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AppGameKit Classic Chat / App Developers Group

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3d point in space
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Posted: 24th Aug 2011 03:44 Edited at: 24th Aug 2011 03:46
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Well i dont know what this group thing is all about but that menu thing that was talked about is intresting. I built menus before useing rc files and it probley work for this too, but I dont know if that should be implemented.

Well how do we join the group and is there a seperate channel for this group. I am ok with graphics.

Go through yourself at a wall.
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baxslash
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Posted: 24th Aug 2011 10:41
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Hi @3d point in space, The menu will just be built programatically in AppGameKit, I'll post the code here when it's ready.

Quote: "Well how do we join the group and is there a seperate channel for this group. I am ok with graphics."

You just joined the group, all you have to do is express an interest really. It's just a bunch of developers helping each other get published really! The original thread for the group is in the DBPro forums here: TGC AppUp Developers Group

There is a link to an IRC chat channel on the first page but I don't know if it gets used much.

I'm sure you can hook up with another member to help with graphics if that's all you are confident with at the moment. Maybe someone with the coding skills who isn't so good with graphics could use your help with a game idea?

Welcome anyway!

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Hodgey
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Posted: 26th Aug 2011 12:49
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@ Baxslash: For Project X (I'm going to call the community project that because it is shorter to type than "X games in 1" and it sounds cool!) are you going to place all of the credits in one spot or do we each provide our own set of credits?

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baxslash
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Posted: 26th Aug 2011 15:12
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I'm working on a menu system that will be very easy to add individual games and credits for each game using functions like "Add_ADG_credit(game$, title$, name$)" or something similar.

It will work the same for adding games to the menu, if people can just work on their engine for now I'll have something with place-holder graphics soon

Here are a list of commands I'm working on (but may add to!):
setup_ADG_menu
add_ADG_menu_game
add_ADG_credit
display_ADG_menu

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mr_d
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Posted: 26th Aug 2011 15:21
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sound really good baxslash. could i suggest that if you want to include ADG in all the function names, that you place this at the beginning - it just looks neater that way. also maybe group the item next, so they look something like:

ADG_menu_setup
ADG_menu_add_game
ADG_menu_display
ADG_credit_add
etc.

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Hodgey
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Posted: 26th Aug 2011 15:23
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Sounds good baxslash! I look forward to testing out those functions. I was just thinking with credits, would it look more professional to have them all in one place? I'm happy either way though.

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Bursar
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Posted: 26th Aug 2011 15:35 Edited at: 26th Aug 2011 15:40
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Is it possible to make it more of a 'screen manager'?

You have no idea how many different menus I might want, for instance:
Main Menu
Start Game Menu
Options Menu - with sub menus for audio/video/controls
Multiplayer Menu - with sub menus for hosting/joining/player customisation

I'm sure there are plenty of others that people can suggest.

Instead of your current functions, you would have something more like this:

ADG_menu_setup
ADG_menu_add(0)
ADG_menu_add(1)
...
ADG_menu_add(100)

Each of those numbers would be the ID of the menu that gets created and there'd be seperate functions for adding buttons or other controls to each screen.

It's likely to be quite a bit more work - I'm not oblivious to that - but it would be massively more functional, and easier for people to fit to their own use.

Edit -> Wait, I think I've misunderstood what you were posting
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baxslash
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Posted: 26th Aug 2011 15:53
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Good suggestion mr_d, I'll do that!

Quote: "I was just thinking with credits, would it look more professional to have them all in one place? I'm happy either way though."

They will be but I may want to add which game "graphics" was done on by which person for example.

@Bursar, I guess people might want to add their own menus using the same system for their own game. I'll make it as flexible as possible to allow for this... we'll have to adapt as we go to some extent

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Hodgey
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Posted: 26th Aug 2011 23:26
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Quote: "They will be but I may want to add which game "graphics" was done on by which person for example."

Yep, that's fine.

I think I might use Radar Invaders for this project actually...

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iviauricius
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Posted: 27th Aug 2011 17:32
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I'd like to join. First, however, who do I speak with about changing my username in the TGC forums?
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baxslash
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Posted: 27th Aug 2011 18:12
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Welcome maurinho! If a moderator is watching you might be in luck. Otherwise try emailing a moderator with a list of possible new names you like in order of preference.

