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Geek Culture / TGC beta forums - closed until further notice

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Jason Brook
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Posted: 15th Feb 2014 17:54
Seems to work just confirming with a clean up.
Jason Brook
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Posted: 15th Feb 2014 17:57
Should look a bit nicer now also.

Can you post what it looks like on your iPad so I know it matches.
Sparrowhawk
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Posted: 15th Feb 2014 18:00 Edited at: 15th Feb 2014 18:02
Here you go:



All fixed I think

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Jeku
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Posted: 16th Feb 2014 06:01
Quote: "Just curious as to why you are of that opinion."


I just hate AJAX sometimes because if implemented incorrectly, it can appear as if the browser is being unresponsive. For example if you click post and it does an AJAX submit instead of a regular FORM submit, the user will not see the browser responding like a regular FORM submit, and they might press refresh. Also, the back button on the browser may not function how the user would expect when using AJAX. Can you be certain that it will run properly across all browsers and mobile devices? JavaScript can be extremely finicky as I'm sure you know, so I'd recommend using a common API like jQuery if you want to make sure it will work everywhere.

And then there's the whole thing of AJAX not working if JavaScript is disabled. I'm not sure who disables JS nowadays, but I can see this all as being extremely weird for a forum. I haven't seen an online forum implement their posting with AJAX before, and there's probably more reasons for that.


Senior Developer - CBS Interactive Music Group
nonZero
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Posted: 16th Feb 2014 08:42 Edited at: 16th Feb 2014 08:49
I disable JavaScript on my Win64 machine bur nothing else and I practically never browse on it. My main browsing is on my Android device atm (bandwidth limits) but I use my Debian machine from time to time (banking, etc) for which I don't worry about security as I run my system under a restricted user account. So for me this isn't a problem except my mobile double-posts but that's auto-detected and was prolly happening due to latency anyway (browser = serverside compression & proxy so posting is finicky but I'm. used to it). I don't know anything about web programming so I can't comment except to say this: so long as it keeps working on my devices, I don't mind what gets used, though my personal belief in coding is that the underlying code be as simple and gemeric as possible. What relevance this has is up to the reader, I just flew off at a tangent, lol.

BTW: Jeku, your post was number 404, lol.

Formerly a cat
Mobiius
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Posted: 16th Feb 2014 12:02
The new posting speed is awesome, but it takes you to the top of the page, rather than to your new post.

It's a small thing, but it annoys my having to submit, then watch the page jump to the top, then I have to page down to get back down to the bottom..

The Next
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Posted: 16th Feb 2014 12:02 Edited at: 16th Feb 2014 12:09
The problem with AJAX is usually when the posting time is long, now that it appears to be very fast there should be no reason for the user to refresh their browser. I also show them a posting message and focus on it, so they are not exactly not informed. AJAX is actually much better for slow connections as instead of doing a full page redirect then heading back to give feedback to the user it leaves the page alone and returns the information as required and I can format client side, the only exception to this at the moment is upon successful posting the page does reload as at the moment I haven't got around to loading it all in on the current page.

At the moment the posting form reverts back to the old method if JS is disabled (not pretty at the moment but it will be), however the usage of the internet now shows that almost everyone uses JS on their browser and so they should it is a very important part of the web.

For the AJAX I am using the jQuery library as you mentioned which supports all browsers and methods of implementing AJAX so it does the hard work for me.

As for forums not using AJAX it is because a large number of them are based on PHPBB or other old forum software, these bits of software have remained almost unchanged for years and are far behind the modern technologies. Meaning that forum software such as vanilla is becoming more popular and that does support AJAX for almost everything.

Quote: "The new posting speed is awesome, but it takes you to the top of the page, rather than to your new post."


I will fix this

Windows 7 Pro, Intel i7 3.8 GHz, 16GB DDR3, NVIDIA GTX 780 4GB Superclocked

View the beta TGC forum progress at the url below View beta forum
Sparrowhawk
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Posted: 16th Feb 2014 14:42
The next, cam I jus ask if these spam emails were forum posts here that we're deleted by admin? Or has something got into the appolo(at)tag email?

