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Dark GDK / DGDK Open Source Project

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Hassan
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Posted: 16th Apr 2010 10:00
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i think having such huge amount of players requires a super computer, not a super engine

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haliop
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Posted: 16th Apr 2010 10:05
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nope, i dont think so ..
as you not always seing all the players , just the ones on your server.. and when you look at the temp server think that the it dosent render the one behind you , so you half your server and half temp.. which is still good.
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TechLord
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Posted: 16th Apr 2010 14:35
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Quote: "after matty talked about UDK , i went and checked it out.

its pretty amazing , its a powerful editor
including everything one needs in order to finish a high detail super extreme games."
UDK is very nice, however, one still requires Designers, Artist and Coders to produce a high detail super extreme game with it. Other drawbacks: Not Open Source & Not for MMOs. I reviewed it a while back for developing The Arrowhead Project - A FPS Fan Game based on Stephen King's The MIST. There is no doubt that UDK could pull off The Arrowhead Project, however, I'm focused on S3GE. When S3GE/S3GEd/S3GW is complete I'm, confident I will be able to craft The Arrowhead Project and all of my other game ideas with it.

Quote: "btw two days ago , i was sitting with some friends and we lith up a smoking accesoris and it hit me, MMOFPS up 2 100000000000 players with no lags, i dont know why i didnt thought of it before, but its absolutly amazing, i actually think i can sell the idea behind it for alot of money.. but , i post it here , for us so everyone can enjoy it , and if it were included in S3GE , well that would honestly make it Super for networking also."
I honestly do not know if 2 100000000000 players is necessary to be fun. MAG has top reviews and supports only 256 Players. Awhile back, I wanted to developed MMOs, today, I'm leaning towards smaller scale Co-op Online Game.

Hows the Logo coming along? I sure would like to replace the Cube - lol.

Super 3D Game Engine (S3GE) - The Ultimate All-in-1 3D Game Engine in development with Dark GDK.
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TechLord
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Posted: 16th Apr 2010 15:11 Edited at: 16th Apr 2010 15:12
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haliop
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Posted: 16th Apr 2010 16:46
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yeah i didnt sat on it yet
was too excited with udk
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haliop
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Posted: 16th Apr 2010 16:46
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hi you didnt answer about the server idea, do you think that can be done?
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jezza
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Posted: 16th Apr 2010 17:29
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Hi guys. Every now and then I seem to come back to these forums and remember this project, and feel guilty for doing nothing.
I notice you are using the old version of the PhysX SDK, a new one was released early this year.
It's nice to see the wiki I created for DarkGDK is still being added to.


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TechLord
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Posted: 16th Apr 2010 17:49 Edited at: 16th Apr 2010 18:01
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Quote: "techlord, is this possible to include in S3GE?"


haliop,

Any Peer-to-Peer, Server/Client configuration could be achieved in S3GE as its open-source. You have a nice illustration there, however, most MMOs use a similar `shard` architecture to manage `zones`. Also, I only see how servers connect. What type of how scenegraph optimizations are made for mass distribution? Load Balancing? Database connectivity? Client side processing optimization such: dead-reckoning, rendering occlusion, physics? There are several areas of optimization not conveyed in the illustration. I personally think the massive amount graphics needed to be displayed with a gazillion players in a scene will cause more lag' then the networking.

Super 3D Game Engine (S3GE) - The Ultimate All-in-1 3D Game Engine in development with Dark GDK.
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Matty H
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Posted: 16th Apr 2010 18:04
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Haliop - I think having 100000000000000 players in one massive game is achievable, like Techlord said, MAG has 256 players, they designed a completely new server structure for that game and I'm sure there are lots of different ways to accomadate lots of players. Like you said, you would not need a powerful super computer as long as your game is designed to keep about a 64 player maximum in your immediate area.

I'm just not sure that more players always means a better game, it would take a super awesome original concept to convince me that a FPS with more that 256 players is worth working on.


Jezza - I never knew about the new PhysX SDK, I have had a couple of weeks off from PhysX but I will look into updating it over the weekend, thanks.

fulcrum physics - free collision/physics plug-in for DarkGDK
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haliop
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Posted: 16th Apr 2010 19:01
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well it was just an imaginary number
talking about a max of 1024 players
which simulate a real war scnerio
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haliop
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Posted: 16th Apr 2010 19:37
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Logo ScreenShot:

not done yet


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TechLord
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Posted: 16th Apr 2010 22:23
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Haliop, thats looking really amazing!!!!

