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Game Design Theory / Text Adventure Competition!

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Darth Vader
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Posted: 4th Jun 2006 11:01
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I have already thought of a story! Now I need to write it out properly! edit it, and then apply it to programming! And I already know how I am going to program it!
Yah!


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Slow Programmer
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Posted: 4th Jun 2006 18:31
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Since there can be no installs of the program does this mean that a file created by the program itself to provide a save/load option during game play cannot be used? It would have to write a file to the players hard-drive, floppy, etc. There is nothing worse than not being able to leave a game and return to pick up play later.
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Jaded Gamer
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Posted: 4th Jun 2006 19:00
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Thank you for starting this contest! I just got DBPro and have been trying to learn how to program. This will be an excellent learning project.
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flashing snall
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Posted: 4th Jun 2006 20:02
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slow programmmer, im using level codes... WHAT IS TECHNOICOL!

dont assume cause ull make an ass out of you and me!
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Matt Rock
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Posted: 4th Jun 2006 23:23
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Quote: "so when's the dealine?"

August 2nd, 2006. Please read the first post in the thread in its entirety for the full list of rules.

Quote: "Since there can be no installs of the program does this mean that a file created by the program itself to provide a save/load option during game play cannot be used?"

Creating files is fine, but I don't want the judges to have to go through the entire installation process just to play the game. When you're testing your media, make sure to check the game's file size with the save files in place to make sure it won't exceed the 5MB file limit. Also, I suggest you might want to make a game folder and place the save file inside that folder for easier access.

Quote: "
Thank you for starting this contest! I just got DBPro and have been trying to learn how to program. This will be an excellent learning project. "

You're welcome! This contest is primarily aimed at people just like you. Everyone has to start off someplace and I'm glad to know some of the newer programmers are taking advantage of this contest's learning possibilities.

note:
Check the prize information in this thread's first post as I'm about to update it with a second grand prize (I would have done it earlier but the edit feature was broken for a while). Good luck everyone!


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Sunflash
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Posted: 5th Jun 2006 08:53
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Quote: "A lot of people think that Java is just for web pages."

Lol, I know, my microwave was programmed with Java

Quote: "I have already thought of a story! Now I need to write it out properly! edit it, and then apply it to programming! And I already know how I am going to program it!"


lol, I'm already about 0.8 of a step ahead of you, I have the storyline, and I'm almost done with my engine. The hard part will be writing the story, and all the MANY outcomes! It will be like writing 10 short stories... that arn't so short
-Sunflash

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Les Horribres
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Posted: 5th Jun 2006 10:21
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Quote: " Any non web-based programming language may be used (no Java, html, perl, etc.)"


How is JAVA truely web based? that was just an afterthought. I personally dispise and really hate this rule.

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Dot Merix
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Posted: 5th Jun 2006 10:30 Edited at: 5th Jun 2006 10:30
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Matt said,
Quote: "If Java can be made to run as an executable does, by just clicking on it, then I don't see a problem with using it. That rule mostly applies to people not creating websites and forcing the judges to play the game over a website, because as you can imagine that might be a little annoying, hehe.
"


That means you can use Java.. but it has to be able to be loaded up upon double clicking the program.. Executable program not requiring any outside programs i believe.

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Computer Nerd
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Posted: 5th Jun 2006 16:07
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Can we have fight scenes?

Like this:



They had them in Zork.

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WarGoat
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Posted: 5th Jun 2006 16:18
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Ah Ah! finnally some new compo! I might join this one. Got some idea for a game.


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Drunken Fiesta
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Posted: 5th Jun 2006 18:05 Edited at: 5th Jun 2006 18:05
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yay! A competition I can do! =)
I just need to decide on a story >.>

Quote: "Can we have fight scenes?

Like this:




They had them in Zork."


I hope so... because all of my ideas require that too.
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Perokreco
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Posted: 5th Jun 2006 18:10
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I think that would fell under text rpg category wouldnt it?
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Perokreco
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Posted: 5th Jun 2006 18:11
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Also, can a trial version of DBP be used?
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Dot Merix
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Posted: 5th Jun 2006 19:39
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Yes that is considered a txt rpg, so yes you can do that. I dont see any reason why you couldnt use a trial version of DBP but i guess you'll have to wait for Matt to approve.

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Bahamut
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Posted: 5th Jun 2006 20:11
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Quote: "Can we have fight scenes?

Like this:





They had them in Zork."


