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FPSC Classic Product Chat / LRMod by DarkGoblin

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Nomad Soul
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Posted: 8th Feb 2011 22:21
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Hi DG

How is this wonderful mod coming along? The last video was great.

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DarkJames
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Posted: 8th Feb 2011 22:24
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Nomad, Get in MSN, Need to talk to ya'.

...What its not Over,what brings darkness, Thats where i'm going.
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Payam
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Posted: 12th Feb 2011 11:46
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Didn't you finish your great mod?
We really like to have it.

Have our guns was a mistake!!!

I am PaYaM
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Ertlov
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Posted: 12th Feb 2011 11:54
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I hope DarkGolin doesn`t mind my jumping in here, but the last Time I talked to him he was quite busy on non-FPSC stuff and said it will take quite some time until this one can be finished.

Come to where the madness is:
http://www.homegrowngames.at
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Dark Goblin
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Posted: 12th Feb 2011 12:28 Edited at: 12th Feb 2011 12:30
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As for now it is hell of getting all the bugs out and also get more performance.
I really need to get the damn performance up because it drops in huge levels with more lights. Don't know how to do that, but I hope to get it fixed later.

Right now I am busy with school things, so its hard to find some free time to work on the mod, but I will not stop here. This is something everyone is waiting for and I will try to do it properly. I just need time for it to be stable and all that, which you can imagine is not very easy, especially if it comes to FPSC/DarkBasic and shaders. This thing needs a lot of performance and DBP is not the language which loves so much effects. I need to do some more things for it to be even useful, right now it's nothing more than that it looks good.

I have a hell of bugs on my list which I need to hunt down before I can even consider a release.
But I have also some more ideas for normal FPSC without the whole dynamic shadows thing, which would require a shader on everything, just like the LightRays (which are already in FPSC 118 --> but still without all the scriptcommands, which is something I don't understand). But I think I will add these new effects in and see how they work and than we will see.
I think I will also not give anything else to official Updates as I told them about 10times to include the scripts and they are still missing. Not to mention all the problems they had while adding my simple code.

But well, thats life.
Wish me some luck with all that and we might see some more nice effects in FPSC.

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Scurvy Lobster
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Posted: 12th Feb 2011 15:41
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Good luck to you Dark Goblin! I wish you all the best in your efforts.

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Dark Goblin
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Posted: 16th Feb 2011 18:51
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Hey guys.
Since LRMod is having some big performance issues I need to fix but have no time to do this, I started working on something else, which came to my mind some time ago.

I always thought that the water effects of FPSC (efxMod or now v118) are not the one I want to use in any game, so I started to integrate the water shader of Evolveds Advanced Lighting (expect the Parallax Water as this is in no way usable in FPSC). With this new water effects I also added the dynamic water mask, which fades the water on the edge of objects, so it looks nicer and the skybox does not appear in the reflection.

Now I "just" need to add a real underwater effect and this is done.

This addition could be a part of LRMod or be in any other Mod in the end. For now I just wanted to show you, that such nice effects are possible.

I will keep you up-to-date with any new news.





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Nomad Soul
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Posted: 16th Feb 2011 19:39
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Quote: "Since LRMod is having some big performance issues I need to fix but have no time to do this, I started working on something else, which came to my mind some time ago."


This is terrible news. The LR Mod videos looked really promising even the perforance although I guess the levels were not big.

I can understand people wanting to have water in FPSC, especially when its using Evolved shaders but dynamic shadows is way more important in the bigger picture.

If the new water gets added to the official engine like lightrays did thats a really positive thing but I hope you don't put LR Mod to the sidelines for very long.

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SHIFT_
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Posted: 16th Feb 2011 20:24
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Nomad Soul has right...dynamic shadows are more important that water..
I can understand you but please try to fix bugs for give us finally a mod with great performance...what's a game with a beautiful water without the shadows?

SHIFT_
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Woolfman
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Posted: 16th Feb 2011 20:24
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Have to agree with Nomad Soul. I really hope you don't put the LR Mod on hold to long it was fantastic work. Which would improve any FPSC game.
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Woolfman
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Posted: 24th Feb 2011 03:13
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Any news on this or any other projects Dark Goblin?
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Dark Goblin
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Posted: 24th Feb 2011 16:44 Edited at: 24th Feb 2011 16:45
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As we are planning on doing a community project on the german board and I have a lot of work to do for school, I am currently not working on LRMod, as the things that need to be done are more complicated than the things I need to do for the community project.

