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Work in Progress / 3D fighting game - Dark Dragon

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Dimis
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Posted: 13th Jan 2012 16:28
@Stab in the Dark software
Thanks for this helpful info! I didn't know that. I will look into it, this weekend. I am exporting my models from 3d canvas, and I don't know if there is an option to uncheck the matrix key export but I will search it when I am home. This scaling issue is a big problem, sometimes in extreme limb rotations my models appear flat!

@ The Slayer
I don't know if I will have this character directly available. Probably the player will have to finish the game in normal or higher difficulty to unlock this one.


New feature (but classic in fighting games):
I will install a "super meter". When it is full, fighters will be able to execute 2 of their special attacks with greater force. I made good use of the fog effect too. It is not impressive like the small cut scenes in the latest Street Fighter but it doesn't look bad I guess.



baxslash
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Posted: 13th Jan 2012 16:32
Oooh, that's gotta hurt

Really nice work!! I love some of those effects they are building up nicely.

Dimis
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Posted: 13th Jan 2012 16:50
Thanks Baxslash! I lost half of my sleep last night working with fog and some of the effects again...
Chris Tate
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Posted: 13th Jan 2012 16:54
I love the look of the scene props and doors; the last moment of video one really allows the character to force the scene through the door into the other area, top class.

Once sound is active it will really become broadly immersive for the player.

Dimis
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Posted: 13th Jan 2012 17:43
@Chris Tate
Thanks! I have 2 backgrounds where fighters can move to another area. There may be more at the final version.
And yes, the sound... It is time to do something about that...
FireIndy
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Posted: 14th Jan 2012 18:11
Just would like to say, the videos of all of this are very impressive. I am really not into these types of games, but to see such a level of polish and fluidity in a DBPro, is amazing. Awesome work

DevilLiger
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Posted: 1st Mar 2012 12:55
so how's progress on the game?

Dimis
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Posted: 2nd Mar 2012 14:38
@ FireIndy
Thank you very much for your comments!

@ DevilLiger
Progress was slow last month. I had a lot of things to take care off and only a little time for the game.

Now, I have one new fighter to show. One of my favorite Mortal Kombat fighters is the iced ninja SubZero. So I wanted to have a fighter who can freeze his opponents in my game too. He is a giant half dragon - half human who can spit ice projectiles, and also creates a cold ground wave from his body that freezes his opponents on the spot.


baxslash
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Posted: 2nd Mar 2012 14:41
Awesome

Dimis
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Posted: 2nd Mar 2012 14:42
Thanks baxslash!
Pincho Paxton
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Posted: 2nd Mar 2012 17:59
It has to be one of the best DBPro projects of all time.

Dimis
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Posted: 5th Mar 2012 18:15
@Pincho Paxton
Thank you! I have worked very hard on this project and I am glad that people like it.

Now there is something else that I just decided to post here. I wasn't sure if I was going to show this to anyone yet. I thought of remaking the original Mortal Kombat 1 in 3D using my game's engine. So the last 2 months, when I had a little extra time I worked on that.
But considering that I don't have enough time for this project I abandoned it. I wouldn't be able to do anything with it anyway, considering the copyrighted characters and all that...

baxslash
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Posted: 6th Mar 2012 09:54
Niiice!! Loved that game...

Dimis
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Posted: 7th Mar 2012 17:59
Quote: "Niiice!! Loved that game..."

Me too of course. MK1 & MK2 are 2 of my favorite games of all times. Perhaps I will complete this remake in the future.

Now I was thinking that I have progressed my game enough, since the first demo, so maybe it is time to make a new, updated one. I will need a lot of feedback and criticism from anyone who is willing to download and test a new demo version. I suppose that there has to be a lot of bugs and problems that I am not aware of yet. I need a couple of weeks to make final adjustments in gameplay, menus and the general appearance of the game.
DevilLiger
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Posted: 8th Mar 2012 23:53
your Mortal Kombat remake looks amazing, but still that was a good move to abandon it. otherwise there would of have been the copyrights people knocking at your door or something. i think the ice dragon guy is awesome.

Quel
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Posted: 9th Mar 2012 01:09
Damn... nobody knocks on your door because of a free remake of something...

-Mental Hybrid: A unique heavy story based shoot'em ~40% (primary project)
-CoreFleet: An underground commander unit based RTS (canned) ~15%
baxslash
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Posted: 9th Mar 2012 10:02
True, free games don't tend to get in trouble.

I wish I had your experience in poser Dimis, I would really like to make some characters for a game idea I have but I'm finding getting back into poser very hard (despite having been quite good on a free version of Poser 5 I got in a PC magazine a few years ago)... it's not the most forgiving program. Undo only remembers 1 action for a start

Keep up the great work anyway!

