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FPSC Classic Product Chat / [LOCKED] Project Blue UM edtion official thread

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Scurvy Lobster
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Posted: 6th May 2009 10:58
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john schwarcz: there are better places than this thread to ask migration questions. Project Blue has other priorities than the migration.
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john schwarcz
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Posted: 6th May 2009 15:36
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sorry

shadow666
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EGG HEAD OF DOOM
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Posted: 7th May 2009 21:13
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this should have Reality-Mod in it. its super cool tho
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crispex
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Posted: 9th May 2009 15:57
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I encountered a bit of a problem.



I encounted this when the loading reached "Loading Segments" or something to the degree. I've tried re-installing FPS Creator without any model packs, same thing.

Originally my debugger came up saying there was an Invalid Win32 Exception (quite possibly the most generic error in programming), meaning something is wrong within the code, though I have no idea what. I would have debugged it, but I have no idea what it was even written in. I turned off my JIT Debugging and got that error. It's got nothing to do with JIT, by the way.

Temporarly away from the Phoenix Sentry.
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s4real
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Posted: 9th May 2009 16:10
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@crispex What version of fpsc are you using ?

Best s4real

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crispex
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Posted: 9th May 2009 16:12
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Latest 1.15.

I'm not sure if it's my PC, probably isn't, because the minute I place the original EXE back, FPS Creator works like it's old self.

Temporarly away from the Phoenix Sentry.
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s4real
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Posted: 9th May 2009 16:22 Edited at: 9th May 2009 16:24
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Thats the problem as Project blue not been released for v1.15, you need to use an older fpsc v1.07 to v1.09 or wait for Project blue v1.6 to be released.

Best s4real

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crispex
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Posted: 9th May 2009 16:25
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Oh, so my own ignorance is what caused the error, heh.

Temporarly away from the Phoenix Sentry.
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Plystire
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Posted: 9th May 2009 21:05
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Quote: "Oh, so my own ignorance is what caused the error, heh."


This is what's referred to as an "Organic Error"


Don't worry, crispex. Sit tight for a little while longer, Project Blue will be using V1.15 in no time.


The one and only,


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crispex
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Posted: 9th May 2009 22:01
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Heh, look forward to it!

Temporarly away from the Phoenix Sentry.
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Red Eye
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Posted: 11th May 2009 21:45
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*.bump.*


FPSCOptyGuide
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DarkFrost
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Posted: 13th May 2009 02:05
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Quote: "this should have Reality-Mod in it."
Lol is reality-mod even out yet? They have been working on v 1.1 forever now, im actually looking forward to reality-mod as well as project blue but i dont see them finishing anytime soon.

-Cyclone
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s4real
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Posted: 13th May 2009 02:55
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update :

Project blue thanks to Ply and errant now has body and legs for the player.

Best s4real

screenshot taken in Project blue v1.6

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Apple Slicer
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Posted: 13th May 2009 02:59
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Now that, is very cool.

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Pride
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Posted: 13th May 2009 03:03
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That...is just sick! Great work, truly great work!


"Tempo non é só unha teoría, senón unha forza"
Try and figure it out
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DarkFrost
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Posted: 13th May 2009 03:26
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My god, now you guys have really done something with your mod. Adding legs and feet just added a whole new wikid asset to fpsc. Great work guys, im looking forward to whats to come. BTW will this be included in the free version? And will the option to build game eventually come in the free version but with like a bunch of splash screens and ads?

-Cyclone
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Nickydude
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Posted: 13th May 2009 03:32 Edited at: 13th May 2009 03:33
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Is the download in the first post V1.15 compatible?

[i]NVM, just read not yet.



THE ANSWER TO ALL FPSC QUESTIONS!
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meteorite
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Posted: 13th May 2009 03:46
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Actually, you can do the legs with Plys mod solo, and have been able to since 1.07

It's all done through scripting

"I can't imagine what this place would have been like if I hadn't found you here." - BJ Hunnicutt
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Plystire
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Posted: 13th May 2009 06:31
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Yes, this is true, meteorite, but an extra command that will be added (specifically for a jumping animation)... and a small tweak to the camera system, has made them much more efficient.