For it I finally added all water effects we need, which I show in this video:


LRMod will be continued after all my school work is done and the additions for the community project are done too.

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Woolfman
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Posted: 24th Feb 2011 23:44
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Quote: "LRMod will be continued after all my school work is done and the additions for the community project are done too."

Thank you very much for the update. That is FANTASTIC news.
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SHIFT_
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Posted: 27th Feb 2011 01:26
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Awesome!

SHIFT_
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Payam
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Posted: 27th Feb 2011 11:39
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I like the ocean mode more than other water modes
Now just do not think about your mod until you finished your school works because school works are more important.
And when you came back try making another water mod for beach,it should come then go back.
The ocean mod can be use for when your level is in a ship not in an island.

Have our guns was a mistake!!!

I am PaYaM
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Hamburger
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Posted: 27th Feb 2011 16:15
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Quote: "Now just do not think about your mod until you finished your school works because school works are more important"


I second that.

On the other hand, I'm probably wrong, but would this correct that "flat shadedness" of curved surfaces on static models? (see picture attached)

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Dillionaire
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Posted: 6th Mar 2011 03:12
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With my previous knowledge in the CryEngine 2 editor, I say we get rid of pre-calculated lightmaps and overhaul everything to a unified, dynamic lighting system!

I've noticed in the most recent video that with so much going on, there appears to be a signifant framerate drop, but I can't provide analysis of ZockerX's true performance hit without knowing what GPU he's running.

However, if Dark Goblin could devise a clever lightmap culling script or code, I think levels could be desiged to reduce the number of dynamic lights in the area. After all, new areas, 90-degree turns, and elevation changes are quite commonplace in FPSC games, so getting the engine to stop rendering the lights far out of view seems pretty feasible.

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Dillionaire
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Posted: 6th Mar 2011 03:12 Edited at: 6th Mar 2011 15:24
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EDIT: My post was approved and posted twice.

Any Mod may remove this post, as it was the same as the one I put before it. Thank you.

My Computer Specifications: Intel i7 980x OC @ 4.2 GHz |3x GTX 580's in SLI | 12 GB, 2000 MHz RAM (Corsair) |2x 1 TB HDD | 1.2 KW PSU |ASUS Rampage III Extreme Motherboard
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JRH
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Posted: 6th Mar 2011 12:12
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What makes this extra amazing is that the shadows are real. Very impressive work!

A few questions though:
1) Are the shadows hard or soft.
2) Are the shadows produced in an average direction, or are multiple shadows supported?

C++ is labourless... if your name starts with 'L' and ends with 'ee'.
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Dark Goblin
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Posted: 6th Mar 2011 13:35 Edited at: 6th Mar 2011 13:40
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@Dillionaire:
I don't quite understand what you mean. The lights are only rendered if they can be even seen in the view direction, so that is exactly what you mean. Also the renderer also uses all the static lightmaps of FPSC/DarkLights and the dynamic lights and combines them.

The performance hit is caused by the slow cubemap function inside DarkBasic Pro, there is nothing I can do about it. This will slow down every GPU, even my 4870.

I need to check for some performance tweaks later. But as I told, I have no time for this right now.


@JRH:
1) Currently they are rather hard, as I want them to look a bit like the DarkLight lights, but that can be changed in the end. There are 4 settings for different quality settings.

2) Multiple shadows are supported as this is a real dynamic light rendering and so all lights are rendered together.

EDIT:
Also I added a check wich takes the distance of the objects and if this is too far, they are hidden, so the light doesn't need to get rendered at all. This speeds up things. But still more lights on screen gives a performance drop. So I would need to do spot lights instead, but they are different as point lights and a lot of people would not understand how to use them and all that. Also this is not a good way to light your level. We would do more static lighting for it to look good and this is not good too.

Need to look into this a bit deeper...

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Dillionaire
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Posted: 6th Mar 2011 15:35 Edited at: 6th Mar 2011 15:35
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@Dark Goblin

If you're playing a test game in FPSC, you can hit one of the bracket keys to render everything in Wireframe mode. I've noticed that after leaving a room, the polygons of that level are still rendered. However, I think there are scripted trigger zones that can increase/decrease polygon culling, so the engine can forget the polygons and increase rendering performance.

