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Work in Progress / SoulHunter

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zzz
19
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Location: Sweden
Posted: 10th Jan 2006 22:35
Aww, why do you guys get so low fps? But it´s good to test it on different computers cuz my computer is so fast so I didn´t know that the game could run so slow. It´ll be hard to implement new code for terrain... The other camera/rotate stuff will be easy.
But right now it´s too much school and I don´t know if I´ll be able to make this game run smooth on "crappy" comps.
urgh, too tired... have to sleep... zzz

Gamerboy
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Posted: 10th Jan 2006 23:56
all you have to do is
1:make the comera higher.
2:hve loading points your lvlv is currently about 4x bigger than it should be divide it up and have loading points in bywtween.
3:more bad guys

2 should DRASITCLY increase fps from what ive been reading.
and 1 is due to demand.
and 3 is due to my liking to fight.
UFO
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Posted: 10th Jan 2006 23:58
I really liked the short intro and the menu. It was awesome!


Hippopotomonstrosesquippedaliophobia-Fear of long words
Antidote
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Location: San Francisco, CA
Posted: 11th Jan 2006 02:05
I have to say that this could really be a great game. Personally though i have a few qualms that I really think should be resolved.

1. Controls. I would have to agree with a WASD movement and mouse spinning type thing with MOUSE1 as attack.

2. Fighting system. I know this is an early development, but the fighting was a bit slow for me. I'd rather be able to attack repeatedly with different moves and stuff. that would be a little more interesting.

As far as my FPS, well it averaged around 20 outside and around 30-35 in the actual dungeon area. Not bad, but deffinetly could be improved.

In case I sound like im nagging to much here is a positive comment:

Really nice job. This game has great potential and it is obvious that you are also a good artist. Can't wait for the next build.



Cian Rice
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Posted: 11th Jan 2006 02:51
Heres my review on the demo:

First, know that I realise that this is in it's early stages.

Upon seeing screens and learning that SoulHunter was being DBC I was instantly wowed by it's graphical prowness. Finally I got a chance to play the demo of a game that style-wise looks like Tim Burton's Nightmare Before Christmas. I was hoping that this game's gameplay would live up to the graphics and god was I disappointed.

Graphics/Presentation:
First off graphically the game looks great besides the fact that it is incredibly dark, however it runs at a rather low FPS on my computer, which runs Half Life 2 and F.E.A.R along with Quake IV at around a solid 60, all of which are much better in the graphics department (although there were teams of modellers on the development of those games who have some degree in art). However over all the graphics in SoulHunter were rather impressive, especially as it is in DBC, an older language which lacks shader support, etc. The same can be said about animations and the overall presentation of the game.

Sound:
ZZZ said this demo lacked sound so I really cannot comment on this area.

Gameplay:
First off this game suffers from a horrendous camera. The camera is positioned barley above the ground and all though you can tilt it up, it doesn't really make much of a difference. As if this isn't bad enouch the controls are rather awkard, the shift button is used to abosrb enemy souls however if you keep using this you make activate sticky keys, etc. And thats a pain in the ass.

The movement mimicks that of Mario just at a much slower pace.

Slow is the keyword of the game. Everything feels slow and dull. Especially the lame combat. You simply just hold down control and the character just swings his sword, there are no effects or anything to make it feel exciting. Also, when jumping between platforms a glitch can occur where the player character just rapidly moves up and down until a directional arrow is pressed which is rather annoying as well.

Overall if I was to give this game a rating out of 10 I would give it a 5.

I know this review sounds harsh but when I expect a demo I hope that the game is at a better and more solid state and unfortunatley this game is not, it certainly has alot of potention. ALOT however at this early phase a demo shouldn't have been released and may turn some people off to what could possibly come furthur down the road.

I suggest you continue watching this one however at it's current state is a drag to play.

- Cian

Gamerboy
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Posted: 11th Jan 2006 03:38
bah this minor problems just make it easier to fix cause now he has other ppl telling him what they saw wrong and now he has other opinions really all that needs to be fixed is the fps the cam and have a faster fighting systm thats all then i could defitely even see this game bieng picked up by a publisher not somone really really big like the 360 devs but someone out there that ppl will still buy it like nintendo and pc. heh id buy it on both gamecube and pc if he gets a publisher or if he sells it via credit card when its finished.
Bizar Guy
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Posted: 11th Jan 2006 04:17 Edited at: 11th Jan 2006 05:22
Quote: "End of Demo: Scream"

AHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!