DevilLiger
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Posted: 9th Mar 2012 11:33
this is proof that they do shut you down. every heard of the Chrono Trigger remake? well it was shut down. here is the link the to video at least.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-ANEBIB0oao

baxslash
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Posted: 9th Mar 2012 11:46
That's a shame... looks good. I didn't think the big companies would be too bothered about none-profit games. If anything it's a good way to find new talent, maybe squaresoft just got jealous they didn't think of doing a remake like this (or were incapable) or maybe there's more to the story. Looks like a rather huge fan project.

Dimis
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Posted: 9th Mar 2012 12:27 Edited at: 9th Mar 2012 12:29
About the copyrights, I found that there are a few 2d MK remakes created in mugen, that are considered fan artwork, and so far people who created them don't have any problems.
Why should there be a problem with free remakes?
Anyway about my remake, I was more concerned about the copyrighted characters. The copyrights of MK belong now to Warner Bross and there could be a problem with them. A few years back when I was working in digital printing I knew of a client who was forced to remove a big sticker of Taz from her car. And it happened here in Greece.
So, if I was to complete this remake eventually, I would probably have to keep it for myself...

I am glad that you like the ice dragon DevilLiger. He is my favorite character from all 25.

About Poser baxslash, it is a great program but this one undo option is a problem, indeed. You only have that, and one more option to "memorize" the entire scene as a second undo. Since this is a little of topic, mail me what you want to make, and I will see if I can help.
The Slayer
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Posted: 9th Mar 2012 14:10
I told this before, but I'll say it again, amazing work, Dimis!

Regarding Poser, I have Poser Pro 8, and it's a great program indeed.

My version does give a bit of trouble when there's a Flash program running, but other than that, no issues so far.
One thing though, I'm not sure if you're aware of this, but as far as I know, you may not distribute the 3D models you create/animate with Poser. Non-commercial, it shouldn't be a problem, I think.
You are allowed to distribute the 2D version of your characters, though.

Cheers

Dimis
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Posted: 9th Mar 2012 14:37
Thanks The Slayer!

About Poser, as I understand from the license agreement, you can't distribute the models specifically the mesh and the textures that come with the package or Poser. There is no limitation concerning models that you create and animate as they are your creations.
Since I am still using Poser 4 and I will probably buy the latest version, I wanted to ask you if version 8 supports .x format export with animation?
The Slayer
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Posted: 9th Mar 2012 14:45
Quote: "I wanted to ask you if version 8 supports .x format export with animation?"

Nope, no directx export. Speaking of which, how do you export your models (with animation) that you make in Poser?

Cheers

Dimis
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Posted: 9th Mar 2012 14:57 Edited at: 25th Mar 2012 00:20
I don't. I only create the animations in Poser and export them to .BVH. Then I import the BVH to 3d canvas and export again to direct x. My models load the animations using the append command. I create the models in 3d canvas. I used as a base a makehuman model.
It is complicated work, I know. I thought that I could avoid all that using the latest Poser but I didn't know that there is no directx export. I thought there was.
I have to start using 3d studio or Blender for my future games.

Cheers


Dimis
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Posted: 25th Mar 2012 02:07 Edited at: 25th Mar 2012 02:11
I was thinking that maybe I should attempt to make the game fully 3d. So I added more walking animations and allowed fighters to walk in the Z axis too. The big problem with this, is that the camera keeps going behind background objects all the time. So either I had to make background objects dissapear when the camera goes behind them, or design all backgrounds again, having all object moved away from the arena area.
Instead of following any off those 2 options, I simply restrained camera's movement up to a point. The result is something between 2.5d and 3d view. Perhaps I should call it 2.75d?
Anyway this is the result:


Of course I have to complete some areas of the backgrounds because they look empty.


Irradic
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Posted: 25th Mar 2012 03:51
This looks really great Dimis ! I think the new camera is a great improvement.
Your animations look really good. Quiet a work flow you got there, but the results are great. How is it to animate with poser ? Do you have IK etc ?

DevilLiger
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Posted: 25th Mar 2012 11:58
the camera is good too. you might have to fade away objects if you have to. i would suggest either redesign your level or keep it the original way.

