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Geek Culture / Xbox One

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Yodaman Jer
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Posted: 24th May 2013 05:27
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OK, I know it's a Cracked.com article, but it makes several key points, and now I've kind of changed my mind on getting an Xbox One...


That used game thing is just ridiculous! I didn't realize it would be quite that extreme.

What are you doing, Microsoft? Don't you love us?

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mr Handy
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Posted: 24th May 2013 09:18
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Quote: "It's x86-64. There is no such thing as x64. It wouldn't be able to access all 8GB of RAM if it wasn't 64-bit."

It's processor is x86.

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Benjamin
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Posted: 24th May 2013 09:22
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Quote: "It's processor is x86."


Regardless of what they are referring to it as, it is 64-bit, which would make it x86-64.

"Sideboobs are awesome. Getting punched in the face is not." - Jerico2Day on violence and nudity
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Daniel Carpenter
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Posted: 24th May 2013 10:23
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I am really waiting for xbox one to come to my country.

Make a picture collage online
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Quik
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Posted: 24th May 2013 10:41
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While i'm not a big "ermagod gotta need to be able to sell me games on!" guy, i do however find it ridiculously stupid that we can't



Whose eyes are those eyes?
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mr Handy
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Posted: 24th May 2013 12:25
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Quote: "Regardless of what they are referring to it as, it is 64-bit, which would make it x86-64."

Proof?

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Dark Java Dude 64
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Posted: 24th May 2013 12:31
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That's just the way it is...

There is no such thing as x64, but the 64 bit implementation of the x86 architecture is called x86-64, but is commonly shortened to x64.

Do some research.

http://www.google.com/
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mr Handy
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Posted: 24th May 2013 12:39
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Quote: "Do some research."

Link, please.

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Benjamin
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Posted: 24th May 2013 13:06
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Quote: "Proof?"


All of the websites that I've found listing the specifications have indicated that it uses the 64-bit architecture. Do you have any sources for your claim that it's 32-bit?

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Dark Java Dude 64
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Posted: 24th May 2013 13:10
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Quote: "Link, please."
Nah, don't bother with the research anymore. Just work on your troll skills for now.

http://www.google.com/
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mr Handy
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Posted: 24th May 2013 14:04
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Quote: "Do you have any sources for your claim that it's 32-bit?"

http://www.xbox.com/en-US/xboxone/what-it-is
Quote: "8 Cores
An 8-core x86 processor lets you instantly switch between a game and your entertainment apps with ease."


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budokaiman
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Posted: 24th May 2013 14:35
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Quote: "That's the thing, though. While 8 gigs of GDDR5 RAM is nice and not a single PC has it because it doesn't exist to the public yet, it doesn't change the fact that the other specs are just average. 8-core @1.6ghz and a 7790 equivalent isn't exactly something that will blow gaming PCs out of the water; just compete with them."


The specs may not seem impressive, but remember that most PC games are usually also on consoles. Most games up to this point have been limited to what the 360 and PS3 could accomplish. Though the specs don't seem much better than a gaming PC, the new games that come out will be much higher quality and start to push the existing gaming PCs to their limits.


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Dar13
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Posted: 24th May 2013 14:44
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Well at least this architecture change to multi-core CPUs will force game developers to multithread more which will benefit PC in the long run.

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A new project is under initial development now.
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Melancholic
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Posted: 24th May 2013 15:14
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Quote: "Well at least this architecture change to multi-core CPUs will force game developers to multithread more which will benefit PC in the long run."


The 360 had a tri-core processor


I can count to banana...
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Dar13
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Posted: 24th May 2013 17:12
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But it was 3.2 GHz. Since the Jaguar core is only 1.8 GHz, they'll have to take advantage of the entire 8 cores in order to get the same processing power. Plus, the X360 was a different CPU architecture so the code written for it wasn't directly portable to the PC. Now, since they're both x86-64 it's much easier to port over.