I would also like to point out, that since this "body" is entirely scripted, you have complete and total control over how it acts. Things all the way down to slight adjustments like where the body appears in relation to the camera up to what animations are played when the player is doing something. If you don't like the angle at which the legs turn when you're running diagonally, it's all handled in the script.


More nice things are to come.

Project Blue is technically ready for some heavier testing, but we feel that it would be wiser to wait until the next Ply's Mod release to fully implement everything we can and get those tested. This will keep people from needing another update in a week or so.


@s4real:

I thought you said you were going to take a video of it.


The one and only,


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Rampage
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Posted: 13th May 2009 07:41
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Quote: "Lol is reality-mod even out yet? They have been working on v 1.1 forever now, im actually looking forward to reality-mod as well as project blue but i dont see them finishing anytime soon."

It never started development. Like .... ever


DarkBASIC Pro. Teh awesumness
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Kerrby
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Posted: 13th May 2009 14:30
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Suggestion. Seeing you've added legs. Would is be too hard to have an option to pull the camera back to Third Person?

Is that too complicated for a mod :p?
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djmaster
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Posted: 13th May 2009 15:21
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With Ply's mod implentation you can already to 3RD person camera.

A.K.A. chargerbandit
[href]http://chargedstudios.ultimatefpsc.com/[href]
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Errant AI
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Posted: 13th May 2009 15:28
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You can pull back to see the armless/headless body

Airslide deserves some credit too! I don't know what code contributions were his but he forced me to make the test body.

I need to hurry up and finish what I'm doing so I can upgrade to 115

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Plystire
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Posted: 13th May 2009 18:35
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Quote: "Airslide deserves some credit too! I don't know what code contributions were his"


None of the code used for this was from Airslide. The "additions" I made to the source to make the legs work better were nothing more than a 10 minute top-off to the already implemented system from V1.07 of Ply's Mod.

Not to be mean or anything, but I feel that the way Airslide implemented the legs was too static and left no room for improvement from the end-user.

For those of you interested, here's the script used for the legs:


The only things different in here from V1.07 are the two commands I've added: "offsetentmovebeforerotate" and "onground"

The first is a command to over-ride the order in which the offset of the entity takes place. In some cases it's good to have the entity/camera rotate before moving, giving you an orbiting effect, while in other cases (This one in particular) it's good to have the entity/camera move before rotating which allows the model to rotate about an offsetted center.
The second command was a condition to check for if the player was in the air or not, thus allowing the user to decribe a specific animation or frame to be used for when the player is in the air.

As you can see, this method of doing the player body is about as dynamic as it's going to get and the end-user is free to change whatever they want.


Your model was a very good test harness for this, though, Errant. You did a good job with it.
Stock characters worked just as well with this system (though required slight adjustments to the offsets in some cases) but the arms being visible defeated the illusion.


The one and only,


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Red Eye
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Posted: 13th May 2009 18:36 Edited at: 13th May 2009 18:37
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Amazing S4real very cool. And Ply and Errant AI


FPSCOptyGuide
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Wizzkid
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Posted: 13th May 2009 23:55
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Awesome!!!

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The Next
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Posted: 14th May 2009 00:05 Edited at: 14th May 2009 00:09
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Reality-Mod is no longer being developed i and another (now left the forums) had started it but due to personal issues for the other person and all the other mods it is no longer being developed we where planning to get back on it in a few months but have had a chat and have decided not to do so, it will be removed from the airmod site very soon and i will be joining the WizMod team doing their website design. So i support WizMod totally now which is also a great mod. Though i will be expanding my knowledge of DBP you may see a little something from me in the future but not to big i dont think.