I reported some similar ones to rick ages ago (linking to some spam drugs website) thinking something had got it, and then realised it may ba a spammer user in the forum. I thought posts were usually edited blank not deleted hence why I'm surprised there is no trace.

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The Next
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Posted: 16th Feb 2014 14:44
They are spam messages I got the emails also. I am about to delete them.

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View the beta TGC forum progress at the url below View beta forum
Seditious
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Posted: 16th Feb 2014 16:56
Quote: " now that it appears to be very fast there should be no reason for the user to refresh their browser"


Just out of curiosity (since I haven't tried the beta forums in a while), when you post a message does it update the page with all new messages (ie. from other people who posted before you hit the button) or just your own?
The Next
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Posted: 16th Feb 2014 16:59
It shows all new messages, soon it will show new messages before you post so you get a chance to alter your content if needed. But haven't quite got that in yet.

Windows 7 Pro, Intel i7 3.8 GHz, 16GB DDR3, NVIDIA GTX 780 4GB Superclocked

View the beta TGC forum progress at the url below View beta forum
Seditious
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Posted: 16th Feb 2014 17:04
Sounds good!
Sparrowhawk
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Posted: 16th Feb 2014 17:47
One thing I did notice when I was on my iPad (sorry I seem to be causing you a lot of trouble!) when I post (using chrome for iOS) the post doesn't appear, and the page doesn't refresh. if I tap post several times, nothing happens - I have to manually refresh the page for my post to appear (and as I tapped submit several times the "cannot post duplicate") appears.

I suspect that's how double posts used to happen in the past. I will try the Safari browser later to see if its just a chrome issue.

Sorry for the trouble I'm causing! :p I do appreciate the work you've been doing here
The Next
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Posted: 16th Feb 2014 17:49
That's fine it helps me find all the bugs and fix them

I think I know why that may be happening and it is because of some temp code I have in place when the posting system is done it shouldn't do this. It is because the page refresh JS code doesn't work the same on all mobile browsers.

Windows 7 Pro, Intel i7 3.8 GHz, 16GB DDR3, NVIDIA GTX 780 4GB Superclocked

View the beta TGC forum progress at the url below View beta forum
Jeku
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Posted: 17th Feb 2014 10:24
Quote: "It shows all new messages, soon it will show new messages before you post so you get a chance to alter your content if needed. But haven't quite got that in yet."


Does this mean the new messages will keep popping up automatically? Won't this cause the new post box to keep jumping down? I'm trying to imagine how that would work.


Senior Developer - CBS Interactive Music Group
Clonkex
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Posted: 17th Feb 2014 13:22
Quote: "Does this mean the new messages will keep popping up automatically? Won't this cause the new post box to keep jumping down? I'm trying to imagine how that would work."


Probably the screen would be pulled down with the box so you could keep typing and not notice anything.

nonZero
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Posted: 17th Feb 2014 22:12
How about some annoying pop-ups like adds? Kay, seriously, the easiest, cleanest solution would be a box above the form with plaintext "feeds" on that thread. Box doesn't move, text scrolls like am IM window. That way it won't be obtrusive and it'll save everyone -- users and developer -- a great deal of hassle. I'm prolly totally off as my aesthetic is hardly ever parallel to anyone else's but I may as well toss it out there.

ver7.5
Jeku
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Posted: 18th Feb 2014 08:30
Quote: "Probably the screen would be pulled down with the box so you could keep typing and not notice anything."


No no no, I totally disagree with that.. it will be jumpy at best If anyone looks at an AJAX message board like Disqus (which is probably the Internet's most famous one), it doesn't pull in people's posts in real-time above the new post that you're typing in. That would be quite annoying to say the least!


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Dark Java Dude 64
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Posted: 18th Feb 2014 08:50
I haven't read some of the above stuff, but it seems to be about the webpage being dynamic so I may be restating ideas that have already been discussed.

It would be neat if new posts would appear automatically, without requiring a page refresh. Although, the IM/chat room nature of that idea may encourage posts that are shorter, less neatly written, and of far greater quantity, which may not be ideal.

