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FPSC Classic Product Chat / [STICKY] Black Ice Mod Official Thread

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s4real
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Posted: 16th Aug 2015 12:21
@@Sinister Spoon :-0 Thanks for the report and your findings its strange that a built game is running slower as this should in fact be faster than a test game as the editor not using up any resources.

You always going to lose 20fps or sometimes half the framerate when using full screen shaders as these use an extra cam and there no way to reduce this with dbp and how full screen shaders work.

The new performance tweaks have been designed under windows 10 as I was getting major framerate drops with the old system so a newer way was added and my framerate now sits at a nice 60fps where before I was getting major framerate drops, so this is why the system was changed.

If you have a skype account and like to email me your user name we could add you to beta test early versions before release so we can get better performances.


best s4real

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Tony06270
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Posted: 16th Aug 2015 16:50
Hello, I have skype and want to help the development of the mod as a beta tester if possible ?

Thank you.
s4real
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Posted: 17th Aug 2015 17:27
Quote: "Hello, I have skype and want to help the development of the mod as a beta tester if possible ?"



send me an email with ya skype name and i will add you to my skype.

best s4real

Amd fx4100,6gb ram,geforce 450
Tony06270
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Posted: 17th Aug 2015 20:14
email send s4real
Sinister Spoon
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Posted: 19th Aug 2015 19:30
Hi again s4. Been doing some more testing again, and the built out exe's are still running poorly. Strangely after reverting to the 1.4 alpha and v 1.17 update to fpsc the editor issues cleared up when applying shaders. I can run the editor at around 45-50 fps with full screen shaders, segment shaders and entity shaders active, the only shaders that seem to have a negative effect are the segment ones.

I did a little experimentation building out segments in the older style with older shaders and the effect was negligable on the fps (maybe 1-2 fps faster)

Thing that baffles me is that it runs fine in the editor, better than fine, better than any fps Ivc had out of fpsc.

But the built games are crippled, its around a 30 fps total loss now, thats just building the game with the same settings as the editor. It seems to be localised to the way my system handles segment shaders.

Its not the post effect shaders that are causing the issue (thats what i think of when full screen shaders are mentioned) Its strange.

Id opt in to the beta to help out but having taken apart and rebuilt my game in different ways over and over again to test and whatnot with different parts of the mod, got it looking beautiful and a decent fps only to find once again the built exe had this flaw built into it is really draining my optimism.

Im gonna reorganise my fpsc folders and set up some libraries to make installing and reinstalling over again slightly less hasslesome, once Ive done that Il drop you a message with my skype n we can work something out. TBH I dont really want the static and dynamic shaders to be all super realistice, reflective and bump mapped etc, I really want just a shader that makes entites react properly and uniformly to light, dynamic objects always seem to stand out slightly more than static ones and I feel if they could just get lit properly, with the cartoon style and cel shader, it would look perfect. Im only really experimenting with the shaders at all to achieve that purpose. I understand its a feature of the 4.7 beta which Im going to reinstall now and run the same build through and compare fps changes.

Incidentally. Ive had this issue with fpsc for a while now with regards to collision detection, I have a lot of physics based puzzles and things in mind but it seems a 50/50 crapshot everytime a player drops or throws a held object as to wether it will just vanish through the floor.

Any thoughts on how to prevent this? I keep having a key that no matter what I do keeps falling through the surface of a table from time to time. or through the floor if I drop it, and this doesnt seem to be an issue limited to just that object but a lot of objects but not all the time.

smoke em if you got em
hukuta94
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Posted: 19th Aug 2015 21:22 Edited at: 19th Aug 2015 21:39
It awesome! Nice mod! Minimap looks great!

1) where can I find a full list of the new FPI-commands?
2) Can you make more than 5 active dynamic lights? Check video-test^
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nbmH9gMjy9U&feature=youtu.be
Screenshot:
s4real
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Posted: 20th Aug 2015 13:41
@hukuta94 :- Full list is in Docs folder.