The Next
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DarkFrost
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Posted: 14th May 2009 00:10 Edited at: 14th May 2009 03:59
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Hey uhh i was wondering how you get these legs to work properlly. All i see when i use it si the entity beneath me, like the whole body

EDIT: Nvm ill wait for airslides

-Cyclone
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Airslide
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Posted: 14th May 2009 01:29 Edited at: 14th May 2009 01:32
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Plystire - I do like the approach that you take for many things, but I feel that the necessary FPI processing eventually adds up for what are simple or trivial features to create in the engine itself and ultimately you are left with a slower game performance-wise. It is also my philosophy that the FPI language should be regulated to high-level commands, leaving the engine to do most of the dirty work for speed reasons and ease-of-use (especially given the target audience). Dark Basic itself is slowed to begin with due to its very nature, and FPI has to go through that, slowing it down further. Each line of your script is cycled through, condition by condition, action by action every game loop, and I think that that processing time could be better spent on things important to gameplay.

My implementation will eventually allow for tweaking such as modification of the offsets in various states, specified animation ranges etc. I'm not hounding your version of it, but my personal opinion is that it is better to let the engine handle the code for this sort of thing, especially since it eliminates a lot of overhead caused by creating an entity.

Now, I will say this - I am rather offended that you chose to demonstrate this feature so quickly after CoZ posted about the WIP (I must emphasize that point) feature in AirMod SE. You can say all you want - sure, it was already possible in Ply's Mod, but I think your actions show that you were all too eager to stomp on the work I have recently done. If I cannot demonstrate such a simple feature without it being taken, how can I expect to safely promote larger features that I have dedicated hours of work to? I have no objection to competitors working quietly at similar/same features, and certainly no objection after the release of my modification, but how can I expect to secure a user base if the trinkets that help to better formulate a complete game are taken one by one before I even have the chance to finalize or release them? This loss of faith may also greatly affect the course AirMod 0.7 will be taking. I do not hold this individual feature in high regard, however I cannot say the same for the motivation behind your actions.

@Those who apologized to me (S4, CoZ, Errant) - There is no need for an apology. You are certainly not at fault and it discomforts me that you feel that way.

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DarkFrost
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Posted: 14th May 2009 03:58 Edited at: 14th May 2009 04:24
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Whoa....Airslide thats pretty deep. Well said tho and i hope your SE edition of airmod comes out okay, even with this loss of faith. Actually i think it'll come out fine especially when there are those like me who are looking forward to it. Here if you need any help, im good with advertising things around the net and testing

BTW will SE support v1.15 of fpsc?

-Cyclone
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Plystire
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Posted: 14th May 2009 04:27
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@Airslide:

Demonstrating the feature "quickly" shouldn't be taken into regard here. It was not at all difficult to do in the current system and took little time and little effort. This was nothing about stomping on your work, either, as I would have pointed out if you had chosen to speak to me directly about this. Seriously, this is a personal confrontation you're making and I find it strange that you would choose to take it up on a public board instead of IM or email.

Whatever, it doesn't matter because I suppose everyone who saw what was going on would like to know what the underlying reason is. S4 and CoZ already know why because they spoke to me directly.

As you know, I hold my Mod in high regard. It's not an ego sorta thing, it's because I feel that I've made a system that expands the potential of FPSC far beyond what it use to be. It's been over a year now that I have worked on it. The feature list grows and with each new feature, more doors have opened... some of which I'm not even aware of.
It strikes me as odd that people would assume that things are not possible simply because there isn't a command titled to their specific desire. It seems like if people want armor for the player then they should have an FPI command titled "GivePlayerArmor=X". What kind of a system is that? That isn't a system at all.

If you want to get into the technical details about slowing down the engine, here's how it works: You give people the broader focus commands that are simple and easy to use. While this does clean up a few things under the hood, what you're missing here is that if it were broken into even two commands, then those two commands could be used in more than one application, thus preventing you from needing to make yet another broad command. After a while of adding these simple commands, you've cluttered the command list and instead of making the system run faster, it only takes longer to perform a check on what to do. What if somebody wanted to fly? Would you make a "LetPlayerFly" command? That seems silly but that also seemed to be your approach here. I was able to make a script that was well over 250 lines with each line containing over 3 conditions and 5 actions. That's a lot when you consider how little the scripts are the gather up over time. When I put that script into use, it had little to no performance effect at all!! But why should it matter if it did? Bloom would slow the engine down far more than any complicated script would, yet I still hear people screaming for that.