I think it's already been stated somewhere that you can, as long as no stats are involved.

To make it more of a challenge, you could set it so you only win if you've already solved a puzzle or drunk the magic potion etc.

IceBound
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iBrent
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Posted: 5th Jun 2006 20:24
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Bahamut wrote: "I think it's already been stated somewhere that you can, as long as no stats are involved."


I'm sorry, maybe I missed something, but I don't see anything in the rules post that says no stats involved...
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sniper
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Posted: 5th Jun 2006 21:35 Edited at: 5th Jun 2006 21:36
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Quote: "no stats "


HUH? NO STATS?! WHAT???
.....
An RPG without stats?????
.....

sniper
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Matt Rock
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Posted: 5th Jun 2006 21:56
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Quote: "Can we have fight scenes?"

Fight scenes are fine, so long as your character does not have RPG-like statistics. Bahamut was referring to the original thread in Geek Culture where this contest was, for the most part, designed and whatnot. You could have ammunition or something of that nature, but otherwise you shouldn't need any stats because this is, after all, a text adventure

Quote: "Also, can a trial version of DBP be used? "

I don't see why not. But can the trial save executables? I never used the trial, I just bought it outright, so I don't know what it's capable of, but if it works for you then go ahead and use it. But please remember that you must submit fully-working programs... we will not compile your source code for you! If that's not a problem the go right ahead


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Perokreco
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Posted: 5th Jun 2006 21:57
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Text Adventure. Where do you see the RPG part. Its an adventure, not an rpg.
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WarGoat
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Posted: 5th Jun 2006 22:29
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ok, but, about the fight scene, can we do, like:

"The troll get closer. You jump off to him as you draw you're sword. You swing you're sheild on his head as he give you a punch in you're stomach. The troll, stuned, move toward you slowly. Getting back on you're feet, you swing you're sword on his feet, and then to his head. The troll defeated and killed, you continue you're way in forest..."

Just telling what it's happenning on the battle, can we do that? I think so because it is basicly just text with no stats. Is that what you mean before? (Sorry for my bad english if I've made mistake. )


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Bahamut
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Posted: 5th Jun 2006 23:09
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Quote: ""The troll get closer. You jump off to him as you draw you're sword. You swing you're sheild on his head as he give you a punch in you're stomach. The troll, stuned, move toward you slowly. Getting back on you're feet, you swing you're sword on his feet, and then to his head. The troll defeated and killed, you continue you're way in forest...""


I think that's the idea. The great thing about that is you need to inroduce skill to kill the troll (as there are no stats). Just typing "kill troll" wouldn't make a very good game now, would it? I'm thinking along the lines of a Monkey Island combat system...

IceBound
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Perokreco
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Posted: 5th Jun 2006 23:54
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Why do you need a combat system in an adventure game?
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Drunken Fiesta
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Posted: 5th Jun 2006 23:58 Edited at: 5th Jun 2006 23:58
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When the story demands it.
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DanH
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Posted: 6th Jun 2006 00:41
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Is it allowable to use either Python or Ruby for this? They are not necessarily 'web-based' and I believe can be bundled into exe's (it includes the interpreter in the executable). If this is the case, am I correct in thinking they would be ok?
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WarGoat
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Posted: 6th Jun 2006 01:03
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I have a question: My exe, alon, is near 5 mb. but, the 5 mb is for the zip file, right? because I didn't even finish my tutorial in the game.


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Bahamut
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Posted: 6th Jun 2006 01:24
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The first rule is no compressed files. People really should read the first post. It explains alot, you know.

IceBound
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WarGoat
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Posted: 6th Jun 2006 01:28
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Oh... I had readed badly, then. I though I could. Then I have almost finish my entry...


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Les Horribres
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Posted: 6th Jun 2006 03:38
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Is there a 'no stats' rule? I did not see any thing refering to that...

Also, can we use self extractors if the extracted files do not exceed 5mb?

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Sunflash
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Posted: 6th Jun 2006 07:38
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Uh oh, Merrenvo, you arn't thinking about making an entry are you? If you are, I may as well give up all together

Quote: "Why do you need a combat system in an adventure game?"


Ideas such as those are what make people successful. If your going to repeat the same typw of game over and over gaain, then people will get bored. Always try to implement several new features to a game that your making that no one has seen. This is one of the many things that make companies, or Indie game developers do well in the market place.

