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FPSC Classic Product Chat / V120 Public Beta 18 (RC)

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GreenDixy
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Posted: 8th Dec 2012 09:45
No fpm really needed i get it with just putting the simple grey floor you have when you start fps and a player marker for me i noticed it in beta 5

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My software never has bugs. It just develops random features.
Scene Commander
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Posted: 8th Dec 2012 09:57 Edited at: 8th Dec 2012 10:02
Quote: "No fpm really needed"


I'm afraid I can't replicate the issue as stated in my previous post. I therefore need an FPM to ensure that I'm replicating the issue exactly.

Incidently, I've tested with the grey floor and player marker and I'm getting stable results.

From reading the forum, 4 users appear to have reported this, is anyone else seeing it that hasn't mentioned it?

SC
ncmako
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Posted: 8th Dec 2012 18:10
Hi SC
Yes the bobblehead effect started about beta 3 or 4,worse in beta 5,little better now in beta 6. Crouching seems to stop the effect.
Happens with any segment or room. Here's my fpm used in the video.
Focus on the wall texture.
http://youtu.be/KDfPx1wCho4

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Flatlander
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Posted: 8th Dec 2012 18:23 Edited at: 9th Dec 2012 00:17
Quote: "Happens with any segment or room."


I created a huge scifi hanger bay room. No bobbles. I downloaded your fpm and ran it without looking at the video. Walking straight down the corridor there is no bobble.

Then I watched your video. Of course there is going to be a bobble when you try to walk along the wall so close. I'm not sure if it happens with all engines and in all games but this is acceptable to me. I'm not sure it can be 100% fixed but perhaps it can be toned down a bit. It sounds like it already has in beta 6. What's happening is you are colliding with the wall and then trying to climb up it and at the same time going forward.

I'm not sure most players would actually try to walk along the wall like that.

Addendum:

I decided to run your level again and try to walk up against the wall as you did in the video. I discovered that I don't get the same amount of bobble that you did. In fact very little and it looked a lot more natural. I will make a video of what I get and post it to YouTube.

I'm beginning to wonder if it has to do with the type of graphic cards that are being used. So far I believe there are only four or five who are reporting this.

Addendum #2:

Here's the video.



THEORY - you know everything but nothing works. PRACTICE - when everything works but don't know why. For me, theory and practice are combined: nothing works and I don't know why.
ncmako
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Posted: 8th Dec 2012 23:49
@Flatlander Yes, yours is definitely a smoother flow when walking.
If I crouch the effect is gone & my movement is smooth as yours.
When I first noticed this effect I just discarded it as a natural bounce or bob when walking and firgured I can live with it. It is only when others saw this that I questioned it.
MK83
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Posted: 9th Dec 2012 00:00
I'm reporting that I'm getting the bobble head effect too.
1.20 beta 6 My video card info is attached, just incase it is needed. By the way, I tested this with all the .fpm files that come stock with fpsc.

mk83 Productions

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MK83
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Posted: 9th Dec 2012 00:08
And DXDIAG info here.

mk83 Productions

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Flatlander
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Posted: 9th Dec 2012 00:15 Edited at: 9th Dec 2012 00:20
MK83, interesting that you have the issue with GeForce GTX 260. I have GeForce GTX 240 so I would probably have to say it can't be the graphics card. As I had mentioned before I don't have this issue as the video above bares out.

Has anyone who has this problem built a stand-alone level and then played it on other computers? If you have access to a way to upload a small game compressed with 7z for others to download, SC and myself could download it and see if it has issues when we play it. This would certainly determine if it is the development computer or something else.

THEORY - you know everything but nothing works. PRACTICE - when everything works but don't know why. For me, theory and practice are combined: nothing works and I don't know why.
ncmako
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Posted: 9th Dec 2012 00:31
I'm running a GeForce210.
I took the same map and threw in a few struts and couple drums.Stayed away from walls best I could, but when approaching
drums(dynamic),bobbing got really bad?
http://youtu.be/vr7ymYw6iUU
Teabone
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Posted: 9th Dec 2012 00:42
The weirdest things happen when you attempt to pick up an item your standing on.... lol

da2020
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Posted: 9th Dec 2012 03:18
I'm getting the bobble head issue too 0.o A lot of people seems to be having this issue, I'll try to build a stand alone and see if the issue is still there.
MK83
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Posted: 9th Dec 2012 14:46
Quote: "Has anyone who has this problem built a stand-alone level and then played it on other computers? If you have access to a way to upload a small game compressed with 7z for others to download, SC and myself could download it and see if it has issues when we play it. This would certainly determine if it is the development computer or something else."