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Matty H
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Posted: 17th Apr 2010 00:00
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Haliop, thats super awesome cool. I may look at vehicles next for Fulcrum even though I may be jumping the gun slightly but I am itching to put them in. I know I have your other model of the car but this would be even better, I would just need the wheels as seperate meshes or limbs, I think lol.

fulcrum physics - free collision/physics plug-in for DarkGDK
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haliop
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Posted: 17th Apr 2010 07:43
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yeah , well since i have some problems with exporting from blender
the main body is one limb and the wheels , bells (i think they are bells.. hmm) and chimny (is that the right word?) and the sphere at the front are a second limb.

about the car wheels , i'll make some wheels you choose.
altough i have no idea on how to implent Normal Textures
it still looks pretty good

and tnx.
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TechLord
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Posted: 17th Apr 2010 09:54
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Hey everyone, I'm working on multiple aspects of S3GE:

1. Revamping Main.cpp to prep new Demo Menu & S3GEd. Say Goodbye to the boring Cube and prepare for awesome MAUI Menus. MAUI has Basic GUI functionality and I've started building menus for S3GEd. There is a significant amount work required for MAUI to compete with Windows (hehe), but, I will add functionality as I go.

2. Building up Darknet Extension: HTTP Server File Transfer, Realtime Message Protocol. Once this functionality is place, S3GE will have the option to load media/data files from remote servers. This is the first step in supporting Master Multi Layer Server (MMLS) Architecture, Moderated Open Repositories, Built-in Version Control, Update/Addon System, Online Stores, and much much more.



3. Writing Preliminary Super 3D Game World (S3GW) XML Format for Loading 3D World Data. I will start writing a XML File to replace all Geometry, Physics, data thats currently hardcoded. This is the initial Format that will be extended to support loading all World Data, SpecialFX, MECS, CHIMP and others into S3GE.

Super 3D Game Engine (S3GE) - The Ultimate All-in-1 3D Game Engine in development with Dark GDK.
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haliop
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Posted: 17th Apr 2010 09:57
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awesome!
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haliop
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Posted: 17th Apr 2010 10:00
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btw Matty
please check this site i think you will find it most intersting
its the site i started 3d modeling with.

http://www.the-blueprints.com/
it has all and i say all and i repeat ... all vehicle blue prints you can imagine , also have mobile phones and stuff..

why do i want you to check it?
well , choose a model for your game.
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haliop
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Posted: 17th Apr 2010 10:13
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i have found the problem with exporting from blender
i'll make a post about in the main GDK.

for short "Modifiers" , mostly i use a Mirror modifier for getting the work faster , sometimes i just forget that its there so i finish the model and export but it dosent show.. a problem accured in X viewer.. hmm the exported model size is good.. it should work..
well , blender dosenot temp remove the modifier "Mirror" so it makes a problem with the Exported Model,
fix:
Saving the Model or Blend file on another name "Save as"
applying all Modifiers , exporting.. and walla
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haliop
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Posted: 17th Apr 2010 10:28 Edited at: 17th Apr 2010 10:29
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here is the model btw , Tech pls check it to see if you can load it and it works well , then i'll texture it.

btw after reviewing it a bit
i see that there are some changes need to be made for it to be sharper, still i need to know if it works on your end , and can you tell me the Tri count?

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TechLord
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Posted: 17th Apr 2010 10:33 Edited at: 18th Apr 2010 13:47
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New Splash Screen
(View Availability has Expired.)


Super 3D Game Engine (S3GE) - The Ultimate All-in-1 3D Game Engine in development with Dark GDK.
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haliop
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Posted: 17th Apr 2010 11:04
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tech does the model works on your end?
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TechLord
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Posted: 17th Apr 2010 11:08 Edited at: 17th Apr 2010 11:09
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Quote: "tech does the model works on your end?"
I recommend you test it with DGDK on your end. If works for you, it will work for me.