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Darth Vader
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Posted: 6th Jun 2006 07:46
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Quote: "Quote: ""The troll get closer. You jump off to him as you draw you're sword. You swing you're sheild on his head as he give you a punch in you're stomach. The troll, stuned, move toward you slowly. Getting back on you're feet, you swing you're sword on his feet, and then to his head. The troll defeated and killed, you continue you're way in forest...""

I think that's the idea. The great thing about that is you need to inroduce skill to kill the troll (as there are no stats). Just typing "kill troll" wouldn't make a very good game now, would it? I'm thinking along the lines of a Monkey Island combat system..."


What you could do for a battle scene is, make it so it explains the battle like sett said but have interupptions like,

"You rush for the troll swoed held high ready to strike a mortal blow, but the troll is a bit quicker, and knocks you flying. You end up in a heap at the far end of the room your sword is a few meters distant, you could race for it but the troll is coming at you maybe hand-to-hand combat would be better?

You Choose
"Run and pick up sword"
"Fight the troll hand-to-hand"

I think this would work, so like if you grab your sword you could say that the troll lunges at you and bites your head off END GAME. but if you fight it hand-to-hand then the story continues. Just remember Matt said to keep it short so maybe don't make to many of these but just enough to be able to give the player control!

BTW is there any specifc theme? I mean is it just fantasy or is Sc-Fi reality allowed?
Thanks!


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Sunflash
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Posted: 6th Jun 2006 08:50
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Nope, no rule says what the theme needs to be... But I already chose Sc-Fi, J/K

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WarGoat
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Posted: 6th Jun 2006 15:35
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@Darth Vader: I think it is a very good idea to let choose the player in a intervention like that. I will try to implement something like that and have different end, like in Fable, so it'll be better.

Anyway, I've already started my entrie, just too bad that we are limited to 5MB, I've could done something better with a parser system, because I am already at 4, 58Mb of size.


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Mirthin
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Posted: 6th Jun 2006 16:09
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Um, yeah. I've got 23 lines of code, and my EXE is 4.05 megabytes.

Is there any way to shrink a DBP file without using a third party compression tool?

At this rate, it really doesn't seem feasible
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Perokreco
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Posted: 6th Jun 2006 18:57
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I thought that the prupose of the limit is to prevent art. it seems that its not only preventing art but the parser and other systems of the game. Why dont we just ban art and allow an unlimited size?
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Warspawn
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Posted: 6th Jun 2006 20:18
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Can this be a team effort or solo only? (obviously the software prizes would just be for one person but that would be up to the team on how to share).

-Warspawn
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Jaded Gamer
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Posted: 6th Jun 2006 22:05
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Quote: "Fight scenes are fine, so long as your character does not have RPG-like statistics. Bahamut was referring to the original thread in Geek Culture where this contest was, for the most part, designed and whatnot. You could have ammunition or something of that nature, but otherwise you shouldn't need any stats because this is, after all, a text adventure
"


No no no! I already have my game half finished and it uses stats too! Please don't change the rules after they were already set in the first post, it seems so unfair to change the rules!

The contest is for a text adventure, but does that mean it can't be a text rpg adventure, or a text space adventure, or whatever?
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Bahamut
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Posted: 6th Jun 2006 23:49
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But a text adventure is like a normal adventure (Monkey Island, Broken Sword) without graphics! An RPG is a completely different genre! Still, it's up to Matt Rock, so don't take what I say too seriously.

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Jaded Gamer
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Posted: 7th Jun 2006 00:13
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Quote: "But a text adventure is like a normal adventure (Monkey Island, Broken Sword) without graphics! An RPG is a completely different genre! Still, it's up to Matt Rock, so don't take what I say too seriously."


I think the Zork series were some of the earliest text adventures, and they had things like stats and money as well.

I hope that these things will be allowed because it adds another flavor, as well as replayability, without violating any of the rules as set out in the original post.
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Tinkergirl
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Posted: 7th Jun 2006 00:19
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@Mirthin: Every time you use a command from a different DB help category (like Basic3d, Animation, Text etc) then your exe will grow by the size of the associated dll in the dark depths of DB.

Things like Basic3d commands will instakill any chance of a small exe, while images, and such will load in others that wont help too much either. Easiest way to check is start a new project and see how the exe size leaps when you add certain commands.
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WarGoat
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Posted: 7th Jun 2006 00:33
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@Mirthin: I think that you'll be ok, because I have, like, 600 lines of code, and my .exe is only 4,58 mb, and I'll add some object, and thing like that, because for now, I do not have a game I have only text with full story and selection for direction West, North, East, South and thing like that, but without lot of selection, because you have only one way at a time, that you can go.