WTLD has been put on indefinite hold.
A new project is under initial development now.
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Melancholic
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Posted: 24th May 2013 17:18
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Quote: "But it was 3.2 GHz. Since the Jaguar core is only 1.8 GHz, they'll have to take advantage of the entire 8 cores in order to get the same processing power. Plus, the X360 was a different CPU architecture so the code written for it wasn't directly portable to the PC. Now, since they're both x86-64 it's much easier to port over.
"


I thought it was only the CPU of the 360 that had a differing architecture? i don't claim to be an expert, so i will quote wikipedia, "The Xenos is a custom graphics processing unit (GPU) designed by AMD (formerly ATI), used in the Xbox 360 video game console developed and produced for Microsoft. Developed under the codename "C1",[1] it is in many ways related to the R520 architecture and therefore very similar to an ATI Radeon X1800 series of PC graphics cards as far as features and performance are concerned"


I can count to banana...
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Indicium
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Posted: 24th May 2013 17:28
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For mr Troll up there. ^
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/X86-64

Why on Earth would it have 8GiB of RAM if you could only utilize 4?


They see me coding, they hating. http://indi-indicium.blogspot.co.uk/
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mr Handy
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Posted: 24th May 2013 17:37 Edited at: 24th May 2013 17:38
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CPU is x86 or x64 (with x86 compatibility).
Read this, how Xbox have 8GB with x86

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Indicium
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Posted: 24th May 2013 18:10 Edited at: 24th May 2013 18:12
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Oh dear.

x64 does not exist.

When people say x64, they mean x86-64, which is a 64-bit extention of x86.

Why on earth would Microsoft go to lengths to implement PAE, which is no doubt slower, when 64bit CPUs are now more common than 32bit CPUs?


They see me coding, they hating. http://indi-indicium.blogspot.co.uk/
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Yodaman Jer
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Posted: 24th May 2013 18:13 Edited at: 24th May 2013 18:16
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Good God mr Handy, how can you profess to be a geek and NOT know that x64 doesn't exist, and that x86-64 means 64-bit?! And as Indicium said, when people refer to just "x64", they mean the 64-bit extension of x86-64.


The processor in the new Xbox One is 64-bit, otherwise they wouldn't be able to utilize all 8GB of RAM they're sticking inside of it. Believe it or not, the professionals know what they're talking about. And PAE would be a ridiculous thing for them to implement, especially in this day and age, since 32-bit software is disappearing slowly.

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Benjamin
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Posted: 24th May 2013 19:56
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Quote: "http://www.xbox.com/en-US/xboxone/what-it-is"


I meant sources for the claim that it's 32-bit and not 64-bit. I find it highly unlikely that one of the big consoles of 2013 would use 32-bit processors. All your quote states is that it uses the x86 architecture, which we already know.

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Quik
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Posted: 24th May 2013 21:09
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Quote: " I find it highly unlikely that one of the big consoles of 2013 would use 32-bit processors."



considering the hardware overall i wouldnt be surprised at all.



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Indicium
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Posted: 24th May 2013 21:19
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Quote: "considering the hardware overall i wouldnt be surprised at all."


You really believe that knowing that it has 8GiB RAM?


They see me coding, they hating. http://indi-indicium.blogspot.co.uk/
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mr Handy
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Posted: 25th May 2013 00:07 Edited at: 25th May 2013 00:22
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Quote: "how can you profess to be a geek"

I love colorful ponies.

Quote: "when people refer to just "x64", they mean the 64-bit extension of x86-64. "

Correct, short is x64, not x86.

Also they say that Xbox one will limit ram for games up to 5GB because it will running 3 OS streams at the same time (like play crysis and skype independently). Plus they say that it will be using modified version of Windows 8, so I suppose PAE for OS authors is a piece of cake. If you can provide a good link to disproove me, I will accept it, srsly.

Stuart Gilray from Just Add Water studio (they working on game for PS4 now) said for Eurogamer, that PS4 graphics would be a bit better and they had to tweak some things for Xbox one.

edit: typos are bald

P.S. just surfing the web:
Quote: "The latest leaks suggest that the Xbox One will have an 8-core 64-bit x86 Jaguar AMD CPU @ 1.6GHz, coupled with a GPU that’s very close to the Radeon HD 7790."

Is that true? I can't find good source.

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Indicium
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Posted: 25th May 2013 00:30
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You're completely missing the point, Microsoft wouldn't say x64 because it does not exist, it's technology slang, the architecture the hardware uses is the 64 bit version of x86. Why is everything an argument with you?