I tried to build a stand alone level, but can't. FPSC crashes right after build engine starts.

mk83 Productions
raymondlee306
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Posted: 10th Dec 2012 01:19 Edited at: 10th Dec 2012 01:36
I was the one who did the test for Lee for what I believe is this version. During that test I did over 15 builds of stock maps and my own custom maps on 2 different computers with different spec and even had to get media from the store as part of the requirement and did not have one failure during testing and building and then testing on another computer (few texture issues, but nothing serious). If I may make one suggestion to those having trouble, I would say backup your files, COMPLETELY remove FPSC and all files and start with a clean install and upgrade. This is what I did to perform the test. Then, before putting your files back in, try building the stock maps and see what that does. Then add your files back in and see if it crashes. If so, then the problem is something in your files and NOT the editor itself. If anyone wants, send me an fpm using only stock media (as we might not have the same model packs) that you know crashes on your system and I will try it on mine. I might not be able to fix it, but if I can't build it you'll know your not crazy (at least about this anyway).
Disturbing 13
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Posted: 10th Dec 2012 06:43 Edited at: 10th Dec 2012 06:43
Has the 'sliding on top of entities that you jump on' thing been fixed?

Scene Commander
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Posted: 10th Dec 2012 07:46
@Disturbing 13

Yes, that has (fingers crossed) been fixed.

As for the `bobble` issue, I'm still investigating. Although a number of users are experiencing it, it isn't consistant and I'm wary of pushing a fix through that may break something else. So please bear with me.

SC
Ertlov
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Posted: 10th Dec 2012 11:29
Hi guys, I experience the bobble effect heavily in Metro Theater flooded demo level - you should have that one.

And I added an FPM (stock media only) where not only the bobble is appearing, also the lift isnt working. It`s not working in the Into the Dark levels, either.

Come to where the madness is:http://www.indiedb.com/games/into-the-dark

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Scene Commander
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Posted: 10th Dec 2012 11:54 Edited at: 10th Dec 2012 11:56
Hi Ertlov,

Maybe I've not been clear. The problem isn't that the effect isn't happening, it's just not happening for everyone. Neither Lee or I can replicate it to anywhere near the extent shown in the various videos.

I've downloaded mcnako's FPM and I'm not seeing the effect, although I do see it in the video. This is obviously making it a little hard to track down.

I've also tested with the metro theatre Flooded FPM and it's very stable for me.

That said, I've been playing around with the physics in the hope of making things a little more stable and I've uploaded an alpha build here for users who are experiencing 'wobble'. This isn't a guaranteed fix as it's been produced without being able to replicate the issue, so maybe users could let me know if this helps.

SC
Corno_1
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Posted: 10th Dec 2012 12:47 Edited at: 10th Dec 2012 17:22
@ scene comander thank you for this alpha build, i did not have this wobble effect anymore! Great work

Addition: Is there any comand or something else how i can give my plr a weapon with X ammo?
Because setvar=$CA, setvar=$A or giveplrweapon=ww2\colt45 X are not working! I just get a gun with one magazin

you need a script? I need useful requests at the moment!
http://forum.thegamecreators.com/?m=forum_view&t=200918&b=23
Flatlander
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Posted: 10th Dec 2012 14:01
Quote: " i did not have this wobble effect anymore! Great work"


I do truly hope this works for everybody else having this issue.

I have been programming for more than 40 years and I'm still amazed when something so elusive can be so easy to fix. Good job SC.

THEORY - you know everything but nothing works. PRACTICE - when everything works but don't know why. For me, theory and practice are combined: nothing works and I don't know why.
Ertlov
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Posted: 10th Dec 2012 14:13
Unfortunately this alpha crashes every try to testgame, no matter which level, on my side.

