I've watched TRON, and I feel sorry for these guys!

TheComet
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Posted: 17th Aug 2012 00:01
Not sure about the graphics of that actually, it looks more like goo than acid. I would make it not so see-through by adding a texture on the surface of the object, something like this : http://www.maclife.com/files/u53/Portal-001.jpg

TheComet

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Fallout
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Posted: 17th Aug 2012 00:43
It's a bit of a bad name to be honest. This is a basic refraction bumped shader for all liquids, and I had a toxic waste style effect in mind. Mind you, if I'm going to be pedantic, most acid you'd see in a test tube is perfectly clear!

I'm going to be merkifying and darkenized it tomorrow for a more toxic effect and will be adding steam effects too. Cheers for the feedback.

Dimis
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Posted: 17th Aug 2012 01:08
Quote: "most acid you'd see in a test tube is perfectly clear"

True. The problem is most games visualize acid the way that the Comet says. People are used to see acid in games usually colored green and almost not transparent.
The shader looks good. You plan to make any special death animation or effect, skin burn or something like that?


Fallout
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Posted: 17th Aug 2012 09:07 Edited at: 17th Aug 2012 09:08
haha. I'm going to try not to labour the point, but if you've seen dangerous liquids in games and you've chosen to call it acid, then that's your own mistake! Just cos you play an FPS and see a biohazard sign next to some green sludge doesn't make it acid. I've always thought "Toxic Waste" in those scenarios.

But I appreciate it is all about managing player expectation. If players won't accept a clear liquid is dangerous, I'll just make it darker and then rename it a toxic waste trap or something. I won't call it acid on principle!

Gonna work on the effect today. Will post screenies later.

As for the death scene, I think some sort of thrashing animation would be good, followed by switching to a floating rag doll. I can use the existing blood decal system to paste burn graphics onto the player too, so they could slowly char black.

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