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FPSC Classic Product Chat / FINALY!!! The first official update is a fact!

Author
Message
Disturbing 13
19
Years of Service
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Joined: 12th Apr 2005
Location: Murder Capital of the World
Posted: 3rd Sep 2006 10:53
Quote: "Some of the models I've got (including, sadly, some of D13's works I recently got) show nothing but white"


man this is one time I am so completely glad that i could not find my code.

Quote: "It took me eight hours to get FPSC back into the condition it was before I installed the patch."


A fix reinstall won't even help?What did you have to do if it's not too much to get it back to normal?

Gemstone Games
18
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 5th Jul 2006
Location:
Posted: 3rd Sep 2006 12:22
But Expired, like you said, only true code programmers would have known about these issues. A lot of us normal people could have gone an extra few weeks if we knew the update was going to be like this. Yeah, an update to FPSC is mighty appreciated, but not at the expense of the efficiancy of the program.

Formerly JMC...
SpyDaniel
18
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 4th Feb 2006
Location: United Kingdom
Posted: 3rd Sep 2006 14:19
Just dont update

I havent updated FPSC yet, I dont think I want to either, if it makes fpsc worse than what it has been, then I see it as a downgrade.
FredP
Retired Moderator
18
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 27th Feb 2006
Location: Indiana
Posted: 3rd Sep 2006 16:43
Quote: "A fix reinstall won't even help?What did you have to do if it's not too much to get it back to normal?"


I had to uninstall the patch.
Then FPSC wouldn't work,period.
So I had to use the repair function in the original V1 installer.
Then I had to move the switch between the original V1 files and the ones I had on my pc until I got it all working again...as far as I know.

xplosys
18
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 5th Jan 2006
Playing: FPSC Multiplayer Games
Posted: 3rd Sep 2006 17:04
Well, TGC is aware at least of the FPS issue. I hope that RickV is right and it is an easy fix. Any update to the engine will bring some minor quirks, especially where custom media is concerned, I would think. We will just have to wait to see what next week brings.

...and why do people around here keep changing their names?

FredP
Retired Moderator
18
Years of Service
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Joined: 27th Feb 2006
Location: Indiana
Posted: 3rd Sep 2006 17:15
I hope they get it fixed quickly since the new model pack I just bought is useless without the patch.

xplosys
18
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 5th Jan 2006
Playing: FPSC Multiplayer Games
Posted: 3rd Sep 2006 17:23
That's part of the reason I'm putting off any more purchases. As I stated before, I'm not angry, or even that much disappointed, with TGC about FPSC. I am very pleased with the program overall and I don't even think that an update is that much overdue.

It just seems like buying more content now is putting the proverbial "cart before the horse". I would like to see the direction TGC will take with this before I commit to any more content.

Walking Dead Productions
18
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 6th Apr 2006
Location: USA
Posted: 3rd Sep 2006 18:11
Quote: "I hate non-programmers... hate hate hate, always have to translate the improvements."


I've only taken up to object-oriented programming (I'm still in my junior year as a Computer Science major). And the average FPSC user doesn't know any programming at all (so you must hate FPSC users, since FPSC is designed as a "no programming required" tool).

Quote: "But Expired, like you said, only true code programmers would have known about these issues. A lot of us normal people could have gone an extra few weeks if we knew the update was going to be like this. Yeah, an update to FPSC is mighty appreciated, but not at the expense of the efficiancy of the program."


QFT

When there's
no more room in HELL
the dead will walk the EARTH
Airslide
20
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 18th Oct 2004
Location: California
Posted: 3rd Sep 2006 19:42
Hopefully to clear some things up:

Most of the bug fixes you guys say you've never heard of or seen were caused with FPSC U62 source code. That was the updated version that used a newer version of DarkBasicPro (Version 6.2) to allow DBP users to edit the source code and to include the updated and more powerful features of the new version of DBP rather those of version U59.