Come to where the madness is:http://www.indiedb.com/games/into-the-dark
Flatlander
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Posted: 10th Dec 2012 14:23
@Ertlov, that's interesting. There is only one line of code that is changed/revised and I can't see where this would crash anybody's test game.

After I made the change for my "own" alpha, it didn't crash for me. Of course, I wasn't getting bobble/wobble problem either. Although, I do have to say that after running ncmako's fpm it run's even smoother. Although you have to be absolutely cognizant of watching for any movements.

THEORY - you know everything but nothing works. PRACTICE - when everything works but don't know why. For me, theory and practice are combined: nothing works and I don't know why.
Ertlov
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Posted: 10th Dec 2012 14:33 Edited at: 10th Dec 2012 14:46
Quote: "@Ertlov, that's interesting. There is only one line of code that is changed/revised and I can't see where this would crash anybody's test game. "


thats interesting because the exe is 7MB smaller than the previous one

Edit:

FPSC 120B6 - no lifts working, wobbling
FPSC 120B6 + Alpha Game exe - crash on test game
FPSC 120B3 - everything working, but with the bugs Beta 3 had

Edit2:

Screen attached

Come to where the madness is:http://www.indiedb.com/games/into-the-dark

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Flatlander
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Posted: 10th Dec 2012 15:25
I'm not saying that what is happening to you is not happening.

You got the alpha that also include Lee's update which I believe deleted some things. I can't imagine that it was 7MB worth after the compile but . . .

I think I'm going to stay out of this now.

I just know it's working for me and I'm sorry it's not working for you.

THEORY - you know everything but nothing works. PRACTICE - when everything works but don't know why. For me, theory and practice are combined: nothing works and I don't know why.
ncmako
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Posted: 10th Dec 2012 15:38 Edited at: 10th Dec 2012 15:39
Thank you SC & Flatlander
Bobbing effect is minimal, next to none.Much smoother.
But I do have to admit, Lift1.fpi is not working.
Lift2.fpi and Lift tubes are working just fine here.

Funny, as the Lift tubes uses Lift1.fpi?
Ertlov
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Posted: 10th Dec 2012 15:40
no offense meant, it`s just very, very strange. perhaps I should make a clean new install again...

Come to where the madness is:http://www.indiedb.com/games/into-the-dark
Scene Commander
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Posted: 10th Dec 2012 18:41
@Ertlov.

A reinstall might be an good idea. It's seeming to me that this has fixed the wobbling issue for many users and I honestly can't see why any of the changes would cause a crash. (In fact, they should make it more stable.).

Obviously, if you're still having problems afterward, we can look at it again.

The lift issue appears to be a collision issue. I tested it with the scifi lift and they work with both scripts, providing you walk onto them. The WW2 doesn't work as you can't get onto it without jumping.

Oddly, the moving platform does work.

I'll have a think about it.
ncmako
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Posted: 10th Dec 2012 18:45 Edited at: 10th Dec 2012 18:46
@Erlov I agree, but before I do a clean install could someone please test this .fpm Simple room with six lifts. I narrowed it down to all lifts working from scifi folder including lift tube. None working from ww2 folder? Strange, very strange.
Again,bobbing effect is gone.Runs very smooth.

Just saw your post SC...will wait.

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MK83
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Posted: 10th Dec 2012 21:01 Edited at: 10th Dec 2012 21:16
Mine is a clean install, the alpha did fix the wobble while walking, but it is there when I jump.

EDIT: also the alpha fixed my build game crash. So I will upload the terrorstrike game I built for testing. Remember the wobble is now when I jump.

mk83 Productions
MK83
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Posted: 10th Dec 2012 21:18 Edited at: 10th Dec 2012 21:19
Mine is a clean install, the alpha did fix the wobble while walking, but it is there when I jump.

EDIT: also the alpha fixed my build game crash. So I will upload the terrorstrike game I built for testing. Remember the wobble is now when you jump.

Sorry for double post.

mk83 Productions
Flatlander
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Posted: 10th Dec 2012 21:19 Edited at: 10th Dec 2012 21:22
Yep, WW2 lifts are not working. I rebuilt a WW2 room with the WW2 lifts one from bottom and one from top. Still didn't work.