What am I getting at with all this? It probably sounds like I'm attacking you again, doesn't it? Well that's not the case. The case here is that I was a little disgruntled at the fact that everyone seems to be underestimating or misunderstanding my Mod. It's like... if they didn't see what they wanted on the featurelist directly, then they go somewhere else. I was upset at how fascinated everyone was that you did something that they could have already done a long time ago. It's upsetting to see how very few people can fathom what can be accomplished with a little bit of thought. Everyone looked at my Mod videos and all I hear about are "How do you do vehicles?" and "How do I get 3rd person to work?" when that wasn't what I was trying to get across with the video! This is about stepping OUT of the simplicity and discovering how to do bigger and better things! I only used the vehicle and 3rd person to show how a camera could be used, but apparently people are even more simple minded than I anticipated.

So before you go on about how I was attacking you, I want to say that I wasn't intending to bring you into the spot at all, I was only trying to make people realise that what they were gawking at was already possible. I'm not trying to steal your work. If I was, I would have chosen a better feature to take than that.


Now, back onto the subject of whether or not to make simplistic and easy-to-use commands versus a dynamic system. Sure, the engine will process things faster, there's no doubt about it, but I've seen way too many things that people ask for that just simply can't be done in the engine because of how inflexible it is. Too many things are hardcoded and that means that people have to either go with what the engine already has, or ask someone to make a Mod to do what they want to do (or heck... go to another engine). I've said it before, the aim of my Mod is to make the impossible possible for people using FPSC. I never said I was going to make it easy, I simply said it was going to be DOABLE. I know there are some things that will never be possible in FPSC, but the impossible will always be more noticeable if you go with the static, hardcoded route. That is my opinion, anyway.


Anyway, I never personally attacked you or your feature, I was only stating that it was already possible and nothing more. If you took it as a personal attack, then I'm sorry.


The one and only,


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Airslide
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Posted: 14th May 2009 04:49
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@Plystire:

I'm not trying to attack your mod either, and I think it's a fascinating achievement, and the level of complexity is truly inspiring. I understand that you feel your mod is underestimated, but I would have appreciated a heads-up before you went out and did this. I have no objection to you showing off such a feature - if you don't have the right, why should I? I merely felt slightly offended that it was done without warning and so quickly after the first (and somewhat poor ) display of AirMod SE.

I do like the way you setup your scripting commands, and the potential is immense. However, I feel that the primary problem - and the reason why you feel the mod is underestimated - is that your target audience is somewhat below what you've developed. When you first released Ply's Mod with AirMod I was eager to jump on it, and I enjoyed the "freedom" so to speak that comes with your scripting style. One of the reasons I've chosen not to mimic it, however, is probably more due to a personal tendency to lean towards something that is performance-aware and completely solid. It's sort of a sub-conscious tendency I've developed where I don't like using methods that feel hack-y. Take armor for example - I prefer it to be part of the engine, so that it can be treated at the same time as health, rather than as a script on say a dynamic light. It's not that there is a problem with your approach, it's just not my personal preference.

Regardless, that's a little off-point. My statements regarding scripting and performance were mostly to defend my side since there is no obvious downfall to yours. I simply wanted to make it clear that my method too has advantages. For example, since it is for a specific purpose, the body object does not need to be added to the entity system.

The real point is that I felt a little offended and that could have been avoided entirely if you consulted me first. The reason I made these posts in public was to primarily defend my position. Please don't feel that I'm attacking you, I'm just letting you know I'm a little upset. Of course, it probably doesn't help that I've been so sick lately that stress comes in buckets...

@Cyclone - Yes, AirMod SE is 115 compatible.

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DarkFrost
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Posted: 14th May 2009 04:56
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@Airslide - Good to hear, makes it all the better and no pressure on its creation from what I read in your post i see your stressed and i understand.