The framerate is actually capped for a very good reason. The speed of the program is basicly the framerate - increasing it means the game would run too fast unless an FPS Timer was included to increase/decrease speed and variables based on how much time it takes between frames. That is not currently in FPSC and would take lots of work to implant.

xplosys
18
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 5th Jan 2006
Playing: FPSC Multiplayer Games
Posted: 3rd Sep 2006 20:01
So what you're saying is, if we did increase the FPS with the program in it's current state, the player/game would be in fast motion(faster) instead of smoother(more FPS).

The forum provides a means to hide our true identity. Too bad we always screw up and let it be seen.
Jams38
18
Years of Service
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Joined: 29th Aug 2006
Location:
Posted: 3rd Sep 2006 20:24
I have not downloaded the patch yet because of all the problems
everyone is having. It is however good to hear that TGC is working on upgrades and a save/load feature will be apart of that.
If they can get the save/load feature in and improve framerate,
plus smarter A.I. FPSCeator is headed in the right direction.

As for changing names i have tried to log on with my old name hammer, But it is not letting me for some reason.
So i had to go make a new one.

Jams38
MaarX
18
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Joined: 27th Feb 2006
Location:
Posted: 3rd Sep 2006 23:37
Installed the patch, now whenever trying to test game get error: MFC17.dll is not working correctly, please reinstall this executable.

C'mon

Walking Dead Productions
18
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 6th Apr 2006
Location: USA
Posted: 4th Sep 2006 00:30 Edited at: 4th Sep 2006 04:44
Quote: "Installed the patch, now whenever trying to test game get error: MFC17.dll is not working correctly, please reinstall this executable."


Click on your Start menu, then Search. Search for MFC71.dll and copy and paste the file into the FPSC root directory.

When there's
no more room in HELL
the dead will walk the EARTH
Airslide
20
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 18th Oct 2004
Location: California
Posted: 4th Sep 2006 01:28
xplosys - Well, the game gets better, smoother gameplay, but it also speeds things up, ex: I have a time variable called mytimer. Every loop it is increased by 1. If the frame rate is 30, after 1 second it should reach 30. If my frame rate is 60, after 1 second it should reach 60. The number of loops reflects the frame rate. This also means if the frame rate is normaly 30 and you set it to 60, an animation would be played at twice the speed. Timers used to avoid this are easy to implant into a fresh project, but into one as massive as FPSC, it is not. The reason is that to use these timers, you have to make all time related vairables floats (real numbers, ex: 2.00 instead of 2) and whenever they are set multiply it by the time between each frame. The animation speed must also be changed.

To put it simply - without a frame by frame timer, increasing FPS would result in smoother yet faster gameplay. To see what I mean, do a simple test game build (just floor and a weapon) and press the 'x' button. It will 'uncap' the framerate, resulting in over-paced gameplay. Try it.

I hope that clears something up.

uman
Retired Moderator
20
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Joined: 22nd Oct 2004
Location: UK
Posted: 4th Sep 2006 02:55 Edited at: 4th Sep 2006 03:00
Quote: "but if you read umans post on the matter he claims that areas that once in massivly slow FPS are no longer slow."


Quite, but I refer to the well documented and known to TGC "Serious Lagg Issue" only, where specific areas of a level sometimes as little as only one tile square can be affected by massisve fps fluctutations and cause drops down to show stoping speeds of even 0 fps in a level where the general overall fps over the vast majority area of a level can be running at quite acceptable gameplay speeds.

The Serious Lagg Issue is known to Lee as it was discovered during product development and the exact reason apparently never isolated - it has nothing at all as far as I understand it to do with the general overall fps speeds within a game but is a separate issue.

Areas affected by it in levels I tested are now free from it - whereas the overall general average fps has been reduced in same level by 50% - in other more complex levels by even more in parts.

That general much lower fps does not seem to be the same issue as the serious lagg issue as to me as its behaviour is different - thats all I can say as I cant know whats going on exactly - I am no expert in whats going on inside the engine at game run time - I just report what the end result is.

Just wanted to make that clear.