I meant something along these lines for the dynamic lights. If you turn some corners, a trigger zone could be made to remove the dynamic lights being rendered as needed. Of course, this would only benefit the engine if you're looking at a solid wall that separates you from a dynamic light. You can't see the lights, but the engine is rendering it. What do you think?

Also, do you think completely dynamic lighting system could be created, so there are no static lights, except maybe for illuminating light fixtures correctly?

My Computer Specifications: Intel i7 980x OC @ 4.2 GHz |3x GTX 580's in SLI | 12 GB, 2000 MHz RAM (Corsair) |2x 1 TB HDD | 1.2 KW PSU |ASUS Rampage III Extreme Motherboard
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Dark Goblin
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Posted: 6th Mar 2011 18:19
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Hm the wireframe mode does not work for me. in test game of course.

The thing with the trigger zone is interesting. This could really be something. So one could place some zones where certain lights are not visible and so they are deleted. This could work...

A complete dynamic lighting system is not possible, as this would take a huge amount of ressources and the performance would be very bad. We are still talking about DarkBasic Pro ;D

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Dillionaire
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Posted: 6th Mar 2011 19:06
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@Dark Goblin

I think when I'm in a test game, "[" turns wireframe on and "]" turns it off. I can't quite remember. It helps a lot of though when I'm debugging performance issues because it shows what parts of the level are still there that I couldn't see otherwise.

Glad to help any way that I can. I must say, your work with FPSC shaders is simply amazing. One of these days your name might be up there with Bond1 in revolutionary effects in FPSC!

Ahh, I see. Now that I think about it, FPSC does have trouble with so many dynamic lights. The reason I had this in mind is because the more dynamic, real-time lighting there is in a game, the more benefits would be realized. Off the top of my head, game file size would be reduced because there would be fewer precalculated lightmaps, the amount of RAM needed when loading a level would be dramatically reduced, load times themselves would be much faster, and the atmosphere created would be so much more life-like! If you can pull this off, you'll definitely change FPSC forever!

My Computer Specifications: Intel i7 980x OC @ 4.2 GHz |3x GTX 580's in SLI | 12 GB, 2000 MHz RAM (Corsair) |2x 1 TB HDD | 1.2 KW PSU |ASUS Rampage III Extreme Motherboard
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Evil Stalker
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Posted: 17th Mar 2011 20:47
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Those water effects are very good
And the shadows are very realistic too
Nice work...

Keep up

You can run... but you can't hide... 'cause everywhere you go I'll be right behind you...
I'm a Stalker...
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Dark Goblin
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Posted: 25th Apr 2011 02:13 Edited at: 25th Apr 2011 02:14
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Hey guys it's me "again" (okay yes it was a long time since I posted in this thread).

Most of the school work is done now and I think I might have some time to continue working on the Mod now.

I just re-thought some parts of the Mod so I can get better performance (I use this post as a little list of ideas, so you can comment them if you want):

Things that can't be done:
- Use spot lights instead of point lights (would kill the lighting, tried, does not work)
- Implement real portal culling for FPSC based universe(because of the stupid behaviour of FPSC Segments)
- Dynamically calculate if a light is visible for the player (see "portal culling" reference)
- Lower performance drop with a lot of lights on screen (DarkBasic related problem with dynamic cubemaps)

Things that could be hard but possible:
- Add ambient occlusion
- Try to use something like portal culling on the dynamic shadow objects --> Not normal FPSC segments(so they are only visible when needed --> need to find a portal culling example)

Things that should be possible:
- Add a script for trigger zones to switch on/off a specific light (so the creator can set them active or not)
- Let the lighting renderer not run at full-screen resolution (better framerate)
- Get basic shader for every possible object type (entity dynamic/static; segment static)
- Fix bugs with new water (some reflection issues)
- Merge with latest available FPSC version (should not be a big problem)
- Fix animation and/or position/rotation of dynamic objects (so they don't flip around when colliding with player)
- Add newest Advanced Lighting version for performance improvements (should also be not that difficult)
- Maybe adjust shadows to be more smooth (not cut.off at the edge to the object --> need to find a way to to something like edge detect and only smooth shadows on object edges)

## Non-lighting related features# - ONLY IDEAS #
- Add real-time Depth of Field (could be very hard)
- Add pixel based motion blur (could be very hard too)
- Add real-time color correction based on overall screen color --> has to use my combined bloom/filmgrain shader


That's just a list of my thoughts. What I need more is to give me some of your ideas of what could be done, because I want to get the best out of the Mod.
So please feel free to write down your thoughts, so I can check and maybe add your's to my list too, because other people might have different and better ideas to do something.
Also if you have an example of a portal culling system in DarkBasic Pro it would be very very cool to link it for me, as that is something I'm in need of.