Super 3D Game Engine (S3GE) - The Ultimate All-in-1 3D Game Engine in development with Dark GDK.
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haliop
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Posted: 17th Apr 2010 11:40
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working.
starting to texture it now.
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haliop
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Posted: 17th Apr 2010 13:45 Edited at: 17th Apr 2010 13:51
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here is the model with diffrent materials and colors
couldnt texture it for some reason.. had some problems with it
altough i did the s3ge texture but it dosent show after exporting

i really need a good and understanable uv tutorial for blender..
well , here is the model just without the S3GE

picutre from blender showing the S3GE


tech can you show a pic from how it looks inside S3GE?

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Matty H
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Posted: 18th Apr 2010 00:50 Edited at: 18th Apr 2010 01:03
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Thats great haliop, with the work you are doing and Techlords latest update I got a boost of motivation, I completed raycasting and also added contact reports, lets keep the momentum going.

Just a quick question, now that we have the source to DarkGDK(still have not looked at it) do we see S3GE as using its own build of DarkGDK? If we actually alter anything of course.


EDIT: When you replace the box with the train, just use a box for collision for now, I will eventually setup a compound actor for it which will make the collision object more accurate.

fulcrum physics - free collision/physics plug-in for DarkGDK
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haliop
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Posted: 18th Apr 2010 11:27
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awesome! im glad to hear that!
im all in with S3GE , i think i'll do more modeling and art and less coding altough coding is possible, im just not as a good cooder as i thought , and i cant seem to sit down and think recently well... nvm

if anything needs to be done , dont be shy.
ask i'll do it with love, or not do it at all

ohh lol , there is the mascot thing
hmm..
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TechLord
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Posted: 18th Apr 2010 13:30 Edited at: 20th Apr 2010 01:34
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S3GE Loco Logo v2 inside the Engine (YouTube)

Quote: "Just a quick question, now that we have the source to DarkGDK(still have not looked at it) do we see S3GE as using its own build of DarkGDK? If we actually alter anything of course."
Yes.

Super 3D Game Engine (S3GE) - The Ultimate All-in-1 3D Game Engine in development with Dark GDK.
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haliop
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Posted: 18th Apr 2010 14:43 Edited at: 18th Apr 2010 14:44
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nice vid , i dont want to be rude.. but i think credit for the model should be there somewhere?

and why does it looks like that?
colors are messed up .. i guess a texture is required, altough on direct X viewer it looks fine.
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TechLord
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Posted: 18th Apr 2010 15:01
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Quote: "nice vid , i dont want to be rude.. but i think credit for the model should be there somewhere?

and why does it looks like that?
colors are messed up .. i guess a texture is required, altough on direct X viewer it looks fine."
Your name is in the source credits. The vid is temporary. That is what it looks like in the engine. We need the texture.

Super 3D Game Engine (S3GE) - The Ultimate All-in-1 3D Game Engine in development with Dark GDK.
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haliop
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Posted: 18th Apr 2010 15:07
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ok i'll work on the texture

, in directX viewer all materials looks fine
maybe a directX code can fix it inside GDK?
cause if it works there.. shouldnot be a problem right?
will the engine use Materials or Texutres?
or a combination of both?
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TechLord
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Posted: 18th Apr 2010 15:12 Edited at: 18th Apr 2010 15:35
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Quote: "ok i'll work on the texture

, in directX viewer all materials looks fine
maybe a directX code can fix it inside GDK?
cause if it works there.. shouldnot be a problem right?
will the engine use Materials or Texutres?
or a combination of both? "
DarkGDK uses textures. Theres a hidden mode not in the DGDK documentation. I found something in the DBPro Docs. I'm checking into it.

Quote: "
LOAD OBJECT

This command loads a model into the specified 3D object number. You must specify a model in the X, 3DS, MDL, MD2 or MD3 format. Once you have loaded the 3D object file successfully, you can use the specified 3D object number to position, rotate, scale, animate and manipulate your 3D object. The object number should be specified using an integer value. The optional Load Mode parameter controls how the data loaded from the model is handled, and which behaviour is required. An additional Reduce Texture mode also controls a run-time scale down of the loaded texture plate. Be aware that when you load an object that has associated textures, you are handing over texture management to the engine which will attempt to save texture memory by re-using textures previously loaded from the same filename. To take over texture management, use LOAD IMAGE and TEXTURE OBJECT commands.