The SciFi lifts are working with one issue but could be taken care of with scripting -- maybe.

If you enter the lift and go to the very back (up against the wall) the lift takes you to the top. Then when you turn around in order to go out the door and move forward, the lift begins it's downward movement and the player could not get out of the lift before it started down.

Addendum:

Lift2.fpi does not work either with the WW2 lifts.

THEORY - you know everything but nothing works. PRACTICE - when everything works but don't know why. For me, theory and practice are combined: nothing works and I don't know why.
MK83
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Posted: 10th Dec 2012 21:26 Edited at: 10th Dec 2012 22:09
finally the download link.
http://www.mediafire.com/?2c0c7ivqbk48bp3

mk83 Productions
Flatlander
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Posted: 10th Dec 2012 23:07 Edited at: 10th Dec 2012 23:27
@Scene Commander:

There is no case available for the condition command AICONDASSOCIATED? There is the constant plus the keyword created but no case. Because of that it will always return true. Is that how it is meant to be?

Addendum:

It seems that there hasn't been a case for this from a long time back. I can't find the code that actually contains the case. ???

Addendum#2:

I am adding a case where it will be false if the player is not associated with a lift. If they are then it will be true. Of course I will let you know what happens with this.

THEORY - you know everything but nothing works. PRACTICE - when everything works but don't know why. For me, theory and practice are combined: nothing works and I don't know why.
Flatlander
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Posted: 11th Dec 2012 00:00 Edited at: 11th Dec 2012 00:37
@MK83

I downloaded and will be making a youtube video of the level. I don't really notice a bobble. I will place the video in this post.

Here 'tis:



I don't consider it an unwanted bobble when player jumps. He is simply bouncing a tad when hitting the floor. Usually caused by the knees bending slightly and then straightening up.

THEORY - you know everything but nothing works. PRACTICE - when everything works but don't know why. For me, theory and practice are combined: nothing works and I don't know why.
Flatlander
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Posted: 11th Dec 2012 03:33 Edited at: 11th Dec 2012 04:01
The reason the WW2 lifts are not working is not because of the code or a bug in the code. It is because of the scripting.

Replace the lift1.fpi with the attached lift1.fpi. Be sure and make a backup of the version you are replacing. This will allow the WW2 lifts to work as well as the SciFi lifts to work better. If you want the WW2 lifts to go faster then you can speed them up with the speed parameter but I would say that they would not really move that fast back in the 40's.

I will look at the lift2.fpi next.

Here is the download for lift2.fpi that will work.

THEORY - you know everything but nothing works. PRACTICE - when everything works but don't know why. For me, theory and practice are combined: nothing works and I don't know why.

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Scene Commander
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Posted: 11th Dec 2012 09:13 Edited at: 11th Dec 2012 09:15
Hi guys,

I've just compared Flatlanders scripts and it's very obvious why this fixes the issue and was in line with my thinking. I'd suggest using FL's scripts with the WW2 lifts from now on, although I'd suggest renaming them Lift1WW2 and Lift2WW2 so you retain the old scripts.

The problem, is also the same reason as to why it's difficult to walk onto the WW2 lift. The root cause of the issue is also, awkwardly the fix for numerous far more serious problems. The solution (inelegant I'll admit), is to place a slightly raised segment (I used SciFi Concrete-Step) facing the lift at which the player enters/exits which will allow smooth egress.

I'll see if I can come up with a coding solution that doesn't break other things, but the above should keep you going.

@MK83

Again, I'm not seeing anything 'bobbling' with the jumping, is it as FT has stated, just when you land?

SC
Ertlov
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Posted: 11th Dec 2012 11:12
@ALL

I did the following:

1. Install FPSC v1.0 online clean into a new directory
2. Install Upgrade 1.206
3. Copy the game Exe from the mediafire link (17,8MB size) into the FPSC root
4. Started FPSC
5. loaded vanilla terrorstrike
6. Hit "test" button

Result: same crash

Note that NONE of my assets were in the files foleder, everything plain stock.