Just look for someone with the moderator badge next to their avatar on the forums and click the "email" button just to the right under their post.

I've seen people get their name changed before

Let me know if you change it though as I'm about to add you to the list of members!

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baxslash
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Posted: 29th Aug 2011 17:24
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I'm making the front end of the ADG Arcade as a seperate system which just lets you select a game to play, then I'm going to make a fairly simple menu system with optional menu items:

Start Game
Options
->Options (variables) can be added to the options menu which can then be accessed by your game from a small array of stored data
Quit

I'll also be adding a simple quit/pause menu for in-game in the form of a question message box:
answer$ = ADG_message_question(question$, option1$, option2$)

This way all of our GUI's will be similar and keep some consistency between games.

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Hodgey
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Posted: 29th Aug 2011 23:27
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Quote: "
I'll also be adding a simple quit/pause menu for in-game in the form of a question message box:"

That's a good idea and will be of great help.

I've discovered something amazing with AppGameKit although you probably wouldn't recognise it until you looked. For DBPro, remember how you had to reload images if the user switched away from the screen and then came back? Well with AppGameKit I don't think you need to do this. I've tried to crash sample projects by alt-tab and ctrl-alt-del but have been unsuccessful. This saves us a lot of time and effort.

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baxslash
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Posted: 30th Aug 2011 00:12
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That's very handy to know, maybe it depends how AppGameKit is doing fullscreen though as DBP doesn't crash if you use fulldesktop rather than fullscreen...

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Hodgey
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Posted: 30th Aug 2011 00:21
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Quote: "maybe it depends how AppGameKit is doing fullscreen"

I don't know how to make an AppGameKit program enter fullscreen/desktop, so I only tested window mode but I did maximize it and still couldn't crash it. However, it will be interesting to see how it handle multi-tasking, actually this might be the reason it doesn't crash? AppGameKit may have been designed to handle/restore itself when the user multitasks.

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baxslash
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Posted: 30th Aug 2011 23:18 Edited at: 30th Aug 2011 23:18
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Just playing with my refurbished (new to me) iPod Touch 32Gb

Now when is the darned AppGameKit player for iOS going to be ready!!!

Been playing with Prof's font maker too... here's a possible one for the menu!


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Hodgey
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Posted: 30th Aug 2011 23:43
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Quote: "Now when is the darned AppGameKit player for iOS going to be ready!!!"

I check itunes every day just to see if it is out, I'm eagerly waiting for it as well!

Quote: "Been playing with Prof's font maker too... here's a possible one for the menu!"

The font looks good, and it's very similar to the font used for the header image on the ADG website.

I've just realized something, since the main purpose of Project X is to promote the ADG website, someone's going to have to link to the website natively in each SDK. I'm pretty sure that we can build in Tier 1 and add in bits and pieces when we transfer the files into the native SDKs. I had a go a launching a website in VS 2010 express using the shellexecute command and couldn't get it to work. But it isn't really something we need to worry about right now.

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baxslash
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Posted: 30th Aug 2011 23:59
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Quote: "and it's very similar to the font used for the header image on the ADG website."

Yup glad you noticed!

Quote: "I've just realized something, since the main purpose of Project X is to promote the ADG website, someone's going to have to link to the website natively in each SDK."

Yeah, I'm hoping TGC add a few simple web commands some time soon...

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Impetus73
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Posted: 31st Aug 2011 00:01
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Hi all! Sign up this old norwegian too! I can never seem to finish a programming project, but I am full of ideas, know how to think out of the box, good at nitpicking other peoples code and a well of ideas on how to solve problems. I started programming in 1988 on an Amstrad CPC6128, and went to the AMIGA machines in the 90's until a lightning fried my Amiga while I were typing on it, in 92.. then i stopped programming, and got a PC. They were "impossible" to make good programs on back then, then came all the problems with varying screen resolutions, and I did not like visual basic... so I sat on the fence... until AppGameKit came along 20 years later, and woke me up from my looong slumber as an old BASIC programmer

----------------
AGK user - novice
Did Amiga / AMOS programming in the 90's, just started programming again with AGK.
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Hodgey
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Posted: 31st Aug 2011 00:15
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Quote: "Yup glad you noticed!"

