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Work in Progress / RPG - Geisha House. Image intensive!!

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sneaky smith12
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Posted: 15th May 2007 23:50
I've been following the progrees of this for quite some time now, and it honestly has come quite a ways. I would like to know though when the expected beta comes out . I would love to test this game.

If at first you dont succeed, LOWER YOUR STANDARDS.
Lucifer
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Posted: 16th May 2007 00:49
hey cash, when are we going to see a new video from the game???!!! we need da vidz!


i like pancakes..
Cash Curtis II
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Posted: 16th May 2007 07:38
Well, I know that I haven't been posting. Progress has been slow. I still have one final to take next week. I'll be working until then, then I'll be back on it at the pace that I was.

Quote: "hey cash, when are we going to see a new video from the game???!!! we need da vidz!"

Very soon. I spent last night making speech icons. Yes, I've finally decided what type of speech interface I'll have. I badly wanted a text parser, but I've resisted and resisted, and now I'll have a nice point and click speech interface. Once that's done, it will be video worthy.

@sneaky smith12 -
I always say soon, don't I? I swear the engine is nearly done. Then it will be a matter of finalizing all of the story, conversations, and media. That's a lot of work even with the engine complete

@Dr Manette -
Probably the only thing I'll do with a mirror like that is have it act as a portal to another area. I don't think I'll want them to be too important to gameplay, and might even have an option to toggle them off.

The camera angle is totally modifiable. I am thinking of adding a true 3rd person following camera though. I'll experiment with it.

@TEH_CODERER -
I'm not sure. When I look at a real mirror, there's no bloom effect to be seen. The only thing I see on my mirror here is refraction along all of the edges where the mirror slants, like half an inch all around. That would be a very nice effect, and not terribly hard to implement, but I don't think I'll bother. But, I appreciate it!!

@Sven B -
Yeah, I've fixed the darkness issue now. I shouldn't have even shown the mirror looking like that Thanks!


Come see the WIP!
Diggsey
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Posted: 16th May 2007 22:33 Edited at: 16th May 2007 22:55
TEH_CODERER
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Posted: 16th May 2007 22:48
It was just because you mentioned the bright reflection spot and I figured that bloom might acheive that. However, if the mirrors aren't a major part of the game then it is OTT as well as un-realistic.

Chenak
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Posted: 17th May 2007 01:51
Again sorry for the lack of updates and progress for the models, I've had a huge amount of coursework to do for uni which has now all been handed.

I may be able to get you the model soon, hopefully it will have a good normal map to go with it if I get zbrush working again
RiiDii
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Posted: 17th May 2007 14:00
Cash, how are you doing the mirror? Another camera or a bitmap, or something else?


Open MMORPG: It's your game!
Aaron Miller
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Posted: 18th May 2007 07:25
@RiiDii
I am willing to bet he is using the modified shader done by Lucy. There was a thread earlier, and Cash posted in it, so he was definately there for it (That's not a bad thing, btw).

@Cash Curtis II
Looking good. Keep up the good work.


Cheers,

-db

Cash Curtis II
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Posted: 18th May 2007 09:01
@Diggsey -
!!

@TEH_CODERER -
I totally understand what you're saying. I've just avoided using bloom at all because it's so slow. It's unfortunate that it is, it's a nice effect when it's used right.

@Chenak -
I know the feeling, like I said I've been really busy lately too. I am definitely looking forward to seeing the model

@RiiDii -
I've set up the system so that there is one more camera and one mirror plain. Along with Sync Mask, and a low resolution image, the mirror only takes away 5 fps, which isn't bad at all. The limitation is that only one mirror can be on screen at a time. You can have 100, but if two should ever be on screen at the same time it will fill the highest numbered mirror with the mirror plain. I'll just have a mirror in a couple buildings anyway.

@DB user 2006+ -
Thanks I'm actually not using the shader. I just set up my own system that meets my needs. Also, I don't want an important system like this tied down to a shader, I want it to work no matter what. There's one area of the game where it will act as a portal, and having it depend upon a shader might not work for everyone.