Dimis
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Posted: 27th Mar 2012 16:42 Edited at: 27th Mar 2012 16:53
@DevilLiger
Having the fighters move free in the background is more fun so I will keep it that way. But I want to complete this game as soon as I can so I will not redesign the backgrounds. I also noticed that some animations look better when viewed from the side as the game was originally but when they are viewed from the front they don't look that good. Plus the models have a lot of designing flaws and they need corrections but I will leave everything as it is now.
I never expected to make this a complete game from the start, I saw it more as a tutorial for me, in 3d game making. I am already thinking of a sequel or better a prequel with a complete story and gameplay. I created a new model and I am experimenting with better animations and a completely 3d environment.
When I am done with this model I could upload a demo just to show how my next game will be like.

Edit - This one will have better sound I hope...


DevilLiger
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Posted: 28th Mar 2012 10:01
either way i can't wait to see this one done. looks very promising. I would like to see more fighting games on the PC anyways.

Dimis
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Posted: 2nd Apr 2012 16:41 Edited at: 2nd Apr 2012 17:04
Ok, the game is upgraded to fully 3d now. I decided to use the 3d view instead of the initial 2.5d, so eventually I have to redesign all my backgrounds. I had a problem with background objects getting in front of the camera but that is fixed now. I should thank Mobiius & Fallout for suggesting camera - objects distance checks to make objects hide when they block the view. I feared that, this solution could slow the game down, but it works very well.

Here are 2 videos that simply show the new 3d view of the game.






baxslash
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Posted: 2nd Apr 2012 16:43
Just too damned good for words... Like the new name too!

Dimis
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Posted: 2nd Apr 2012 16:49
Thanks baxslash! I am not sure about the title still. The thread's name is wrong now. It should probably be renamed to "3d fighting game. Possibly named "Dark Kumite".

Congratulations and my best wishes for the new family member!


baxslash
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Posted: 2nd Apr 2012 16:55
Thanks Dimis!

Pincho Paxton
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Posted: 2nd Apr 2012 18:03
I can't put it into every day words, so I remember an advert for Pepsi...

Lipsmackin' thirstquenchin' acetastin' motivatin' goodbuzzin' cooltalkin' highwalkin' fastlivin' evergivin' coolfizzin' Dark Kumite!

Dimis
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Posted: 2nd Apr 2012 22:22 Edited at: 2nd Apr 2012 22:23
Thanks!
Just saw the advert on youtube.


Dr Tank
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Posted: 8th Apr 2012 05:07
Looks even better than before. I prefer "3D" movement in fighting games. It feels more cinematic and real.
TheComet
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Posted: 8th Apr 2012 11:11
@ Dimis

Is it possible for someone to create a level to add to this game? What are the requirements and specifications?

I love the work you've done on this! Do you have "special" attacks implemented? Something like a special bar that fills up slowly the more you hit your opponent, and when it reaches a certain level you can unleash a super attack.

TheComet

Dimis
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Posted: 9th Apr 2012 13:51
@Dr Tank
Thanks. The 3D movement certainly feels more real. There is no point making a 3d fighting game without using the Z axis, I finally realized that. Still I have to fix a few camera and AI bugs now, but I will keep the game fully 3D.

@ TheComet
Quote: "Is it possible for someone to create a level to add to this game? What are the requirements and specifications?"

If you want to create a background for the game, sure it is possible, I can post instructions. Or do you mean an ingame level editor? Because I don't plan to install something like that.


TheMechanic
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Posted: 9th Apr 2012 14:47
Dimis, What can I say? this project is just WOW!

You really have LOADS!!!! of TALENT!!!! but you probably already know that

What plugins did you use to create Dark Kumite?

Congratulations on this project you definately have a VERY bright future ahead of you! Keep it up!
TheComet
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Posted: 9th Apr 2012 21:50
Quote: "If you want to create a background for the game, sure it is possible, I can post instructions."


That's what I meant

TheComet

Dimis
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Posted: 10th Apr 2012 15:12
@ TheMechanic
Thank you very much!
I didn't use any plugin, so far, for the development of the game just native DBpro staff.

@ TheComet
Great, I'd like a new background for my game.
A few details:
Each backgrounds is consisted from 4 - 6 separated objects with multiple limbs, using simple textures. Nothing special with that.
But keep in mind that:
Each background is loaded at the beginning of every fight and unless there is a rematch at the end of the fight, the background is deleted and the next one is loaded for the next fight. That means they need to load quickly, they can't be too "heavy".
Now the only serious problem you should know, has to do with background objects that are near the "fighting area". Usually the camera goes behind them and the view gets blocked. I have 2 ways to solve that. I try to keep objects, (big walls for example), 1 sided if it is possible. For other objects that can't be 1 sided you can do something else. Make them separated limbs included in 1 object and I have installed code that will hide those limbs when they block the view.

I hope that I am making sense here, because I am at work and I am typing fast.

I will try to post some images for example later today or tomorrow and more details.

Is there something specific that you have in mind for a background or anything more that you want to ask?