The 'A's gave it away

Quote: "Yeah, I'm hoping TGC add a few simple web commands some time soon... "

So am I, KISTech said something about http support "later this year" but I don't think we should quote him on that.

@ Impetus73: Welcome to the group! I think this community project is perfect for you (as well as many others including myself) because we have some good developers here and need all of the ideas we can get! You can always contribute in some way.

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The Slayer
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Posted: 31st Aug 2011 03:10
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Quote: "The 'A's gave it away"

Which ones?
Oh yeah, the ones that look like the Dark Basic Pyramid?

The font loox nice, baxslash!

Cheers

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Hodgey
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Posted: 31st Aug 2011 09:10
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The 'A's are pretty unique and as soon as I saw them I was like "I've seen those somewhere before". Yep, the ones that look like the DarkBASIC pyramid although I didn't draw that relation upon seeing them.

Only one day until the newsletter release! I must say I love reading it, especially the ADG section, Baxslash and BatVink do a good job.

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baxslash
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Posted: 31st Aug 2011 12:55
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Welcome Impetus73! Looking forward to seeing you around. If that 73 is relevant to your age you're the same age as me

Quote: "The font loox nice, baxslash!"

Thanks! It's only a place-holder really (unless you really like it) until I have some code to pass on for the menus. Soon...

Quote: "Only one day until the newsletter release! I must say I love reading it, especially the ADG section, Baxslash and BatVink do a good job."

Mostly Batvink's work this month as 'guest' contributor. I've taken a back seat this month, been very busy. Should be an interesting read for me for a change!

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Hodgey
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Posted: 31st Aug 2011 14:34
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Quote: "Mostly Batvink's work this month as 'guest' contributor. I've taken a back seat this month, been very busy. Should be an interesting read for me for a change!"

Nothing like a bit of suspense!

I posted this in the other thread but I'm not sure how many saw it so I'm going to post it in this thread. Here is an arsenal of graphics that can be used as placeholders for those who aren't the greatest artists but also can be used royalty free so long as we give the artist, Ari Feldman, credit. It might take some of you back a few years as well.

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Bursar
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Posted: 31st Aug 2011 14:39
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I also have an array of free graphics on my web site, under the Free Stuff heading: http://tymargames.co.uk/
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baxslash
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Posted: 31st Aug 2011 14:47
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Thanks Bursar (and Hodgey) for the free stuff links. Could come in very handy for the ADG Arcade project!

BTW I'll start a WIP thread once I have the basic structure and menus sorted out...

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Hodgey
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Posted: 31st Aug 2011 14:54 Edited at: 31st Aug 2011 14:56
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Quote: "I also have an array of free graphics on my web site"

The more the merrier, thanks for sharing Bursar!

Quote: "BTW I'll start a WIP thread once I have the basic structure and menus sorted out..."

Good idea, for now there's no rush to create a WIP thread because TGC haven't created an AppGameKit WIP board yet but I suppose we could use the current WIP board, nothing to say you can't put an AppGameKit WIP in there as far as I know.

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baxslash
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Posted: 31st Aug 2011 15:04
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I just took a loof at your stuff Bursar, I'll definitely try to use some of your spaceships in my game if that's OK? If I get time for a game of course!

Quote: "we could use the current WIP board"

I agree this was what I was planning to do, just name the thread "[AGK] ADG Arcade!" or something similar.

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Bursar
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Posted: 31st Aug 2011 15:07 Edited at: 31st Aug 2011 15:08
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Quote: "Could come in very handy for the ADG Arcade project!"

Is there a plan for this yet, such as games to include, and whether it will be free or purchasable? I was planning on making a triple pack of arcade classics (Space Invaders, Asteroids and probably Missile Command) as a way of getting to grips with AppGameKit, and I'm about 50% of the way through Asteroids at the moment (been lacking some spare time to work on it the past few days), but would be happy to have them included in the ADG Project

Quote: "I'll definitely try to use some of your spaceships in my game if that's OK?"