They see me coding, they hating. http://indi-indicium.blogspot.co.uk/
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mr Handy
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Posted: 25th May 2013 00:49 Edited at: 25th May 2013 01:00
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I just can't find a link to respectful source with Xbox specs in details. What's wrong with it, huh?

Quote: "You're completely missing the point, Microsoft wouldn't say x64 because it does not exist, it's technology slang,"

Benjamin before truly said that it is uncool to release a 32-bit console in 2013. And we all know that x86-x64 shortens to x64:


Why does M$ confuses people like me with their "x86" and just make Xbox to look worse to me?
That's pointless!
They should shout x64!!! x64, buy it!!!
I don't get it.

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Quik
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Posted: 25th May 2013 01:06
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Quote: "I just can't find a link to respectful source with Xbox specs in details. What's wrong with it, huh?"


ever heard of this one?

*Yo, dude - did you know that <spews incredible and amazing crap>
*WOOOOT? WHERE DID YOU HEAR THAT?
*I'm not quite sure duuude, but i know it's reliable!
*How?
*I just know!



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Indicium
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Posted: 25th May 2013 01:54
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When Microsoft are saying x86, they're trying to make the point that they've moved away from the PowerPC architecture.


They see me coding, they hating. http://indi-indicium.blogspot.co.uk/
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Yodaman Jer
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Posted: 25th May 2013 03:06 Edited at: 25th May 2013 03:09
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Quote: "I love colorful ponies."


I think that usually means something more than the word "Geek". jk.

Quote: "Quote: "The latest leaks suggest that the Xbox One will have an 8-core 64-bit x86 Jaguar AMD CPU @ 1.6GHz, coupled with a GPU that’s very close to the Radeon HD 7790."
Is that true? I can't find good source."


Yes, it's true, and it's what we've been trying to tell you all along. x86 and x86-64 are literally the same thing, and they all mean 64-bit. Microsoft would be out of their minds to release a console for the next gen that didn't use 64-bit processing, because that would severely limit the amount of RAM available for games. And the reason they're limiting the use of 5GB to games is because the other 3GB are dedicated to running the OS underneath. But that's still 5GBs of RAM, something that wouldn't really be possible if they had stuck with 32-bit processors, or PowerPC processors. PAE, as mentioned before, would be an insane way to manage memory on an upcoming game console.

EDIT: I see your point that is confusing, because several software downloads usually say something like "If you want the 64-bit version of this software, download [Software Title x64]", but they just shortened x86-64 to either x86 or x64. If you think about it, 32-bit software was never referred to as x86, and if anything it should've been referred to as x32. If Microsoft had built a new Xbox with a 32-bit processor, they wouldn't have called it anything except by its own name (example: Intel Celeron blah blah blah).

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Libervurto
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Posted: 25th May 2013 03:56
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Apparently, Mr Handy has a point:
Quote: "Although most x86 processors used in new personal computers and servers have 64-bit capabilities, to avoid compatibility problems with older computers or systems, the term x86-64 (or x64) is often used to denote 64-bit software, with the term x86 implying only 32-bit."

From wikipedia: x86

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Yodaman Jer
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Posted: 25th May 2013 04:47
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It implies it, yes, but it's never been an official term (as far as I know) to exclusively mean 32-bit. Why on earth would a higher number (x86) represent 32-bit?

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Libervurto
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Posted: 25th May 2013 05:36
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I guess people just stopped writing "x86-32" after a while and dropped the "32" so now people assume it's 32-bit unless otherwise stated.

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swissolo
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Posted: 25th May 2013 06:13
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Wow I've stirred up quite a discussion with my little mistake there glad I left it. It isn't possible to push 32-bit software to 8 GB of memory making it large address aware is it? Doesn't that only reach 4 still?

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Interstellar
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Dark Java Dude 64
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Posted: 25th May 2013 06:20
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Microsoft posted a question on Facebook asking if people are excited about xbox one. Based upon the response, it's pretty safe to say the xbox is going to be a massive commercial failure unless Microsoft makes significant changes.

http://www.google.com/
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Yodaman Jer
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Posted: 25th May 2013 07:04
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Yeah, I just looked at that DBD 79. If it ends up being a failure that would be really interesting to see how Microsoft might fix it.