There is no way to have more than 5 active dynamic lights in fpsc as this is the max direct x9 can handle at a time.

best s4real

Amd fx4100,6gb ram,geforce 450
Nomad Soul
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Posted: 21st Aug 2015 00:40
**NEW RELEASE**

The v4.8 update is now uploaded with the following:

- Black Ice map editor now uses high resolution textures
- Added DX9 to installer (optional) for Windows10 users

You can now continue designing and editing maps in glorious high definition. DX9.0c June 2010 has been added to the installer options for anyone moving to Windows10 as this is not available out of the box.



s4real
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Posted: 21st Aug 2015 13:00 Edited at: 21st Aug 2015 14:03
New version is now being UPDATED.



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Nomad Soul
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Posted: 21st Aug 2015 15:26
Apologies for the confusion everyone, v4.8 stable is now uploaded so if you already downloaded this, please download it again and install the new one.

uman
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Posted: 21st Aug 2015 16:19
Hi Guys,

Can you confirm why I am getting the infamous black blog displaying on world objects following full shader lightmapping in my levels and not getting any correct lightmapping, shadows and so on?

The Demo which comes with the Mod works great and lightmaps correctly?

I have attached a screen shot of a level to show my issue which shows the blobs but no shadows anywhere else attached to/cast by world objects or entities.

I have heard of this issue a long time ago being encountered by others and believe there was a suggested reason and fix perhaps?

Thanks for the help.

Seems to be a wonderful piece of work this if I could get the benefit and get a decent light map result.

Thanks again.

Peter



You don't see 'im, till 'im come callin

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Mriganka
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Posted: 21st Aug 2015 16:57
Do you have the proper shader maps for the walls @uman? The blobs seem to occur when the required shadermaps are not present for the ps_2_0 wall segment shader or bumpent.fx.

Nomad Soul
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Posted: 21st Aug 2015 17:38
Hi uman

Not seen you around for a while but nice to see you and thanks for trying the mod. The black blob issue is because the shaders need a specific set of textures to work correctly.

To use the segment shader from the mod demo, you need to have the following textures in place:

_D2 = this is typically used by FPSC when full shader effects are not enabled and have more detail baked into the texture itself. For black ice modding this should just be a copy of the _D texture.
_D = standard diffuse texture which just gives basic details like color and layout. D and D2 textures can also make use of an alpha channel to describe areas of transparency.
_N = normal map texture which describes the surface geometry and depth. It allows additional detail to be added from the diffuse map.
_I = specular map texture which is used to describe how the surface reflects light.

Here is an example segment file. Then have a look in the texture folder its pointing to so you can see how the textures are setup and ensure your effect field is pointing to the correct shader.



Textures for static entities are setup slightly differently so let me know if you need any help with those.

uman
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Posted: 21st Aug 2015 17:45
Mriganka,

See attached screen shot of Shaders ps 2.0 folder content.

As far as I would understand I would have all shaders as distributed by TGC/FPSC downloads/installs and if the Demo level of the beta works and I can lightmap it then I should in theory be able to do the same for my own maps having the same install(s) for both.

This issue has been around a long time and as said I believe the cause and fix was known a long time ago. I just cant find any threads related to it.



You don't see 'im, till 'im come callin

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Nomad Soul
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Posted: 21st Aug 2015 17:53
If the black ice demo level and simple.fpm from the default FPSC maps are both working correctly with shaders and lightmapping then it will be because you are trying to use a shader without having all the textures setup correctly.

uman
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Posted: 21st Aug 2015 20:24
Thanks for that Nomad



You don't see 'im, till 'im come callin
Tectonic
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Posted: 22nd Aug 2015 01:20
Congrats to s4real and Nomad Soul - this mod was mentioned in TGC's latest newsletter. Keep up the good work guys. I am going to use this mod in my latest project that should be starting soon!
Teabone
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Posted: 22nd Aug 2015 03:13
I may check this one out

(Teabone)
Susysyay
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Posted: 22nd Aug 2015 23:14
Downloaded the new version, and everything is great except one thing. After installing it, it asked me to input my serial key, which I did. Once started up a level, I went to the preferences menu and the SHADERS option is completely absent. I can't turn them off or on. The whole section of that menu is missing.