I've not experienced some of Lucy's problems either. I'm not sure if I'm missing something obvious, but I'm very picky about how things look and I'm happy with the effect. It turned out exactly as I planned (rare and definitely good).


Come see the WIP!
Aaron Miller
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Posted: 18th May 2007 09:05
@RiiDii
*Digs for money in wallet*

@Cash Curtis II
Oh, ok. On that note, I am curious, have you used shaders else where in the game?


Cheers,

-db

Alquerian
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Posted: 18th May 2007 10:09 Edited at: 18th May 2007 10:10
I know that I have avoided using shaders like the plague. Some of them (as Cash mentioned) look fantastic, such as the bloom shader, however they often come with very cumbersome overhead. For this reason my terrain editor will not be using a shader for texturing by default, and possibly not at all.

On a side note, Driftwood RPG (as some have come to know it), will have several optional shaders. I can totally understand Cash's stance on this.

Cash - You have been keeping us all in suspense far too long. Really we need a video or some screenies just to survive. For God's sake anything! oh and... !!!

Visit the Wip!
Cash Curtis II
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Posted: 18th May 2007 10:41 Edited at: 22nd May 2007 12:36
@DB user 2006+ -
Quote: "On that note, I am curious, have you used shaders else where in the game?"

Absolutely. I have normal mapping for many of the characters and gloss shading for the water. I also have included GG's contrast enhancing shader for lightmapped objects. Hopefully you can tell from the videos and some of the pictures. The shaders are optional though, just as Alquerian mentioned. I definitely don't want any part of the game to depend on a shader.

@Alquerian -
Quote: "You have been keeping us all in suspense far too long. Really we need a video or some screenies just to survive. For God's sake anything! oh and... !"

Yeah, yeah, I'm a dirtbag I will soon, I just want to finish the conversation system. It's shaping up nicely and fits nicely with the existing framework. That will really take the game to the next level. I built a mini project to make it in, and I'm glad I did. Compiling 1000 lines of code over and over really beats 19000
!!!!


Come see the WIP!

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Aaron Miller
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Posted: 18th May 2007 11:06
I want to join in on the smiley fun!
!!!!!

@Cash Curtis II
Ok. Actually, I think I knew that, but it just wasn't in my mind at the time. Sorry for the original post, but at least I now know it's optional.

Cheers,

-db

RiiDii
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Posted: 18th May 2007 18:05
Cash, here's something I discovered a little while ago; you might want to play around with it. There are some trade-offs though - such as flashing text. If you are using sprites or image pasting for text anyway, then this might be a happy alternative to multiple cameras.




Open MMORPG: It's your game!
Diggsey
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Posted: 18th May 2007 19:29 Edited at: 20th May 2007 23:58


edit:
All gone HAPPY NOW??? lol

Jack
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Posted: 19th May 2007 05:54 Edited at: 23rd May 2007 01:20
Nice game

[/center]
Aaron Miller
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Posted: 19th May 2007 08:51
lol. Cash.... All your thread are belong to !

Roxas
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Posted: 19th May 2007 11:12 Edited at: 19th May 2007 11:13
Anny updates ?

PS:






[B] - LINKIN PARK - [/B]

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Deathead
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Posted: 20th May 2007 00:05 Edited at: 20th May 2007 00:09
Roxa's Pawns all!

Sorry Cash¬
This is one of the i think most greatest RPG's every on here!

JOIN NOW!Or be square!
Diggsey
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Posted: 20th May 2007 12:41
@Cash
You can't blame us.
I think another video might stop this smiley madness

Deathead
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Posted: 20th May 2007 14:05
diggsey is right!!!

JOIN NOW!Or be square!
Benjamin
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Posted: 20th May 2007 20:05
Guys, stop spamming his thread.

Tempest (DBP/DBCe)
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Deathead
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Posted: 20th May 2007 22:18
Ben you just spammed there was no reason to post
Guys,stop spamming his thread. So really it counts as spam.
But im still awaiting for another screenie to comment on.