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Dark Java Dude 64
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Posted: 25th May 2013 07:06
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Indeed! I honestly think it's too late for them to make significant changes without changing their release time frame...

http://www.google.com/
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Yodaman Jer
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Posted: 25th May 2013 07:25
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Me too. The chances of them changing anything in time for launch, even in December, are pretty slim. Unless they end up like RIM and just keep postponing it until further notice.

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Dark Java Dude 64
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Posted: 25th May 2013 07:30
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They should do that, with Windows 8 and to some degree the Surface, I think they need to concentrate more on getting something people like released than releasing it in time.

http://www.google.com/
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mr Handy
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Posted: 25th May 2013 12:25
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Quote: "If you think about it, 32-bit software was never referred to as x86"

Microsoft Visual C++ 2010 Redistributable Package (x86)
Microsoft Visual C++ 2005 Redistributable Package (x64)

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Indicium
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Posted: 25th May 2013 13:08
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But when they're making that differentiation they're not trying to point out a difference in CPU architecture.


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Benjamin
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Posted: 25th May 2013 13:15
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Quote: "Microsoft Visual C++ 2010 Redistributable Package (x86)
Microsoft Visual C++ 2005 Redistributable Package (x64)"


As far as I know when people simply write x86 whether it's 16-bit/32-bit/64-bit is implied by whatever is 'current'. Initially it was implied for 16-bit, and then 32-bit, and now it seems it's being implied for 64-bit, since fewer and fewer people use 32-bit processors anymore.

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mr Handy
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Posted: 25th May 2013 13:49 Edited at: 25th May 2013 13:50
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Nes 8 bit
Sega 16 bit
PS one 32 bit
SNes 64 bit

Every new console showed bigger value to promote itself.

Why Xbox one not using "x64" when it is x64? I don't get it. Srsly.

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Benjamin
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Posted: 25th May 2013 15:13
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Quote: "Nes 8 bit
Sega 16 bit
PS one 32 bit
SNes 64 bit"


Er what? Sega had several different consoles, and the SNES CPU was 16-bit.

"Sideboobs are awesome. Getting punched in the face is not." - Jerico2Day on violence and nudity
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Quik
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Posted: 25th May 2013 15:17
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he must be meaning nintendo 64.... which came 6 years later



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TheComet
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Posted: 25th May 2013 15:50
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BUUUUURRNEED!!

Apply liquid nitrogen to singed area!

TheComet


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Matty H
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Posted: 25th May 2013 17:03
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I am a little confused how I will be watching tv on my Xbox One?

I currently use Virgin who provide me with a box and a remote control. Before that I had an even better box from sky which also had a remote control.

I have to pay these companies for my channels, is the Xbox going to be able to hook up with sky and virgin boxes? Unlikely. So is XBox going to provide my TV channels in place of sky or virgin?

If it can provide me with what Sky/Virgin provide as well as games then perhaps I may get one, but I doubt it will do this.

Can anyone tell me how this is supposed to work?

Right now it looks like PS4 for me, it could be great if XBox can really provide that whole experience in one place but it seems flawed to me?

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Quik
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Posted: 25th May 2013 17:21
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btw - i can null down the whole "I dont see what the problem with always on DRM with consoles"

Well.. here's a example for you - I use the console because its versatile, and great to have with you to friends house OR ON A VACATION...

and when i'm in my cabin/cottage thing - i dont usually bring internet with me - however, I might bring the console because it's a great way to have some fun with the family..

baseline - I dont want internet ruining my bloody console experience.. which is - have fun without the hassle - really



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Libervurto
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Posted: 25th May 2013 19:45
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I don't understand how these companies keep taking turns to lose the plot between console cycles, it's like as soon as either one gets an edge on the other they go crazy.

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Yodaman Jer
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Posted: 25th May 2013 22:22
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Quote: "PS4 Will use your TV as well for gaming"


I would certainly hope so.

Is there much more info on the PS4? I'm actually not finding much on the web about it. I do know several developers are already saying they prefer developing for it over the One, though. That's something interesting to consider for sure...

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mr Handy
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Posted: 25th May 2013 22:31
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Quote: "Is there much more info on the PS4?"

It will be on sale on winter holidays.

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