-Winner of the X10 Revival Competition, Susysyay
"I'm havin' too good a time today, I ain't even thinkin' bout tomorrow."
Avenging Eagle
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Posted: 25th Aug 2015 23:43
I'm getting an interesting error when using static_spec_norm_alpha.fx on a Chinook helicopter model made (pic attached). I took it as read that FPSC couldn't render backfaces but, strangely, using static_spec_norm.fx it can! The only problem is that is doesn't pay attention to the alpha channel in the diffuse map which is necessary for the helicopter's windows to appear transparent. So I swapped in static_spec_norm_alpha.fx and now, although I have transparent windows, entire sections of my model are now transparent that shouldn't be. Backfaces are now also not being rendered. I suspect this is to do with the way the shader is combining the various texture maps with the FPSC-generated lightmap.

Basically what I'm looking for is a combination of the two shaders that renders backfaces but also renders the alpha channel as intended (and most importantly, only WHERE intended). Any idea what edits I can make to the .fx file to achieve this?

Fantastic work on the mod by the way. It's made me open up FPSC again for the first time in months!

AE

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Nomad Soul
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Posted: 25th Aug 2015 23:46 Edited at: 25th Aug 2015 23:58
@Susysyay
If you have upgraded from a free copy of FPSC, please follow the instructions in this thread.
http://forum.thegamecreators.com/?m=forum_view&t=154050&b=28

@Avenging Eagle
Please can you email me the files for the helicopter and I'll take a quick look at this for you.

ncmako
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Posted: 26th Aug 2015 05:14
@Avenging Eagle, Wow your Chinook is looking good I know you've been working on it for awhile.

@Nomad Soul or S4real
Have the "Moveable Lights" been added or fixed with the latest
updates? Reading thru the threads I'm not sure if so. Last I saw
they didn't work with Nomad Mod? If they are working is there
an example how to implement?
thank you

My games never have bugs. They just develop random features..
Lots and lots of random features...
Nomad Soul
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Posted: 26th Aug 2015 20:25
@ncmako
Moving lights have not yet been added to Nomad Mod as this requires an update to the source and the shader system. I will be looking at this and also your hand torch model after Beta v5.0.

@Avenging Eagle
Thanks for sending me the files. I've now fixed the static entity shader (static_spec_norm_alpha.fx) so it renders backfaces and transparency correctly. I'm about to upload Beta v5.0 so please install this to apply the fix once I've confirmed its available.



s4real
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Posted: 26th Aug 2015 21:02
@ncmako look in the black ice scripts and you see attachlighttoentity, add this to the main to the entity you like to have movinglights.

As nomad has said these don't work with nomad mod shaders at the moment.

TO ALL :-

We been getting a lot of bug reports that are in fact issues with custom stuff and not in fact issues with the mod.

So we changed are policy that we do not support 3rd party packs or custom media, if you have any issues then you must repeat the problem with stock media or Nomad media and then we will look into the problem.

Any non stock media or Nomad media is down to individuals and the authors of the media to get this working with black Ice mod.

best s4real

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Nomad Soul
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Posted: 26th Aug 2015 23:11 Edited at: 26th Aug 2015 23:12
**NEW RELEASE**

The v5.0 update is now uploaded with performance changes which have given us great results so far and the static entity shader fix (static_spec_norm_alpha.fx) which now renders transparency and backfaces correctly.

ncmako
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Posted: 27th Aug 2015 06:03
@ S4real Thank you. Works like a charm.
@ Nomad Soul, can't wait to try it out. Downloading now

My games never have bugs. They just develop random features..
Lots and lots of random features...
hukuta94
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Posted: 27th Aug 2015 12:36
I have a few questions.
1. The black ice mod's scripts I found the fpi command "maketexture = x". The list of fpi commands haven't descriptions. How to use this command?
2. How use FPI command "makevideotexture =x y" and "usevideotexture = x"?
3. Could you make full list of all commands FPI that contains this mod please?