I am more than happy that the SLI seems to be gone and I am sure the general fps speeds will be put back to what they previously were at the very least - that would be one issue of very serious importance to users that will be put to rest and that has to be good news for future gamemaking with FPSC.



"I am and forever will be your friend"
Godrich13
18
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Joined: 28th Jun 2006
Location: In your Mind...
Posted: 4th Sep 2006 08:22
Ok guys thanks for solving my problem.

I think that all this program needs is the save/load feature and maybe make the multiplayer component better (only one map per EXE!?!)

Linux Rocks.
Zizaco
18
Years of Service
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Joined: 17th Apr 2006
Location: Brazil
Posted: 4th Sep 2006 15:10
What is "culling bug caused when a door opens into another areabox and is culled too soon"?

Sorry for my bad inglish!
brummel
18
Years of Service
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Joined: 26th Nov 2005
Location: Sweden
Posted: 4th Sep 2006 16:42
Im not gonna download this if it slows down the fps with 50%. I wouldnt even do it if it only slowed it down with 25%.

Gamerelease top 10 at www.freewebs.com/krillej/blog.htm

Check it out now!
Gemstone Games
18
Years of Service
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Joined: 5th Jul 2006
Location:
Posted: 4th Sep 2006 17:42
Quote: "What is "culling bug caused when a door opens into another areabox and is culled too soon"?"


Wasn't this question answered already earlier in the thread?

Formerly JMC...
LeeBamber
TGC Lead Developer
24
Years of Service
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Joined: 21st Jan 2000
Location: England
Posted: 4th Sep 2006 17:59
Sorry for the performance drop guys, my machine is so incredible powerful now that nothing I run will ever drop below the maximum framerate I ask for. I have a few ideas why the speed drop is so substantial, and I will make a special effort this evening to profile the engine and get some answers for you. I will also consider a very quick V102 update to solve these issues. You should not have to suffer even a 10% speed drop!

"Small, smart, and running around the legs of dinosaurs to find enough food to survive, bedroom programmers aren't extinct after all "
xplosys
18
Years of Service
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Joined: 5th Jan 2006
Playing: FPSC Multiplayer Games
Posted: 4th Sep 2006 18:45
Thanks for your quick response Lee. Good luck in your work.

The forum provides a means to hide our true identity. Too bad we always screw up and let it be seen.

Benjamin A
19
Years of Service
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Joined: 31st Oct 2005
Location: The Netherlands
Posted: 4th Sep 2006 19:04
Lee, not sure if this is of any help. But with the update my completely custum made level that has no characters at yet, but only some entities items, the frame rate dopped from 32fps to 4fps. With non custom media, the framerate drop wasn't as drastic, but still well over 50%

I've installed the original version again and now everything runs at 32fps again.

Still, looking forward to the update for the update.

http://www.gamefun4u.nl/index.html
GameFun4U, the ultimate funtainment. Cool Games and Resources for your own games.
brummel
18
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Joined: 26th Nov 2005
Location: Sweden
Posted: 4th Sep 2006 21:09
I just tried it out... I did want too but model pack 3 forced me too it. The framedrop wasnt too bad though... I stayed at 26 fps as lowest, but that was without enemies and before i had 32 fps with 3 enemies. Now i have to reinstall it again...angry...

Gamerelease top 10 at www.freewebs.com/krillej/blog.htm

Check it out now!
DJ Professor K
18
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Joined: 19th Dec 2005
Location: Somwhr in front of a brokn kyboard.....
Posted: 4th Sep 2006 21:33
great i jsut hope when save/load is complete to be release, they bring it with the feacture for level select (wich is also a must)


great work boys

My love is seperated in 2 parts, 1 of them is 3ds Max 7, the other; FPSC.
Whyrag
19
Years of Service
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Joined: 27th Aug 2005
Location: Seattle
Posted: 4th Sep 2006 22:41
I would like to have the storyzone patch more than save/load or anything else. would be great to add as many storyzones as needed without a crash . save load would be great as well.
Zaibatsu
18
Years of Service
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Joined: 1st May 2006
Location: Lost in Thought
Posted: 4th Sep 2006 22:59
50% slower! That's good news!