-Cyclone
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Nickydude
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Posted: 14th May 2009 14:21 Edited at: 14th May 2009 14:21
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Plystire, Airslide glad you guys understand each other and any further 'personal' discussions will of course be done by PM or email.



THE ANSWER TO ALL FPSC QUESTIONS!
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john need a new name
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Posted: 14th May 2009 17:26
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nickydude- you havent respinded to my emails ?
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Black Profductions
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Posted: 15th May 2009 13:11
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wait, if you plan to add multiplayer features, i mean, new ones like dynamic objects and more starting weapons,maybe ill buy it

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Nickydude
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Posted: 15th May 2009 13:52
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john need a new name, or should I say john schwarcz, this is your second duplicate account. Your first one is banned until June, you know why. Don't create dupe accounts when you're banned. Make another account and you will be permanently banned.



THE ANSWER TO ALL FPSC QUESTIONS!
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Red Eye
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Posted: 17th May 2009 14:09
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Bump, COOL PROGRESS mate, really cool features. keep it up


FPSCOptyGuide
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s4real
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Posted: 17th May 2009 14:10 Edited at: 17th May 2009 14:12
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Update :

Beta testing is almost over so a beta will be released soon on the forum's.

Best s4real


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Toasty Fresh
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Posted: 18th May 2009 07:14
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Quote: "by PM or email. "


P... M...?!

"You are not smart! You are very un-smart!"
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creator of zombies
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Posted: 18th May 2009 10:15
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Quote: "P... M...?!"

Private message/messenger. As in over MSN etc

CoZ

-Demon Sun: Lead Developer-
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Toasty Fresh
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Posted: 18th May 2009 10:43
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Mmm... for a moment there I thought the forum got a PM system.

"You are not smart! You are very un-smart!"
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The Fps Creator rocks!
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Posted: 18th May 2009 14:32
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Why do I have to email you to make it work S4real???

I want a new computer!
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xplosys
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Posted: 18th May 2009 18:19
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Quote: "P... M...?!"


Post Menopausal


S4, Test report sent.

Brian.

fpsFREE - Contact Me
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shadowfire
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Posted: 18th May 2009 21:36
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please let airmod work with v1.115! i really want it but i can't downgrade without losing all my custom media!

my motto: if it looks awesome, it probbably is awesome.

shallowness is fun!
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s4real
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Posted: 18th May 2009 21:55 Edited at: 18th May 2009 22:38
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@The Fps Creator rocks! I let you work that one out.

@xplosys Many thanks got it.

@shadowfire there a new release just come out that support v1.15

=====================================================================

Update:

New beta release today for the forum to test you must have fpsc v1.15 to test this version out.

Best s4real

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Hockeykid
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Posted: 18th May 2009 22:51
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Quote: "Update:

New beta release today for the forum to test you must have fpsc v1.15 to test this version out.

Best s4real"


Can the beta be bought early? Meaning if i bought today could i get the v1.15 current beta with build game?

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s4real
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Posted: 18th May 2009 22:52
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@hockeykid If you want it to be like that without it being fully tested then yes.

Best s4real

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4125
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Posted: 19th May 2009 00:07
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Found 2 Bugs With The Lastest Beta, Final, w.e....

1. The Win Zone trigger Zone Doesn't fade out Anymore It's Just Go To Black. But It Stil Works

2. The Gun Ammo Is Buggy. The P226 (EAI) Shows 16 as a Clip but I Set It to 15...When I Shoot, Sometimes The Numbers Skip And I End Up Shooting 12 Shoots or Something. This Happened Wih the P226 And The G36C..I think It Should Happen With the rest....

V115.003 W/ Project Blue UM V1.6e

Computer Specs: Intel Core 2 Duo E7400 2.80GHz @ 1066Mhz FSB 3MB Cache, Dual Channel 8192MB DDR2 PC6400 800MHz RAM, XFX Nvidia Geforce 9800 GTX+ 512MB, MSI P7N SLI-FI Motherboard - nForce 750i SLI
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s4real
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Posted: 19th May 2009 00:33
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@4125 thanks for the bug reports, the winzone always just gone black for me I never seen it fade.

Best s4real

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