P.S. It very nice mod. I like it. Great work!
s4real
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Posted: 29th Aug 2015 17:41
Quote: "I have a few questions.
1. The black ice mod's scripts I found the fpi command "maketexture = x". The list of fpi commands haven't descriptions. How to use this command?
2. How use FPI command "makevideotexture =x y" and "usevideotexture = x"?
3. Could you make full list of all commands FPI that contains this mod please?
"


A full list is in the Doc's on all the new commands for the mod, makevideotexture is in fact a none mod feature and is in standard fpsc.

best s4real

Amd fx4100,6gb ram,geforce 450
Nomad Soul
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Posted: 3rd Sep 2015 00:53 Edited at: 3rd Sep 2015 00:53
I will be adding a new shader in the next update. This is a variation of the segment shader which can be used with floors and based on the north / south specular effect used in the stock FPSC shaders but also using normal maps.





seppgirty
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Posted: 3rd Sep 2015 01:16
looks fantastic!

gamer, lover, filmmaker
Madcow
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Posted: 5th Sep 2015 16:31
Quote: "I will be adding a new shader in the next update. This is a variation of the segment shader which can be used with floors and based on the north / south specular effect used in the stock FPSC shaders but also using normal maps."


Like the games from the previous generation of consoles, if I understand correctly. This gonna be GREAT :

Utinni !
Madcow
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Posted: 10th Sep 2015 12:17 Edited at: 10th Sep 2015 12:21
Ignore this one.

Utinni !
Mriganka
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Posted: 11th Sep 2015 13:33
Hope you think of adding third person or top down view. They would make the mod rock even harder!

Nomad Soul
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Posted: 18th Sep 2015 14:32 Edited at: 18th Sep 2015 14:39
@seppgirty - Thanks for the feedback and hope you enjoy it. We are still working on the next update but hopefully won't be long.
@Madcow - Exactly! I was looking at some modern games and this has been a very popular effect in the previous console generation.
@Mriganka - Keep watching out for more updates.

Apologies its been a while since we posted an update but Beta v6.0 is being worked on and we have almost finished integrating moving lights with Nomad Mod. Here is a video showing progress on the next update.



Madcow
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Posted: 18th Sep 2015 16:52 Edited at: 18th Sep 2015 16:55
This is awesome !
I just can't wait to integrate the next release in my current project !

Utinni !
ncmako
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Posted: 18th Sep 2015 23:53
Absolutely stunning Nomad Soul. The moving lights is terrific.
Looks great!

My games never have bugs. They just develop random features..
Lots and lots of random features...
Tectonic
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Posted: 23rd Sep 2015 01:07
This moving light is simply brilliant. The icing on the cake would be:

[1] to have a hand actually hold the light in a similar way to the flashlight, so that it does not appear to be just floating.
[2] to have the light be returned to an upright position when it is picked up.

I am not sure how difficult this would be to do, but it would be nice to have.
seppgirty
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Posted: 23rd Sep 2015 01:38
You 2 guys work miracles with each other. Amazing work. I wish to God there was a way to get an actual 3rd person camera into this engine.

gamer, lover, filmmaker
seppgirty
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Posted: 26th Sep 2015 01:16
@ s4real and nomad

have you read this post from Lee in the DBO thread.

http://forum.thegamecreators.com/?m=forum_view&t=215409&b=1

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ncmako
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Posted: 26th Sep 2015 05:10
Wow. Just read thru it, now that is interesting.