That is everything for now, but I hope that with your help I find everything that is needed right now.

Yours,
DG

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Michael Thompson
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Posted: 25th Apr 2011 06:41
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Ok, so this looks really good, but it looks as though it is all based on the lighting effects of the engine. are you planning on adding anything else? any other graphical effects or more commands unrelated to the lighting by any chance?
Thanks.

A mod has been erased by this sig because it is too large
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uzi idiot
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Posted: 25th Apr 2011 11:22
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Wow, it sound like it's going to be incredible if manage to fit all that in!

You have blown my mind with what you have already done, I can't wait to see what's coming next!

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Dark Goblin
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Posted: 25th Apr 2011 15:30
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Quote: "Ok, so this looks really good, but it looks as though it is all based on the lighting effects of the engine. are you planning on adding anything else? any other graphical effects or more commands unrelated to the lighting by any chance?"


Well the Mod basically is called "Light Rendering Mod" so its obvious that the most features are based on the lighting part.
But after this is finished I will take a look on other important parts (maybe even try some more scripting things, we will see).

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Red Eye
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Posted: 25th Apr 2011 17:30
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Good job on the mod so far. If you need any Portal Culling ideas or systems, i am happy to help.

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Dark Goblin
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Posted: 25th Apr 2011 19:46 Edited at: 25th Apr 2011 19:55
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Found a good working Frustrum Culling system.
Just need to implement it into FPSC and hope that it works in the source too.

I also updated the first post with the above list and added a "done/working on" etc. list to it so you can see what I'm working on currently and what is finished (of the new things only. The parts that are already in, are not in that list!)

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defiler
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Posted: 26th Apr 2011 03:23
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wow that water looks awesome, now if only we could have it work on a entity plane so we could have small puddles here and there.

very nice work.

Current Project: Lost Contact: Chapter 1
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Nomad Soul
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Posted: 26th Apr 2011 18:39
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All I ask is that we get a beta release to try out.

The lack of dynamic shadows in FPSC is really holding back what is otherwise a nice rendering pipeline.

Bond1 did a great job with his planar shadows but this isn't going to be solved with object shaders. It needs to be hard coded into the source code and Lee said fixing the experimental dynamic shadows would require a LOT of work.



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Dark Goblin
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Posted: 3rd May 2011 19:32
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I finished adding Triggerzone Scripts for deactivating or activating dynamic lights.

Will show you some InDev Footage soon and will also explain a bit what is happening.

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uzi idiot
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Posted: 3rd May 2011 19:40
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Can't wait to see more
any chance of moving dynamic lights?


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Red Eye
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Posted: 3rd May 2011 20:22 Edited at: 3rd May 2011 20:23
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@DarkGoblin: You mean other type other than Frustrum Culling... because frustrum culling is something that dbp already has... so does darkgdk. Frustrum Culling is whatever object is outside the field of the camera hide it... otherwise show it... thats already in dbp... I would look into Portal Culling or other options.

Altough i dont know if Lee switched it off in fpsc source code... but i dont think so.

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Dark Goblin
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Posted: 3rd May 2011 21:42
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I know that DBP already has object culling, but in this case, I would need one based on limbs (as the FPSC universe is only one object) or much better, a polygon based culling.

But right now I disabled the culling anyways, as it produces not much more performance but more problems. I'm finalizing the Trigger Zone Part (working good so far) and will than look if I can do a showcase Video... we will see

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Dark Goblin
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Posted: 15th May 2011 16:13 Edited at: 15th May 2011 16:35
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Well well well...

over a week and no new update. Shame on me.
Well last time I was a workin on other things, but today I have done some more work on the Mod.

Today I converted the Mod to the latest FPSC Beta (v118 Beta 15) and also started to completly rewrite the code which handles the dynamic entities, as that was a complete mess before and led to more crashes than you could imagine (I don't go into detail, as most of you would not even understand a word).

