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FPSC Classic Models and Media / [LOCKED] EAI Task Force 341 character set WIP (56k warning)

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Errant AI
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Posted: 15th Jan 2010 18:02 Edited at: 15th Jan 2010 18:03
@Aaagreen- Brilliant. I was going to contact you to see if you could run a Source test for me. Awesome.

@General Jackson- Sounds great. I'll be in touch.
General Jackson
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Posted: 15th Jan 2010 18:02 Edited at: 15th Jan 2010 18:10
Hey i posted right before you check it out quickk!

{edit}Yay

Black Profductions
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Posted: 15th Jan 2010 18:16
Errant, i can run you a unreal 3 test latter, if you are interested just tell me

Aaagreen
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Posted: 15th Jan 2010 18:56
Mmmmmmmmmm. Cant wait to reskin those faces.

Jeku always gets drunk and tries to Moderate the ocean. Tirelessly slapping the waves as they roll in.
michael x
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Posted: 15th Jan 2010 19:09
Errant i have been testing bond1 new shaders and learn how get the right lighting without the glossy look. here in the pic the one on the left no shader and the one on the right with shader. allow the model look to be part of the seg back ground. the model on the left looks like a cartoon compare to the other one.

more than what meets the eye

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Spycrabz
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Posted: 16th Jan 2010 01:24
Ooh! Ooh! Can i test them?

DarkFrost
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Posted: 16th Jan 2010 02:31
Which bond shaders work with characters?

[img][/img]
Bugsy
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Posted: 16th Jan 2010 05:47
you're looking for testers?

I'd like to throw my hat in the ring, but I won't spam your inbox, errant. you've got enough to deal with.



to fenix mod!
A r e n a s
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Posted: 16th Jan 2010 11:31
Hoora! Testing stage, this is good news Means that they are almost ready for release I'd love to beta test if your are beta testing

.CALIBRE - COMING MAY 2010
mgarand
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Posted: 16th Jan 2010 12:05
Hey Errant,

If you need a Beta-tester, i would love to test them!

btw, that screenshot looks ace!


cheers! Mgarand



Creativity is inventing, experimenting, growing, taking risks, breaking rules, making mistakes, and having fun.
Aaagreen
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Posted: 16th Jan 2010 12:22
Don't all his screenshots look ace?

Jeku always gets drunk and tries to Moderate the ocean. Tirelessly slapping the waves as they roll in.
mgarand
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Posted: 16th Jan 2010 12:22
yeh, but the last one is the best!



Creativity is inventing, experimenting, growing, taking risks, breaking rules, making mistakes, and having fun.
JJB Productions
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Posted: 16th Jan 2010 15:31
Ill be a beta tester. These are great! MW quality, maybe even better!

I AM LEGEND: THE VIDEO GAME
http://forum.thegamecreators.com/?m=forum_view&t=152828&b=25
Aaagreen
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Posted: 16th Jan 2010 15:52
They're certainly better than the CS:S counter-terrorists.

Jeku always gets drunk and tries to Moderate the ocean. Tirelessly slapping the waves as they roll in.
Bugsy
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Posted: 16th Jan 2010 19:07
agree'd. at least when I looked at them in detail.



to fenix mod!
Lucidx
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Posted: 16th Jan 2010 20:36
Looking good.

Lucidx
Soviet176
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Posted: 16th Jan 2010 21:02
Heh I would love to test them out errant.

"I haz no sig :o"
A r e n a s
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Posted: 17th Jan 2010 00:32
I think that all of his target audience are here and wanting to beta test. I reckon either no beta testing is done except with close friends or most of us will be disappointed when it is announced who is testing and who isnt.

.CALIBRE - COMING MAY 2010
Toasty Fresh
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Posted: 17th Jan 2010 01:44
I'd test but knowing me I'd end up getting frustrated and giving up or getting confused and not knowing what to do then giving up.