My games never have bugs. They just develop random features..
Lots and lots of random features...
ChadWoodworth
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Posted: 27th Sep 2015 08:56
This was all great until I built a game. Only 3 out of the 12 systems would run.
s4real
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Posted: 27th Sep 2015 15:54
Quote: "This was all great until I built a game. Only 3 out of the 12 systems would run. "


Make sure the two dlls are in the same dir as your built game or it will not play,I find this to be the problem with most built games.

@seppgirty :- Interesting thread thanks for the link.

Quote: "You 2 guys work miracles with each other. Amazing work. I wish to God there was a way to get an actual 3rd person camera into this engine."


Thanks for the comment, depends what you mean by 3rd person camera, do you mean for 3rd person games.

To all,

We sorry for the delay in the next release but there been a lot of work to get the moving lights to work as it wasn't a simple add to the engine.

best s4real

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hukuta94
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Posted: 27th Sep 2015 19:54
we will wait as long as necessary. You are doing great work, guys. I look forward to the new release
Nomad Soul
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Posted: 27th Sep 2015 23:25 Edited at: 27th Sep 2015 23:44
Thanks for the comments everyone.

@Tectonic - Its not really feasible to do this as you can add the moving light script to any entity and would need custom models / animations.
@seppgirty - Thanks for the link. We are definitely going to use the new DBPro compiler to extend the memory cap. Hopefully there will be some other low hanging fruit.
@ChadWoodworth - As s4real has said you probably need to include the dll's (msvcp71.dll, msvcr71.dll) in the root directory of the built game. If you use Vishnu packer it does this for you.
@hukuta94 - See the next post!

Nomad Soul
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Posted: 27th Sep 2015 23:39 Edited at: 27th Sep 2015 23:53
**NEW RELEASE**

The v6.0 update is now uploaded with the following:

- Nomadmod shaders now support moving lights.
- New floor shader (north/south specular).
- New dynamic light entity (gas lamp).
- Added ncmako's hand torch weapon.
- Added entity workshop 2 (with license)

There is a new demo map for moving lights so you can test that immediately before adding to your own levels. Thanks to ncmako for the awesome torch model and we've included Entity Workshop 2 in the FPSC tools folder.

*There is a limitation with the current moving lights implementation for characters. You can use them with characters but not yet optimised for GPU skinning / performance.
*You can only use 1 moving light per level so plan them carefully.

seppgirty
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Posted: 27th Sep 2015 23:55
Quote: " depends what you mean by 3rd person camera, do you mean for 3rd person games."


yes, for third person games like splinter cell, max payne, Allen Wake. A few mods have been released. (including yours) with a limited 3rd person view.

gamer, lover, filmmaker
MK83
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Posted: 28th Sep 2015 01:06 Edited at: 28th Sep 2015 01:11
Quote: "- Added entity workshop 2 (with license)"


Can't find.

never mind, Tools folder!!!!!!!!

mk83 Productions
Mriganka
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Posted: 28th Sep 2015 03:49
Great job guys! You rock! But whenever you get time please integrate similar features available in Aegul's to Black ice. And third person or top down view like Outbreak by Kravenwolf would be a great thought as I have designed a few maps specially for those views. And the north-south shaders are amaizing and the darkai has been hell of an improvement!

ncmako
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Posted: 30th Sep 2015 01:29
Terrific Nomad Soul. Downloading now .
Cant wait to test out
My games never have bugs. They just develop random features..
Lots and lots of random features...
s4real
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Posted: 1st Oct 2015 14:18
Quote: "Great job guys! You rock! But whenever you get time please integrate similar features available in Aegul's to Black ice. And third person or top down view like Outbreak by Kravenwolf would be a great thought as I have designed a few maps specially for those views. And the north-south shaders are amaizing and the darkai has been hell of an improvement!"


Thanks for the comment.

We are going to look into 3rd person and topdown view just we having some issue with how to get the guns to reload and pickup and change, its a shame aegul's not around anymore he could prob help us on this.


To All,

Thanks for supporting the mod and the comments.


best s4real
Amd fx4100,6gb ram,geforce 450

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