Load Mode:
0-DBV1 legacy behaviour
1-DBPro : out of the box new pro standard
2-Leave states alone to keep material/diffuse effects
3-Leave states alone to keep material/texture effects
4-Ensure object blends texture and diffuse at stage zero
5-Leave states alone to keep multi-material effects

Reduce Texture Mode:
0-No Reduction
N-Divide By N
Syntax

LOAD OBJECT Filename, Object Number
LOAD OBJECT Filename, Object Number, Texture Mode
"


I tried each Texture Mode. There was no change

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haliop
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Posted: 18th Apr 2010 16:33
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it just comes to mind
what if one have a car model for example
you have the main body which probably has some reflection
and you have the windows that are transparent ...

now , if DirectX can use some materails on the same model then it should work both with GDK and DBpro, or just native Directx to manipulate one of the above.

on the other hand we can always make 2 models , one for the car and one for the window , the only problem is that we will have to glue them together meaning more cpu power to keep it together with XYZ ,Rotation and all..
what if you have 20 cars.. its 40 models that could easily be dealt with GPU only instead of CPU..
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haliop
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Posted: 18th Apr 2010 17:19
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Logo Model Update:
after doing some mastering in UV .. and! i finnaly got it , and im having a new approach which is more like the normal uv we see on other models , meaning you will be able with gimp or photoshop to change whatever you want texture wise , with good accuracy and percision. im still working on it and i want to make it as simple as i can , it takes time as its a manual work.. but well worth it .

more:

Limbs are now seperated
wheels (duo)
chimny
front bars

everything is now seperated so it will be easier to manipulate in game and actually to costumize it the way you want .

-------------------------
triangles , was 88## someting like that.. and now its 8082 (800 less)

-------------------------

renamed all limbs / objects
such as front wheels , center wheels , rear wheels..
chimy , front bars
wheel connectors (or wheelCon)

will be eaiser to debug it ingame session.

------
release of the final model
tonight or tommarow , depending on the UV succses.
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haliop
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Posted: 18th Apr 2010 20:58
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ok , uv is fOuOcked up...
i hate it.
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Matty H
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Posted: 18th Apr 2010 23:25
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Don't give up haliop, I'm just about to try to set te car up with physics, it may take a while though as its a little tricky to get the balance right, wheel material, friction, suspension etc.. the list goes on.

fulcrum physics - free collision/physics plug-in for DarkGDK
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haliop
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Posted: 19th Apr 2010 09:54
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not giving up , its just too complicated to do something that is not complicated at all.. blender has some feature i would love to delete
... damn i always forget its an open source.. i can make something with it ..
like giving it an extension to Fulcrum or Maui
this way , once the model is done , i add parts of Physics for say
and it gives an output file that fulcrum can read for setup a vehicle or any other type of armed or junction based models..

dont know what i can do with it for Maui..
i will look into that.. that could speed our work by a ton.
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marlou
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Posted: 19th Apr 2010 12:44
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I wonder when we can start making a functional game.
I have been spending my time learning DirectX and OpenGL and just realized i should concentrate making games. It's starting to get unenjoyable. And I completely forgot about the pathfinding. Sorry about that. XD.
Sigh.. Can someone start a game design board for DOSP so we can make a game already? Maybe i should just make my own game.
Im also wondering why the source codes of DarkGDK doesnt show low level access. Its pretty useless and I have tried to load other file formats into DarkGDK but failed.
Its almost two years since i started my game development craze and havent made a game. XD. Its too much. I cant stand it anymore. XD
I should make a game once and for all by any means.

So..uhmm..good work guys..we already have mascots and stuffs.
How do i download the sourcecodes of dosp?
I cant figure out.

When a person has nothing but a dream, can he dare to dream.
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haliop
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Posted: 19th Apr 2010 15:00
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marlou , how about coming with an idea for a game?
concept.. who vs who.. normal stuff.. and we can implent these as an Example game for dosp
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Isocadia
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Posted: 19th Apr 2010 16:35
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Well, instead of the demo you have now, with 1 gizmo and 1 object, why don't you put someone on creating a world, where the demo is like a game where you simply walk and by clicking on, I don't know, doors, you activate different parts of the engine. So lets say I got a street, and each stone I step on activates something that shows the power of the engine.

Just an idea.

Isocadia

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Matty H
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Posted: 19th Apr 2010 20:35
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marlou - I have finished raycasting but I have not updated yet, if you need it for AI soon let me know and I'll update asap.