Your signature has been erased by a mod - Please reduce it to 600x120 maximum size
Aaagreen
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Posted: 17th Jan 2010 11:06
What I was thinking was creating a moving camera demonstration like one of the HL2 e3 demos - also the CSS stress test. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z56dRuQIpMw Except of course showing the normal mapped models, not some random refraction blocks.

Jeku always gets drunk and tries to Moderate the ocean. Tirelessly slapping the waves as they roll in.
Lucidx
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Posted: 17th Jan 2010 17:56
Beta testing gives me gas, I'm just looking forward to the release of these.

Lucidx
Hughes1994
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Posted: 17th Jan 2010 18:23
Ill be a beat tester, these are amazing. Great Work!

Aaagreen
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Posted: 17th Jan 2010 19:06
Enough with the beta testing requests, he hasn't even said he needs any yet. Just testers to port the .fbx format in to alternative engines.

Jeku always gets drunk and tries to Moderate the ocean. Tirelessly slapping the waves as they roll in.
Bugsy
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Posted: 17th Jan 2010 19:23
translation: "I want to beta test, but not in fpsc"

I'm curious to see how these would look in source. EAI's weapons looked really good.



to fenix mod!
Spycrabz
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Posted: 17th Jan 2010 22:39
I would try source, but Green has already done that...

(offtopic) You stole my sig green


My Portfolio: http://spycrabz.wordpress.com/home/
PW Productions
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Posted: 18th Jan 2010 06:53
EAI, when are you going to send me the SCAR payment button? You said sometime this weekend, but then again, I said I'd be patient. Just curious on how the characters are comin' along too.

New Site is up! Go check it out!
A r e n a s
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Posted: 18th Jan 2010 10:28
My friend has emailed EAI, with a reply, but in the second reply, he asked about the Scar with no luck :S Theres not much more that we can do except hope that we get a reply with purchase details about the scar and acog before the week has ended...




.CALIBRE - COMING MAY 2010
Errant AI
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Posted: 18th Jan 2010 16:55
Hi Guys, I'll get the SCAR info out there after I've delivered beta files for evaluation.

I've got enough testers for this phase. No need for additional volunteers.

On that matter, I just finished exporting the beta subset. I have spec maps and normal maps completed with those today as well. I am just about to load them up into FPSC and give them a check. Bond1 has been very kind to lend me an early version of his new ps2.0 char. shader and I am excited to see the results. I will be sure to grab some screenshots and post them. Now, if everything passes GO, I need only to put together some basic documentation and I will then contact those on the testing hook. Once those have left the nest, I will turn my attention to SCAR while I await feedback.

Thanks for everyone's patience and support with this.
Aaagreen
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Posted: 18th Jan 2010 18:39
Recieved and replied.

Jeku always gets drunk and tries to Moderate the ocean. Tirelessly slapping the waves as they roll in.
General Jackson
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Posted: 18th Jan 2010 19:13
Hey Errant, I sent you a mail

Team Vent
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Posted: 19th Jan 2010 03:27
I can't wait for these.
Errant AI
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Posted: 19th Jan 2010 17:19


Some preliminary screenshots testing bond1's new skinning_norm_spec.fx.



Those are all from last night. I've had to reformulate my normal baking recipe and still some work to be done with that. The new shader, overall is really great. The lighting actually matches the scene and that's terrific. The only problem I'm running into right now is that the lighting in the clavicle area seems sort of reversed. The spec control is amazing though. It's very sensitive which takes some getting used to. I am now really missing my high contrast ratio monitor!
Marc Steene
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Posted: 19th Jan 2010 17:30
Looking good


FPSC MIGRATION: http://bit.ly/5I8LYO
FPSC NUCLEAR EXPLOSION: http://bit.ly/67v8GI
Bootlicker
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Posted: 19th Jan 2010 17:46
I would love to beta test as this will be the onjly way I would be able to even get a glimpse of these. I unfortunately cannot buy these. If EAI remember that email I sent him he will know why...