Come to where the madness is:http://www.indiedb.com/games/into-the-dark
Scene Commander
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Posted: 11th Dec 2012 11:40
@Ertlov

This sounds like an editor conflict, which seems to happen occasionally for some users.

I'd suggest moving back to Beta 6 (not the alpha). This issue should be fixed with another full beta build.
Flatlander
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Posted: 11th Dec 2012 15:13
Quote: "The problem, is also the same reason as to why it's difficult to walk onto the WW2 lift"


I have no problem walking onto the WW2 lift as long as it is a part of the lift segment. I do have a problem with walking onto the lift if it is used apart from the lift segment. In other words using only the dynamic entity. I'm not sure why one would do this as a WW2 lift would never be a separate platform as if you were making a scifi game.

Also, I was having difficulties with the scifi lifts as I had mentioned in a previous post. Do what you feel is right but if you have an issue with the platform starting out prematurely before you can get off then use the same script.

THEORY - you know everything but nothing works. PRACTICE - when everything works but don't know why. For me, theory and practice are combined: nothing works and I don't know why.
MK83
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Posted: 11th Dec 2012 15:34
@Scene Commander
Quote: "@MK83

Again, I'm not seeing anything 'bobbling' with the jumping, is it as FT has stated, just when you land?"


It is.

mk83 Productions
Scene Commander
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Posted: 11th Dec 2012 16:29
@MK83

That's how's it's supposed to be I think.. It's the physics simulating shock absorbtion.
MK83
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Posted: 11th Dec 2012 18:45
okay

mk83 Productions
Stalker93
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Posted: 12th Dec 2012 16:44
There's till the "water+lightrays" reflections issue..i'm getting weird blackish reflections while keeping water and light rays on..if I switch the water back off, I get a black plane lying on the lowest floor of the map..Someone know a fix? Thx!!
ncmako
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Posted: 12th Dec 2012 19:37 Edited at: 12th Dec 2012 19:39
All is running smooth with the Alpha fix, only problem I came across is "currentweapon" Tried many combinations,but nothing seems to work.
Corno_1
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Posted: 12th Dec 2012 19:48
@ncmako look here in beta6 currentweapon is now plrcurrentweapon
http://code.google.com/p/fpscreatorengine/source/detail?r=715
But i must say plrcurrentweapon is very mean for my entity locgic. I test it with various scripts! Look here for the script scene
http://forum.thegamecreators.com/?m=forum_view&t=202140&b=23
And i have a question: Is there any trick how i can give with giveplrweapon= a weapon with more than one magazin

Thanks for all Scene

you need a script? I need useful requests at the moment!
http://forum.thegamecreators.com/?m=forum_view&t=200918&b=23
ncmako
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Posted: 12th Dec 2012 20:02
@Corno_1 Yep,your right. I see it. That was back in Oct.29th?
I tried many ways to used "plrcurrentweapon" but always crashes?
Flatlander
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Posted: 12th Dec 2012 21:30 Edited at: 12th Dec 2012 22:21
This is how plrcurrentweapon works.

First of all it is a condition. Secondly, it looks to see if the player is holding the weapon from a particular slot. In other words, if the player has two weapons.

Slot #1 - Colt45
Slot #2 - Tommygun

Now if you use the following script:

:state=0,plrwithinzone=1:state=5
:state=5,plrcurrentweapon=1:state=10
:state=5:state=15
:state=10:rpg_showquicktext=b-36-r Player has weapon from slot #1 - The Colt 45!,rpg_wait4enter,state=15
:state=15,plrwithinzone=0:state=0

If the player is holding the Colt45 when entering the trigger zone, the text in state #10 will be displayed. If the player is holding the tommygun then no text will be displayed. The command in state #10 is from RPG Mod.

If you replace the value 1 with 2 in the first state #5 then the reverse will take place. If player is holding the tommygun and enters the trigger zone then it will be true and so display the text. Of course you need to make sure that what you want to happen is truly based on the gun the player is holding.

Addendum #1:

The slot must be filled with that weapon. If it is not considered a weapon in the engine then it will not take up a slot.