The next, far more significant idea is this: it would be neat if, at the bottom of a thread, there would be a blank post template attached to the bottom of the thread (it would appear as if it was simply a blank post), and the user would be able to type their message in it. Upon hitting the post button, the page wouldn't reload or anything, but rather the post would simply become a part of the thread. Last time I used Facebook around a year ago, I think it worked a little bit like that.

So I have no idea if those ideas have been discussed, or if they would be by any means practical to implement or not, but I thought I'd throw them out there. I have rather limited web dev knowledge, so I can't judge how complex that system would be beyond what's obvious.

nonZero
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Posted: 18th Feb 2014 11:06
Well, the question is also: do we nees a real time preview? We lived without it since what 99? We could just have an alert that goes from dull to red/green (like a little light) in the form's corner to let us know that a new post was made and leave whether we want to check it up to us (checking requires Ctrl+(A, C*), F5 which is really not a deal breaker. *some legacy system may require Ctrl+(A, insert).)
That would be easier to code and even less obtrusive and it would discourage the abovementioned quick-posting (which happens often anyway, lol).

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The Next
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Posted: 18th Feb 2014 13:09
Just to clear this all up. The way I see it working at the moment to give the best of everything is that posts do not show up until you actually click post. When you do if there are new posts it will load them and show you a message saying "new posts were posted are yo sure you wish to post" and you can scroll up to see the new messages.

This way there is no annoying constant reloading of posts that may cause annoying scrolling and overuse of bandwidth. It also means it won't tun the site into a PM system.

Let me know thoughts on this.

Windows 7 Pro, Intel i7 3.8 GHz, 16GB DDR3, NVIDIA GTX 780 4GB Superclocked

View the beta TGC forum progress at the url below View beta forum
Sparrowhawk
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Posted: 18th Feb 2014 13:21
That seems like the most efficient method
nonZero
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Posted: 18th Feb 2014 14:26
Got my vote.

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Jeku
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Posted: 18th Feb 2014 19:35
Quote: "When you do if there are new posts it will load them and show you a message saying "new posts were posted are yo sure you wish to post" and you can scroll up to see the new messages."


Ahh that's a good design Sounds good!


Senior Developer - CBS Interactive Music Group
Clonkex
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Posted: 19th Feb 2014 13:45
Quote: "No no no, I totally disagree with that.. it will be jumpy at best If anyone looks at an AJAX message board like Disqus (which is probably the Internet's most famous one), it doesn't pull in people's posts in real-time above the new post that you're typing in. That would be quite annoying to say the least!"


Oh no, no, I don't think it's actually a good idea! That was just my idea of how such a system would work.... but even then in my mind I pictured it being sort of jumpy and annoying.

Quote: "Although, the IM/chat room nature of that idea may encourage posts that are shorter, less neatly written, and of far greater quantity, which may not be ideal."


Indeed it would. I don't like realtime forum updates.

Quote: "checking requires Ctrl+(A, C*), F5"


Haha that's exactly what I do when I can bothered to even check if anyone's posted recently

Quote: "some legacy system may require Ctrl+(A, insert)"


Really? I've never seen that before How interesting.

Quote: "When you do if there are new posts it will load them and show you a message saying "new posts were posted are yo sure you wish to post" and you can scroll up to see the new messages."


Sounds good, except for one thing: If you're in a hurry (say, to get to work) you will often rapidly finish your message, click post and run, expecting that when you get home people will have read your message. It's the most annoying thing when you get home and discover that it failed to post () for some reason. But it's a small issue; it just means you have to hang around for those few extra seconds (or minutes if you've used your download limit for the month and are shaped ).

nonZero
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Posted: 19th Feb 2014 15:56
Quote: "Really? I've never seen that beforeHow interesting."

In the days before GUI OSes, that was the de facto keystroke, at least in MS-DOS. Lots of support still exists and most Windows applications accept it for legacy reasons. Works on Linux for some apps that ignore Ctrl+C (Termination Signal, akin to Ctrl+Break for MS-DOS) for obvious reasons. Ye older days are fuzzy memories but I still instinctively use legacy keystrokes now and then.

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easter bunny
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Posted: 22nd Feb 2014 01:07
Indicium
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Posted: 22nd Feb 2014 01:29
Remote spam machine.