JOIN NOW!Or be square!
Benjamin
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Posted: 20th May 2007 22:48 Edited at: 20th May 2007 22:49
Quote: "Ben you just spammed there was no reason to post"

Go fall down a well. I had to post because I needed to tell morons like you to stop wrecking cash's thread.

Tempest (DBP/DBCe)
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Roxas
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Posted: 20th May 2007 22:55 Edited at: 21st May 2007 00:10
Edit:
Sorry
.........


[B] - LINKIN PARK - [/B]
RUCCUS
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Posted: 20th May 2007 23:54 Edited at: 22nd May 2007 04:50
@Cash:

Wow dude, this game is looking amazing. Just one suggestion I thought Id make, in almost every RPG I see, the enemies always walk towards you, even if you're like 10 meters away. I noticed in your video your RPG does this too, the skeleton kept walking, slowly, towards the player as the player ran. It might be cool to have enemies begin jogging and then maybe even running, depending on how far the player is from the enemy. Then you could introduce stamina, allowing the user to run for short bursts of time.

Lucifer
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Posted: 21st May 2007 17:55
i'm still waiting for that new video cash!!! you'd better bring it or else


i like pancakes..
Diggsey
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Posted: 21st May 2007 18:40
Lol, its been weeks since you promised us a new video

Aaron Miller
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Posted: 22nd May 2007 07:18
It's been a few days since you responded.

Cheers,

-db

Agent Dink
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Posted: 22nd May 2007 10:56
Maybe Cash died... He probably stayed up for a few days in a row, didn't eat or use a restroom and kicked the bucket while programming.

I have no signature...
Cash Curtis II
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Posted: 22nd May 2007 12:35 Edited at: 22nd May 2007 12:37
@RUCCUS and Benjamin -
I appreciate you guys looking out for the thread. The smiley faces are okay though, they're delivered with good nature and a bit of impatience for my new video. This page was already ruined though by my lack of a video, so I wanted it to get used up anyway so that I could occupy post 281 with something good. Unfortunately the video is not ready yet and I have class in a little while. Maybe tonight after class I'll be able to pull it together. We'll see. If not tonight then I should definitely have one tomorrow.

It's very good to know that you guys are following the thread

@RiiDii -
That is a fantastic alternate method for the use of mirrors. My issue right now with it is the double sync. Right now, syncing is one of the slowest things that happens in the game besides the physics update. I worry that if I do it twice with so much media it will drag. Have you tried it out yet in your project? I'm very interested in how it performs. If you haven't then I'll try it out after the video that I keep promising everyone

@Diggsey, Deathead, Lucifer, DB user 2006+ -
Soon, I swear!!

@RUCCUS -
Some enemies should definitely be able to run. Probably not the skeletons, they're likely past their athletic prime
Some of the other enemies should though, it does strike me as a bit odd that nobody tried very hard to catch you (besides the animals, they can run). I love the idea of stamina too, I'll definitely add that. That will add a new strategic element to the game. I always though stamina was a good part of the Quest for Glory games.

@Agent Dink -
Quote: "Maybe Cash died... He probably stayed up for a few days in a row, didn't eat or use a restroom and kicked the bucket while programming."

If that happened, hopefully my wife would lie about my cause of death. Like maybe, I died during sex instead. A dork's death seems a cruel way to go

*******************************************************


Okay guys, I know this is pretty lame, but please bear with me. I've been busy, and I'm very picky about what goes into the game. I've been working on the conversation system. I ported all of the Geisha House guts to a smaller program (1000 lines long) so that I wouldn't have to recompile 19k lines over and over again. I'm really glad I did, it's come together nicely. It doesn't look all that hot right now, but it is directly portable to the game.

When you hover the mouse over a character, if they are capable and able to talk, a tiny talk icon will fade in above their head. When you click it, the available conversation topic icons will unfold from that icon to the right. When you click on a topic, the icons will collapse, and the conversation will occur.

The system is tied into the flag system, so saying something can trigger a game event, a game event can trigger a conversation, and topics unlock and lock other topics. Also, they don't say the same thing every time, they can progress through different phrases or randomly select one. I set it up so that it's very easy to script, so actually making the conversations will be very easy.