Alright, fps-wise, I got an average of 30 outside and an average of 60 in the dungeon. I'm pretty sure it's the matrix slowing it down outside. If you replace it with an object, you could probably even have a bigger draw distance for the grass.

Graphics are wonderful. I loved it when the troll thing popped out of the ground, and the animations are superb. The game had a very stylized cinematic feel to it.

Now to get into the gameplay... While the camera looks great, it's far from playable, especially when grass or an object gets in the way of the camera and you. This can be solved by raising the camera up about a foot or two. Just enough so that things are easier to see, but you still get a good sense of size. Also I hated how the camera didn't turn until you stopped moving... that is where the biggest problem with the controls happened. You don't need to switch to mouse movement; you just need to fix that. In fact, I feel that mouse controls might ruin the cinematic quality of the game. Next you really need to give Soul hunter some sort of shadow. Jumping puzzles are just plain hard when you can't tell exactly where your character is. Then the one area which felt like it was more than just a piece missing from an early build... It was way too easy. You really should make it so soul hunter only swings his sword one every time you press control. And he should have a way to block attacks (shield? Holding his sword in a defensive position like in fable?). And finaly the ai. I wish the baddies were smarter... just a bit too obvious and simple for an action adventure.

I don't mean to say I didn't like it, it was actually pretty fun. I also understand how early a demo this is, I just mentioned everything I felt you could improve. With a bit more put into the gameplay, this could easily be one of the best games made in dbc. No joke, I could actually see myself playing this more often than most of my other games if the gameplay and world layout are as much as I hope in the end.

edit: @Animeblood, the game only seems slow because the fps is low. it actualy moves fairly quick when gooing at 60 fps, which it did for me in the dungeon.

zzz
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Posted: 11th Jan 2006 15:31 Edited at: 11th Jan 2006 15:34
As you all have seen this game IS in its early stage! The controls, the camera, the enemy AI and the FPS will be improved! But it´ll take its time and this demo was released just to show how the animations and the graphics looks like and to give you people a chance to improve the game! I´ll try to make the world as an .x instead of a matrix. And the controls are just temporary and the player will be able to change which controls to use. And I haven´t thought of the shadows actually so it was good that you said that Bizar Guy! I´m sorry to hear that you disliked it so much Animeblood, I hope you like the next build better! Now I just have to find that matrix to .x converter that The Nerd told me about...
Thank you guys for playing the "demo" !


zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz* huh?
Gamerboy
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Posted: 11th Jan 2006 15:33
SOUL HUNTER
i still cnat get over how cool that name sounds!
Hawkeye
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Posted: 11th Jan 2006 15:58
The demo was teh uber. Nothin' to comment on that hasn't already been said a thousand times. I mean, hey, it's just a demo... and as demos go, this was amazing. Newsletter-worthy-ness-amazing. Just keep it up mate, you're doin' fine


I am but mad north north-west; when the wind is southerly I know a hawk from a handsaw - Hamlet, Hamlet
zzz
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Posted: 11th Jan 2006 16:10
Thanks Hawkeye! Just when I thought that nobody was ever going to like this game! *Just joking!*
Does anyone know where I can find Lost in Thoughts matrix to .x converter??


zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz* huh?
Kangaroo2 BETA2
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Posted: 11th Jan 2006 16:42
Just seen the demo, downloaded it and played it.

GREAT job

The graphics are great I love the models and the artwork

I found the camera annoying at first until I worked out that it centred behind you when you stopped, then it was fine Perhaps add a key to rotate the camera left and right around the player? (4 and 6 on the keypad would work nicely with the 8 and 2 to zoom )

The menu system and general presentation was perfect. Love it

I'm afraid the framerate was very low for me, between 18 and 27fps depending on what was going on on screen. My pc has a fairly slow processor (2Ghz P4) but a pretty cool graphics card (9700pro) and will usually play most games really well. DBC games are not always known for their speed though unfortunately

There are various techniques that can really help though, for example rather than checking for whether the player has hit all enemies each loop only check the ones hes near to - and then to speed it up even more you can write an array to only check on of those per loop this would not really affect accuracy as it would still be able to check around 20 objecst per second

One thing that is probably REALLY slowing it down is using dbps own collision system. Nuclear Glory 2 (NOT 3) for example would be more accurate and MUCH faster - I haven't tried Sparky's dll but I'm sure it would be very similar.