Thanks,

Ben

bond1
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Posted: 19th Jan 2010 18:22 Edited at: 19th Jan 2010 18:36
Quote: " The only problem I'm running into right now is that the lighting in the clavicle area seems sort of reversed."



This isn't a mirrored UV area is it? And the UV's are all "forward facing"? That is, if you put a texture with text on it, the letters will face the correct way? If not, then the lighting will appear inside out. This shader's lighting algorithm does not account for flipped or mirrored UV's, which is an expensive pixel shader operation to implement, and would require ps3.

Wierd though, because bumpbone doesn't account for this either, and I don't notice it on that one. Although it's really hard to tell what's going on with that shader because of it's "floodlight directly over the head" shading.

Ideally, ambient light should be kept pretty low, and all lighting should rely on your scene lights. But to make this shader as forgiving as possible under any lighting conditions you throw at it, as you turn up ambient light, it will automatically fade in a forward facing "hero" light so the character doesn't look too flat from pure ambient lighting.

Love the goggles

----------------------------------------
"bond1 - You see this name, you think dirty."
Errant AI
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Posted: 19th Jan 2010 18:38
Nope no mirroring on that area and everything is right-reading. Meshes frequently get re-X-form reset so it's not a flipped face issue either.

I'm mostly puzzled because it doesn't occur with bumpbone but as you say it floods from the top and so it's hard to tell. I only have the boot mirrored but it's less obvious of a spot if the lighting gets wierd. I wouldn't even bat an eye at this but it's close to camera level.

Here's the portion of the normal map which is affected. I haven't really got the hang of looking at the red/blue colors yet but maybe it's obvious to you whee I am going wrong.





---

@Bootlicker - there's always compos and such. You should never need to settle for only a glimpse. Gotta shed the defeatist outlook.
General Jackson
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Posted: 19th Jan 2010 18:48 Edited at: 19th Jan 2010 18:57

When I beta test for Unity, could I beta test the guy in thie back of this picture? not the closeup guy, the one at the back
If im allowed to choos of course

bond1
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Posted: 19th Jan 2010 18:49 Edited at: 19th Jan 2010 19:09
How are you baking your normal maps? There is a harsh color gradient right in the top of the shoulder area, which means there is a HUGE offset in direction of the normals right there being applied by your normal map, which also means there is also going to be a big directional lighting change. Judging by the color gradient there on both sides, the normal is probably getting offset by more than 90 degrees, which would account for the backwards lighting. There's your culprit, I'm interested in your normal map workflow though, only because I've never seen one quite like it.

I've attached one of my normal maps just for comparison, I don't see any large scale directional changes (large scale color shifts).

EDIT: This isn't by chance a world-space normal map is it? Tangent space normal maps are usually uniformally blueish in color.

----------------------------------------
"bond1 - You see this name, you think dirty."

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mgarand
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Posted: 19th Jan 2010 22:01
damm, it looks so nice!
Have a beer for all the good work !



Creativity is inventing, experimenting, growing, taking risks, breaking rules, making mistakes, and having fun.
Bugsy
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Posted: 19th Jan 2010 22:06
seriously. even if these make me take out a second mortgage, I'm getting them.

I mean it.

give yourself a clap Errant AI



to fenix mod!
Bootlicker
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Posted: 20th Jan 2010 16:28
Quote: "@Bootlicker - there's always compos and such. You should never need to settle for only a glimpse. Gotta shed the defeatist outlook."


I have tried to enter comps etc, I just dont bother anymore... I am making a game for the latest apoc competition, I think it's probably one of the best that I have made but I dont think it will be enough to top other peoples.

I did however find £15 the other day, I invested it in a couple of your weapons....

Thanks,

Ben

Errant AI
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Posted: 20th Jan 2010 17:02
Quote: "I've attached one of my normal maps just for comparison, I don't see any large scale directional changes (large scale color shifts).

EDIT: This isn't by chance a world-space normal map is it? Tangent space normal maps are usually uniformally blueish in color."