Absolutely fine. They were put up for people to use
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baxslash
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Posted: 31st Aug 2011 15:27
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Quote: "Is there a plan for this yet, such as games to include, and whether it will be free or purchasable?"

I imagine there will be a free download page on our site with a donation button (PayPal probably) but we may attempt to get it published on AppUp too (for a small fixed price). It's a bit early really but we'll worry about the details once we have a finished product.

Quote: "I was planning on making a triple pack of arcade classics (Space Invaders, Asteroids and probably Missile Command) as a way of getting to grips with AppGameKit, and I'm about 50% of the way through Asteroids at the moment (been lacking some spare time to work on it the past few days), but would be happy to have them included in the ADG Project"

That's great! I would only say that we may need to make them not too close (even in name) to the 'original' games as this might get us in copyright infringement trouble. Maybe try to put a twist of some sort on the games?

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Hodgey
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Posted: 31st Aug 2011 15:35
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Quote: "I was planning on making a triple pack of arcade classics (Space Invaders, Asteroids and probably Missile Command) as a way of getting to grips with AppGameKit, and I'm about 50% of the way through Asteroids at the moment"

Nice! My game is going to be similar to space invaders so since you're already half way through asteroids is it okay if I relieve you of the space invaders game/theme, just to have a bit of variety?

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Bursar
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Posted: 31st Aug 2011 15:58
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Quote: " I would only say that we may need to make them not too close (even in name) to the 'original' games as this might get us in copyright infringement trouble"

The games weren't going to be called that. It's just everyone knows what you're talking about when you use the original names

Quote: "is it okay if I relieve you of the space invaders game/theme"

Fine by me. I guess we'll need to wait until a little further down the line when the project is ready to go, and then everyone can start chucking hats in the ring for games they wish to submit.
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mr_d
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Posted: 31st Aug 2011 16:12
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Quote: "Fine by me. I guess we'll need to wait until a little further down the line when the project is ready to go, and then everyone can start chucking hats in the ring for games they wish to submit."

I believe this has already started in the other thread

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Bursar
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Posted: 31st Aug 2011 16:22
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Ah yes. With that thread pushing 40 pages, maybe the project should have its own thread - along with requirements, such as resolution, if we're going to try and standardise on a control scheme and so-on.
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baxslash
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Posted: 31st Aug 2011 17:51
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@Hodgey, I took a little look at your code when I started the menu system. Is there a consensus on a simple set-up for variable resolutions in AppGameKit that you (or anyone else) knows of?

I have a very basic set-up at the moment that just works depending on what I set the resolution up at in the "setup" file but it was just to get me started.

I still haven't really got my head around how it works yet!

@TheSlayer, how about a logo for "ADG Arcade"?

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The Slayer
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Posted: 31st Aug 2011 19:09
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Quote: "@TheSlayer, how about a logo for "ADG Arcade"?"

Sure, mate.
Do you mean a logo (brandname), or rather a banner? And, what size should it be?

Cheers

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baxslash
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Posted: 31st Aug 2011 19:12
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Quote: "Do you mean a logo (brandname), or rather a banner? And, what size should it be?"

For now could you do a logo around 640x480 something like:
ADG
Arcade!


I'll see what else I need as the menu progresses.

Cheers!

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The Slayer
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Posted: 31st Aug 2011 21:04
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@baxslash:
Is this image for the main menu? Or a start up logo? Cuz I was thinking of placing little screenshots from the different games in between the 'ADG' and 'ARCADE!'.

Cheers

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Bursar
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Posted: 31st Aug 2011 22:35 Edited at: 31st Aug 2011 22:36
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If I may suggest...

Maybe each game author can supply an image of their game (either action shot or title screen), and the main menu is like a bank of arcade machine with the screen shot showing on the monitor of the arcade machine. You then scroll across the various arcade machines to find the game you want to play.

A bit like this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fMaZ2b4bQbs
By the way, Arcade Classics is one of the finest SID tunes ever!
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Hodgey
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Posted: 31st Aug 2011 23:37
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Quote: "Is there a consensus on a simple set-up for variable resolutions in AppGameKit that you (or anyone else) knows of?"