They see me coding, they hating. http://indi-indicium.blogspot.co.uk/
nonZero
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Posted: 22nd Feb 2014 08:12 Edited at: 22nd Feb 2014 08:16
I don't see the use of that site. Tbh, the keystrokes to refresh take me <1000ms and the site\'s speed is the bottleneck for most decent connections. People such as myself, who pay per MB bandwidth would actually be losing out with an auto-refresh system. Remember, too that auto-refresh will stuff up form data (although my particular browser saves I most of the time. Dunno ir it's cool or annoying yet).

ver7.5
swissolo
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Posted: 22nd Feb 2014 19:59
Quote: "Sounds good, except for one thing: If you're in a hurry (say, to get to work) you will often rapidly finish your message, click post and run, expecting that when you get home people will have read your message. It's the most annoying thing when you get home and discover that it failed to post () for some reason. But it's a small issue; it just means you have to hang around for those few extra seconds (or minutes if you've used your download limit for the month and are shaped ).
"

I was a bit concerned about this too. How about the post will post anyways after 1 minute? That way there's plenty of time to stop it, but if the user leaves and expects the post to be posted they don't have a need to worry

nonZero
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Posted: 22nd Feb 2014 22:20
It taketh but a trivial amount of time to post. Surely thou art all capable of a minuscule wait. That said, I fear this prompt would interfere with mine browser.

Which segways me onto another topic: Mobile site? Or is this App still happening? I think m.forum
thegamecreators.com would be better than an app. I'm happy to help with design and beta testing (I have access to Android phone, Android tablet and Symbian phone (with native and j2me browsers) and as I should be free from mid - end of March. Hopefully I'll have nice internet by then.

ver7.5
nonZero
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Posted: 23rd Feb 2014 11:23
Sorry for double-post, edits on mobile are tough. Anyway, I had an idea of maybe the community make new smilies to add to or replace the old as we now have better, smoother image tools for free. One smiley we really need is an ic:monocle, though. At least I think.

ver 7.5 /// int 145 /// str 45 /// dex 85 /// end 200 /// mat 3
Dark Java Dude 64
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Posted: 23rd Feb 2014 12:01
I fully support both ideas presented in the preceding post.

The Next
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Posted: 23rd Feb 2014 18:37
I am happy to add new ones, but the old ones will have to stay or have only minor updates and keep their general theme.

I won't be able to make them though, but if someone feels up to the task I will leave that up to the community and once a high enough quality pack is created they can be used If someone wishes to make a thread on it and get the community submitting new smilies the go ahead and we will see what turns up.

Windows 7 Pro, Intel i7 3.8 GHz, 16GB DDR3, NVIDIA GTX 780 4GB Superclocked

View the beta TGC forum progress at the url below View beta forum
swissolo
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Posted: 24th Feb 2014 22:21
but the old smileys are awesome! Wouldn't want to lose them I have no problem with the addition of more though.

Seditious
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Posted: 25th Feb 2014 01:41
Just tried out the beta forums for the first time in a quite a while and I have to say I'm quite impressed!

I did notice though, that there's a fair amount of blank space in posts that makes them larger than they need to be: http://s30.postimg.org/jy76oaedd/gap.jpg
Clonkex
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Posted: 27th Feb 2014 01:09 Edited at: 27th Feb 2014 01:12
Quote: "Ye older days are fuzzy memories"


Ye older days don't exist for me; the first computer I learned to use was a Windows 98SE PC If I remember correctly, it had an 800MHz Celeron CPU and an Nvidia Riva TNT2 GPU (32MB?). I would have been about 12 and my brother 11 and we spent many hours installing games from old PC User CDs. Cube was possibly the most exciting and long-lasting game we discovered. I used to get up at 4am and spend the next 3 hours creating awesome levels for my brother to play. Once we finally got new PCs (2009), we got multiplayer working and made awesome levels together, still on that older version of the original Cube. We made one level that was called "Dimensions" and then a second called "Dimensions World", with which I accidentally overwrote the first level because I forgot you can't have spaces in the name :S

Anyway.

Quote: "Anyway, I had an idea of maybe the community make new smilies to add to or replace the old as we now have better, smoother image tools for free"


Ah no! I love the current smileys, they're so much better than most new ones!