Your all thinking I'm crazy, but i said that becuase i made a level and had to take out half the scenery to get 28 fps, now I can put them back in and get 31 like i used to! once its fixed...

_Ken sent me
Godrich13
18
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Joined: 28th Jun 2006
Location: In your Mind...
Posted: 5th Sep 2006 06:20
you are crazy Zai.

My machine also doesn't drop below the max, of course my computer has only exsisted for about a week

Linux Rocks.
Gemstone Games
18
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Joined: 5th Jul 2006
Location:
Posted: 5th Sep 2006 07:16
Well you guys are probably using gaming-styled PCs, so it's understandable why you wouldn't notice the difference unless you were on anything less. Further evidence why a "minimal" and "optimal" computer setup is beneficial for businesses like this.

Lee, thanks for the quick response, and hopefully we can get this whole thing fixed rather quickly.

Formerly JMC...
om2ar
18
Years of Service
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Joined: 15th Jul 2006
Location: Saudi Arabia
Posted: 5th Sep 2006 07:21 Edited at: 5th Sep 2006 07:22
Quote: "Sorry for the performance drop guys, my machine is so incredible powerful now that nothing I run will ever drop below the maximum framerate I ask for. I have a few ideas why the speed drop is so substantial, and I will make a special effort this evening to profile the engine and get some answers for you. I will also consider a very quick V102 update to solve these issues. You should not have to suffer even a 10% speed drop!"


Thanks...while you at it ,try fix the lightmaps problems.
Gemstone Games
18
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Joined: 5th Jul 2006
Location:
Posted: 5th Sep 2006 07:30 Edited at: 5th Sep 2006 07:32
@Oja:
Didn't you just say you quit FPSC maker?

Look, if a simple lightmap issue is what's making or breaking your experience, try installing the update to the software. THEN you'll have something to complain about. I don't see why you'd need static lighting anyway, dynamic gives the lighting a more natural feel.

EDIT: Okay, after reading Bond1's response, I understand his position a bit more. That still doesn't explain your willingness to give up on the program on just that one issue.

Formerly JMC...
bond1
19
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Joined: 27th Oct 2005
Location:
Posted: 5th Sep 2006 07:30
Quote: "Thanks...while you at it ,try fix the lightmaps problems. "


Not to sidetrack the thread TOO much, but I hear you oja. It's frustrating to build a great model, then have faceted shading appear on it, it totally ruins the model.

A workaround...make either the entity dynamic OR light dynamic.

Maybe try posting this in the bug forum or feature creep...

----------------------------------------
"Your mom went to college."
My FPSC stuff at http://hyrumark.zftp.com/FPSC/hyrumarkfpsc.htm
Steve J
18
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Joined: 22nd Apr 2006
Location: Vancouver, Washington
Posted: 5th Sep 2006 08:25 Edited at: 5th Sep 2006 08:25
I tried it, no performance issues. Specs:

Intel x6800 Core 2 Duo 3.2mhz (OCed)
2gb OCZ ddr2 high performance ram
2 Nvidia 7900's 512mb ram


No issues, but those bug fixes helped on a few of my levels.

http://www.milkpaton.com/
http://phoenixophelia.com
SteveJ, less, and less Controversial!
bond1
19
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Joined: 27th Oct 2005
Location:
Posted: 5th Sep 2006 08:36 Edited at: 5th Sep 2006 08:39
DANG! You better not have any performance issues with a machine like that!

EDIT: The Geforce 7950's are now out, your machine is now an outdated piece of crap.

----------------------------------------
"Your mom went to college."
My FPSC stuff at http://hyrumark.zftp.com/FPSC/hyrumarkfpsc.htm
Gemstone Games
18
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Posted: 5th Sep 2006 12:23
See, that's just my beef--the guys that have no issues have the souped-up gaming PCs. OF COURSE they're not gonna have any issues with the updates! This should have been tested on a consumer-level PC before being released.