I've been reading through this thread and believe we can use a combination of virtual resolutin and percentage resolution but it seems as though we need to use a percentage based system.

Now for some theory. What we can do is something like this
// DeviceWidth and DeviceHeight are defined in the setup file...I think
SetVirtualResolution ( GetDeviceWidth(), GetDeviceHeight())
SetDisplayAspect ( GetDeviceWidth() / GetDeviceHeight())

AGK should then scale our programs as we deploy it. For devices that don't support the aspect, AppGameKit will create a window that does support it and there will be a black boarder filling in the gaps. Now, it may be possible to eliiminate the black boarder by recompiling the game with a different virtualresolution which just means changing the values in the setup.age file. This is my understanding of what's been said by other people, hard to say without an actual test...so where is the AppGameKit player!

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baxslash
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Posted: 1st Sep 2011 00:59
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@theslayer, send me an email with your idea. I like bursar's idea and it's very similar to my current idea which is based on the album view in iTunes if you know what I mean?

I'll take a look at your code in the am hodgey as I'm too knackered right now!

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Hodgey
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Posted: 1st Sep 2011 12:16
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Quote: "I like bursar's idea and it's very similar to my current idea which is based on the album view in iTunes if you know what I mean?"

I was pondering what the interface would be like and I think that is a very smart way to handle it.

Quote: "I'll take a look at your code in the am hodgey as I'm too knackered right now!"

From what it sounds like all you have to do is wait a couple of hours but by now it's probably well an truly into the a.m.

Thank you BatVink for the mention in the newsletter, I wasn't expecting it.

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baxslash
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Posted: 1st Sep 2011 12:51
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Quote: "From what it sounds like all you have to do is wait a couple of hours but by now it's probably well an truly into the a.m."

Working every night at the moment, wish it was all on AppGameKit but mostly it's CAD...

Quote: "Thank you BatVink for the mention in the newsletter, I wasn't expecting it."

You were the one who got us all properly going on the idea so it's deserved!

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Hodgey
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Posted: 1st Sep 2011 13:15
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Quote: "Working every night at the moment, wish it was all on AppGameKit but mostly it's CAD..."

It is my hope one day that AppGameKit will become a full time job for me. I'm sure a lot of you have the same dream.

Quote: "You were the one who got us all properly going on the idea so it's deserved!"

I guess so It is my hope that someone in the Birmingham Children's Hospital reads the newsletter. I'm currently in the process of re-programming my Radar Invaders game in DBPro and I'm quite happy with the code, the second time around alway seems neater. Once its done it should be a quick translation into AppGameKit and then easy integration into Project X.

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baxslash
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Posted: 1st Sep 2011 14:37
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Quote: "Once its done it should be a quick translation into AppGameKit and then easy integration into Project X."

Great! Looking forward to it

Does anyone else have anything they're working on that's worthy of mentioning?

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Bursar
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Posted: 1st Sep 2011 14:58
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Once I've got Rocks From Space out of the way, I'm going to start on a roguelike.

I've been fleshing out some procedural dungeon generation code lately, and although it still needs a bit more work, I'm hoping I can get something up and running reasonably easily.

Here's a quick look at the dungeon generation running in DBP. Some of the tiles are funky colours so I can see when it changes between rooms and coridoors, and it's zoomed out so I can see the whole map in one go.

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baxslash
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Location: Duffield
Posted: 1st Sep 2011 15:03
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Looks nice Bursar!

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Hodgey
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Posted: 2nd Sep 2011 00:49
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Since you're designing the menu like the album view for itunes when would you like images/placeholders for our games and what size would you like them?

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baxslash
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Posted: 2nd Sep 2011 01:03
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Not yet, I'm using some crappy space invaders / asteroids pics from google for now

Got the 'scrolling system working nicely, demo soon...

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DVader
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Posted: 2nd Sep 2011 03:20
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@hodgey, "I don't know how to make an AppGameKit program enter fullscreen/desktop, so I only tested window mode but I did maximize it and still couldn't crash it"

You change the setup file to fullscreen=1. Very simple. AppGameKit works fine even when task swapping out and in in this mode. Maximizing the window is not the same as full screenmode, you could maximise a DB window just fine as well.

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