Quote: "It taketh but a trivial amount of time to post. Surely thou art all capable of a minuscule wait."


Not necessarily. It can take 30 seconds or more on slower internet and when you're in a real hurry you're often sort of sliding away from the keyboard whilst still typing, then just before you move too far away, you hit Post and run.

Quote: "but the old smileys are awesome! Wouldn't want to lose them I have no problem with the addition of more though."


Agreed, agreed and agreed!

My new PC bits should be here soon (next half-hour I hope, our mail delivery is a little slow). My PC died a week ago and decided to go all out and fully upgrade it (and send myself broke at the same time). So that means:

Core 2 Quad 9550 -> i5 4670
MSI MS-7528 -> Asrock Z87M Extreme4
Kingston 2GB (something) and Samsung 1GB (something, found at the tip) -> Corsair Vengeance 2x4GB 1600MHZ
(something) 400W -> Thermaltake Litepower 600W
Nvidia GTS250 1GB -> Nvidia GTX560 1GB (second hand)

Total price ~$750 and worth every cent!

Ridiculously excited! The combined increase of speed from the i5, GTX560 and synchronous DDR3 RAM (over mix-and-matched DDR2 RAM) should be instantly noticeable. Take into account that my harddrive supports SATA3, yet my last board was only SATA2, and my PC is going to absolutely fly! PC Case Gear, thankyou for proving parts slightly cheaper than eBay and all from the the same place!

Ancient Lady
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Posted: 28th Feb 2014 04:03
Yup, I be old.

My first PC (not the Atari 400) was a name brand IBM PC with an Intel 8086 chip (and IBM Basic was a built in chip on the motherboard) with 4.77Mhz, a floppy drive (5 /14") and a 5MB (yes, megabyte) hard drive. It ran IBM DOS (Windows was just not there, yet). It cost $5K in 1983. It had 64K (yes, kilobyte) memory on the motherboard and we added a card to bring it up to 640K.

Cheers,
Ancient Lady
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Dark Java Dude 64
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Posted: 28th Feb 2014 23:59 Edited at: 28th Feb 2014 23:59
Bug found!

At the time of posting this, the last post in the Posting Compo explains what I found.

The issue appears not to be a thing on this thread, oddly..

[i]

Jeku
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Posted: 2nd Mar 2014 07:54
Soundcloud integration on this site is pretty wonky. When I originally added it to this site, the integration was small, but now you can see how much room it takes up in the posts:

[soundcloud]jeku/blind-eye-jake-jensen-remix[/soundcloud]


Senior Developer - CBS Interactive Music Group
nonZero
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Posted: 2nd Mar 2014 09:23 Edited at: 2nd Mar 2014 09:36
Had a look at the beta using my mobile. Surprisingly less buggy than the current forums. In text-only mode, the layout isn't too bad (reaponsive). The only issues are a) with images on, posts lose uniformity and b) the layout ain't too great. Other than that I\'d say that maybe I spoke too soon about a mobile site as a few tweaks would fix this (although a mobile site would be less data-intesive and it would be open to a whole new style to better suite devices with <600px x-resolution). Anyway, the functionality is quite good. I'll prolly keep using the normal site until the beta gets fully implemented (for convenience and familiarity).

Edit: Escaped chars in post-edits went away for a while but then recently popped up again.
Edit 02: Escaped chars didn't show up this edit. Undefined Behavior? Anyway, it's not that serious really.

ver 7.5 /// int 145 /// str 45 /// dex 85 /// end 200 /// mat 3
Clonkex
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Posted: 2nd Mar 2014 12:23
Quote: "My first PC (not the Atari 400) was a name brand IBM PC with an Intel 8086 chip (and IBM Basic was a built in chip on the motherboard) with 4.77Mhz, a floppy drive (5 /14") and a 5MB (yes, megabyte) hard drive. It ran IBM DOS (Windows was just not there, yet). It cost $5K in 1983. It had 64K (yes, kilobyte) memory on the motherboard and we added a card to bring it up to 640K."