There are still a few things to work out, but no worries at all, 95% of everything I need is done. All that's left now is to have events interrupt the conversation, the character stay near the PC during the conversation, and to integrate the talk animation. I haven't done the last one yet because obviously these little capsule guys don't have any animations.

So, here are two lame pictures showing you a basic conversation. It's between the inkeeper and the player. The inkeeper is red and the player is green. Imagine if you will this taking place with actual models...

Selecting the topic...

We asked about the beer...



Come see the WIP!

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dark coder
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Posted: 22nd May 2007 14:31
Quote: "If that happened, hopefully my wife would lie about my cause of death. Like maybe, I died during sex instead. A dork's death seems a cruel way to go"


I didn't know Viagra was lethal

Anyway to make this not a useless post. progress looks good! other than the font in the last two pics but I'm sure they can be edited at any point. Hope to see a demo soon .

Benjamin
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Posted: 22nd May 2007 14:41 Edited at: 22nd May 2007 14:48
Quote: "I didn't know Viagra was lethal"

Yeah, so you should watch out, you may have been fine last time you used it but next time you may not be so lucky.

Tempest (DBP/DBCe)
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dark coder
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Posted: 22nd May 2007 14:49
Quote: "Yeah, so you should watch out, you may have been fine last time you used it but next time you may not be so lucky."


Yes, I would have warned you too, Only the issue will never arise.

Benjamin
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Posted: 22nd May 2007 14:50 Edited at: 22nd May 2007 14:57
Quote: "Yes, I would have warned you too, Only the issue will never arise."

Yes, because unlike you I don't have any problems down there. You, however, have a brain of enormously low IQ.

Tempest (DBP/DBCe)
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dark coder
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Posted: 22nd May 2007 14:53 Edited at: 22nd May 2007 14:56
You appear to have 'erectile dysfunction' and 'a brain' mixed up.

Lucifer
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Posted: 22nd May 2007 14:56
Cash, usz needzz daz viiiidddeeeooossss

Quote: "Soon, I swear!! "


soon is not soon enough


i like pancakes..
Benjamin
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Posted: 22nd May 2007 14:58
Quote: "You appear to have 'erectile dysfunction' and 'a brain' mixed up."

Probably.

Tempest (DBP/DBCe)
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Diggsey
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Posted: 22nd May 2007 20:49
Lol, Lucifer, cash has almost finished the best ever DBP game, and showing a new video 'soon' is not good enough You have REALLY high standards!!!

@Benjamin
What were you saying about spamming cash's thread?

@Cash
I'm glad you didn't die, and I can't wait for the next vid!

Agent Dink
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Posted: 22nd May 2007 20:57
Yay, he lives!

Dieing at the computer however, is something to be proud of!

I have no signature...
Benjamin
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Posted: 22nd May 2007 21:05
Quote: "What were you saying about spamming cash's thread?"

Well everyone was saying that Cash was dead, so I thought a bit of humour might cheer him up. It's a rather nasty condition after all..

Tempest (DBP/DBCe)
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Lucifer
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Posted: 22nd May 2007 21:21
Quote: "'soon' is not good enough"


NO!!! it's not

Quote: "cash has almost finished the best ever DBP game"


i didnt think about that untill now but his game might just be the BEST dbp game EVER, i have never seen a game made in dbp that looks this good and looks so professional..


i like pancakes..
Diggsey
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Posted: 22nd May 2007 21:36 Edited at: 22nd May 2007 21:36
@Benjamin
I agree, not many people make a full recovery after death. It can seriously affect your health, and can also prevent you from getting any excercise...

Bizar Guy
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Posted: 22nd May 2007 22:14 Edited at: 23rd May 2007 06:30
Dying sucks. No one I know who has experienced it has recommended it to me.

I like the capsule guys Cash, they're Awesome. But seriously that was a good idea to not build it with everything else. I'm going to try that on my next game...

BiggAdd
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Posted: 23rd May 2007 04:52
This is looking really good Cash!!

Im sorry about not speaking on msn much. I don't really use it often.