Formerly JMC...
Walking Dead Productions
18
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Joined: 6th Apr 2006
Location: USA
Posted: 5th Sep 2006 17:08 Edited at: 5th Sep 2006 17:08
I don't have any performance issues with the new update. The problem I have is that I get a runtime error everytime I try to load maps I created with V1. Any maps I make with the new version run fine.

When there's
no more room in HELL
the dead will walk the EARTH
Godrich13
18
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Joined: 28th Jun 2006
Location: In your Mind...
Posted: 6th Sep 2006 06:27
Quote: " See, that's just my beef--the guys that have no issues have the souped-up gaming PCs. OF COURSE they're not gonna have any issues with the updates! This should have been tested on a consumer-level PC before being released. "


Manufacturer: Dell Inc.
Processor: Intel(R) Pentium(R) D CPU 2.80GHz (2 CPUs)
Memory: 1022MB RAM
Hard Drive: 244 GB
Video Card: RADEON X300 SE 128MB HyperMemory
Monitor: Gateway EV910C
Sound Card: SigmaTel Audio
Speakers/Headphones: Emachines Stock
Keyboard: USB Root Hub
Mouse: USB Root Hub
Operating System: Windows XP Media Center Edition (5.1, Build 2600) Service Pack 2 (2600.xpsp.050622-1524)
My rig is far from "Souped up"

Linux Rocks.
Gemstone Games
18
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Posted: 7th Sep 2006 11:50
Are you kidding me, Godrich? That's got, at the LEAST, twice the specs my comp does. Your hard drive alone's triple what mine's got, so don't try telling me your comp's bare-minimum.

Formerly JMC...
Benjamin A
19
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Joined: 31st Oct 2005
Location: The Netherlands
Posted: 7th Sep 2006 13:58 Edited at: 7th Sep 2006 14:00
Godrich13 your machine is souped up..... 2CPU's and 1GB RAM and a brand new Radeon X series.... that is far above average. With your machine you're not going to have aby problems with the update or FPSC in general when it comes to speed.

Most of us have to deal with a single core 1.8-2.5 GHZ CPU, if we're lucky 512Mb (and very lucky 1Gb, but most don't) RAM and a Radeon 9200-9800 series. Such a machine does suffer from any type of framerate drop quickly.

http://www.gamefun4u.nl/index.html
GameFun4U, the ultimate funtainment. Cool Games and Resources for your own games.
DJ Professor K
18
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Location: Somwhr in front of a brokn kyboard.....
Posted: 7th Sep 2006 14:07 Edited at: 7th Sep 2006 14:09
i want that hdd mines only 80g and i'm always fighting to what to delete/uninstall so i can install that application/game.... how i miss those days where each application used max 400mgs and the best games only 600/700mgs... now evrything asks 5g-8gs... darn it... ok, time for everyone to make games ike kreidge (game with 1mg and a bit more, but has graphics that you never tought to see on a game that small)

My love is seperated in 2 parts, 1 of them is 3ds Max 7, the other; FPSC.
Walking Dead Productions
18
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Location: USA
Posted: 7th Sep 2006 18:07 Edited at: 7th Sep 2006 18:08
I'm having problems with the update, and here's my specs:

Processor: Intel P4 3.4 GHz
Memory: 2048MB DDR2 667 (PC2-5300)
Hard Drive: 560GB SATA 3.0 GB/s
Video Card: nVidia GeForce 6800GT 256MB
Monitor: Dell 1800FP 18" flat panel
Sound Card: CreativeLabs SoundBlaster Audigy 2 ZS
Speakers: CreativeLabs 7.1 Surround Sound
Operating System: Windows XP Pro SP2

It's not the best system, but it's not low-end either. And I'm having a lot of problems with the update.

When there's
no more room in HELL
the dead will walk the EARTH
uman
Retired Moderator
20
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Joined: 22nd Oct 2004
Location: UK
Posted: 7th Sep 2006 19:09
I am posting this here too - a copy from my Update thread - it may help users in deciding whether or not to install the recent Updates

Quote: "In an attempt to be helpful.