I hope that I get a better loading system done for it in the next days, but one thing is for sure, it needs a hell more work on the object shader side than before.

But for all of the guys out there who think "Is this guy crazy? I have no idea of shaders!" I can tell you, that in the end there will be a big tutorial with everything you need, understandable for everyone.

But for now, I go back to my code and see what I can do and maybe in some days the showcase video I told you about, can be done.

Thanks for your patience guys.

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ZockerX
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Posted: 15th May 2011 16:18
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Quote: "Is this guy crazy?"


Believe me, yes he is.
Thumps up your great work on it.

Greetings

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uzi idiot
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Posted: 15th May 2011 16:25 Edited at: 15th May 2011 16:26
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So we need to edit shaders to get them to work with shadows.
That's cool! Some people might want some things casting shadows and others not


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Hamburger
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Posted: 15th May 2011 17:52
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Are you going to be putting moving lights into the mod too? Just wondering.
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Dark Goblin
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Posted: 15th May 2011 17:59
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Moving Lights will be implemented if I find a good way to define where they should move.
Also this is a feature that I will start at the end of the Mod as there are other more important things to do before

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Dark Goblin
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Posted: 16th May 2011 19:23
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Okay so you waited long enough.
Today I finished the entity loading part and also the showcase video I promised to upload.

You can watch it on YouTube (be sure to watch in HD).



Please post some comments. Thanks

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JRH
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Posted: 16th May 2011 20:09
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I love evolved's lighting, but you make it look beautiful in FPSC. It creates so much extra atmosphere.

Good job!

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uzi idiot
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Posted: 16th May 2011 20:19 Edited at: 16th May 2011 20:24
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Wow! It's amazing! Have you tried it on lower PCs with lower specs?
I love your mods, but on my crappy laptop they all run at 5FPS.
(I need a better computer)

[edit]Another question, do the shadows render transparency?


Mental Stability is over-rated!
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Dark Goblin
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Posted: 16th May 2011 21:09
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Quote: "Wow! It's amazing! Have you tried it on lower PCs with lower specs?"


Not right now ^^

Quote: "[edit]Another question, do the shadows render transparency?"

They will in the end... hopefully.

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Nomad Soul
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Posted: 17th May 2011 01:43 Edited at: 17th May 2011 01:44
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@Dark Goblin

Your video was very interesting. I like the use of trigger zones to activate and deactivate lights if they can be seen.

In the video you talk about the technical things which people are not interested in but many of us are so I hope you will continue uploading them.

It looks like the best of both worlds with Doom 3 style shadows being cast from light sources with self shadowing and Half Life 2 style torch light casting shadows on the world.

Nice timing with the imminent release of V118 final source too. Please keep this mod going. EFX and Corvus mod seemed to fade away but this is much better.

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DarkFrost
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Posted: 17th May 2011 01:56
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*jaw drops*

This is what we need!!!! Hope it has good compatibility with things, such as EAI guns. Most mods seem to get errors when I place 'em in my levels.

[img][/img]
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Dark Goblin
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Posted: 17th May 2011 12:57
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@DarkFrost:
Right now weapons are a bit of a problem for me, but I haven't focused on them right now.
But in the end they will and have to work. Otherwise the Mod is useless.
That's on the top list after I get my tihngs to work.

@all:
I now added another nice feature. You can now bind a light to an Object via a main script in which you define the light color and range and it updates if you move the object. I leave it to 1 "Objectlight" only, because of the framerate.

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Joined: 23rd Jun 2009
Location: Grand Rapids MI
Posted: 17th May 2011 13:54
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Quote: "I now added another nice feature. You can now bind a light to an Object via a main script in which you define the light color and range and it updates if you move the object. I leave it to 1 "Objectlight" only, because of the framerate.

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Cool! WCould that possibly work with weapons? like a flashlight or some glowing lights on a scifi gun? Just curious, would probably require a little work, but if you said a script then if the project blue mod has weapon scripts then maybe you could use that to bind the light to a gun or something... hmmm...

Keep going!
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uzi idiot
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14
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Joined: 27th Dec 2009
Location: Who Knows?
Posted: 17th May 2011 17:46
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Quote: "You can now bind a light to an Object"

=) I'm so happy! That is going to be useful!


Mental Stability is over-rated!
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