Wow... I know how far we've come with computers (and how quickly!), but when you list all the specs like that, it really puts it into perspective. I mean, a 5MB HDD?? And $5K?! I suppose back then there was very little extraneous information to store, such as overly complex installers and shiny graphical interfaces. And memory was ridiculously expensive. Dad had a Commodore 64, so I know all about how you would spend hours just to get a small dot moving across the screen

The oldest computer we own currently is our Sega Mega Drive (Sega Genesis for you Americans) console, with a Sega CD II attached (and heaps of games!). Also have the Sega Master System converter thingy that plugs in the top. My favourite game of all time on that machine is Sonic The Hedgehog 2, with Flashback being another favourite. I've nearly finished it, too. Flashback I mean. I have the passcodes saved in a .txt on my desktop right now. I tried SO many times when I was younger to finish that game, but always failed. Recently I ended up with a huge, heavy and ancient CRT TV in my room and decided to dig out the Mega Drive. I set it up under my bed and for several days played Flashback. It's a really hard game, particularly when you have to be very careful not to bump the RF lead or risk losing the fleeting signal you've managed to get by bending the pins with a pair of pliers. I might finish it tonight, who knows

Anyway! Massively waaaaaaaay off topic there, just random ranting! Sorry. Back to attempting to finally bring 2D animation software into the modern era using AppGameKit and ..... WHAT. My brother has just started GTAIV in an IRON MAN suit!! These mods are awesome!

Phaelax
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Posted: 2nd Mar 2014 18:51
My first computer didn't even come with a harddrive, Amiga 500! But my first windows PC was a 486, 66MHz I think with 8mb ram and a 1.2GB harddrive. Win 3.11. I wish I still had all my old computer shopper magazines, it's interesting too look at what some of those old parts cost back then.

nonZero
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Posted: 2nd Mar 2014 20:58
I know this thread isn't Postcom, but, while we're talking old, anyone remember the physical size of old hdds. My first PC was a 286 and it had a massive hdd. If I recall it was around the size of a DVD RW, maybe bigger. Don't recall the capacity but it was likely laughable. Yet this thing was a brick and it was noisy as hell when it booted.

ver 7.5 /// int 145 /// str 45 /// dex 85 /// end 200 /// mat 3
JimHawkins
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Location: Hull - UK
Posted: 2nd Mar 2014 23:07
Some of us go back to the days when you had to use a cassette recorder for storage. Oh joy.

-- Jim - When is there going to be a release?
Ancient Lady
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Posted: 2nd Mar 2014 23:38
yup. Getting "Revenge of the Pharoah" to run on my Atari 400 was always fun. If the tape wasn't in just the right position, it would fail loading at about the 15 minute point.

Cheers,
Ancient Lady
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JimHawkins
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Posted: 2nd Mar 2014 23:49
Oh yes. Strange music. After 10 minutes of tweeting you might get a "Hello world" up on the screen. Or on the Apple ][ it would be "HELLO WORLD" unless you'd spent serious money on an upper/lower-case board.

It was all, by today's standards, lethally expensive. Early floppy drives were advanced if they held 100K of data. They cost about the same as a dual-core tablet now.

But it was fun. It's just not as much fun now.

-- Jim - When is there going to be a release?
Ancient Lady
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Posted: 3rd Mar 2014 01:43
We replaced the membrane keyboard almost immediately. And my (now ex-)hubby insisted on getting the external floppy as soon as it came out ($450 in 1983).

But I did use it to create the birth announcements for my daughter. And some games for my son. He started learning about computers with it. "The program goes from the dicks drive over the wire into the pooter" (spelled exactly how he said it) was a great statement for a three year old.

Cheers,
Ancient Lady
AGK Community Tester and AppGameKit Master
Dark Java Dude 64
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Posted: 3rd Mar 2014 01:48
Quote: "Or on the Apple ][ it would be "HELLO WORLD" unless you'd spent serious money on an upper/lower-case board."
It would be a company like Apple to do something like that, even back then, eh?

Indicium
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Posted: 3rd Mar 2014 01:51
Quote: "It would be a company like Apple to do something like that, even back then, eh?"


*Exasperation*


They see me coding, they hating. http://indi-indicium.blogspot.co.uk/

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