Techlord - Going on comments above, how about having a testing world for S3GE, I would suggest maybe a terrain(using blitz terrain if possible) with various objects to aid testing physics, AI etc.
In fact, I started doing something similar to test my physics:



I need a runway, somewhere to launch a rocket, a few ramps, maybe a garage to keep haliops car in etc..

You could also show off maui by making a few buttons which may alter the world in some way, or control a remote vehicle or something.

Anyway, whatever it is I would suggest we give it a testing look, like mine above.

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haliop
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Posted: 19th Apr 2010 21:31
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lol.. its still without wheels... hehehehehehehehehhe
i lauged after a whole day spending banging my head infront of blender uv mapping , almost bought Z brush then figured out.. damn i dont have the money for that..

well nvm,
yhmm here it is:
LocoLogo v0.2
why 0.2?
cause its not finsihed yet..
too many triangles. about 8000, that can easily downgrade to about 3000 even less
0.2 , also becouse UV texture is at its simpliest form and need some work in it to make it better looking like a hot potato focusing on the "hot".

ok , enough here is a picture of the UV texturing
using 2 Textures
1. MainBody
2. Accesories
ENJOY , download like below (ps. not working in DirectX 10 dont know why.. )

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haliop
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Posted: 19th Apr 2010 21:32 Edited at: 19th Apr 2010 21:36
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btw , matty mind if i grab the code for the car on terrain?

edit:
about the world demo idea...
how about one main world as a junction, where each one of us will have "he's own place" in it , making multiple world, where you can code for yourself familliarizing self with maui / fulcrum?

like a demo with levels , each one of us can show his style..
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Hassan
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Posted: 19th Apr 2010 21:46 Edited at: 19th Apr 2010 21:46
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@matty : hey that's a car, not a ship, why's it diving over there

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Matty H
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Posted: 19th Apr 2010 22:20
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@Hassan - lol, I might try to put wheels on tonight.
@haliop - At the moment the car does not really drive very well on the terrain, I'm currently working on it. When I finish vehicles I will update and it will be available to everyone.

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haliop
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Posted: 19th Apr 2010 22:31
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put 4 cylinder for now , i will make you a wheel...
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Matty H
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Posted: 20th Apr 2010 00:07 Edited at: 20th Apr 2010 00:08
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No rush, I just made a quick wheel in 3DWS. Trying to figure out how to get it positioned and rotated in the right place, I cant find any up to date examples anywhere

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TechLord
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Posted: 20th Apr 2010 01:37 Edited at: 20th Apr 2010 02:04
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S3GE Loco Logo v2 inside the Engine (YouTube)

Quote: "Techlord - Going on comments above, how about having a testing world for S3GE, I would suggest maybe a terrain(using blitz terrain if possible) with various objects to aid testing physics, AI etc."
I'm working out the S3GW XML Format & Parser. If you have ideas for the format please advise.

Quote: "Can someone start a game design board for DOSP so we can make a game already?"
Give it a go Marlou. How is Pathfinding coming along?

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Matty H
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Posted: 20th Apr 2010 03:09 Edited at: 20th Apr 2010 03:14
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Quote: "I'm working out the S3GW XML Format & Parser. If you have ideas for the format please advise."


I'm afraid thats something I have no clue about, never really done anything with XML, are you going to hold all the physics objects variables in there or does that go somewhere else? <-- see, no clue lol.


EDIT: Haliop, I have your car driving around the terrain with wheels, the code is very messy at the moment and the car is a little unstable but I'm making progress, is there any way you could give me the train logo without the wheels and the little wheel stick thingy also?

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TechLord
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Posted: 20th Apr 2010 03:36 Edited at: 20th Apr 2010 03:38
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Quote: "I'm afraid thats something I have no clue about, never really done anything with XML, are you going to hold all the physics objects variables in there or does that go somewhere else? <-- see, no clue lol."
Yes. A majority of the properties should be accessible from S3GW XML. MAUI XML has a physics tag used for setting 2D/3D physics, I figure Game Entities will follow suit:
.

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haliop
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Posted: 20th Apr 2010 10:42
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yes , version 0.3 will include:
much lower poly count
wheels and wheels connectors seperated .

expect it in about 4 - 8 hours , depends on my day.
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