TheComet
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Posted: 11th Apr 2012 08:28 Edited at: 11th Apr 2012 08:40
Yes, I have one more question. Can I make it animated? The fighting area will stay static, but I'd like to have moving parts in the background area. How do you handle your smoke, electricity, flashing lights etc. in your videos?

[EDIT] Oh and the most important thing. What are the dimensions of the playing area?

The few ideas I had are:

-Space station
-Swamp
-Caves

TheComet

Dimis
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Posted: 11th Apr 2012 16:07
@ TheComet
Quote: "Yes, I have one more question. Can I make it animated? The fighting area will stay static, but I'd like to have moving parts in the background area. How do you handle your smoke, electricity, flashing lights etc. in your videos?"

The background can be animated, no problem.
About the effects, that depends on the type of effect. I don't use any plugins, I am trying to use simple Dbpro stuff. In the last 2 videos that I posted, for example, the vapor in the second video is made of plain ghosted objects with scrolling texture. The blinking red light in the back is done with texture swap combined with a toggling light source. The electricity in the first video is another ghosted object with a little limb manipulation (random rotation, random scaling and vertical offset). But I also have animated objects like flags.

Quote: "Oh and the most important thing. What are the dimensions of the playing area?"

The size of the fighting area is approximately 1000 horizontal x 600 vertical units. The rest of the background is extended more, depending on the background.
I keep the fighting area in rectangle or square shape because I don't use collision checks to keep the fighters in the borders. I use simple coordinate checks. Maybe I should see if I can use sliding collision to give the backgrounds different shapes, or to put breakable objects in the backgrounds.
Quote: "The few ideas I had are:

-Space station
-Swamp
-Caves"

A swamp or cave background sounds good. I was planning to make a cave too. A swamp could be interesting. You are thinking of having the fighters walking in the water of the swamp?
Now about the space station, I don't think that it will not fit in the game. But it could be an extra hidden background that a player could unlock somehow. There was something similar in Soul Calibur 4, I think that you could unlock a background from Star Wars.


CumQuaT
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Posted: 12th Apr 2012 05:48
Wow, haven't looked at this for a while. It's come so far! Well done! It's looking amazing!


Design Runner
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Posted: 16th Apr 2012 01:12
I would love to make a background as well. If I handled it properly, would I be able to make a raft on a river? I would animate the water plane, ground, and trees to move in a circle. Simple bilboard trees at a distance would look awesome. I could make all of the models and textures, but when it comes to the water I would leave the shaders to you. Maybe I could even have them on a 18th century style boat?

Dimis
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Posted: 17th Apr 2012 17:55
@ CumQuaT
Thank you for your comments!

@Design Runner
A 18th century style boat on a river sounds very good! I'd like to have something like that in the game! I will take care of the water. Nice to have more names in the credits of the game. Waiting to see how it will look like!


And now the game has a music composer! Community member "Subzero" (perfect name for the composer of my game) agreed to provide soundtracks for the game! Welcome onboard!


Design Runner
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Posted: 18th Apr 2012 05:34
aprox. what is my poly limit for the boat, and for the outside? I have no doubt with the terrain polys, tree polys, and boat, it will get quite high.

Dimis
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Posted: 18th Apr 2012 17:42
I don't keep a track of the poly count of my backgrounds. Generally I try to keep backgrounds at the lowest possible count, without sacrificing quality, at least for objects that are near the fighting area.
I don't mind that much about distant objects because the camera will never go near them.
So far I have no problems with complex backgrounds, only with big transparencies.
I suppose that the boat can be higher than all other objects because it will be the main theme of the background and the camera will focus on it. Trees will increase the poly count inevitably. I personally can't make a good low poly tree.
When I get the chance I will count my scenes to give you an average count.


Design Runner
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Posted: 18th Apr 2012 23:08
Ok, I finished modelling the ship. Final tri count is 2132.



I still need to unwrap it and apply textures. What texture maps will I need other than diffuse? spec, normal, gloss, bump, etc?

Dimis
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Posted: 20th Apr 2012 20:03
Just saw it. Nice work with the model!
The 2132 count is good. It could even be higher than that.
But I have 2 problems... I know that it is a ship and it is supposed to have 1 or more sails, but the fighting area must be clear of all objects. The mast is in the middle of the background and I will have problems working with it. All fighting games that usually have objects in the fighting area make them breakable so they don't get in the way of the fight.
The biggest problem is that the boat is too small so it has to stretch a lot, to give enough space for the fighters and for the camera to move.
Can you send me the model as a simple object, just to make a test to see how big it should be and if there are any problems with the camera's view?


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