Another way to speed it up would be to change the matrices to meshes, I knwo this is easily possible to do i real time in dbpro I think there is a code around here that would do the same for classic, you could then use inytersect object rather than ground height.

Anyway the game itself is really cool, I love your design and graphics skills, there's also a lot of humour in it which really comes accross nicely Things to add would be attacking whilst jumping, a slightly faster start to the attack animation and rotation control over the camera whilst moving but I'm sure you are aware of all of these. GREAT job so far and I really like the way this project is progressing


Preorder EA here:http://forum.thegamecreators.com/?m=forum_view&t=67575&b=8&p=0
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zzz
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Posted: 11th Jan 2006 17:23
Thanks for the tips Kangaroo!
Quote: "only check the ones hes near to"

It already does! Hard to believe with the speed it has, huh? I´ll try that array thing though!
I didn´t find any command for converting a matrix into mesh... This is the first thing I have to fix! Does any one know of a dll or an editor that can convert the matrix in any way to increase speed? After that I´ll fix the camera and the fighting system.


zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz* huh?
TKsFox
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Posted: 11th Jan 2006 19:51
Uhm when i tested that game it ran at 0 - 2 FPS !

my specs:

2.8 ghz
1024 mb ram
gd gfx card - dont ask for the name
...

Half Life 2 n stuff is running like ice cream.
I m sure its caused by the display mode. My PC cant handle any DB Classic games - dno y. But when i run em windowed then it works. Also sumtimes when i set display mode to 1024,768,16 at begin.

It's me...
Steve Fash
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Posted: 11th Jan 2006 20:49
This is a great demo so far, but again my framerate is quite low (23fps average)...
I'm playing on an Athlon XP2400 (@2ghz), 768mb ram, radeon8500 (with optimised omega drivers and all setting to performance mode)..
look forward to the next demo when you've had chance to make some of the adjustments as mentioned above. (tried it on a fedorce fx5200 and got an average of 12fps with performance settings)..

Steve

For game/demo music for YOUR PC productions visit:-www.futuredevelopments.org.uk
UFO
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Posted: 12th Jan 2006 01:05 Edited at: 12th Jan 2006 01:05
It got around 20 fps in the dongeon(I found it ) I liked how the troll rose out of the ground, and those freaky doll things. The smileys don't extremely fit with its surroundings with its suit. It looks kind of wrong. They were cool though! I really liked it. I can't wait until you improve the frame rate and camera, finish the level, and release a new demo!!!!!


Hippopotomonstrosesquippedaliophobia-Fear of long words
zzz
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Posted: 12th Jan 2006 19:45 Edited at: 12th Jan 2006 21:19
Ufo, this is a weird game so those suits will stay!
Right now I´m messing around with the Sparky dll and woha! Over 200fps with a 27534-polygons terrain! I haven´t implement it to soulhunter though, but I think I´ll make the levels as one or more 3d objects, so the levels will look more realistic(with the same art style of course).
And then the AI... I´m not really a gamer myself, so what do you want the enemies to do? Give me some hints so I have something to work with!

[Edit] Just thought it looked so funky...

[Edit2] Managed to make a lightmapped texture! (Not shown in the picture above)


zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz* huh?

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UFO
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Posted: 13th Jan 2006 00:29
Uh...don't tell me you are going to make your game like that

I guess the suits are ok...

What do you mean what do the enemies do? Do you mean animations, or how they attack you ai-wise?


Hippopotomonstrosesquippedaliophobia-Fear of long words
Bizar Guy
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Posted: 13th Jan 2006 01:04
Quote: "Uh...don't tell me you are going to make your game like that "

I'm pretty sure he wont,
Quote: "Just thought it looked so funky... "


zzz
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Posted: 13th Jan 2006 15:32
Quote: "Uh...don't tell me you are going to make your game like that"

Of course I will...
No, just joking! That´s just a picture of the "playground" I made to test Sparky´s dll.
Quote: "What do you mean what do the enemies do? Do you mean animations, or how they attack you ai-wise?"