I'm currently doing exams, We can start talking about music for your game, unless you've already found somebody to do it for you.

RiiDii
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Posted: 23rd May 2007 17:40
Quote: "Have you tried it out yet in your project?"

Not yet. I have played around with a similar technique for showing great distances, where the background image was lower resolution for blurring, and the foreground was a high resolution image for detail. I was able to get a better frame rate than just a single massive distance shot. My only setback was aligning the two images "perfectly" (see the attached sample).

What I do know...

Trick 1) Use a considerably lower resolution bitmap; it doesn't need to be very high for a mirror or portal.

Trick 2) Spread out updates. "Mirrors" are updated during different frames to thin out the resource impact. If you have one mirror, update it every frame. If you have two mirrors, update them every other frame. For 10 mirrors, update two mirrors a frame over five frames.

Trick 3) Text on screen will flash, so sprite or image based text needs to be used instead.


Open MMORPG: It's your game!

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Code Dragon
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Posted: 24th May 2007 04:24
Amazing!
From the videos I can tell this is going to be commercial, right?

I can't believe the engine is 19000 lines, that's very big!

Beyond this place there be dragons.
Cash Curtis II
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Posted: 24th May 2007 19:44 Edited at: 29th May 2007 17:00
@dark coder-
Quote: "Anyway to make this not a useless post. progress looks good! other than the font in the last two pics but I'm sure they can be edited at any point. Hope to see a demo soon"

Thanks!! The font can easily be changed, but it looks way better in-game. I hope of getting a demo out soon as well!

@Benjamin-
Quote: "Yeah, so you should watch out, you may have been fine last time you used it but next time you may not be so lucky.
"

You never know in this high stakes, high drama industry...

Quote: "Well everyone was saying that Cash was dead, so I thought a bit of humour might cheer him up. It's a rather nasty condition after all.."

That's all that saved me, you know. Being dead sucks.


@Lucifer-
Quote: "Cash, usz needzz daz viiiidddeeeooossss"

Umm... I'll reply in kind...
Blazz blaahhzz videiosszzzzeseses!!! lololz lolz, uz needz ta ch8illaxes dudz!!!!
I jest I appreciate your interest in Geisha House, and I definitely aim to please!

Quote: "but his game might just be the BEST dbp game EVER, i have never seen a game made in dbp that looks this good and looks so professional.."

You are definitely being too kind


@Diggsey -
Quote: "I'm glad you didn't die"

Yeah, I'm pretty glad about that too...

Quote: "cash has almost finished the best ever DBP game"

Thanks You're too kind. I wouldn't necessarily agree, but I appreciate it.

@Bizar Guy -
Quote: "I like the capsule guys Cash, they're Awesome. But seriously that was a good idea to not build it with everything else. I'm going to try that on my next game..."

Thanks! It definitely helps to break it up. There's only so much you can do in the initial build, so you're left with lots of pieces that you need to add. If you try to add them to the whole project, it is a total mess and might never get finished. I've always broken it up into smaller projects. It doesn't always work perfectly, but it is so much faster and easier.

I agree though, I wouldn't call this the best DBP project ever. Maybe, mabye, in this genre. Are you talking about Claymore Island? That was a stellar looking game. I hope it gets finished. That game was a perfect blend of playability, fun, and gloss. I've seen other excellent RPGs as well, very beautifully made. They just tend not to get finished unfortunately. I can pinpoint exactly the various stages of development during which they die.

@BiggAdd -
No worries, I've been testing lately as well. I'll get in contact wity you, can't wait to finish up GH's musical assets.

@RiiDii -
That's a fascinating approach. If it's done correctly, nobody will even notice. Needless to say, I'm very interested in the mechanics of this

Currently I'm using a very low res image, 128x128. I've played with the FOV and got it looking alright. Although, I'm not spreading out the updates. I'll do this straight away.

As for #3, I don't use text except for debugging, I use bitmap fonts. After I finish the section that I'm on I'll get back on portals/mirrors and see what I can come up with that works with what I've already got.

I appreciate the help!