If you want to install the updates so as to report any findings then I am sure TGC would welcome the feedback here or in the Bug Report Forum - however unless you want to partake in that I would suggest you put installation of the currently available V1.01 and V1.02 updates on hold. They have issues and wont help you either in the short or longer term"




"I am and forever will be your friend"
Gemstone Games
18
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Posted: 8th Sep 2006 11:04
@WDP:
Okay, then I was proven wrong. I apologize. Up until you posted, everyone that didn't have issues were using computers specifically designed for gaming, and I had yet to see someone with that kind of comp having issues. Now I know it ain't us poor twerps alone that are dealing with it.

Formerly JMC...
sp3ng
18
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Posted: 8th Sep 2006 14:22
i think i had something to do with tgc updating fpsc

my (blocked by uman) forum post can be found here:
http://forum.thegamecreators.com/?m=forum_view&t=87627&b=26
Steve J
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Location: Vancouver, Washington
Posted: 9th Sep 2006 23:23
The nvidia 7950's have only bare minimum performance increases, and for the extra heat, it isn't worth it.

http://www.milkpaton.com/
http://phoenixophelia.com
SteveJ, less, and less Controversial!
bond1
19
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Posted: 9th Sep 2006 23:48
Quote: "The nvidia 7950's have only bare minimum performance increases, and for the extra heat, it isn't worth it."


My post above was meant to be tongue-in-cheek, as you obviously have one of the best-specced machines money can buy right now. I just thought it was funny that someone with such a powerful machine was posting about performance issues (or lack of).

----------------------------------------
"Your mom went to college."
My FPSC stuff at http://hyrumark.zftp.com/FPSC/hyrumarkfpsc.htm
uman
Retired Moderator
20
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Location: UK
Posted: 10th Sep 2006 01:30
All else being equal : the Updates released to date are neither as stable nor do they reach the same level of performance as V1 when tested on an equivalent system using the same V1 levels as a credible stable benchmark environment.

Thats apart from the fact that many users have had serious and in some instances show stopping problems with the Updates - not seen with V1.

You cant test for anything unless you use a stable and equal benchmark environment, preferably with some history of results to measure against.



"I am and forever will be your friend"
Gemstone Games
18
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Posted: 10th Sep 2006 06:29 Edited at: 10th Sep 2006 06:32
@sp3ng:
No, that wasn't responsible for the update, that was just stupid on your part. For all we know, that post pushed BACK the releases of the updates that everyone has been clamoring for. So quit trying to take credit for this, as updates to the program have been obviously planned for some time.

If you ARE responsible by some freak of a miracle, then congratulations; you have just figured out how to ruin tons of people's work in one download. Hope you're proud about that.

Formerly JMC...
uman
Retired Moderator
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Posted: 10th Sep 2006 15:15
FPSC Updates their release or development have nothing to do with users in any way whatsoever. Neither does it have anything to do with users posts or their content specifically or in particular.

FPSC Updates and releases are soley at TGC descretion and that and they will continue.

Hopefully the next Update will provide the stability that will provide the basis to allow TGC to further progress the product - thats the objective.

TGC are aware of users current difficulties and are concerned to make this so as soon as is practicably possible.

As the saying goes "Make me Happy".



"I am and forever will be your friend"
dark person12
19
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Joined: 29th Aug 2005
Location: baltimore
Posted: 11th Sep 2006 06:06 Edited at: 11th Sep 2006 07:08
[quote]OMG, how do I know if my version is updated now... I installed the patch... But when I go in FPSC, and then Help> About it says V1.0!!!

Why is that? Is it upgraded, or isn't it?

Thanks,

MaarX

when mine stats it says Early adapt version
hellp me he got v1 [mod edit] is wrong with mine
Gemstone Games
18
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Posted: 11th Sep 2006 10:12
*holds eyes shut* Can someone please translate to me what he said so that I might give him an answer that doesn't involve ripping apart the insides of his computer?

Formerly JMC...

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