AI-wise! I had some thoughts that they shall be able to attack you from behind but I can´t get any more ideas... *Empty brain*


zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz* huh?
UFO
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Posted: 13th Jan 2006 15:50
oh...I have an idea. You could make the smiley or something kind of ghost like, and then sink in the ground and pop up behind you. But only make it ghost like when it is sinking+popping up. If there are more than one monster attacking you, you could make them surround you...That might be a bit hard though...


Hippopotomonstrosesquippedaliophobia-Fear of long words
Bizar Guy
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Posted: 13th Jan 2006 22:58 Edited at: 14th Jan 2006 00:47
Well, as a general rule, your enemies should never just blindly run at you, unless they are the most basic enemies (like the dolls or the pigs). They should attack differently, and if they're in a group (I'm thinking of the smilies in the suits, mainly but not only) they should try and attack you from all sides. Also the really smart ones should be able to block your attacks unless you time them right (like the skull devil).

I'll post more ideas as they come to me...

Edit: oh yes, make multiple attack animations, so it doesn't look the same every time you hit the attack key.

UFO
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Posted: 14th Jan 2006 00:23
Yesm and I don't think the enemy attacks should be more random, and should give a little more time to react. You should also let the player block attacks, like a magical sheild that lowers your magical power, which you get more of when you get a soul.


Hippopotomonstrosesquippedaliophobia-Fear of long words
zzz
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Posted: 23rd Jan 2006 19:05
I just want to tell you that most of the things are fixed, just the AI and shield left.

Improvements:
Increased fps, > 130! (It will be set to 60, though)
Different sword moves and ability to use sword while jumping(like zelda, minish cap).
Shadow for Soulhunter and in the terrain.
3 camera modes,"Super mario 64", Mouse movement and the old crappy one. + You can move it up and down a MUCH longer distance.
Layered fog at the ground, a bit swamp-like.
Better collision.

Besides that, the grass effect is disabled right now cuz it´s slowing the game down a lot.


zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz* huh?
Steve Fash
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Posted: 23rd Jan 2006 19:26
Quote: " I just want to tell you that most of the things are fixed, just the AI and shield left."


Ooooh, new demo soon I hope ?
Steve

For game/demo music for YOUR PC productions visit:-www.futuredevelopments.org.uk
TEH_CODERER
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Posted: 23rd Jan 2006 21:37
Phew about the frame rate! 12 fps was a little low and my PC isn't that bad at all! Can't wait for the new demo.

[url]andrewneale2004@yahoo.com[/url]
http://www.elbsoftware.dbspot.com
Hawkeye
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Posted: 23rd Jan 2006 21:51
Excellent! *cheers*


I am but mad north north-west; when the wind is southerly I know a hawk from a handsaw - Hamlet, Hamlet
UFO
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Posted: 24th Jan 2006 00:17
Yay! update!!!!

Quote: " I just want to tell you that most of the things are fixed, just the AI and shield left."

Wow! You added my sheild suggestion! I feel so important


Hippopotomonstrosesquippedaliophobia-Fear of long words
Kangaroo2 BETA2
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Posted: 24th Jan 2006 00:36
Wow that all sounds brilliant! Yay!


Preorder EA here:http://forum.thegamecreators.com/?m=forum_view&t=67575&b=8&p=0
+ Model Pro out now in Program Announcements!
zzz
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Posted: 25th Jan 2006 19:50 Edited at: 25th Jan 2006 19:50
Two of the new sword moves:



zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz* huh?

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UFO
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Posted: 25th Jan 2006 22:34 Edited at: 25th Jan 2006 22:34
Wow! Cool...but I don't really understand what it is doing...


Hippopotomonstrosesquippedaliophobia-Fear of long words
Hawkeye
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Posted: 26th Jan 2006 03:03
omg! it's the deadly Attack of the Farting Tiger in the second screenee!


I am but mad north north-west; when the wind is southerly I know a hawk from a handsaw - Hamlet, Hamlet
The admiral
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Posted: 26th Jan 2006 04:43
lol looks like hes doing a flip of sorts

The admiral
zzz
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Posted: 26th Jan 2006 18:30
Farting tigers?
Ermh, I have to admit, those pictures are pretty bad...
The admiral is right, it´s a flip. The first one is the jump attack.


zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz* huh?
Hawkeye
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Posted: 26th Jan 2006 19:29
You mean there's no such thing as The Way of the Garlic Eating Tiger?