Yep. It was world-space. For some really odd reason quite a while ago. I got it in my head that the lighting direction would get messed up on bumpbone.fx if world-space wasn't used. It so happened that the problem was that the shader maps were not getting loaded (due to missing D2) and when the problem was resolved it happened to be at the same time I tried world space. This is the general weakness of being ignorant LOL. I simply didn't realize that the lighting direction was top-down no matter what. I mistakenly thought that it was because it needed to know x,y,z from the normalmap!

Thanks so much for showing me that normalmap. As soon as I saw I knew the problem but went offline before being able to reply. I'm really glad because this means I don't need to bake the normalmaps anymore. I can just filter my greyscale bumpmap and it works perfectly.

Here's the same bit of map but done correctly:



And the result!







YAY!

The beautiful thing is that just being able to filter my bumpmaps is a HUGE time savings over baking.

Now tuning spec. Color spec. maps are just rad (the black is now where I want it, desert is close, woodland has yet to be touched). The shader is just brilliant. Starting to feel good about things.

OK side-note about the characters in the above pic; This is Marine10v.A-H. The cool thing about these particular characters is that they share the same texturemap. They are intended for designers to use them as generic/filler dudes. These are also a bit lower poly/detail (3100-3300 tris ea.). You can have many minor variations but not need to store/load excess textures. This also streamlines things if you want to make a retexture because you only need to modify one map to affect eight guys. At first I worried that the camo patterns would look really bad if repeated too many times but it's not as bad as I had feared. Older/bolder patterns like woodland or DPM might look more repetitive though.

Speaking of textures, I am doing a quick remix of textures. I have decided to downgrade to 1024s because the difference in detail is obfuscated by the normal map (which will remain at 2048 for excellent detail). The only downside was that when I did that the digital camo got blurry so I need to reapply it at lower pattern scale so that it remains totally crisp.

I fully intend to be satisfied with developments come tomorrow morning. I am looking foreward to getting away from these guys for a couple days.
bond1
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Posted: 20th Jan 2010 17:10 Edited at: 20th Jan 2010 17:11
Ah yes, that map looks much better! Can't wait to see a video of these guys - as good as screenshots look it's no substitute for seeing things in real time. Great job

Yes bumpbone can really mess with your mind, glad it's getting replaced.

----------------------------------------
"bond1 - You see this name, you think dirty."
Bugsy
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Posted: 20th Jan 2010 18:14
positively blowing my mind. these characters are the best I've ever seen in FPSC.



to fenix mod!
KeithC
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Posted: 20th Jan 2010 18:26
Awesome work; as usual.

-Keith
General Jackson
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Posted: 20th Jan 2010 19:25
Yeah Errant got your email cant wait

Will be sure to post screens of them in Unity.
In fact I am going to right now start making a desert map to showcase these guys in

Aaagreen
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Posted: 20th Jan 2010 20:13
I am also making a showcase map of sorts - expect funky shaders and lighting 'n' stuff.

Jeku always gets drunk and tries to Moderate the ocean. Tirelessly slapping the waves as they roll in.
DarkFrost
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Posted: 20th Jan 2010 21:34
Looking great!

Also, are you thinking on creating an arctic-like alternate camo? Would be a great addition to the current black, desert and soon-to-be woodland.

I don't mind making one or editing a current made one to have it appear as a winter camouflage.

Well lemme know what you think about another alternate camo, and if you'd like me to make it, or if you rather do one yourself.

Anyways keep up the great work! Looking forward to buying/trying these out!

[img][/img]
General Jackson
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Posted: 20th Jan 2010 21:46
Quote: "Also, are you thinking on creating an arctic-like alternate camo? Would be a great addition to the current black, desert and soon-to-be woodland."

I 2nd that.

Hughes1994
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Posted: 20th Jan 2010 21:47
Quote: "Also, are you thinking on creating an arctic-like alternate camo? Would be a great addition to the current black, desert and soon-to-be woodland."


I 3rd that.

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