@Code Dragon -
Quote: "From the videos I can tell this is going to be commercial, right?"

Yes, it is. I've taken way longer than I promised the publisher, but I suspect that they'll get over it.

Quote: "I can't believe the engine is 19000 lines, that's very big!"

Yeah, it is pretty huge. There are many separate parts that can easily get in each other's way if I'm not careful. But so far it's all working

******************************************************


Okay guys, you've all been demanding it, begging for it, yelling at me for it. Here it is, the most over hyped presentation ever. Be warned, it isn't all that great. It does demonstrate some important changes and additions to the game.

First and foremost, conversation. The system uses a point and click GUI icon system. When you talk to someone, possible topics of conversation pop up. You select what you want, and various things can happen. They'll talk about it. That can unlock or lock other topics, and activate other game flags, which can do anything. It can unlock areas, lock them, cause events to happen, etc.

None of it is hard coded. It's all scripted, and it's very easy to modify the conversations without recompiling. Flags as well. The two systems work very closely together.

Characters can say things by themselves as well. If the game wants to warn you about something, the main character will tell you about it now. A slope might be too steep, or he might not want to enter the water. Now he'll tell you about it.

So, those are some other additions. I've added the ability to limit movement on steep slopes. The main character can no longer enter the water (because of his armor, other characters can swim around freely). All characters have footstep sounds. Those sounds are secondary to the main character's footsteps, which take precedence. The effect satisfies me.

I've also added mirrors. Unfortunately, LuaEdit eats code. Not in the normal way you might think either. About once a month it will crash. When it does it will delete every .lua file in the directory of the failed file. Unfortunately, it's been 3 weeks since I've backed up my script files, so I lost all of my mirror scripts. Thus, you don't get to see the mirrors in final form. That will be in another video down the road when I feel like adding mirror scripts back in.

So, it's been an update of details, no huge spectacular things like the battle system. Those kinds of updates are the most fun because they are so visually noticable.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hv6nGhOZsy8


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hv6nGhOZsy8


I've got a few kinks to work out. One important thing is that somehow my zooming in and out functionality is now broken. I have no idea how, the systems are in no way related, at all. I added in my conversation code from the capsule guy program, and everything worked for the most part, but that was instantly broken. I'll figure it out, just plainly annoying.

One thing that slowed me down was modifying the LUA arrays. It was quite painful to accomplish. Here's what I had to pass to the LUA system...
Quote: "speech["dwarf"][1]["open"]=0"


But here is how it looks in DBP code form...


Special thanks to monotonic for his unwitting help. A previous post of his helped me to modify the LUA arrays exactly how I needed to make this work.

That's all for now, hope you all enjoy. I'm going to take the weekend off. Later!!!


Come see the WIP!

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Alquerian
18
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 29th Mar 2006
Location: Reno Nevada
Posted: 24th May 2007 20:24
Cash, you really don't give yourself enough credit when others compliment you, so knock it off and quit pretending to be modest.

The video was amazing. It transformed your game. It brings it from a traditional hack`n`slash to a real adventure, complete with dialog and quests. It's a BIG step and I really like it.

Everyone raise your steins of lukewarm piss to Cash, cuz he really deserves it!

Visit the Wip!
Benjamin
21
Years of Service
User Offline
Joined: 24th Nov 2002
Location: France
Posted: 24th May 2007 21:21 Edited at: 24th May 2007 21:37
Looks very smart! It's great how you manage to improve the quality every time in certain areas, some people just make things a certain way and can never see how to improve upon it.

Anyway, the conversation system is pretty neat, although that orc (or whatever that mad axe-wielding lunatic was) was rather rude turning around half way through the conversation.

I've noticed you make NPCs give extra information when you ask the same question twice. While this is cool, it might be annoying having to spend ages getting full information out of an NPC (due to the wait times between responses), perhaps you could add the ability to beat the information out of them?

Keep up zee good work!

Quote: "You never know in this high stakes, high drama industry..."

Actually I was talking to dork coder.

Tempest (DBP/DBCe)
Multisync V1 (DBP/DBCe)

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