Addendum #2:

Another thing I thought of is that this command should not be in a constant loop. It should only be executed once and then whatever needs to be done if true is done. If the engine is constantly checking to see if the player is holding this particular "weapon" throughout the game there will be a terrible drain on the FPS for the game. It is not meant to be a constant checker for what the player is holding as a weapon. I don't know if I explained this very well but this is the best I could do.

I don't meant that it can only be executed once in the entire level but its use should be minimized.

THEORY - you know everything but nothing works. PRACTICE - when everything works but don't know why. For me, theory and practice are combined: nothing works and I don't know why.
s4real
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Posted: 12th Dec 2012 23:38
Quote: "Hi guys,

I've just compared Flatlanders scripts and it's very obvious why this fixes the issue and was in line with my thinking. I'd suggest using FL's scripts with the WW2 lifts from now on, although I'd suggest renaming them Lift1WW2 and Lift2WW2 so you retain the old scripts."


I think its a very bad idea to make scripts to fix issues with the source instead of fixing the problem, I've seen this a few times now making new scripts to fix problem instead of fixing the problem at hand in the source.

After updating to Windows 8 fpsc does run a lot faster 20fps faster in-fact so the speed for the new beta pretty good in windows 8 shame its still 30 fps slower than wasp but its workable.

Having the cap so high causes many issues and could be the problem with the bobble effect fpsc has always ran stable at 80 fps or lower any higher and it become unstable.

Culling scripts don't work anymore so they need fixing.

There def improvements with this version but still a long way to go

Keep up the good work scene

best s4real


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Flatlander
FPSC Tool Maker
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Location: The Flatlands
Posted: 13th Dec 2012 00:01 Edited at: 13th Dec 2012 00:04
Quote: "I think its a very bad idea to make scripts to fix issues with the source instead of fixing the problem, I've seen this a few times now making new scripts to fix problem instead of fixing the problem at hand in the source."


I must disagree. First of all it is a collision problem that has cropped up because of the model itself. Eventually the lift may be remade but it's not necessary because one can use a script in order to turn the collision off at the right time and then back on again. There was another minor issue that had to do with distance of the player. If the player would go to the back of the lift and then come forward to get off, the lift would start moving downward/upward. This was fixed. These scripts will be a part of beta 7. If you start messing around with the physics or anything like that in the core you are asking for trouble.


Quote: "Having the cap so high causes many issues and could be the problem with the bobble effect fpsc has always ran stable at 80 fps or lower any higher and it become unstable."


Most of the time I get 130 fps and I have no bobble effect. The only thing that the higher frame rates can cause an ill effect is with the animation of decals.

Quote: "Culling scripts don't work anymore so they need fixing."


How can they be fixed if you don't explain why they aren't working for you? It's like if I said Vishnu packer doesn't work for me anymore.

THEORY - you know everything but nothing works. PRACTICE - when everything works but don't know why. For me, theory and practice are combined: nothing works and I don't know why.
ncmako
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Location: Hendersonville,NC
Posted: 13th Dec 2012 00:05
@Flatlander
Thank You! Yes, that gives me a totally different perspective on the matter. Will test out here shortly.(fingers crossed)
Also, the "plrcurrentweapon" I didn't see listed yet even in the newest script list posted 10th dec.(part of my problem)
Again, Thank You
s4real
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Posted: 13th Dec 2012 00:16 Edited at: 13th Dec 2012 02:07
@F l a t l a n d e r :- First scene knows about the culling scripts not working so its just a reminder.

Second the models have worked with no problem up until the latest version come on you meant to be a moder this problem are due to fixes thats causing other issues.I admit I've not looked into the new source code but the lift issues have never happened before for me all the time I've had the software.
I feel its a case of fix one thing make more issues/bugs.
Workarounds is ok but other things break.
My point was that something has changed to stop them from working how they should be and scripts is a bad idea because you not fixing the problem you just given a workaround and this will lead to other issues in the long run.


As a moder as well you should know that not all system run well with fpsc running above 80 fps, but you couldn't of done much testing in that field if you didn't know this.

Scene doing a great job but I can see this becoming a bit of a fix one problem make 10 more maybe take a step back and look at the code again from early copies.

This is not a dig at anyone just my personal feedback
best s4real


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