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Perokreco
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Posted: 7th Jun 2006 00:36
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Well, an text rpg is a completely different thing then an text adventure.
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WarGoat
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Posted: 7th Jun 2006 00:42
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Yes, because RPGs use stats for combat, trade, chracteristic, and for a lot more of thing.


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Les Horribres
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Posted: 7th Jun 2006 01:24 Edited at: 7th Jun 2006 01:29
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Quote: "I thought that the prupose of the limit is to prevent art. it seems that its not only preventing art but the parser and other systems of the game. Why dont we just ban art and allow an unlimited size?"


Uhh, what are you using as a parser... currently I have 'bout 20 words fully in, (meaning that they fully interact as they should). And even then the EXE is still around 120kb. I have a rudementary program with DBP and that loads images, sound, music, animation and that is still around 1.5mb...

Something is wrong there... so I am gonna say this, you are only allowed to use 2D images and they do not help your score what-so-ever.



@Others, I still don't see what is wrong with stats, or combat.

Stats are apart of many... things... besides, Matt Rock said
Quote: "variables to offer players items, weapons, etc. to utilize during play. Most text adventures fall into one of two "


Weapons act as stats, and you need stats for 'bash and mash' combat.




BTW, Text Parsers are easy... can we get additional points for the complexity and functionality of our parses?


@SunFlash... of course I am! This sounds like a rather nice challange and I don't have to deal with media (i hate media )

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Perokreco
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Posted: 7th Jun 2006 02:08
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You get point for technical aspect. And i fully disagree with stats, as its makes a game an RPG. We should wait for Matt to rule on this.
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WarGoat
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Posted: 7th Jun 2006 02:18
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Merranvo, you say that weapons acts as stats, you mean, variable. Because stats and variable are similar but not the same, for me. A variable is a word or a character that store data, right? But a stats is the name that we use for the variable that contain attributes of a player game, like, in a RPG, a variable callled HP that store the health point of the plaer, would be a stats. But a variable called WhereGo$, for storing where does the player go, would be a variable.

For me, it is how I see those thing. Tell me if I am telling something not true.


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Dot Merix
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Posted: 7th Jun 2006 02:23
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I think stats should be totally acceptable... A text adventure.. text rpg.. whatever you want to call it is still text.. So long as it gives you options for what you want to do to advance in the game, makes it an adventure.

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Sunflash
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Posted: 7th Jun 2006 02:56 Edited at: 7th Jun 2006 02:57
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Yeah, stats should be allowed.

Anyways, my engines almost done, and I'm at 339 lines of code (including whitespace, so really only 300 lines probably) and it's only 2.25 MB's. I havn't attempted to write the story yet because ideas keep coming in. I need to email a scientist for questions... I need to figure some stuff out about the dispursion of Chlorine in the Atmoshpere... and how fast Ultra Violet Ras from the sun could spread... lol.

@Merrenvo
Well I'm glad your in
Now I have a reason to work hard
-Sunflash

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Les Horribres
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Posted: 7th Jun 2006 02:57 Edited at: 7th Jun 2006 03:08
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let me make it ultra simple

if (weapon.pwnage.equals("Uber1337Killer")) weaponSTATdammage=1000;

yes, in programming it is a variable, but it acts as a stat in game. And then again, what is the point of weapons if you don't have the HP to back you up.

You attack monster for 1000 points... he looks at you and laughs while chomping on your head. Game Over, wanna die again?


@Sunflash... DBP files really get inflated huh...

Either Way, my main work is gonna be my engine, which I hope to make flexable enough to completly remove the map from the source and not limit myself on what I can do.

Good Luck...

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BN2 Productions
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Posted: 7th Jun 2006 03:18
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you said no media, what about background music that just loops to remove the boring noises of keys on a keyboard typing.
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Les Horribres
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Posted: 7th Jun 2006 03:31 Edited at: 7th Jun 2006 03:32
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He said that media would not affect your score
Quote: "* Media: only 2D static images in bmp or jpg form are allowed. They can only be used to enhance aesthetics and may not be animated, or act as an integral part of gameplay. Music and sounds can be included but must be wav, mid, midi, or mp3 format. Media will NOT effect your presentation's score whatsoever,"


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