Noooooooooooo.... lies, all LIIIIIEEEEEEESSSSSS!!!!!!


I am but mad north north-west; when the wind is southerly I know a hawk from a handsaw - Hamlet, Hamlet
UFO
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Posted: 27th Jan 2006 01:01
Cool, zzz!


Hippopotomonstrosesquippedaliophobia-Fear of long words
zzz
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Posted: 29th Jan 2006 12:26 Edited at: 29th Jan 2006 13:12
I tried to play Soulhunter on my old computer.
Specs:
128 mb RAM
756mhz processor
Win98
I takes 5 minutes to start the computer.
And I think it has a 32mb graphics card.

The game ran at 18-21 fps on that machine, and thats faster than most of the dbc demos(iced: 16 fps, jetski: 17 fps).

Edit: It runs at 180+ on my new computer(3,4ghz,1gbRAM,nvidia6800u)


zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz* huh?
Xenocythe
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Posted: 29th Jan 2006 15:45
Nice, really nice!

"Forgiveness is a good thing"
"Forgiveness is between them, and God. I set up the meeting"
-Man on Fire
Kangaroo2 BETA2
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Posted: 29th Jan 2006 16:32
Great news! good optimising job


Preorder EA here:http://forum.thegamecreators.com/?m=forum_view&t=67575&b=8&p=0
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French gui
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Posted: 29th Jan 2006 16:59
Wow! How can I have missed that? This is one of the most promising game of the forumz. Very impressive work Mr Zzz!!!

headcrab 53
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Posted: 31st Jan 2006 18:51
Looks good so far. The graphics are great. I see you've gotten the frame rate higher too. To increase it a bit more, you could probably cut out half or almost half of the grass and lower it's texture resolution.

I agree with the suggestions other people are making:

1) Speed up the combat a bit. I noticed that you could hold down control and the enemies would walk into the sword and die. Here's my suggestion: Have the sword swing quickly every time you press the attack button, and you have to hold down a seperate button to block attacks, but you can't block and attack at the same time. That should make the combat more interesting. Also you should be able to move while attacking and blocking.

2) The camera needs to be higher. I also think that the mouse should be used to control, maybe like this:

Mouse : Turn
WASD : Move
Left Click : Attack
Right Click : Block
Space : Jump
Shift : Absorb souls
Escape : Pause

and the camera should turn with the player. Then the camera could move up and down with the mouse as well.

"Not again!" - A Grunt
zzz
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Posted: 31st Jan 2006 22:46
Uhm... Covenant, almost all the things you listed are already fixed. Did I forget to mention that? Check the prev page...
And as I have said a thousand times before , The controls and the grass will be toggleable.

The "only" things I have to fix is monster blocking attacks, a shield for soulhunter and I´ll do my best to increase the AI. And please, no more comments for the demo, it´s too late now.


zzz
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Posted: 4th Feb 2006 16:29 Edited at: 4th Feb 2006 16:30
Options program added.
Monster block attacks done but ugly.
Still no shield for Soulhunter...
But a new screenie!


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Hawkeye
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Posted: 4th Feb 2006 18:19
Werid background, but nice water/fog


I am but mad north north-west; when the wind is southerly I know a hawk from a handsaw - Hamlet, Hamlet
Bush Baby
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Posted: 4th Feb 2006 19:41
Still looking great!

"I will gladly admit I was owned."
Gamerboy
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Posted: 5th Feb 2006 03:05
Any new enemies?
Bizar Guy
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Posted: 8th Feb 2006 03:13
Alright! Game's looking great, and I love the new camera angle. Keep up the good work.

RavageFX
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Posted: 9th Feb 2006 17:37
the models are really freaky keep up the good work

Dont eat a cheese at night. Or you'll meet me.
moogal
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Posted: 13th Feb 2006 10:22
This is a beautiful project. Sh*t like this is why I visit this forum! Looks like you have a good clipping distance. I know most people hate fog, but a little fog would look good in these levels. Green grass + night = fog. Stay with it.
zzz
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Posted: 13th Feb 2006 21:31 Edited at: 13th Feb 2006 21:33
Thanks, guys! I´m still working on this!
Controls, grass and screen resolution can now be changed in a separate options-program. Circle-shadows added to soulhunter and the enemies. New design on the main menu, still the same machine in the middle but the stuff around it looks much better now. Still no shield though...
And last, a new enemy!


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